im so glad i dont play this game anymore

oy gevalt

hi i'm in this thread

so i made a really productive post in the thread that got locked, go see it if you care it's page 38



anyway

because you knobheads are too busy circlejerking and kneejerking at every decision that gets made let's dissect what's been done (and also undone) and why it's good or bad.

first off the Ranking Council. this list of people is actually amazing. the only reason people are lashing out at it is because loctav, PR god that he is, said "hey these people came up with that rule nobody agrees with" when really that's not at all what happened (i know this from talking to the actual people in the Ranking Council, so I'm not pulling this out of my ass) but hey throwing people under the bus always works when you don't wanna take the blame yourself, so that's what happened (page 2 of the locked thread). without this nobody would have minded especially when you have C445/Doomsday/CB/FrostxE/Garven on that list and that even if you don't like one of the individuals in that list, it's a group which means they work and take decisions as a group which means no rushed stupid decisions (you know, like announcing that rule was).

as for the rule itself now. is it objectively bad? no. is it bad in the current context? hell yes. Once again I explain this in the actual good post I made at page 38 but let's tl;dr. easies and normals have retarded hardcap rules that don't allow for any flexibility = every easy and normal plays the same and if you wanna make a hard map that fucks up your spread hard because 2/6 of your diffs are wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy down low in the general difficulty scale. I also explain why trying to cover the entire difficulty range is a bad idea.

people have been getting unreasonably angry at the fact that you can't have several difficulties of the same skill level anymore, but really they're full of shit. 99.9% of the time this happens is because some fucknut wants to shoehorn their fucknut buddy's guest difficulty except fucknut buddy is too bad at mapping to adapt to the diff curve the map has and/or too lazy to make his own set. there is actually no way you can defend this. If you're a mapper that wants two difficulties of the same skill level but with different skills required (one stream diff, one jump diff for example) shove both in the same difficulty and split even. if you're not a dumbass, it works.

finally after the dust settled i slid into ztrot's PMs like a motherfucker to understand how this blunder happened and make him understand why it happened. turns out hey! lower difficulties are gonna get that overhaul i advocate for, but it's (understandably since this hasn't been touched in at least 5 years) a project that's going to need time and hard work. and hey guess what that's what the ranking council is gonna work on and since they're full of people that understand what the fuck is going on in this game it will work well.

so chillax for a bit and learn to not kneejerk like a motherfucker when anything is decided. makes you look like a fucking tool.

i wish i could call people fucking tools without having a reddit post made about it

i'm literally green with envy right now

good post by the way

this is the power of the black name

you're relevant enough that your posts will be taken seriously but you have enough freedom of action to call everyone names

I am thinking whether going by the "appeal all players" philosophy is the right idea. The diff spread needs to be appropriate for the song. A 60 BPM song is more likely to recieve a E diff and a 320 BPM song is more appropriate with an X diff. I actually tried to come up with my own version of the rank criteria rules and had a couple people criticize it. It is centered around an automated system that raises the kudos requirement to rank per diff if there are to many similiar diffs. Someone pointed out that the main flaw of such system is that it doesnt appeal to players of all levels. Also, the community generally maps HI diffs, and less ENX diffs. What would happen is that HI are surpressed and ENX are barely affected

Coming up with a solution that appeals to all is hard if not impossible. It's better to leave things as thay are if you can't say what you think the conequences of doing something would be.

if that were the case, no changes would have ever been made to osu! since its original inception

there is no other game of this type available before us to work off - we are the pioneers

Mr Color wrote:

hi i'm in this thread

so i made a really productive post in the thread that got locked, go see it if you care it's page 38



anyway

because you knobheads are too busy circlejerking and kneejerking at every decision that gets made let's dissect what's been done (and also undone) and why it's good or bad.

first off the Ranking Council. this list of people is actually amazing. the only reason people are lashing out at it is because loctav, PR god that he is, said "hey these people came up with that rule nobody agrees with" when really that's not at all what happened (i know this from talking to the actual people in the Ranking Council, so I'm not pulling this out of my ass) but hey throwing people under the bus always works when you don't wanna take the blame yourself, so that's what happened (page 2 of the locked thread). without this nobody would have minded especially when you have C445/Doomsday/CB/FrostxE/Garven on that list and that even if you don't like one of the individuals in that list, it's a group which means they work and take decisions as a group which means no rushed stupid decisions (you know, like announcing that rule was).

as for the rule itself now. is it objectively bad? no. is it bad in the current context? hell yes. Once again I explain this in the actual good post I made at page 38 but let's tl;dr. easies and normals have retarded hardcap rules that don't allow for any flexibility = every easy and normal plays the same and if you wanna make a hard map that fucks up your spread hard because 2/6 of your diffs are wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy down low in the general difficulty scale. I also explain why trying to cover the entire difficulty range is a bad idea.

People make more advanced patterns in normals than in easys though, as in 3/4th sliders into notes/other sliders, basic distance increase etc. It may not be much more difficult for established players but for newbies it's another step on the difficulty ladder. My personal opinion however is that easy diffs are most often redundant when there's a <2* normal after it.

people have been getting unreasonably angry at the fact that you can't have several difficulties of the same skill level anymore, but really they're full of shit. 99.9% of the time this happens is because some fucknut wants to shoehorn their fucknut buddy's guest difficulty except fucknut buddy is too bad at mapping to adapt to the diff curve the map has and/or too lazy to make his own set. there is actually no way you can defend this. If you're a mapper that wants two difficulties of the same skill level but with different skills required (one stream diff, one jump diff for example) shove both in the same difficulty and split even. if you're not a dumbass, it works.

Actually you're full of shit here buddy, you have no idea what you're talking about. You're only thinking of one scenario (which is arguably not even a majority of the cases) and while if things ran like you imply, then it would be against the rules if 2 guys have mapped the same song, and only one of them has a full spread, the other sends him his diff to get it ranked and not have to make some time consuming low difficulty diffs and get all of them modded again (wasting modders time as well). It's only logical to collaborate and help eachother out don't you think? If you have a perfect spread and add another difficulty which is the same as one you already have, whats the fucking problem? I think you're being way too cynical here...

finally after the dust settled i slid into ztrot's PMs like a motherfucker to understand how this blunder happened and make him understand why it happened. turns out hey! lower difficulties are gonna get that overhaul i advocate for, but it's (understandably since this hasn't been touched in at least 5 years) a project that's going to need time and hard work. and hey guess what that's what the ranking council is gonna work on and since they're full of people that understand what the fuck is going on in this game it will work well.

so chillax for a bit and learn to not kneejerk like a motherfucker when anything is decided. makes you look like a fucking tool.

Rest somewhat makes sense. However if people didn't get unreasonably mad over these ridiculous proposals peppy might not have reacted like he did and closed it down either. I'm proud that this community is still community driven after 8 years in which bad ideas are heavily criticized and brought to light by the "peons".

i dont understand why ranking has to be so fucking dramatic and nuanced, just rank maps that generally get good responses from players and are fun/complete/timed/hitsounded properly.

and then we have 0 issues whatsoever, except from people that try to force their ideals of 'quality' onto maps when they should just leave it alone if they don't like it and go play other maps like a sane person would. Right now it's about whether or not a few people think a map is good, not whether most people who will actually play it think it's good, and that's kind of bad.

You can't let people tell other people what they do and don't find fun, that's how you get sperglords like loctav posting shit like this because god forbid a map be challenging in any nontraditional way. If you can't play a map why are you even looking at it?

Then again, even assuming these arent problems, the PP system is so screwy atm that you could just give scoreboards to unranked maps, and exclude everything that isnt a pp farm map from even counting on your top ranks, and the entire system wouldn't really be any worse for wear. So I think we should polish the foundation more before we try to build so much around it.

also @Mr Color that was a great post, definitely helped me see you as more than just that guy who would bully people in ot back in the day

xxjesus1412fanx wrote:

So I think we should polish the foundation more before we try to build so much around it.

^ THIS, THIS AND THIS

Haha oh nice ive been clean for an entire year and have actively made changes to my behavior and staff still doesnt trust me

Bahaha but fuck me for actively making an effort to change that, right

Its almost as if i actually fucking believed anyone for a second when they said "you can change your history Reditum if you just dont get silenced so much, make an effort to be involved, and dont be a fucktard for a while"

Fuck me for giving a shit about this game right???

This is the kind of shit that makes me ragequit so much in the past. How long is "long enough" until i can actually get a fucking answer besides "oh well 2 years ago uncalled loctav a cunt so"

I legitimately honestly feel like shit like ive wasted the past fucking year of my life trying to improve only to learn that its done literally nothing.

Ephemeral wrote:

if that were the case, no changes would have ever been made to osu! since its original inception

there is no other game of this type available before us to work off - we are the pioneers

Umm, there's osu tatakae ouendan don't you know anything god

see you keep doing the whole "being a fucktard" thing which sets it back right to square one, truth

you should give many shits much more consistently and then people would be far more inclined to trust you again (maybe?)

also yeah i totally forgot that oto was a multiplayer game with user-made content and got like a few million unique users each month

MY BAD

anyway this thread lost any value it had so i'm outta here, peace

it's not worth being trusted by some of the cunts in charge, it has negative intrinsic value, don't waste mental or emotional energy on these guys reditum

ephemeral though, hes cool, not one of the people im talking about

Ephemeral wrote:

also yeah i totally forgot that oto was a multiplayer game with user-made content and got like a few million unique users each month

MY BAD

WELL I HOPE YOU LEARNED SOMETHING TODAY

Khelly wrote:

Ephemeral wrote:

also yeah i totally forgot that oto was a multiplayer game with user-made content and got like a few million unique users each month

MY BAD

WELL I HOPE YOU LEARNED SOMETHING TODAY

I SURE DID

oh shit i posted in this after i said i wouldn't

#staffgaffs2016

xxjesus1412fanx wrote:

it's not worth being trusted by some of the cunts in charge, it has negative intrinsic value, don't waste mental or emotional energy on these guys reditum

ephemeral though, hes cool

On one side I know that and im become more and more aware that im literally kicking a brick wall any time i want to express valid concerns to staff

On the other hand im literally holding back tears in my fucking programming class because regardless of anything, being explicitly told that a year of active work and change when i was literally ready to just get this account perma'd and move onto something else was entirely meaningless as my past is still something that lingers on, the literal reason i got denied from the BAT 3 years ago that (alongside with distateful comments from Wojjan) and the reason that ive been fighting a literal uphill battle in this game for so long.

And i think the worst thing is that people told me "nah bro you have a chance." even Loctav had told me that (see my Apology Thread in development) when its all a fucking lie. I wish someone could have just let me know that im better off not even trying.

be real, even if you had more pull do you really think you alone could change everything? At the end of the day it comes down to the agenda of a select few, dissidents are ignored. 40 pages of explosive negative backlash are essentially ignored, one idealistic former staff member is not enough. Just move on, the game is only worth being invested in if you're a player at this point. Or if you just stick around for the community..

even Peppy isnt enough, you still have Loctav and Zak posting after him trying to get their last word in. Zaks post got deleted, loctavs stays because he's actually important enough.

Very true. There are plenty of staff members that have tried being a link from staff to players only to run into the same issues as me.

Ive already had many recent "I told you so" moments happening over the past few months, but meh. Youd think id learn after 4+ years that my services arent appreciated and i shouldnt waste so much time on this.

I actually was able to get a refreshing break from this game by playing toontown. It might be good to get back into that.

the game is actually pretty decent if you do what i used to do, fire up the game and never even open the chat or talk to anyone unless they message you first. the chat is a shitstorm of autism and nazi modding, the multiplayer lobbies are awful, apparently being a mapper is just going to get worse. If you are purely and entirely invested in the simple and pure experience of clicking the circles, all the flaws of the pp system, the ranking criteria drama, the dictatorship of mods and qats are so far away and irrelevant that the game is enjoyable.

self improvement is the satisfying reason to keep playing, the carrot on the stick if you will. 90% of players are just playing the game. It's true that for the most part drama like this doesn't affect their experience at all, but if mappers are going to be scared off by shit criteria propositions, then well that DOES impact them.

ive said it before and ill say it again, mappers are the lifeblood of the game, a priceless resource in a game like this that relies entirely on community made content. The Staff should be doing their best to make as nutritional and wholesome of an environment as possible for them, but it's all about personal gain and controlling things with these people. It's absurd.

Nube wrote:

Actually you're full of shit here buddy, you have no idea what you're talking about. You're only thinking of one scenario (which is arguably not even a majority of the cases) and while if things ran like you imply, then it would be against the rules if 2 guys have mapped the same song, and only one of them has a full spread, the other sends him his diff to get it ranked and not have to make some time consuming low difficulty diffs and get all of them modded again (wasting modders time as well). It's only logical to collaborate and help eachother out don't you think? If you have a perfect spread and add another difficulty which is the same as one you already have, whats the fucking problem? I think you're being way too cynical here...

then make a collab difficulty. or make a new mapset. you're never wasting anyone's time by making two different sets on the same song. or else 80% of all TV Size anime songs would be a waste of time because they are mapped and play the exact same way.

else you can just wise up and make a difficulty that's of a skill level the mapset hasn't covered yet.

like really this should be common sense but since i'm getting called out maybe i should lay down the basics

also i really want to comment on CDFA's tiny violin but that's a can of worms i don't want to open at risk of hurting feelings ahh fuck it let's do it -- just know that redemption works to a certain standard - if 5 fucking years down the line you still can't be called trustworthy then there's a damn well good reason not to ever trust you in any endeavour you may want to partake in. You've been given more chances than anyone else i've ever known on the staff and blown it every single time. how about you take a real good look in the mirror and realize how much you've pushed the patience of everyone that has ever given you a chance and then reflect on why you're feeling so persecuted. Don't take your own failures out on other people that aren't accountable for them.

In other words, the staff may have its bunch of problems, but you'd just add up to the pile. live and learn.

this shall be my last post in this thread

Thx for giving me an ultimatum instead of fucking me over in the false pretense that i still have a chance.

Im realizing more and more that its over. Im out of chances.

Ill figure out a plan of action within the coming week