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Let's talk about the mappool for the osu!mania world cup.

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Hydria
An open letter to the current mappool selectors:

So as discussed in twitch chat and in the #osumania chat, there's quite an upset with the maps that have been selected, due to most of them being biased towards certain mappers, not allowing other really good mappers enter the spotlight, and leaving the game in a negative view. Here, on request, and discussed with a couple of high level people, is a list of mappers that aren't being featured at the current moment that have really good published maps, and that should be considered for future mappool usage so we can at least end the tournament with a positive feeling:

Julie - https://osu.ppy.sh/s/283841
Zenx - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/671822
Blocko - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/760458 / https://osu.ppy.sh/s/171880
Mat - https://osu.ppy.sh/s/308765 / https://osu.ppy.sh/s/298553
LeiN- - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/570789
Shoegazer - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/763511 / https://osu.ppy.sh/b/716961
Fullerene- - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/554655
Ichigaki - https://osu.ppy.sh/s/276941 / https://osu.ppy.sh/s/264749
PiraTom - https://osu.ppy.sh/s/227106
Quick Draw - https://osu.ppy.sh/b/654145 / https://osu.ppy.sh/b/467324
Tidek - https://osu.ppy.sh/s/323163 / https://osu.ppy.sh/s/239048
DE-CADE - https://osu.ppy.sh/s/200552 / https://osu.ppy.sh/s/187154 / https://osu.ppy.sh/s/217951

Also, maps in this thread are considered good overall - t/162296


Anyone else can feel free to leave their own ideas of what good mappers exist, and will be added to the list if seems fit. Please don't just see and ignore this post mappool selectors, otherwise some unneeded discussions and rivalries may form in the community which can only cause it to go downhill.

Chinese translation (hopefully) coming soon.
Shoegazer
Meh.

I personally don't understand the insane backlash of this. While I understand why people are having an uproar because of this, I really don't think it's that much of an issue - considering that most of the maps picked are supposed to be ranked/qualified (though that criterion would probably be irrelevant at higher rounds) anyway. I don't really think the mappool is really that bad aside from one or two maps (though this might be personal preference but w/e). As far as I know most of the maps in the links provided are a tinge bit too difficult or too long, there doesn't seem to be much of a ranked selection in the 4.0-4.2* range that's 2 minutes that's not SDVX or rhythm game music.

Not to say that they don't deserve the backlash completely, having a lot of maps of a single mapper is generally not recommended unless the mapper is very versatile, which the mapper isn't. Overshot the amount of maps Spy had, but the thing about variation still applies. This is just a bit out of hand. Clam down.

Also thanks for listing my maps, though I personally don't think Blue Planet [Terra] is that good, neither is Hold Angel's Hallowed.
Topic Starter
Hydria

Shoegazer wrote:

Meh.

I personally don't understand the insane backlash of this. While I understand why people are having an uproar because of this, I really don't think it's that much of an issue - considering that most of the maps picked are supposed to be ranked/qualified (though that criterion would probably be irrelevant at higher rounds) anyway. I don't really think the mappool is really that bad aside from one or two maps (though this might be personal preference but w/e). As far as I know most of the maps in the links provided are a tinge bit too difficult or too long, there doesn't seem to be much of a ranked selection in the 4.0-4.2* range that's 2 minutes that's not SDVX or rhythm game music.

Not to say that they don't deserve the backlash completely, having a lot of maps of a single mapper is generally not recommended unless the mapper is very versatile, which the mapper isn't. This is just a bit out of hand. Clam down.

Also thanks for listing my maps, though I personally don't think Blue Planet [Terra] is that good, neither is Hold Angel's Hallowed.
The problem is that most of the maps are supposed to be ranked/qualified. With the way the ranking system is right now, most great mappers don't bother to get their maps ranked (but that's for another discussion) so we don't see great maps that could be picked overall. Also, the maps shown there are just an example of some of their good maps, not actual suggestions for the mappool.
Shoegazer

Hydria wrote:

The problem is that most of the maps are supposed to be ranked/qualified. With the way the ranking system is right now, most great mappers don't bother to get their maps ranked (but that's for another discussion) so we don't see great maps that could be picked overall. Also, the maps shown there are just an example of some of their good maps, not actual suggestions for the mappool.
I do agree that the ranking system is beyond arduous and is annoying and it discourages people who are proficient at mapping from another community to actually get their stuff ranked (I'm one of them for certain, so is Halogen-). But it is kind of a reward for putting in the effort more than anything else anyway to me, albeit probably not the best way to do so. That's a discussion for another time though, yes. And fair enough with the last point.

Again though, it's not that I completely disagree with the backlash, I just think that it's blown way out of proportion. I heard that the other mappools would be better, so I'd wait patiently for those.
Elementaires
what do you want to do? map selectors are QAT and they choose their maps, we cant do anything to it, i guess they dont care about twitch chat and the thread here anyway

it makes me smile when i see "maps will be better later" ; isnt a mappool need to be correct and balanced for each stage?

they probably ignored the "4k maps suggestions for world cup" thing
Halogen-
As someone who is not fond of the map pool for this round myself, I will go out and say that this backlash towards the map selectors is a bit ridiculous.

There are ridiculous claims that the map selectors took up 70%/80%/(some other untrue percentage) on a Reddit post, when in reality, they were only responsible for 5 of the 15 maps in this round. I've played all of the maps in the pool for the round of 16 to practice them - yes, while the diversity of mappers could be improved a bit, the diversity of maps (i.e. the actual maps in a physical level) are very much a different story. One look at Spy's maps in this pool can showcase that really easily.

One is a clusterfuck of burst and aggression (TRIGGER*HAPPY), another one is a really densely layered map that requires a lot of control (HEAVENLY MOON), the other is generally tame and quite honestly in my opinion, probably one of Spy's best maps (Ambitious).

Do I really need to discuss the other maps and put them down by BPM, overall structure, mapper, etc? I think the better thing to do is stop the arguing and antagonizing, and just wait for the next map pool. A lot of people are looking forward to that over this one, but kicking and screaming like a toddler having a tantrum is going to do nothing more than aggravate people.
Topic Starter
Hydria

Halogen- wrote:

As someone who is not fond of the map pool for this round myself, I will go out and say that this backlash towards the map selectors is a bit ridiculous.

There are ridiculous claims that the map selectors took up 70%/80%/(some other untrue percentage) on a Reddit post, when in reality, they were only responsible for 5 of the 15 maps in this round. I've played all of the maps in the pool for the round of 16 to practice them - yes, while the diversity of mappers could be improved a bit, the diversity of maps (i.e. the actual maps in a physical level) are very much a different story. One look at Spy's maps in this pool can showcase that really easily.

One is a clusterfuck of burst and aggression (TRIGGER*HAPPY), another one is a really densely layered map that requires a lot of control (HEAVENLY MOON), the other is generally tame and quite honestly in my opinion, probably one of Spy's best maps (Ambitious).

Do I really need to discuss the other maps and put them down by BPM, overall structure, mapper, etc? I think the better thing to do is stop the arguing and antagonizing, and just wait for the next map pool. A lot of people are looking forward to that over this one, but kicking and screaming like a toddler having a tantrum is going to do nothing more than aggravate people.
Ok, we know the original backlash was a bit overdoing it, but it's still a point that needs brining up due to the rules the map selectors have to follow. If we include victorica_db in that list, that makes 8/15. Half the mappool shouldn't go towards 3 people, maybe 2 maps max per mapper seems fair in any stage. Trying to force map selectors to heavily bias ranked maps over unranked maps just means we don't see mappools that could've been a higher tier than what they are currently. This point needs to be brought up now regardless of the news of the next mappools being better as what stops this happening against next year? If we want tournaments in the future to be better, there needs to be a discussion now.
Halogen-
I like how victorica's being added a part of the issue as a repeat issue, but I don't see anyone making any claims about the fact that SanadaYukimura had two maps featured either (not that they should, both maps are quite respectable). It's just the same group circlejerk raging against the same other group of mappers at this point. Active mania players know that Victorica and Spy are raged about all the time, and this is no different.

EDIT: also, I'm not taking the fact that you linked other maps into this argument here, because I wouldn't doubt that there probably is some decent material in there. I'm arguing purely off of principle.
Starry-
We understand all of your concerns regarding the diversity in mappers for the RO16 mappool, and quite simply it will definitely be improved in time for the Quarterfinals mappool release.

In regard to the mappool competency, our main aim was to provide a diversity of map types suitable for tournament play, a majority being from our current ranked maps. We believe we did this well. Qualia was picked for it's low bpm density, whilst Invitation from Mr.C was picked for containing suitable high bpm patterns. Violet Soul was picked for any teams to use as an advantage as it is a trickier LN map, whilst Dadadadadadadadadada was picked for it's 1/3 jacks. gigadelic(m3rkAb4# R3m!x) was picked for teams with better stream consistency, whilst HEAVENLY MOON was picked for it's density and [13][24] streams, and so on.

In terms of the form suggestions, each one was looked at. Out of our 250+ suggested maps, a large majority of them were not suited for the difficulty range for the RO16 mappool. And regardless, even if they were, some maps have difficulties we plan on potentially using for the later stages of the tournament, so they could be not used at this time. Meanwhile, some maps already had their lower difficulties used in the Group Stages mappool, so they could also not be used. Not to mention other maps were either authentics or from IIDX (which were clearly stated for people not to request). Maps such as https://osu.ppy.sh/b/489080&m=3 that were suggested was declined due to the majority of the map being very easy for most participants, up to a difficulty spike near the end, whilst https://osu.ppy.sh/b/492841&m=3 was declined since the Slider Velocity was a bit over the top to transition into a really dense section, which we didn't deem too be too good for tournament play, and the list goes on.

However we did not heavily consider source to be much of a deciding factor when picking out charts for the MWC (considering the already-limited amount of ranked maps we have here in osu!mania), and we know this was not ideal on our part. We will look to have it influence our decisions a lot more in the future and, quite simply, we apologise for any inconvenience caused by this lack of mapper diversity.
Tidek
Yeah, that is true, diversity of structure/styles of maps is pretty well done in mappool. The only bad thing where everyone agree is trigger happy being bad as in your example (44teru) because of difficulty spike.

And tie breaker should be a style mixed map, unfortunately kanshou only decides who burst 123412341234 better. Map like Haelequin extended vet. could be a lot better for tie breaker because of BIG VERIETY of patterns.
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