manishmathur wrote:

then why i am not improving fast ? -_-

manishmathur wrote:

then why i am not improving fast ? -_-

RagingTsunami wrote:

I think IryN is a secret multiaccount slowly trying to convince a group of 20 people on the forums to buy their osu course

-s12 wrote:

You can have the "best" mindset and be the worst player.
You can also have the "worst" mindset and the best player.

The only thing about your mindset that either stops you from or keeps you going is whether you get discouraged or not.

Some may say that being focused on results is "bad mindset", but how do you expect a player to push himself if he doesn't care about the results?

https://www.twitch.tv/afrodafroosu/clip/LuckyDaintyHamburgerKAPOW?filter=clips&range=30d&sort=time

https://youtu.be/xfMLtzH1ONg?t=832

Notice the contrast here?

Yhuan Debeste wrote:

RagingTsunami wrote:

I think IryN is a secret multiaccount slowly trying to convince a group of 20 people on the forums to buy their osu course

hm

IryN wrote:

Recently I've been trying to figure out how exactly did I improve so fast and hit 4 digit with only 350 hours in the game. I didn't want to end up with just talent or genetics as my answer so I started to look on youtube to see how differently I play from other people.

After watching a couple of vids I noticed that a lot of the people that I watch tend to get frustrated whenever they choke a score or just aren't doing good in general. It made me realize that I've never been frustrated by a choke nor have I ever raged at the game. If I choke, the first thing that comes into my mind is "wait that's actually doable, I'll try that again" and not "holy shit that could've been such a good play if I didn't mess up"

I did some more research and came across a video by digitalhypno on mindset. He talked about growth mindset and fixed mindset, you can go look it up but if you don't want to then basically growth mindset is having the belief that skill and talent can be improved and fixed mindset is believing that talent is fixed and cannot get better.


TL;DR, If you want to improve, stop raging over chokes and bad days. Stop talking about genetics and how genetics is the only reason top players are good. And stop believing that it's hard to improve. Believe that you can get better over time.

Thank you for coming to my Ted talk

Machiavellian wrote:

IryN wrote:

Recently I've been trying to figure out how exactly did I improve so fast and hit 4 digit with only 350 hours in the game. I didn't want to end up with just talent or genetics as my answer so I started to look on youtube to see how differently I play from other people.

After watching a couple of vids I noticed that a lot of the people that I watch tend to get frustrated whenever they choke a score or just aren't doing good in general. It made me realize that I've never been frustrated by a choke nor have I ever raged at the game. If I choke, the first thing that comes into my mind is "wait that's actually doable, I'll try that again" and not "holy shit that could've been such a good play if I didn't mess up"

I did some more research and came across a video by digitalhypno on mindset. He talked about growth mindset and fixed mindset, you can go look it up but if you don't want to then basically growth mindset is having the belief that skill and talent can be improved and fixed mindset is believing that talent is fixed and cannot get better.


TL;DR, If you want to improve, stop raging over chokes and bad days. Stop talking about genetics and how genetics is the only reason top players are good. And stop believing that it's hard to improve. Believe that you can get better over time.

Thank you for coming to my Ted talk

I think thats kinda cap, I literally never rage at the game yet i dont improve like you. I know I can improve and obv top players put in insane amounts of work. The issue isnt the fact that I cant imrpove, its that I want to know how others do it so quickly. Talent doesn't make you a good player, but it makes you a better player faster.

Machiavellian wrote:

I think thats kinda cap, I literally never rage at the game yet i dont improve like you. I know I can improve and obv top players put in insane amounts of work. The issue isnt the fact that I cant imrpove, its that I want to know how others do it so quickly. Talent doesn't make you a good player, but it makes you a better player faster.

IryN wrote:

I think you're just kinda proving my point by saying, that's kinda cap. You already don't believe that a good mindset helps which kinda ruins the entire point of what I said. That or this advice just isn't for you.

IryN wrote:

TL;DR, If you want to improve, stop raging over chokes and bad days.

IryN wrote:

TL;DR, If you want to improve, stop raging over chokes and bad days. Stop talking about genetics and how genetics is the only reason top players are good. And stop believing that it's hard to improve. Believe that you can get better over time.

Thank you for coming to my Ted talk

Lmited wrote:

IryN wrote:

I think you're just kinda proving my point by saying, that's kinda cap. You already don't believe that a good mindset helps which kinda ruins the entire point of what I said. That or this advice just isn't for you.

The reason he doesn't believe that a good mindset helps, is because, he says he's had a good mindset for most of the time he's been playing, and still has not improved as fast as you have.

Voidedosu wrote:

IryN wrote:

TL;DR, If you want to improve, stop raging over chokes and bad days. Stop talking about genetics and how genetics is the only reason top players are good. And stop believing that it's hard to improve. Believe that you can get better over time.

Thank you for coming to my Ted talk

Are you trying to tell me something after last night?

Almost wrote:

Having a growth mindset will help but you can still be the best player in the world with a fixed mindset. In Carol Dweck's book, Mindset, she gives the example of John McEnroe who became the world number 1 in tennis despite having a fixed mindset.

manishmathur wrote:

I noticed that on maps which i enjoy i score better and map which i don't really enjoy have not that good score.

That's why learning a specific skill is hard if you not enjoying it

-s12 wrote:

manishmathur wrote:

I noticed that on maps which i enjoy i score better and map which i don't really enjoy have not that good score.

That's why learning a specific skill is hard if you not enjoying it

It's the other way around. You have fun because you see how good you are at the particular skillset/skillsets that the map requires you to be good at in order to set a nice score. And when you try playing something else that requires a skillset you suck at you have less fun because you realize how bad you are at that particular skillset.

I think this phenomenon is called cognitive bias. You should look into it.

Voidedosu wrote:

Almost wrote:

Having a growth mindset will help but you can still be the best player in the world with a fixed mindset. In Carol Dweck's book, Mindset, she gives the example of John McEnroe who became the world number 1 in tennis despite having a fixed mindset.

THat sounds like if your fixed mindset is already that you're the cream of the crop so being #1 is more like an expectation than anything.

-s12 wrote:

It's the other way around. You have fun because you see how good you are at the particular skillset/skillsets that the map requires you to be good at in order to set a nice score. And when you try playing something else that requires a skillset you suck at you have less fun because you realize how bad you are at that particular skillset.

I think this phenomenon is called cognitive bias. You should look into it.

Fxjlk wrote:

Mindset is a dumb topic to talk about for improvement in osu, it makes little difference. If you spend many hours trying to improve but make little progress then mindset is the least of your issues.

Mindset is only good for consistency. This only matters for tourneys since pp mainly measures peak skill.

-s12 wrote:

It's the other way around. You have fun because you see how good you are at the particular skillset/skillsets that the map requires you to be good at in order to set a nice score. And when you try playing something else that requires a skillset you suck at you have less fun because you realize how bad you are at that particular skillset.

I think this phenomenon is called cognitive bias. You should look into it.

I disagree, I think it goes both ways. If you have fun you perform better, if you perform better you have more fun.

Its a chicken or the egg scenario

Voidedosu wrote:

But you can perform worse but still have fun, or perform better but not have any fun at all?

Fxjlk wrote:

Mindset is a dumb topic to talk about for improvement in osu, it makes little difference. If you spend many hours trying to improve but make little progress then mindset is the least of your issues.

Mindset is only good for consistency. This only matters for tourneys since pp mainly measures peak skill.

-s12 wrote:

It's the other way around. You have fun because you see how good you are at the particular skillset/skillsets that the map requires you to be good at in order to set a nice score. And when you try playing something else that requires a skillset you suck at you have less fun because you realize how bad you are at that particular skillset.

I think this phenomenon is called cognitive bias. You should look into it.

I disagree, I think it goes both ways. If you have fun you perform better, if you perform better you have more fun.

Its a chicken or the egg scenario

Almost wrote:

I don't think having a good mindset really matters in times when things are going well and you're having fun because those times are really easy. Having a good mindset is only really useful when you aren't having fun because you've hit a plateau or are playing on tilt.

Fxjlk wrote:

Almost wrote:

I don't think having a good mindset really matters in times when things are going well and you're having fun because those times are really easy. Having a good mindset is only really useful when you aren't having fun because you've hit a plateau or are playing on tilt.

I agree that having a good mindset is a good thing and it helps with plateaus and tilt. The problem is that other factors are way more important for improvement. The other problem is that a good mindset is intangible and there are more pragmatic things that can be focused on to improve.

Almost wrote:

But I think you would agree that there are no downsides to actually working on your mindset and that improving your mindset would actually help you improve at the game faster at least in a small way?

Machiavellian wrote:

(for some reason quoting isnt working for me lol)

I think you're just kinda proving my point by saying, that's kinda cap. You already don't believe that a good mindset helps which kinda ruins the entire point of what I said. That or this advice just isn't for you.- IryN


I don't understand how saying I don't agree with your opinion proves your opinion is correct lol. I don't rage over chokes and bad plays. I don't say that genetics is the only reason top players are good, and I do not believe that improving is hard. Yet our outcomes are not the same yet possessing a similar mindset which kinda proves in and of itself that your point is incorrect about mindset being a large role in improvement. It helps sure, but not in the way you think. A bad mindset may make you quit for example which obviously stops your improvement but as long as you don't give up mindset doesn't make you a better player at all. I no offense believe that these freaks of nature who improve insanely fast have zero clue why and don't want to believe its genetic even though evidence points to it being the case which shows due to how vague everyone's answer on how to improve quickly. I truly believe now that top players or people who improve abnormally fast really do nothing different from normal players at all, they just think they do lol. They are simply more talented. Like I said before, talent DOESN'T automatically make you a good player, but it DOES make you a BETTER player FASTER. I know anyone can improve and its easy, but thats not the point. Its the RATE of improvement. This isn't saying you don't work hard, you simply get more results from your work than the average player.

IryN wrote:

Machiavellian wrote:

(for some reason quoting isnt working for me lol)

I think you're just kinda proving my point by saying, that's kinda cap. You already don't believe that a good mindset helps which kinda ruins the entire point of what I said. That or this advice just isn't for you.- IryN


I don't understand how saying I don't agree with your opinion proves your opinion is correct lol. I don't rage over chokes and bad plays. I don't say that genetics is the only reason top players are good, and I do not believe that improving is hard. Yet our outcomes are not the same yet possessing a similar mindset which kinda proves in and of itself that your point is incorrect about mindset being a large role in improvement. It helps sure, but not in the way you think. A bad mindset may make you quit for example which obviously stops your improvement but as long as you don't give up mindset doesn't make you a better player at all. I no offense believe that these freaks of nature who improve insanely fast have zero clue why and don't want to believe its genetic even though evidence points to it being the case which shows due to how vague everyone's answer on how to improve quickly. I truly believe now that top players or people who improve abnormally fast really do nothing different from normal players at all, they just think they do lol. They are simply more talented. Like I said before, talent DOESN'T automatically make you a good player, but it DOES make you a BETTER player FASTER. I know anyone can improve and its easy, but thats not the point. Its the RATE of improvement. This isn't saying you don't work hard, you simply get more results from your work than the average player.

well that's exactly what I agree with, I just think that it would be better if you ignore talent and genetics because knowing it won't help you at all. The way I see it, saying someone is more talented than is just gonna slow you down since it makes you think that there's no way to catch up to that person because they are more talented. Instead, if you just ignore that they're more talented, it would get you more motivated to improve or help you avoid a fixed mindset. What you're saying IS true but I think it's in every players best interest to ignore it and just focus on getting better. I hope that made sense (ﾉ◕ヮ◕)ﾉ

Machiavellian wrote:

I mean it may make some people feel better knowing that they aren't doing anything wrong and you just might have to grind more but as a whole I do believe it would make people just feel worse but I feel the need to say the facts because I feel that someone who is going out of their way to seek answers on how to improve quickly should get them if there even are any. I do agree that it doesn't really help anyone but neither does saying don't get mad at game and people should have accurate information if they want it.

Mikaruge wrote:

I've literally only seen good taiko performances when I felt good about playing for instance.

IryN wrote:

Update: I'm slowly leaning into the idea that genetics plays a big role in making a player. If not genetics then talent. Why? I tried playing 3mod around an hour ago and instantly started getting 2 miss A rank plays on slow 4* DT maps. I showed some scores to some friends and the response was mostly "what the fuck" so either genetics is helping me or 3mod isn't that hard.

Either way you should still ignore genetics and talent and focus on being the best player you can be. It's gonna help you in the long run.

e: hard work is still of course the most significant part of your improvement. It would probably take up 95% of how good you'll be and genetics is only on the 5%. But you definitely cannot say that genetics isn't a thing, because it is. It's not as significant as hard work. But it's definitely there.

Simon12 wrote:

IryN wrote:

Update: I'm slowly leaning into the idea that genetics plays a big role in making a player. If not genetics then talent. Why? I tried playing 3mod around an hour ago and instantly started getting 2 miss A rank plays on slow 4* DT maps. I showed some scores to some friends and the response was mostly "what the fuck" so either genetics is helping me or 3mod isn't that hard.

Either way you should still ignore genetics and talent and focus on being the best player you can be. It's gonna help you in the long run.

e: hard work is still of course the most significant part of your improvement. It would probably take up 95% of how good you'll be and genetics is only on the 5%. But you definitely cannot say that genetics isn't a thing, because it is. It's not as significant as hard work. But it's definitely there.

it's not genetics

Simon12 wrote:

IryN wrote:

Update: I'm slowly leaning into the idea that genetics plays a big role in making a player. If not genetics then talent. Why? I tried playing 3mod around an hour ago and instantly started getting 2 miss A rank plays on slow 4* DT maps. I showed some scores to some friends and the response was mostly "what the fuck" so either genetics is helping me or 3mod isn't that hard.

Either way you should still ignore genetics and talent and focus on being the best player you can be. It's gonna help you in the long run.

e: hard work is still of course the most significant part of your improvement. It would probably take up 95% of how good you'll be and genetics is only on the 5%. But you definitely cannot say that genetics isn't a thing, because it is. It's not as significant as hard work. But it's definitely there.

it's not genetics

IryN wrote:

Update: I'm slowly leaning into the idea that genetics plays a big role in making a player. If not genetics then talent. Why? I tried playing 3mod around an hour ago and instantly started getting 2 miss A rank plays on slow 4* DT maps. I showed some scores to some friends and the response was mostly "what the fuck" so either genetics is helping me or 3mod isn't that hard.

Either way you should still ignore genetics and talent and focus on being the best player you can be. It's gonna help you in the long run.

e: hard work is still of course the most significant part of your improvement. It would probably take up 95% of how good you'll be and genetics is only on the 5%. But you definitely cannot say that genetics isn't a thing, because it is. It's not as significant as hard work. But it's definitely there.

Lmited wrote:

Some people put countless hours in and don’t get any results, and the fix isn’t as simple as “work harder” or “have a good mindset”

Lmited wrote:

Sometimes there just isn’t a fix

Simon12 wrote:

Lmited wrote:

Some people put countless hours in and don’t get any results, and the fix isn’t as simple as “work harder” or “have a good mindset”

I agree.

Lmited wrote:

Sometimes there just isn’t a fix

I disagree.

KupcaH wrote:

Yeah, some people put in a lot of hours without getting results but that doesn't mean that there's no fix to that. With the right approach, you can always get better.

Maybe very slowly, but still possible.

Simon12 wrote:

KupcaH wrote:

Yeah, some people put in a lot of hours without getting results but that doesn't mean that there's no fix to that. With the right approach, you can always get better.

Maybe very slowly, but still possible.

I think a slow improver could turn into a fast improver.

KupcaH wrote:

Maybe, but I think if someone got to that point where he's hard stuck for a really long time, he definitely developed tons of bad habits that it'll be very hard to get rid of.

Simon12 wrote:

KupcaH wrote:

Maybe, but I think if someone got to that point where he's hard stuck for a really long time, he definitely developed tons of bad habits that it'll be very hard to get rid of.

I don't think it would be any harder than it would be to keep playing the same way.
It would take a little time to adjust, no doubt, but I don't think it would take as long as you probably think it would take.

Simon12 wrote:

Mikaruge wrote:

I've literally only seen good taiko performances when I felt good about playing for instance.

this is just anecdotal

I've had sessions where I've been pissed off, sad, bored or happy and none of that seemed to have any direct link to how well I performed during those sessions. Why would your emotional state make any difference here? I don't understand.

KupcaH wrote:

Nah, I don't agree. Changing 'grips/techniques/the way you play game' after playing that way for long time feels like trying to write with another hand. And most importantly, it's super hard to maintain grip or whatever without automatically going back to what you were doing before, as it just feels too natural for you.

KupcaH wrote:

I've developed a really weird way of singletapping with my middle finger(always was my dominant one), and I just couldn't move past 210bpm singletapping speed mark no matter how much I've tried(and trust me, I've tried a lot of different approaches and spend A LOT of time to practice it). After like half year~ of almost ineffectual practice I just gave up on that idea and learned how to alternate.

KupcaH wrote:

Until now I struggle to singletap consecutive jumps of even 200~ bpm with my middle finger. I recently tried to randomly singletap with my index and found out that I don't have any issues even with 250~ bpm jumps, even though I've never practiced or even tried to singletap with it.

KupcaH wrote:

tl;dr I disagree, it's very likely to take way more time to adjust than just "a little time". It all depends on how strongly these bad habits are ingrained in you.

BeeCat wrote:

i have 230h and can hit rasputin jumps, almost passed lemon tree, can play yomi yori, soundchimera rolling pandemonium 220bpm or hightechnological 220bpm and on a tournament the commentators thought i was cheating on the map we used as a warmup… but my consistency is bad i need a lot of tries to fc something since all i do is play hard maps and my area is rly small…
but yeah well said, whenever i hold a combo i get nervous but thinking, this map is easy its so slow i can read every circle… then you start to really improve… but i dont know how i was able to learn how to play 230bpm spaced streams with only 230h of playtime i havent seen anyone hit those with that little playtime