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B1rd
so instead of trying to hit to the beat of the song you should try and change the offset to compensate for you own sense of rhythm?
Vuelo Eluko

B1rd wrote:

so instead of trying to hit to the beat of the song you should try and change the offset to compensate for you own sense of rhythm?
Martell

Riince wrote:

B1rd wrote:

so instead of trying to hit to the beat of the song you should try and change the offset to compensate for you own sense of rhythm?
Mathsma

B1rd wrote:

so instead of trying to hit to the beat of the song you should try and change the offset to compensate for you own sense of rhythm?
You're missing the point. There are an incredible amount of songs that are incorrectly timed, he is saying you can fix that by changing your local offset.

I wouldn't do it because I am lazy and there are simply too many songs to even bother.
Woobowiz

Mathsma wrote:

B1rd wrote:

so instead of trying to hit to the beat of the song you should try and change the offset to compensate for you own sense of rhythm?
You're missing the point. There are an incredible amount of songs that are incorrectly timed, he is saying you can fix that by changing your local offset.

I wouldn't do it because I am lazy and there are simply too many songs to even bother.
I thought it was a ranked prerequisite to have a map timed properly....
Mathsma

Woobowiz wrote:

I thought it was a ranked prerequisite to have a map timed properly....
It is probably better handled now, but in the past there were many maps that were ranked with hardly passable timing.
KagamiHRS
Some maps do has late timing and so I had up adjust local offset like -5 to -15 ms. Most of them are timed properly though. I rely on the hit sounds so my UO is 0 ms.
I do hit very accurately so that isn't the real issue.
Maxis

Martell wrote:

Riince wrote:

wow these forums' quote limitations tho

This guide may work on old (quite old) maps that are genuinely mistimed, but most of the time (especially on maps past 2011) you're actually just hitting too late or too early. Woobowiz is correct: mistimed maps are unrankable now, even if they're noticably off by just a couple of milliseconds. Changing offset based off of your own hit 'offset' rather than the map's timing, making the map's offset actually off and mistimed, will actually screw up your sense of rhythm further if you do it for most of your maps, and you'll end up deterring your accuracy in the future because you won't know how to time hits worth crap.

My point is is that if you hit too early or too late on certain maps and you change the offset when it's already correct, you'll just be setting yourself up for failure because you'll learn how to get good accuracy by hitting too early or too late (not by actually timing properly). If you do this too often, your accuracy will actually be pretty bad since you will never push yourself to learn how to time your hits properly--which is what accuracy is all about.

Also...

Mathsma wrote:

You're missing the point. There are an incredible amount of songs that are incorrectly timed, he is saying you can fix that by changing your local offset.
Mistimed maps are out there, I will admit, but I don't think there are as many as you say because of the current ranking criteria. I'm not saying never change the local offset, but what I am saying is always check whether a map is mistimed or you're mistiming the map before changing the local offset. Most of the time it will be the latter (unless you're retro and you exclusively play maps from 2008), which is why this is damaging for accuracy.

Also sorry for lengthy explanation, but really felt like I had to shed some light on why this is a bad idea.

TL;DR: check a map's timing before screwing with the offset.
Kouya-

Mathsma wrote:

I wouldn't do it because I am lazy and there are simply too many songs to even bother.
buny

B1rd wrote:

so instead of trying to hit to the beat of the song you should try and change the offset to compensate for you own sense of rhythm?
How does changing the offset "compensate for ones sense of rhythm"?
It doesn't change how the map plays to the beat, it simply shifts the timeline.

Also, pretty much only old maps are going to have the wrong offset and this is a pretty bad way on determining offset because it only gives you a general idea of if you're too early or too late - in your screenshot we can see that you hit notes too late too, and a lot can factor into this such as streams (nobody will ever perfectly maintain a long stream without having to compensate speed).

You should only be changing offset if you know for certain that it's off.
Vuelo Eluko

buny wrote:

B1rd wrote:

so instead of trying to hit to the beat of the song you should try and change the offset to compensate for you own sense of rhythm?
How does changing the offset "compensate for ones sense of rhythm"?
It doesn't change how the map plays to the beat, it simply shifts the timeline.

Also, pretty much only old maps are going to have the wrong offset and this is a pretty bad way on determining offset because it only gives you a general idea of if you're too early or too late - in your screenshot we can see that you hit notes too late too, and a lot can factor into this such as streams (nobody will ever perfectly maintain a long stream without having to compensate speed).

You should only be changing offset if you know for certain that it's off.
it's rarely or never off enough to cause a noticeable hit error margin that can't be made up by simply playing better. this is just an unnecessary chore.
a waste of time, even.
GoldenWolf

Woobowiz wrote:

I thought it was a ranked prerequisite to have a map timed properly....
It is, but apparently inaccuraries of ~10ms are acceptable.
Lach

GoldenWolf wrote:

Woobowiz wrote:

I thought it was a ranked prerequisite to have a map timed properly....
It is, but apparently inaccuraries of ~10ms are acceptable.
More like +/- 5. I've had quite a few maps changed online by 6-7ms in the past.
pooptartsonas
I change my offset fairly often, but honestly I wouldn't recommend it unless you're consistent enough to know for sure that your misplaying is due to the song being mistimed, rather than your own inconsistency. If you're an accuracy player though, on OD10 it really does make quite the difference; I think you guys are underestimating how many maps are out there that are mistimed enough to actually affect play.
Dexus
To get higher accuracy it's better to IGNORE the hit error bar (one less thing to look at/worry about while playing). Instead focus on what the hitsounds relate to in the music and time it in sync with them. Also fixing your UO takes priority over messing with LO. The only time you really need to mess with the LO is when the map is clearly and painfully out of sync; the couple ms inaccuracy are acceptable because windows itself fluctuates plus I don't think anyone can hit a stable -1/+1 every time they play. If you're seeing that on EVERY map you're playing that you hit early or late then it's commonly 2 things: 1) your UNIVERSAL offset is wrong 2) you're not listening to the music.

To fix your universal offset simply go download the offset wizard song by peppy and put these sounds into your skin [ http://puu.sh/9BkRs.zip ] Then go into the options and open up the offset wizard (Have the offset wizard song by peppy playing). Stop the music and raise the offset to +10 or +20 and then start it; every tick try and lower it by 1ms until the sound shifts to a deeper almost muted kind of sound. From there go further about 3ms and you should be fine. If you're uncertain about it you should be able to hit stop and then play, the metronome ticks should sound the same as before you stopped the music. I use -5ms on my laptop, -3ms on my desktop. Commonly I see computers be within this range.
Topic Starter
Moeri
I think some people also did not read everything, because in the beginning I clearly said that it also depends on hardware, some keyboards have delay and some only tiny.

If keyboard is very sensitive, it means even if you click right on the beat, it clicks earlier, like mine. I mostly have to use -10 and -15ms offset.
^Edit: What I mean with if you click right on the beat it clicks earlier is that, it's very common amongst players who has used standard keyboards to click the button almost/all the way down to activate it.
If keyboard is average then you might not have to change offset so much.

And I am NOT forcing you anything, do not blame me for putting up tips. And please think well before you post(like the thing about that it's rather the song that could be timed incorrectly than you click in wrong timing).

Any how, I already listed a few factors that affects your accuracy:
- Keyboard delay
- Song timed incorrectly
- Your skin's hitsound could have delays
- Soundcard issue where it's not made for listening to music and messes up

... or you're just generally bad when it's about clicking to the rhythm. (practice makes perfect!)
Topic Starter
Moeri

Dexus wrote:

To get higher accuracy it's better to IGNORE the hit error bar (one less thing to look at/worry about while playing). Instead focus on what the hitsounds relate to in the music and time it in sync with them. Also fixing your UO takes priority over messing with LO. The only time you really need to mess with the LO is when the map is clearly and painfully out of sync; the couple ms inaccuracy are acceptable because windows itself fluctuates plus I don't think anyone can hit a stable -1/+1 every time they play. If you're seeing that on EVERY map you're playing that you hit early or late then it's commonly 2 things: 1) your UNIVERSAL offset is wrong 2) you're not listening to the music.

To fix your universal offset simply go download the offset wizard song by peppy and put these sounds into your skin [ http://puu.sh/9BkRs.zip ] Then go into the options and open up the offset wizard (Have the offset wizard song by peppy playing). Stop the music and raise the offset to +10 or +20 and then start it; every tick try and lower it by 1ms until the sound shifts to a deeper almost muted kind of sound. From there go further about 3ms and you should be fine. If you're uncertain about it you should be able to hit stop and then play, the metronome ticks should sound the same as before you stopped the music. I use -5ms on my laptop, -3ms on my desktop. Commonly I see computers be within this range.
I don't think ignoring hit error bar is a very good idea because it DOES work as it should and it's for you to diagnose(not sure how to spell) between your click timings and the actual song, rather than the beatmap itself, because it's the beatmap that's mostly not right.

And I'm not sure why but universal offset never really worked for me, I still get same delay even if I put -15ms comparing to put -15ms manually.
nrl

Lach wrote:

More like +/- 5. I've had quite a few maps changed online by 6-7ms in the past.
This work of art has an online offset of 15ms.
Vuelo Eluko

NarrillNezzurh wrote:

Lach wrote:

More like +/- 5. I've had quite a few maps changed online by 6-7ms in the past.
This map has an online offset of 15ms.
I believe "Map" is a rather exaggerated term for this.
nrl
You're right, edited.
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