Unrestricted wrote:

This is my first map, most definately not going for rank as it is a learning expererience for me, looking to improve my mapping and have fun whilst attempting it.

vnhero wrote:

Here's my mod, take it or leave it. There's not many problems with your map in my opinion.


You should reduce the volume of the hitsounds, maybe 60% or something like that

00:54:999 (6) - there's a sound after this note so add a note after this Added notes to match the melody of this section
01:10:999 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6) - you should spread out these jumps, don't group them together in one area on the gridHave now done this, plays more smooth
01:19:666 (3) - I think you should make this a slider
01:20:999 (3) - same as aboveAdded slider in similar fashion of the section after for both notes.
01:41:333 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13,14) - the placement of the notes in this combo is a bit unpleasant, with everything perpendicular to each other like that and I don't like the stacking either (the next combo is the same) I have kept the perpendicular feel, but changed the stacking of the 5 notes for easier reading and smoother play
Otherwise, I think your map is great and should be ranked.
Thank you.

paydayzcool wrote:

Unrestricted wrote:

This is my first map, most definately not going for rank as it is a learning expererience for me, looking to improve my mapping and have fun whilst attempting it.

I like what you just said here: You're not going to take too much time on this map are you? ^_^

Welp, my mod's right here. You wanted a learning experience, you're getting one!

One of the first things I suggest you do is have a look at this video here: t/55282
100% hit sound volume is also too high. You want to keep the hit sounds as quiet as the music so that you can hear it, but it blends with the music.
Ever heard of "Kiai time"? That's used when the music is at its most intense parts or the chorus of the music. upon reaching kiai time, notes will begin pulsing, stars will shoot everywhere, etc. You can configure Kiai time in the timing section. I have messed around with hitsounds and some Kiai time,
and will find the best placings soon
00:27:999 (1) - Avoid bezier sliders like these. (Bezier sliders have inaccurate curves and usually have 3-4 points. You can tell that this is a bezier slider because the midpoint needs to be dragged out further to emphasise the slider curve. To fix this, delete the slider and do it again without adding a fourth point.) Use sliders like these: 00:59:999 (5), notice that the midpoint is always in the centre of the slider no matter where you drag it.The sliders in this section all have 3 points and i'm not quite sure of the problem being mentioned.
00:48:333 (6,1) - With small gaps like these, try to make it more evident that these notes are further apart on the timeline. This would mean placing the notes further away from each other on the playfield. Increased spacing between these types of gaps on 4 occasions
00:55:999 - This here is an empty space which should include notes to represent the playing melody. It's not the right time to include a pause.I have not made a change here, i feel like the pause is needed and that the part of the music here is not melody and hard to map in a meaningful way.
01:21:666 (1) - This is a well made slider, but this could be more easily made using three points.
Also, try to add in some variety in rotations to your sliders (especially the straight ones) by rotating them 5 degrees or -5 degrees.I will make that slider type using 3 points from now on, added variaton of ~5degrees to many consecutive straight sliders, only leaving few perpendicular in all but one section
02:02:499 (6,1,2) - These three notes on the timeline are spaced differently, while on the playfield, the point at which to hit the notes are not made obvious because of their spacing there. If you put the 1 closer to the 6, it would become more readable.Very obvious mistake on my behalf, changed it up now to make it more readable, overall tried adding more distance spacing.
02:33:666 (8,9,10) - Welp, readability here went down the drain XD. Thought it could possibly be very challenging to read, added spacing to allow easier reading

Good effort for a first map. I believe you should check out Pishifat's youtube channel here for more information on mapping: https://www.youtube.com/user/Pishifat

• 
  
  Flow: Most Pattern you created had a good flow. Still there are some issues because the whole map was not one solid thing. It felt more like a bunch of pattern just copy-pasted into it. Many times because of that segmented feel of the map, the flow kinda broke cuz of that
  
  Aesthetics: You mainly used basic symmetric pattern. Its not really bad but also now really good. sometimes you had bad overlaps or such. Come to that later
  
  Emphasizes: You didn't really emphazise a specific part of the song and it felt pretty similar all the way through, beeing the biggest issue here.
  
  Emphasizes

1. 00:03:833 (1) - I don't think this sudden change is fitting. You should either stay to what you were mapping to before OR change to map to that noise a little earlier, 00:02:666 (1) - here. I would maybe suggest to make use of slow slider. A little later you ignored the same sound (little pitched) you just mapped a spinner to 00:08:999 (3) - . You could do it for example like this: 00:02:332 (3) - (3) is where your spinner was A little later starting at 00:07:666 (3) - Maybe like that. Also a small thing you need to fix, the back and forth slider actually starts one tick earlier as you can see in the picture. It should start 00:09:999 (5) - here.
   
   Aesthetics
   
2. 00:00:000 (1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3) - Looking at aesthetics here, this has a theme to it but i think it it poorly executed. I don't know if you did these anti-blankets intentionally like here 00:00:999 (3,1) - If you want to have those anti-blankets its fine BUT, i would recommend you the distances between objects should be the same. Let me show you on a picture what exactly I mean. Those are the same pattern for the exact same sounds in the song and yet all the distances i marked with colored lines are different. A good thing to start is, to make all these distances the exact same length. A good thing for measurement is to look at approach circles Like i did in this example Its just a small thing but it actually has a HUGE impact on the visuals of your map. A little "trick" I do, is to move stuff forward/backwards in the timeline to see the approach circles (i moved every single object in the picture on the same tick) Then i arrange my objects around these approach circles in the distances I feel are fitting.
   
   Flow
   
3. 00:05:333 (1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3) - Flow here is sometimes off. If you look at that Picture the i marked with blue circles where flow is off. If your intention is to emphazise these sounds it would be okai for dooing it on 00:06:666 (1,1) - these two. I even would change the direction of the flow there from counterclockwise to clockwise.
   
   Emphasizes
   
4. 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - Here are some big issues. at first 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1) - you just mapped on these single sounds there. and suddenly here 00:13:332 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1) - the map goes crazy. The contrast of these to is so extreme its very very unfitting. You should really ask yourself if you want to map on exact these sound here 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1) - because IF you want to map on these you would have to map in this part 00:13:332 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1) - to that long background synth noise. I would highly recommend you to map this part 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1) -
   maybe like I did in that Picture. If you do it like that you still have Emphasized those specific sounds (with those sliders) Using of those back and forth sliders give a player still the feeling of a calm section without such HUGE unpleasant gaps in between notes where noting is happening. Of course the same counts for the same part after where you even put a much huger gap 00:18:666 (5,1) - here were players definitely want to click something.
   
   Aesthetics
   
5. 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - here are also really wonky aesthetics going on. You tried to create what is supposed to be simple shapes, what is good already, but you executed poorly here. You want all these different patterns to go into each other like a gear. This is how your pattern looks if you put all circles on the same time. There isn't really a shape visible. You had that idea of a shape but you arranged all circles randomly. Always think on where should my circle go. Does it overlap with something in the past? Are the distances similar? Does it have a clear visible shape or does it look random?
   So your idea originally was to have 3 of those shapes Work together. So here is how you should do it then. Create your shape but use evenly distances. Then rotate this shape maybe of like 9° if you don't want to have a 2012 looking Nightcore map. Now Copy this shape and paste it where you want to have this shape again. Here you wanted to use it right after. But since there is a higher pitch going on you may want to increase spaceing between your object. (Just selct your pattern then press Ctrl + Shift + S). Now look for a good spot where want to put it (keep in mind it still should have good flowy transition from one shape into another) make sure there are no ugly overlaps.
   Thats how i would suggest you to do things like that. Eventually things will look like something then. Keep in mind: Thats just one way of doing it. There are many many others and probably they are way better, but they are very likely are created the way i told you. If not, then the circles should be arranged in a way it makes sense and forms shapes.
   
   Overall

1. 00:44:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6) - This is like the first segment. 00:49:999 (7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4) - this is the 2nd segment 00:52:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6) - here we have a 3rd segment 00:56:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - 4th and finaly 00:59:333 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1) - 5th
   The problem here is, everything feels strangely different when music has not changed at all. Looking in detail at 00:44:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4) - This part:
   
2. 00:45:666 (6,1) - Gaps like this break the flow. If you don't want this to happen use sliders. 00:45:666 (6) - make this a slider ending on the red tick so players are constantly moving. It's your Kiai where you said its the climax of the song, we don't want to go easy here. Looking at the Rhythm you did that part well. The Aesthetics are very poor here but lets ignore them for now. You did good until here 00:49:999 (7) -
   
3. 00:49:999 (7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4) - Not looking at visuals here there is not a single change in the music at all. And yet you just changed how you mapped completely. If the song stays the same so should your mapping. I think you did it because you were frightened of it being too repetitiv. To avoid that, just make use of different forms of jumps so it doesn't feel repetitive.
   
4. 00:45:333 (5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4) - This part here should be mapped in a similar way. The music starts to change here 00:54:999 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - so this can be different. Also 00:55:999 - this sound here is so distinct you just have to map it.(just put a slider there or something but don't leave this are with that huge gap where just nothing happens. (Still your Kiai time. You always wana go crazy there)
   
5. 00:56:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1) - For that last part of your Kiai you can do it different than the first part of your Kiai because of that "break" in the music with the distinct sound. But still, map similar throughout this part itself.

1. Is my flow good or does it have like flow breaks (like i showed you in that picture earlier) anywhere else.
2. If there are breaks in the flow, is it justified, like is there a very distinct sound in the song that allows me to break the flow for Emphasizing.
3. Do I have well executed visuals for example, are there Slider overlapping? Are circles touching? Are the distances to objects random or are they the same?
4. Did I make sure to map Similar parts similar or do I have weird changes in rhythm when the music has no change?
5. Are the changes in difficulty throughout the map reasonable? (You want it to go slow at the start and get more difficult to the end)

YelloJello wrote:

Hiya, I'm not from a modding queue or anything, just bored. So I'll give you a quick mod. Ill be focusing on the top diff

Apologies beforehand, but I dont use the forums often so my modding style is probably alot less clean than better modders

General

SPOILER

Just to note a couple of things, the music starts as soon as the MP3 begins, so theres no need to adjust the offset, considering that this is your first map, let me know if you understand the basics of timing and offset adjustment. Yup, I understand timings, this map was from the featured artists and the BPM and offset was already set for me on this occasion
Also, for a first map, this is alot higher quality then most first maps people make, im not sure if you've made maps that you havent posted prior, but good job on that front. thanks

Pixie Dust

SPOILER

0:00 you're ignoring a sound on the red tick, shorten the slider to a 1/2 slider and place a circle on the blue tick.The sound heard here is the end of the kick from the first white tick, as it is not meant to be a "held" note I dont think it should be emphasised in any way
00:499 - As a general rule of thumb, its usually pretty bad to skip over white ticks when mapping, best to remap all sliders that go straight through white ticks. (Without starting on them at least.) For this one, I'd recommend a circle on the red tick and a 1/4 slider on the white tick. Remade a few sliders throughout the song, but not the one mentioned as there is not sound on the white ticks as the song is very syncopated at the beginning
03:833 - There is no change in the music and you have put a spinner here, spinners are used to emphasize held notes or approaching and fading sounds, even then only in specific situations. This will only pass in 1 star difficulties. Have removed spinner and added notes to represent the similarities to previous bar(s)
40:083 - first off, the stream starts on the white tick, not the blue tick, NC it while you're at it. Second, the notes arent spaced correctly, remove the stream and place a slider here, then use the convert slider to stream function in the compose tab to fix it. Finally, the stream isn't very good looking aesthetically, this comes with experience though so its fine if you have trouble with it when starting off, the reverse sliders are good though, keep those.Used the slider into stream function, didnt know it existed, now spaced correctly
59:333 - This pattern is really uncomfortable and probably has no chance of being ranked, watch this and this, or recap if you allready have. Recapped both videos, kept notes in same place, but changed the order to keep sharp angles more prominent, now feels easier and more playable
01:38:333 - It'd bad for a slider to go from white ticks to larger white ticks. Replaced slider with circles to emphasise all notes of the melody
01:41:333 - This sort of mapping stopped around 2012, 90 degree angle spam isnt very enjoyable.Kinda kept the 90degree angle feel but,
rotated objects ~5degrees out to keep from being boring

I could go more in depth but im tired right now, so let me list down the important things you need to work on.

1. Prioritization(?) of ticks, don't put a slider on a white tick to a bigger white tick, red tick to white tick, blue tick to red tick, etc.
2. You seem to ignore lots of sounds and covering them with either long sliders or spinners, this is acceptable but use only when it fits the music or the map.
3. Understanding of flow, wide angled jumps are bad, and uncomfortable movement should be used only when it makes sense to do so.

Good luck!

Thanks for mod, am working on making sure flow works now, have learnt a lot about the basic rules of timings with sliders, will re-cap on pishifats videos also. Thanks a bunch!
Edit:Oh and on streams put new combos on any first or second white tick
Edit edit: I agree with paydayzcool in the case of 55:999

Zunv wrote:

Hey,

NM from my Modding Queue

Pixie Dust

• 
  
  Flow: Most Pattern you created had a good flow. Still there are some issues because the whole map was not one solid thing. It felt more like a bunch of pattern just copy-pasted into it. Many times because of that segmented feel of the map, the flow kinda broke cuz of that
  
  Aesthetics: You mainly used basic symmetric pattern. Its not really bad but also now really good. sometimes you had bad overlaps or such. Come to that later
  
  Emphasizes: You didn't really emphazise a specific part of the song and it felt pretty similar all the way through, beeing the biggest issue here.
  
  Emphasizes

1. 00:03:833 (1) - I don't think this sudden change is fitting. You should either stay to what you were mapping to before OR change to map to that noise a little earlier, 00:02:666 (1) - here. I would maybe suggest to make use of slow slider. A little later you ignored the same sound (little pitched) you just mapped a spinner to 00:08:999 (3) - . You could do it for example like this: 00:02:332 (3) - (3) is where your spinner was A little later starting at 00:07:666 (3) - Maybe like that. Also a small thing you need to fix, the back and forth slider actually starts one tick earlier as you can see in the picture. It should start 00:09:999 (5) - here. Changed all parts in this beginning section so that mapping stays the same when the music stays the same, which means removing the spinner. The back and forth slider starts in the correct place but ends 1 tick early as it was hard to play beforehand with a 1/4 jump. As I have kept the same mapping style throughout the opening bars,
   I have ignored the suggestion for a slow slider as I felt it added more divide when testing about.
   
   Aesthetics
   
2. 00:00:000 (1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3) - Looking at aesthetics here, this has a theme to it but i think it it poorly executed. I don't know if you did these anti-blankets intentionally like here 00:00:999 (3,1) - If you want to have those anti-blankets its fine BUT, i would recommend you the distances between objects should be the same. Let me show you on a picture what exactly I mean. Those are the same pattern for the exact same sounds in the song and yet all the distances i marked with colored lines are different. A good thing to start is, to make all these distances the exact same length. A good thing for measurement is to look at approach circles Like i did in this example Its just a small thing but it actually has a HUGE impact on the visuals of your map. A little "trick" I do, is to move stuff forward/backwards in the timeline to see the approach circles (i moved every single object in the picture on the same tick) Then i arrange my objects around these approach circles in the distances I feel are fitting.I tried using your approach circle trick, but decided in the end to use distance snapping to place each object at set distances from eachother,
   as this helped with aesthetics and playabillity. I have also replaced objects so that they would flow better in this new configuration.
   
   Flow
   
3. 00:05:333 (1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3,1,2,3) - Flow here is sometimes off. If you look at that Picture the i marked with blue circles where flow is off. If your intention is to emphazise these sounds it would be okai for dooing it on 00:06:666 (1,1) - these two. I even would change the direction of the flow there from counterclockwise to clockwise.Made many changed throughout the opening to make sure flow was working well, changing the direction on the sound you had mentioned to emphasise the change in music.
   
   Emphasizes
   
4. 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - Here are some big issues. at first 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1) - you just mapped on these single sounds there. and suddenly here 00:13:332 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1) - the map goes crazy. The contrast of these to is so extreme its very very unfitting. You should really ask yourself if you want to map on exact these sound here 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1) - because IF you want to map on these you would have to map in this part 00:13:332 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,1) - to that long background synth noise. I would highly recommend you to map this part 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1) -
   maybe like I did in that Picture. If you do it like that you still have Emphasized those specific sounds (with those sliders) Using of those back and forth sliders give a player still the feeling of a calm section without such HUGE unpleasant gaps in between notes where noting is happening. Of course the same counts for the same part after where you even put a much huger gap 00:18:666 (5,1) - here were players definitely want to click something.I had the same advice from a play tester about that gap being too large of a contrast with the "crazy" part. I have taken your advice and added the repeating sliders to still emphasise the "background" sound, but keep the fast feel going so the next part does not feel too unexpected, the same gap in the next section is also filled in, which removes the large gap where players will want to click something, as now both sounds are being represented by the repeating sliders/clircles.
   
   Aesthetics
   
5. 00:10:666 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - here are also really wonky aesthetics going on. You tried to create what is supposed to be simple shapes, what is good already, but you executed poorly here. You want all these different patterns to go into each other like a gear. This is how your pattern looks if you put all circles on the same time. There isn't really a shape visible. You had that idea of a shape but you arranged all circles randomly. Always think on where should my circle go. Does it overlap with something in the past? Are the distances similar? Does it have a clear visible shape or does it look random?
   So your idea originally was to have 3 of those shapes Work together. So here is how you should do it then. Create your shape but use evenly distances. Then rotate this shape maybe of like 9° if you don't want to have a 2012 looking Nightcore map. Now Copy this shape and paste it where you want to have this shape again. Here you wanted to use it right after. But since there is a higher pitch going on you may want to increase spaceing between your object. (Just selct your pattern then press Ctrl + Shift + S). Now look for a good spot where want to put it (keep in mind it still should have good flowy transition from one shape into another) make sure there are no ugly overlaps.
   Thats how i would suggest you to do things like that. Eventually things will look like something then. Keep in mind: Thats just one way of doing it. There are many many others and probably they are way better, but they are very likely are created the way i told you. If not, then the circles should be arranged in a way it makes sense and forms shapes.I took in the advice about pattern working like a gear,
   I understand that now and have moved the patterns in the mentioned sections to work in such a way, i feel like it flows better now and actually has a good look to it.
   
   Overall

Your biggest issue that is throughout the entire map is, it feels way to segmented. You changed patterns in a way its counter intuitive without thinking about what and where you should have emphasized stuff. Lets take your first Kiai time as an example for the whole map and break it down:

1. 00:44:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6) - This is like the first segment. 00:49:999 (7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4) - this is the 2nd segment 00:52:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5,6) - here we have a 3rd segment 00:56:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - 4th and finaly 00:59:333 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1) - 5th
   The problem here is, everything feels strangely different when music has not changed at all. Looking in detail at 00:44:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4) - This part:
   
2. 00:45:666 (6,1) - Gaps like this break the flow. If you don't want this to happen use sliders. 00:45:666 (6) - make this a slider ending on the red tick so players are constantly moving. It's your Kiai where you said its the climax of the song, we don't want to go easy here. Looking at the Rhythm you did that part well. The Aesthetics are very poor here but lets ignore them for now. You did good until here 00:49:999 (7) - I have added a slider like suggested in the spot, I believe it plays the same but adds to the song because, as you mentioned, it is Kiai time and yes they should be constantly moving.
   
3. 00:49:999 (7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4) - Not looking at visuals here there is not a single change in the music at all. And yet you just changed how you mapped completely. If the song stays the same so should your mapping. I think you did it because you were frightened of it being too repetitiv. To avoid that, just make use of different forms of jumps so it doesn't feel repetitive.I agree with you, i did change the style here because I was frightened of the repetitiveness, however, i believe that at the level of players who play this difficulty, the amount of jumps with no break may be too difficult to keep up with,and the slower paced sliders make this part more playable to a lower skill level.
   
4. 00:45:333 (5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4) - This part here should be mapped in a similar way. The music starts to change here 00:54:999 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - so this can be different. Also 00:55:999 - this sound here is so distinct you just have to map it.(just put a slider there or something but don't leave this are with that huge gap where just nothing happens. (Still your Kiai time. You always wana go crazy there)
   I really don't like the idea of having notes in that section, it is an entirely new sound that is not repeated until the next "chorus", and there is no real way to map, as it is not vital to the melody and the rest of the music stops at this point, including the drums which is key to what I was following,I will avoid making gaps like this in the future but I am attached to this one.
   
5. 00:56:666 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1) - For that last part of your Kiai you can do it different than the first part of your Kiai because of that "break" in the music with the distinct sound. But still, map similar throughout this part itself.

Okay, have changed it to add differences, but also remove the differences that were too different.

I could go on like that throughout the map but it wouldn't be of much help for you. You should now go through your map again with all the things I just told you in mind and see where you did bad and where you did good.
I can already see you don't put circles totaly randomly. You have shapes and pattern in it but you just mapped those poorly.

Summarized you want to ask these Questions:

1. Is my flow good or does it have like flow breaks (like i showed you in that picture earlier) anywhere else.
2. If there are breaks in the flow, is it justified, like is there a very distinct sound in the song that allows me to break the flow for Emphasizing.
3. Do I have well executed visuals for example, are there Slider overlapping? Are circles touching? Are the distances to objects random or are they the same?
4. Did I make sure to map Similar parts similar or do I have weird changes in rhythm when the music has no change?
5. Are the changes in difficulty throughout the map reasonable? (You want it to go slow at the start and get more difficult to the end)

If you have any questions, if something is unclear, ask me anytime.

And as always I will link pishifats mapping Tutorials here Maybe you watched them already, but you definitely should watch them again. Some things you may have forgotten.

I still wish you Good Luck on this and your next maps The more you map, the better you get.