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[Proposal - Metadata] Include singing in character as part of CV/VO rule

posted
Total Posts
14
aceticke
Global Moderator
236 posts
Joined August 2016
Topic Starter
aceticke
Current rule is as follows:

When a fictional character is credited as the singer of a song, their credit is to be formatted in a Character (CV: Voice Actor) or Character (VO: Voice Actor) format. For live action, credit the voice actor only.
Reword suggestion is as follows:

When a fictional character is credited as the singer of a song, their credit is to be formatted in a Character (CV: Voice Actor) or Character (VO: Voice Actor) format. For live action, credit the voice actor only. If a song is attributed to a fictional character and their voice actor is credited as the singer, it may also be formatted as such.
open to rewording for easier understanding
Stompy_
Beatmap Nominator
870 posts
Joined March 2020
Stompy_
+1 on this imo seems like a good way to deal with CV markers
Drum-Hitnormal
Beatmap Nominator
1,710 posts
Joined March 2011
Drum-Hitnormal
can you provide some specific cases this would apply?

`If a song is attributed to a fictional character` -> how do you determine this? the character is not part of the metadata

it could be case of the CV doing a song as solo artist without relation to the character
ex: beatmapsets/1955030#mania/4049154
Last edited by Drum-Hitnormal , edited 1 time in total.
aceticke
Global Moderator
236 posts
Joined August 2016
Topic Starter
aceticke

Drum-Hitnormal wrote:

can you provide some specific cases this would apply?

`If a song is attributed to a fictional character` -> how do you determine this? the character is not part of the metadata

it could be case of the CV doing a song as solo artist without relation to the character
Literally any western movie where they credit a song sung in character to the actor, which is what brought this proposal up in the first place.

Generally context clues help, especially watching the character sing it.
Last edited by aceticke , edited 1 time in total.
Doormat
2,049 posts
Joined September 2013
Doormat

aceticke wrote:

Drum-Hitnormal wrote:

can you provide some specific cases this would apply?

`If a song is attributed to a fictional character` -> how do you determine this? the character is not part of the metadata

it could be case of the CV doing a song as solo artist without relation to the character
Literally any western movie where they credit a song sung in character to the actor, which is what brought this proposal up in the first place.

Generally context clues help, especially watching the character sing it.
There are cases where they bring in a big-name artist/actor to cameo/star as a character in a movie and have them perform a song as that character, but the song is still credited to the person and not the character (for example: will.i.am in Madagascar 2, Jack Black in the recent Super Mario Movie, Beyoncé in the Lion King remake, Idina Menzel in Frozen)

While I personally think we should keep to the original source metadata whenever possible, I do agree with including CV/VO as an optional choice when it's heavily implied

edit: added some more examples and fixed some wording
Last edited by Doormat , edited 4 times in total.
-Flashlight-
Beatmap Nominator
549 posts
Joined February 2017
-Flashlight-
+1
Ryu Sei
2,897 posts
Joined October 2013
Ryu Sei
When the song is heavily implied to be sung by the character while it's officially credited to the artist instead, it's a good idea to make it as optional choice. Whichever works best!

Or simply allow it to dropped to the tags instead if it raises concern.
Last edited by Ryu Sei , edited 1 time in total.
h3oCharles
1,496 posts
Joined July 2016
h3oCharles
would this affect when CV or VO is to be used? there's a footnote specifying when to use one of them, but you aren't proposing to change it or merge it here

asking this cuz idk how it could affect this mod beatmapsets/1843213/discussion/-/generalAll#/3591127
aceticke
Global Moderator
236 posts
Joined August 2016
Topic Starter
aceticke

h3oCharles wrote:

would this affect when CV or VO is to be used? there's a footnote specifying when to use one of them, but you aren't proposing to change it or merge it here

asking this cuz idk how it could affect this mod beatmapsets/1843213/discussion/-/generalAll#/3591127
It wouldn't change anything, the actor credit remains the same as current rules.
Drum-Hitnormal
Beatmap Nominator
1,710 posts
Joined March 2011
Drum-Hitnormal
my concern is this needs more wording to indicate when it is appropriate to use. Make it more clear.

like you said `Generally context clues help, especially watching the character sing it.` this is a helpful clause to add

some ppl might start confusing solo artist vs a character song by CV, like the case:

Waki Azumi in Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear, she sing a song as solo artist but also voiced a character in the anime. But the song is not related to that character. It would be wrong to add CV in this case.

this is a pretty frequent case for anime, most common one being Kito Akari probably
Last edited by Drum-Hitnormal , edited 1 time in total.
aceticke
Global Moderator
236 posts
Joined August 2016
Topic Starter
aceticke

Drum-Hitnormal wrote:

my concern is this needs more wording to indicate when it is appropriate to use. Make it more clear.



some ppl might start confusing solo artist vs a character song by CV, like the case:

Waki Azumi in Kuma Kuma Kuma Bear, she sing a song as solo artist but also voiced a character in the anime. But the song is not related to that character. It would be wrong to add CV in this case.

this is a pretty frequent case for anime, most common one being Kito Akari probably
Current wording should be okay as is, it specifically states it must be attributed to a character, thus being sung in character.
rosario wknd
850 posts
Joined April 2015
rosario wknd
Just remove the For live action, credit the voice actor only. caviat entirely, its unecessary and counterintuitive.

I don’t really understand how a character being in live action completely circumvents this rule, they’re still playing/representing a fictional character regardless of how they’re presented.
Last edited by rosario wknd , edited 1 time in total.
Jonarwhal
1,227 posts
Joined November 2013
Jonarwhal

Drum-Hitnormal wrote:

can you provide some specific cases this would apply?

`If a song is attributed to a fictional character` -> how do you determine this? the character is not part of the metadata

it could be case of the CV doing a song as solo artist without relation to the character
ex: beatmapsets/1955030#mania/4049154
I think this would apply for something like this
https://youtu.be/cPAbx5kgCJo

It would make Auli’i Cravalho and Moana (CV: Auli’i Cravalho) both acceptable
Okoayu
Nomination Assessment Team / Elite Nominator
4,952 posts
Joined May 2012
Okoayu
will reraise this point for the CV / VA section in community/forums/topics/1894663
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