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Trouble with learning japanese

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19
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse
(I seriously have no idea where to post this thread// I was thinking about the "japanese" thread, but since this is in english.. D:)

Heya there guys,

I've got some trouble with the japanese language. I'm currently learning japanese and I got big problems with remembering the symbols of Hiragana/katakana and I somehow don't learn them. Normally I get used to languages fast, if I speak,read or write alot of it, but I have only classes twice a week and reading something like a newsletter is impossible, since I don't know kanji. I am on of the guys, who learned to speak english through games (or the internet) and I would love to the same with japanese, but there is always kanji and I don't even know the basics, how should I understand kanji then?

Basically I'm looking for texts, which are somehow interesting, or games in japanese with only hiragana and katakana, where I can translate f.e. the chatboxes and get used to the language step by step. I couldn't find much about it via google and I even tried to play Final Fantasy on japanese in hope to learn something, but instead I got hit by a super soaker loaded with kanji.

I really hope someone can help me with this problem and maybe it will even help others, who got the same trouble as I have.

love cya <3
Sayorie
975 posts
Joined December 2014
Sayorie
"Learning japanese grammar first is not the easiest way, but it is the best way to learning how to read japanese texts" (based on the app where I learned from below). Most friends which I know started on learning japanese phrases and ended up getting stumped on actual japanese texts.

This is a really good app that teaches you japanese the way the schools in japan teaches their students. I hope this can help you. Also, you won't be bored with this, since its approach is on the practical side.
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... mmar&hl=en

Regarding kanji, I don't think there is a shortcut to studying it. I guess you just have to familiarize and memorize them. Heck, even japanese people have trouble with kanji, having to depend on furigana at times.
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse
Thanks for the response!

I don't want to learn kanji yet, because I've got already enough trouble with hiragana and katakana. I guess, I will wait with kanji til my classes get their or maybe even a bit earlier, but for now hiragana and katakana means life. I will take a look into the app you suggested, maybe it can help me out, thanks a lot !
Dazardz
55 posts
Joined June 2014
Dazardz
I'm currently learning Japanese too, but I have to self teach because I don't have classes. I don't have trouble learning hiragana or katakana because I have an app that's pretty useful for remembering the characters. It's called Memrise. It does a great job at teaching hiragana or katakana (which is ultimately together called kana) through the app, but you can also do it on the website here.

It's on both the Google Play store and Apple Store, so you shouldn't have trouble finding the app either. After that, if you just get out your phone whenever you're free during the day and practice it for even a small amount of time, it's sure to make a difference. Hope what I've told you is useful to you, good luck.
Sayorie
975 posts
Joined December 2014
Sayorie
Also, the ultimate best way to quickly learn how to speak in japanese is to have a conversation with someone who really knows how to speak the language. The same way goes with the other languages actually. This way, your mistakes will quickly be corrected and you will be more familiar with the terms by using them in a conversation. As far as I know, the language is strict with the pronunciation, so it's also important to learn how to speak it, not just read it.

E.g. the 'r' sound in japanese is more of a roll-and-clip of the tongue to the frontal roof of the mouth--rather that flexing your tongue highly backward like we do in english--making it very similar to the 'l' sound. That is why L-words in english are translated to "r-syllables" in japanese. For example, Love Live in katakana is 「ラブライブ」, or rabu raibu
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse

Arthraxium wrote:

Also, the ultimate best way to quickly learn how to speak in japanese is to have a conversation with someone who really knows how to speak the language. The same way goes with the other languages actually. This way, your mistakes will quickly be corrected and you will be more familiar with the terms by using them in a conversation. As far as I know, the language is strict with the pronunciation, so it's also important to learn how to speak it, not just read it.

E.g. the 'r' sound in japanese is more of a roll-and-clip of the tongue to the frontal roof of the mouth--rather that flexing your tongue highly backward like we do in english--making it very similar to the 'l' sound. That is why L-words in english are translated to "r-syllables" in japanese. For example, Love Live in katakana is 「ラブライブ」, or rabu raibu
It's rather hard for me to have conversation in japanese, because I just have learned how to ask for the time and how to answer it. Basically I'm really at the beginning and I can't even ask your name or tell you my name. That's why I think, I'll do this a little bit later, when I know more. And about R/L I know that already mostly because of anime, where you can notice, that they say to "Julia" "Juria". But also because my teacher is japanese and she told us that, even that she got still problems pronuncing L/R in the german language, which makes it pretty funny to be honest for us :)


Dazardz wrote:

I'm currently learning Japanese too, but I have to self teach because I don't have classes. I don't have trouble learning hiragana or katakana because I have an app that's pretty useful for remembering the characters. It's called Memrise. It does a great job at teaching hiragana or katakana (which is ultimately together called kana) through the app, but you can also do it on the website here.

It's on both the Google Play store and Apple Store, so you shouldn't have trouble finding the app either. After that, if you just get out your phone whenever you're free during the day and practice it for even a small amount of time, it's sure to make a difference. Hope what I've told you is useful to you, good luck.
Thank you for your answer! :)First of, the only reason why I got classes is, because I'm studying and they giving away like 4 languages classes during your study time and I wanted to use them for japanese, because why not? :D I will try the app you suggested me maybe it can help me out! :D
EchizenMK2
4 posts
Joined April 2015
EchizenMK2
Best way to learn Japanese is to have an environment that forces you to make use of it. Eg, going to Japan. Having a chinese or Japanese background does help as the two can be pretty similar. Having someone who does know the language fluently is a major help. There is NO shortcut to learning Kanji. Except learning chinese but thats a pretty stupid way of learning it. Hiragana and katakana are practice, practice, practice. Drill them in and learn how to use it properly. (This is where your friend comes in to guide you) I wish you all the best. がんバて よ！
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse

EchizenMK2 wrote:

Best way to learn Japanese is to have an environment that forces you to make use of it. Eg, going to Japan. Having a chinese or Japanese background does help as the two can be pretty similar. Having someone who does know the language fluently is a major help. There is NO shortcut to learning Kanji. Except learning chinese but thats a pretty stupid way of learning it. Hiragana and katakana are practice, practice, practice. Drill them in and learn how to use it properly. (This is where your friend comes in to guide you) I wish you all the best. がんバて よ！
I don't have any asian environment unless you count russia as asian. I started to learn japanese, because I liked it from anime, hearing how they talk and even from osu with the songs, f.e. vocaloid. There are some songs, where I think, i don't know what you are singing, but I like it. Overall asian culture interested for a long time and I will be moving to japan after I end my studies, but until them I don't have a way to get an asian environment. I don't any have "friends" ( depends what friends means for you), who learns or learned japanese - most of them doesn't even care about anime or something from japan, they are more "west sided", if you could say it like that. The only ones I can talk to in japanese, if I could speak it better, are the guys in my studyclass, where we are like 25 guys, but I don't even know the name of 80% of them. What I tried once was, I went to japan-guide.com and searched there for "pen friends/friends" on the forum, but the guys, who contacted me wanted to speak german with me, because I'm native german.
Aomi
1,993 posts
Joined August 2013
Aomi

JeyMi wrote:

I started to learn japanese, because I liked it from anime, hearing how they talk and even from osu with the songs, f.e. vocaloid.
You do know that's not how they actually talk in Japan, do you?
And they aren't that much into vocaloid either iirc ;p
They despise weebs so good luck trying to talk to some of them about anime; though Akihabara sells all kinds of shit so yeah lol
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse

Aomi wrote:

JeyMi wrote:

I started to learn japanese, because I liked it from anime, hearing how they talk and even from osu with the songs, f.e. vocaloid.
You do know that's not how they actually talk in Japan, do you?
And they aren't that much into vocaloid either iirc ;p
They despise weebs so good luck trying to talk to some of them about anime; though Akihabara sells all kinds of shit so yeah lol
Anime woke my interest in the japanese language, I know that they don't talk in japan like they do in anime - I've watched some TV shows with eng subs on youtube. Anime was the first step for me towards the japanese language. I've been trying to learn more about the japanese culture, what they eat, how they interact f.e. I watched TV shows, mostly game shows tbh because they are hilarious ( gaki tsukai ). I also watched some interviews of japanese people, just to see how they really talk and I kept liking it. The more I learned or found out of japan, the more I liked it. I can't say how there dailylife really is or how I will like it there, but my mind is set. I want to move to japan for a while after I'm done with my studies and I don't want to be there with no knowledge of the japanese language. Don't know, how long I want to stay in japan, but I want to work and life there for about 5-10 years and if I keep liking it, I will stay in japan and maybe I'll be able to have a family there.

TL.DR. I'm learning japanese, because I started to like it alot and my plans are to move to japan one day for while or forever. Who know's ? ^^
EchizenMK2
4 posts
Joined April 2015
EchizenMK2

JeyMi wrote:

Aomi wrote:

JeyMi wrote:

I started to learn japanese, because I liked it from anime, hearing how they talk and even from osu with the songs, f.e. vocaloid.
You do know that's not how they actually talk in Japan, do you?
And they aren't that much into vocaloid either iirc ;p
They despise weebs so good luck trying to talk to some of them about anime; though Akihabara sells all kinds of shit so yeah lol

Anime woke my interest in the japanese language, I know that they don't talk in japan like they do in anime - I've watched some TV shows with eng subs on youtube. Anime was the first step for me towards the japanese language. I've been trying to learn more about the japanese culture, what they eat, how they interact f.e. I watched TV shows, mostly game shows tbh because they are hilarious ( gaki tsukai ). I also watched some interviews of japanese people, just to see how they really talk and I kept liking it. The more I learned or found out of japan, the more I liked it. I can't say how there dailylife really is or how I will like it there, but my mind is set. I want to move to japan for a while after I'm done with my studies and I don't want to be there with no knowledge of the japanese language. Don't know, how long I want to stay in japan, but I want to work and life there for about 5-10 years and if I keep liking it, I will stay in japan and maybe I'll be able to have a family there.
TL.DR. I'm learning japanese, because I started to like it alot and my plans are to move to japan one day for while or forever. Who know's ? ^^

That's cool. Osaka is my hometown and is a great place wink wink. *hinting where you should visit* But the internet isn't the best place to learn Japanese trust me. Having a jap neighbour makes it feel like overseas is home haha. Good luck.
Last edited by EchizenMK2 , edited 1 time in total.
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse

EchizenMK2 wrote:

That's cool. Osaka is my hometown and is a great place wink wink. *hinting where you should visit* But the internet isn't the best place to learn Japanese trust me. Having a jap neighbour makes it feel like overseas is home haha. Good luck.
I didn't even thought about where to visit so far :3(But I have to save up a bit of money to just visit japan once.. D: If I remember correctly it was like 600-800€ for me and that kinda depressed me and I stopped looking for other prices.) What I wanted to do for sure is to see the cherry blossom & summer festival. If I could talk somebody about japan or in japanese, that would be great, but the only ones I can do it to besides my classmates are japanese sushi restaurant, i guess and they don't even talk japanese unless you go visit the head cook, who most likely knows japanese. Basically if I could talk or hold normal conversations, I would f.e. join the osu #japanese chanel and maybe find their somebody to talk to me or I'll have to find someone somewhere in the internet, who I can add on skype/line and talk/call them there. But I don't really know about that :D
EchizenMK2
4 posts
Joined April 2015
EchizenMK2

JeyMi wrote:

EchizenMK2 wrote:

That's cool. Osaka is my hometown and is a great place wink wink. *hinting where you should visit* But the internet isn't the best place to learn Japanese trust me. Having a jap neighbour makes it feel like overseas is home haha. Good luck.

I didn't even thought about where to visit so far :3(But I have to save up a bit of money to just visit japan once.. D: If I remember correctly it was like 600-800€ for me and that kinda depressed me and I stopped looking for other prices.) What I wanted to do for sure is to see the cherry blossom & summer festival. If I could talk somebody about japan or in japanese, that would be great, but the only ones I can do it to besides my classmates are japanese sushi restaurant, i guess and they don't even talk japanese unless you go visit the head cook, who most likely knows japanese. Basically if I could talk or hold normal conversations, I would f.e. join the osu #japanese chanel and maybe find their somebody to talk to me or I'll have to find someone somewhere in the internet, who I can add on skype/line and talk/call them there. But I don't really know about that :D

Speaking of Japanese chefs, some are pretty friendly! well simple conversation is a good way to start and Japanese people do like it when you at least try to talk in our language. I'm sure the Japanese channel will have some english speakers but don't get your hopes up. ENglish class is terrible. Furthermore its not advised to speak english on the foreign channels. I would offer help but my Japanese is whack.
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse

EchizenMK2 wrote:

Speaking of Japanese chefs, some are pretty friendly! well simple conversation is a good way to start and Japanese people do like it when you at least try to talk in our language. I'm sure the Japanese channel will have some english speakers but don't get your hopes up. ENglish class is terrible. Furthermore its not advised to speak english on the foreign channels. I would offer help but my Japanese is whack.
I wasn't attending to go the japanese channel to speak english there :) If I could write/read more or less proper japanese,I would go in there and try to speak with them or make friends :D But for now, I'll try to learn with the 2 apps, which were suggested to me and If things going well, I will start again with Final Fantasy in japanese and learn the kanji, which will be thrown at me. At least I will learn a lot of vocab with it and even if I don't talk, I will be able to read and understand it and with that, I can continue my journey on different website and places and connect myself with others :3 If you like to, you can help me even if you think your japanese is whack :D Maybe in some weeks, I can help you too with it.
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse
With songs like these ones, I really started to like the japanese language more and more:
daoko - Girl https://vimeo.com/139288942
ME!ME!ME! feat.Daoko / TeddyLoid https://vimeo.com/114099080
Jitsu wa watashi wa opening https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIuZLbEyOIk
Sotsugyou Memories Sayonara Anata - Sawai Miku(I love this voice.) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRrBGOguDps

or f.e. claris and others - thought I share them with you for fun
piruchan
753 posts
Joined October 2013
piruchan
For hiragana and katakana:
Get one of those books with empty boxes instead of lines inside of them (not sure what they're called in English) and write the characters. Most courses would tell you to write one line or two line of the same characters, but no one is stopping you to fill an entire page with a single character if you want to. Ask someone who knows Japanese to check if your writing is correct. There are minor details in Japanese (and Chinese) characters that you might miss the first time you write it which might turn the character into something with an entirely different meaning, especially for kanji.
I'm talking about this kind of book

Do drills. Lots of them. If you're on Windows Phone, get Tango Master. That's the one I'm using.

For kanji:
Do the same as above, and learn radicals. Learn what they are, their meaning, and the sometimes strange (sometimes it just doesn't make sense) logic on how they create a single character. They're also going to help you remember characters by remembering what's left, right, top, down, inside, and outside.
As someone has said, learning Chinese characters helps you big time in this, but that's kind of a roundabout way of doing it.
neonat
Beatmap Nominator
3,535 posts
Joined April 2012
neonat
https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... a.katakana
The hiragana app is useful as well. Used this while I travelled between home and school. You will get the hang of it in no time ( I was only given about a week or two to learn each alphabet set by hard for my module)
Piine
1,573 posts
Joined March 2012
Piine
Hiragana I can successfully say it went easy for me. Katakana and Kanji was a rough start...
szeysse
18 posts
Joined October 2012
Topic Starter
szeysse
I thought, I let you know that these 2 apps helped me out alot so far. They helped me to memorize all the character and keep them. I was able to learn with them, if I was on Bus, train or even on the toilet for a bit - it really helped me alot. Now I can at least read hiragana and katakana properly - cant understand but read. ! :D

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.legendarya.helloandroid&hl=de
https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.legendarya.katakana&hl=de
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