Makan1 wrote:

the riot literally would've died down in like 10 mins TOP
chill.

I wasn't handling it (was in transit at the time), but I agree with the decisions made. There's no harm in turning off chat to let people calm down. And it worked.

And yes, I do understand that twitch gives the game popularity, but that's not one of my primary goals. I have never wanted to see the game grow faster than it naturally is. Yes, from a "marketing" and "profits" perspective this is just stupid, but osu! is not a commercial project to me, even though it may be so by nature.

peppy wrote:

I wasn't handling it (was in transit at the time), but I agree with the decisions made. There's no harm in turning off chat to let people calm down. And it worked.

Considering people are still arguing about it right now at this very moment, I wouldn't say it "worked".

The main reason 'it worked' was because 99% of the people who were 'rioting' got timed out for 10 minutes, lol.

If gaining popularity isn't your primary goal for the OWC, what is your goal exactly? I mean.. I can only applaud you for not thinking purely business, but what is it that you strife for then?
- Entertainment value? A part of this is the Twitch chat experience. However immature you may find it, it's still valuable to a lot of people (if that wasn't apparent enough by the discussion going on at the moment).
- Esports viability? With how unstable the client is (e.g. disconnects from Bancho), this is incredibly hard to achieve at the moment. Unless you're gonna make a local tournament, so that people can play offline (and this is pretty much impossible to achieve).
- Bringing the community together? It sure is working, just not the way you probably intended it to.

Now listen, take what you want from whatever I'm saying, I mean.. I've been playing this game for only 4-5 months, so what do I know? But I do think there could and should be a change in the way this tournament (and even the game as a whole, not really relevant to this particular discussion though) is being handled.

peppy wrote:

Makan1 wrote:

the riot literally would've died down in like 10 mins TOP
chill.

I wasn't handling it (was in transit at the time), but I agree with the decisions made. There's no harm in turning off chat to let people calm down. And it worked.

And yes, I do understand that twitch gives the game popularity, but that's not one of my primary goals. I have never wanted to see the game grow faster than it naturally is. Yes, from a "marketing" and "profits" perspective this is just stupid, but osu! is not a commercial project to me, even though it may be so by nature.

What is the primary goal for OWC then? Most of not all e-sport tournaments are either made for entertainment or to promote the game. Unless you're enjoying the drama that is coming out on the forums and reddit, I don't really understand what you're trying to do with OWC.

peppy wrote:

Subscriber mode was not a mistake. It will be used again if people botspam the chat.

I was mostly just referring to the sub mode when people were spamming "dududu" when Darude - Sandstorm was playing. It was removed almost instantly after it was put on. That's why I called it a mistake, because I assumed all the moderators agreed it was okay for the viewers to spam that just once.

All the other occasions when sub mode was put on I have no saying in.

things are out of your control

Plaatinum wrote:

What is the primary goal for OWC then? Most of not all e-sport tournaments are either made for entertainment or to promote the game. Unless you're enjoying the drama that is coming out on the forums and reddit, I don't really understand what you're trying to do with OWC.

Probably bring some friendly competition to the top players, and some enjoyment to the spectators. Which in most cases, it does achieve.

The tournament is for players' enjoyment, specifically those playing and those interested in watching. Trust me that the majority of viewers are enjoying it, and the majority of players are enjoying their time in the tournament. If not then they are free to not participate.

Bancho "instability" is actually not bancho's end, but the user's. Unfortunately most osu! players are not diligent about their personal security and tehrefore succumb to being attacked by others with relatively weak DoS attacks.

I'm not going to continue posting in here, as I'd rather this discussion was about the amazing plays we've seen so far.

peppy wrote:

The tournament is for players' enjoyment, specifically those playing and those interested in watching. Trust me that the majority of viewers are enjoying it, and the majority of players are enjoying their time in the tournament. If not then they are free to not participate.

Bancho "instability" is actually not bancho's end, but the user's. Unfortunately most osu! players are not diligent about their personal security and tehrefore succumb to being attacked by others with relatively weak DoS attacks.

I'm not going to continue posting in here, as I'd rather this discussion was about the amazing plays we've seen so far.

Is it possible to make the viewer experience a bit better by delaying the stream for about a minute so we don't get any lag or ghost misses? On the stream, half the combo breaks are usually not actually combo breaks, and it makes the whole viewing experience very anti-climatic.

The stream is already buffered. The "fake misses" are being actively worked on, and should be fixed by next weekend. It's more complex than you may think. That said, "fake misses" are already at the point where they recover within 1 second. The audio desync was due to some experimental code that was tested this weekend which performed poorly. I didn't have much control over that and was not present when it was deployed, else I would not have allowed it.

But that Japan vs Sweden match, right? Am I the only one that found it entertaining?

peppy wrote:

The stream is already buffered. The "fake misses" are being actively worked on, and should be fixed by next weekend. It's more complex than you may think. That said, "fake misses" are already at the point where they recover within 1 second. The audio desync was due to some experimental code that was tested this weekend which performed poorly. I didn't have much control over that and was not present when it was deployed, else I would not have allowed it.

But that Japan vs Sweden match, right?

I only just remembered this, so I thought I might add on as well.

Another way to improve viewer experience would be to increase the background dim. We're here to watch the players play, and bright backgrounds always blend with the circles and its especially hard to see notes when watching the stream on a lower quality.

peppy wrote:

But that Japan vs Sweden match, right? Am I the only one that found it entertaining?

nope : ) I was grabbing my hair when Sweden won because the only asian team that I cared about lost. really surprising how in the span of 1 year, players can grow in immense potential and take down some of the strongest players. I hope to see more of it when Austria shreks the next team they face. I wonder if an Austria V Germany match is possible because thats what I wanna see. but the way its going, I really looks like thats gonna happen *_*

Makan1 wrote:

I wonder if an Austria V Germany match is possible

only in the loser bracket because nl is going to wreck germany

silmarilen wrote:

Makan1 wrote:

I wonder if an Austria V Germany match is possible

only in the loser bracket because nl is going to wreck germany

woooooooo

shots fired

or in the finals, how would you like that?

peppy wrote:

I am very familiar with twitch chat. That doesn't change my opinion on moderation. If you don't like it then please do not watch. osulive is our channel run by our staff. This is our turf, not yours. Go to another twitch channel if you want your free reign.

No, this is our turf as well. We play this game. We view this game. We experience this game just like you guys do. The entertainment value will be far greater when chat is moderated by the correct people. You don't like the twitch chat - fine. Then leave it yourself perhaps. I'm sorry, but this logic seems childish to me. I can understand one not liking twitch chat, but the civil discussion is being held in #owc. The hype chat is twitch chat. Both needs are being represented, one through the in-game client and one through twitch. We do not need a heavily moderated hype channel only because you do not like the hype.

Plaatinum wrote:

peppy wrote:

The stream is already buffered. The "fake misses" are being actively worked on, and should be fixed by next weekend. It's more complex than you may think. That said, "fake misses" are already at the point where they recover within 1 second. The audio desync was due to some experimental code that was tested this weekend which performed poorly. I didn't have much control over that and was not present when it was deployed, else I would not have allowed it.

But that Japan vs Sweden match, right?

I only just remembered this, so I thought I might add on as well.

Another way to improve viewer experience would be to increase the background dim. We're here to watch the players play, and bright backgrounds always blend with the circles and its especially hard to see notes when watching the stream on a lower quality.

Talking about skinning change, I know there is a reason to use the default skin and it's all cool but couldn't we make the 300s transparent? It's really hard to keep up when player is dropping his accuracy, especially on stream heavy maps or with names like WubWoofWolf or AmaiHachimitsu that are too long to see accuracy % on the screen.

WWW carry

poland ftw

here2pown wrote:

WWW carry

poland ftw

Say it once more, I double dare you

Jetzu wrote:

Plaatinum wrote:

increase the background dim. We're here to watch the players play, and bright backgrounds always blend with the circles and its especially hard to see notes when watching the stream on a lower quality.

300s transparent? It's really hard to keep up when player is dropping his accuracy

I support this. Invisible 300s are pretty much part of every personal skin as it gets seriously obstructive during game play. The OWC has higher level maps which means an even great amount of notes so for simplicity sake omitting the constant 300s would help the viewers get a better view of the play.

GladiOol wrote:

peppy wrote:

I am very familiar with twitch chat. That doesn't change my opinion on moderation. If you don't like it then please do not watch. osulive is our channel run by our staff. This is our turf, not yours. Go to another twitch channel if you want your free reign.

No, this is our turf as well. We play this game. We view this game. We experience this game just like you guys do. The entertainment value will be far greater when chat is moderated by the correct people. You don't like the twitch chat - fine. Then leave it yourself perhaps. I'm sorry, but this logic seems childish to me. I can understand one not liking twitch chat, but the civil discussion is being held in #owc. The hype chat is twitch chat. Both needs are being represented, one through the in-game client and one through twitch. We do not need a heavily moderated hype channel only because you do not like the hype.

From what I saw in the video clip, that looked more like a digital riot. Plus, people were spamming the Twitch chat so they needed to stop the disruption somehow because I'm sure of any of the mod were to tell them to stop, they would keep spamming. I said this in the osu subreddit but, the osulive stream, to me, is mainly for watching seeing as the chat "normally" is zipping by so quickly. Anyways, I'm off to sleep. Godspeed everyone and that's my purse, I don't know you.

-Ephemeral- wrote:

Jetzu wrote:

increase the background dim. We're here to watch the players play, and bright backgrounds always blend with the circles and its especially hard to see notes when watching the stream on a lower quality.

300s transparent? It's really hard to keep up when player is dropping his accuracy

I support this. Invisible 300s are pretty much part of every personal skin as it gets seriously obstructive during game play. The OWC has higher level maps which means an even great amount of notes so for simplicity sake omitting the constant 300s would help the viewers get a better view of the play.

I dont think there is a need for invisible '300's. there are plenty of players who still use a visible '300' but what they do need to change is the 300, 100, and 50 because they all look the fking same and its impossible to tell if a player hit a 300 or a 100. On the VERY old skin, you can see the 300, 100, 50, but not the hitcircle. now you can see the hitcircle but cant distinguish between the 300,100,50..... will there ever be a balance?

??? something weird happened with the quoting looollolo so manual

GladiOol wrote:

peppy wrote:

I am very familiar with twitch chat. That doesn't change my opinion on moderation. If you don't like it then please do not watch. osulive is our channel run by our staff. This is our turf, not yours. Go to another twitch channel if you want your free reign.

No, this is our turf as well. We play this game. We view this game. We experience this game just like you guys do. The entertainment value will be far greater when chat is moderated by the correct people. You don't like the twitch chat - fine. Then leave it yourself perhaps. I'm sorry, but this logic seems childish to me. I can understand one not liking twitch chat, but the civil discussion is being held in #owc. The hype chat is twitch chat. Both needs are being represented, one through the in-game client and one through twitch. We do not need a heavily moderated hype channel only because you do not like the hype.

Amen.
Especially about the bold parts.

To me, this is exactly as if you went to a professional soccer match, and expected the spectators to... just... "behave themselves" and silently watch the match while holding a serious discussion about the performance of the players in the stadium. This will NEVER happen, thankfully, because of that hype.
Soccer supporters want to show how much they love their team, and overall, just want to have fun. Which is achieved by screaming, shouting, singing, praising a player when he scores, taunting an opponent who's messing up, doing the wave, being mad at the referee's decisions if they find it unfair, etc.
What do we have in twitch chat ? People supporting their teams, cheering them, praising their favorite players ( ヽ(｡･ω･｡)ﾉ raise your rrtyui's ヽ(｡･ω･｡)ﾉ ), making fun of that only guy who didn't FC while his whole team FC'd, being mad at the referee's decisions (like someone gets DC'd and the point is still given to the other team for example), etc.

And guess what, people enjoy it. Yes, this is what the twitch chat is all about, the "hype". Just as Gladi said, the civil discussion is held on #owc + forums, just let us shout it out on twitch. I perfectly understand that some people might hate it, but in the end it doesn't hurt anyone. Prohibiting it would irritate quite a lot of people, though.
(oh and please stop banning the Kappa emote on twitch. Like, seriously, twitch without Kappa is like a Street Fighter game without Ryu. You wouldn't remove Ryu, would you ? e_e)

If street fighter looked like this, sorry but I would remove Ryu.

peppy wrote:

If street fighter looked like this, sorry but I would remove Ryu.

That must be pretty fucking awesome to play, though.

GladiOol wrote:

peppy wrote:

I am very familiar with twitch chat. That doesn't change my opinion on moderation. If you don't like it then please do not watch. osulive is our channel run by our staff. This is our turf, not yours. Go to another twitch channel if you want your free reign.

No, this is our turf as well. We play this game. We view this game. We experience this game just like you guys do. The entertainment value will be far greater when chat is moderated by the correct people. You don't like the twitch chat - fine. Then leave it yourself perhaps. I'm sorry, but this logic seems childish to me. I can understand one not liking twitch chat, but the civil discussion is being held in #owc. The hype chat is twitch chat. Both needs are being represented, one through the in-game client and one through twitch. We do not need a heavily moderated hype channel only because you do not like the hype.

^This.

Twitch chat is twitch chat, thats just what it is, and people love it. Even if there's a riot, let them riot for 5 minutes. They'll stop eventually and everything's fine. Thats how this works. Taking something away and tons of silences will make them remember forever though.
You can take stuff like Kappa away from the osu chat, sure. But taking twitch away from twitch is rather dumb/lame.

There's several ways to ignore the chat anyway, just make it full screen or use windowed mode or something.

Minifrij wrote:

There's several ways to ignore the chat anyway, just make it full screen or use windowed mode or something.

or just click the hide button

peppy wrote:

If street fighter looked like this, sorry but I would remove Ryu.

I could deal with it. The Ryus, not the removal.

here2pown wrote:

WWW carry

poland ftw

can this please stop it is so annoying

www fcing with nomod, farto fcing with hr on freemod, who gets hyped by chat AND commentators? www of course.
3 people on polish team have same acc, commentators: "look at this amazing acc from www"

i basically have to mute the stream when poland is playing because it is SO annoying.
yes he is a good player and shit but this is just going too far and disrespecting all the other players too much.

cptnXn wrote:

here2pown wrote:

WWW carry

poland ftw

can this please stop it is so annoying

www fcing with nomod, farto fcing with hr on freemod, who gets hyped by chat AND commentators? www of course.
3 people on polish team have same acc, commentators: "look at this amazing acc from www"

i basically have to mute the stream when poland is playing because it is SO annoying.
yes he is a good player and shit but this is just going too far and disrespecting all the other players too much.

That's something that every team with one stand-out player has to deal with.

I know it's not right and especially for the game against France all the players deserved more credit than they got, but it is like it is, when you play fans are also focused on you because you're "the guy who FCd Freedom Dive".

WW is very known player and you could say he's osu! celebrity. When you watch Portugal play football commentators also treat it like it's Cristiano Ronaldo & friends. Hell, same with Poland and Lewandowski. You may see headlines after the game "Portugal won 3:0, Ronaldo didn't score" just because he's this fameous.

Like I said, I agree that especially commentators should pay more attention to other playes, but casual fan knows 3 polish players - WW, Rafis and Niko (maybe also Adamqs as "that cheater who gets unbanned after 1 day") and it's really pointless for anyone to get mad at them for only noticing WW when Poland is playing. Let them just be, you won't convince them that Fartownik, Amai, Sterrum and Wilchq had just as big if sometimes not bigger role in Poland winning.

its annoying me with myself aswell, yeah its kind of to be expected but i just stated my opinion there. I hate it because others deserve way more attention, for example first time OWC players who consistently play good are just not even mentioned once, thats pretty sad

edit: and if someone can change that atleast a bit it would be the commentators, thats what im hoping for
the chat will always be www fangirls all the way

I haven't watched any of Poland's matches but I can definitely say the commentators weren't only focusing on the star players in the matches I've watched. They didn't orgasm over happystick, sapphireghost or dragonhuman. I would say they're focusing a lot on unpopular people in fact because I would not have noticed MathClass pretty much fced every map she played during her match against China. I would say the commentators are doing a good job at not focusing on the superstar players. They do sound very awkward though.

I really hope peppy stays true to his word and next week we can watch the matches without any fake combo breaks. Surprised he didn't fix it last year.

pielak wrote:

I haven't watched any of Poland's matches but I can definitely say the commentators weren't only focusing on the star players in the matches I've watched. They didn't orgasm over happystick, sapphireghost or dragonhuman. I would say they're focusing a lot on unpopular people in fact because I would not have noticed MathClass pretty much fced every map she played during her match against China. I would say the commentators are doing a good job at not focusing on the superstar players. They do sound very awkward though.

I really hope peppy stays true to his word and next week we can watch the matches without any fake combo breaks. Surprised he didn't fix it last year.

i haven't really seen too much hype for star players either, other than the occasional comment on how well they're doing on the song which pretty much all players playing in the current map gets

I think on free mod picks, the commentators should focus more on the players that have the mods on rather than the no mods because the mods turned on is what makes the match interesting. In fact, I hope that free mods bracket turns into more of a mirror mod next year, minus flashlight (has anyone actually picked fl?...)

the whole nl team picked hd fl on a warmup map, but that doesnt really count dat 400 combo from synchro tho

cptnXn wrote:

here2pown wrote:

WWW carry

poland ftw

can this please stop it is so annoying

www fcing with nomod, farto fcing with hr on freemod, who gets hyped by chat AND commentators? www of course.
3 people on polish team have same acc, commentators: "look at this amazing acc from www"

i basically have to mute the stream when poland is playing because it is SO annoying.
yes he is a good player and shit but this is just going too far and disrespecting all the other players too much.

I really want to make a compilation video with the best ones 8)

pielak wrote:

... MathClass pretty much fced every map she played during her match against China.

Wow, really? I had no idea. Very cool!

!Warning - this post can contain engrish! You have been warned.
I'd like to talk about 2 things:

1. Situation with Twitch chat.
It is just my oppinion, but this chat is hype chat and you cant change it no matter how much you try. OWC stream has about 3k viewers. Lets say that only about 15% of those ppl actually type in chat (wchitch is +- 450). You just suimply can not have discussion (of any kind) with so many participants, because the voice of 1 man sinks in screaming of the others.
Twitch chat is very similar to fans on stadium - they scream (caps on), they sing simple songs (dududududududdu), they cheer for their favourite players and they very easly get hyped.
So I don't see why you should not let them do those things.
If some one doesn't like crowds on stadium he just watches match in TV at his house, where he can enjoy game and comments of casters more than he could at stadium. Same thing should be with Twitch - if you dont like it's chat just hide it (there is button for that), or watch on full screen, and let others get hyped.
And if you wish to have "discussion" about match just use #OWC in game.

I dont say that this chat should be let on its own - there still should be timeouts for ppl spaming pastas (etc.) not related to match, or OSU! in general.

2. Lets call it "WWW Case". I watched PL vs FR game and I think that some of you just overreact. Yes, WWW is very often praised for his perfromance, but it is not like the other playes don't get credit... For me it looked like this: "WWW still with double S", 2-3 sec later "AmaiHachimitsu and NerO have perfect score as well".
I understand that for some players this can be annoying and they can recive this as "kind of staying in shadow of WWW", but as Jetzu said - he is something like celebrity of OSU and you just have to face it. (Or maby build your own picture, and become "celebrity" as well )

BTW. There is big improvement in casters job compared to last year, so I dont see reasons to complaining about this. Keep on good work.

Just free Twitch chat

zyvik wrote:

!Warning - this post can contain engrish! You have been warned.
I'd like to talk about 2 things:

1. Situation with Twitch chat.
It is just my oppinion, but this chat is hype chat and you cant change it no matter how much you try. OWC stream has about 3k viewers. Lets say that only about 15% of those ppl actually type in chat (wchitch is +- 450). You just suimply can not have discussion (of any kind) with so many participants, because the voice of 1 man sinks in screaming of the others.
Twitch chat is very similar to fans on stadium - they scream (caps on), they sing simple songs (dududududududdu), they cheer for their favourite players and they very easly get hyped.
So I don't see why you should not let them do those things.
If some one doesn't like crowds on stadium he just watches match in TV at his house, where he can enjoy game and comments of casters more than he could at stadium. Same thing should be with Twitch - if you dont like it's chat just hide it (there is button for that), or watch on full screen, and let others get hyped.
And if you wish to have "discussion" about match just use #OWC in game.

I dont say that this chat should be let on its own - there still should be timeouts for ppl spaming pastas (etc.) not related to match, or OSU! in general.

2. Lets call it "WWW Case". I watched PL vs FR game and I think that some of you just overreact. Yes, WWW is very often praised for his perfromance, but it is not like the other playes don't get credit... For me it looked like this: "WWW still with double S", 2-3 sec later "AmaiHachimitsu and NerO have perfect score as well".
I understand that for some players this can be annoying and they can recive this as "kind of staying in shadow of WWW", but as Jetzu said - he is something like celebrity of OSU and you just have to face it. (Or maby build your own picture, and become "celebrity" as well )

BTW. There is big improvement in casters job compared to last year, so I dont see reasons to complaining about this. Keep on good work.

Just free Twitch chat

nope. And yes casters are doing an amazing job! and also Mods <3

peppy wrote:

The stream is already buffered. The "fake misses" are being actively worked on, and should be fixed by next weekend. It's more complex than you may think. That said, "fake misses" are already at the point where they recover within 1 second. The audio desync was due to some experimental code that was tested this weekend which performed poorly. I didn't have much control over that and was not present when it was deployed, else I would not have allowed it.

But that Japan vs Sweden match, right? Am I the only one that found it entertaining?

You are not alone that match was amazing i was sure Sweden would loose, maybe eu country can win this year we'll see. #GoSweden