Shiro wrote:

- the spacing feels completely erratic
- the map uses AR9 for a song that is described by the mapper themselves as "calm"
- the map uses highly inconsistent extended sliders some of which are slowed down and with jumps afterwards which makes the map extremely confusing to read and awkward to play

Strawberry wrote:

i'm sorry Broccoly. ; ;
good luck for the re-rank.

Raging Bull wrote:

forever unranked for 2 months. Let's see.

dkun wrote:

With the thoughts of other BAT's and myself, I'm afraid I'm going to have to unrank this. There should be other BAT's (Irreversible and UWS) following up with a mod post, but my initial unrank reason is that the offset needs +10 and notable problems in the Broccoly diff that need to be addressed.

Shiro wrote:

- the spacing feels completely erratic
- the map uses AR9 for a song that is described by the mapper themselves as "calm"
- the map uses highly inconsistent extended sliders some of which are slowed down and with jumps afterwards which makes the map extremely confusing to read and awkward to play

1. 00:20:571 - Make sure to resnap the delayed break.
   
2. 00:32:501 (1,1) - If you could reduce some distance there, that would be great.
   
3. 00:49:202 - Needs to be 15% volume on the end like the other sliders.
   
4. 01:03:676 (1) - Whistle missing on head?
   
5. 01:04:704 (1,2) - I'd like it moved up a bit for nicer flow. Try it.
   
   Example

   
6. 01:15:667 (3) - Needs 1 grid left to equalize the spacing in this anti-jump pattern.
   
7. 01:17:037 (1) - Missed whistle on the head. Also if you don't like this placement, you can revert back and try something more like this:
   
   Example

   
   I think it played better this way tbh. It's nice to have some spacing between them.
8. 01:29:713 (1,1) - For consistency purposes I'd like to move the slow down slider to 01:30:055. That's what the player will be expecting here. Mainly it's consistent with 01:32:111 (1).
   
   Example

   
9. 01:30:226 - Something strange going on with the volume here, I think you forgot to bring it back up.
   
10. 01:43:791 (1) - Could be nicer if you started the spinner in 1/4 at 01:43:834.
    
11. 01:44:615 - Don't change the SV in the middle of the spinner. It would be nicer to move this timing section to 01:44:786.
    
12. 01:59:175 - Need to resnap the ending of the break to here.
    
13. 02:17:332 (1,1) - If you could reduce some spacing there it would be nice, it's extremely difficult not to get a 100 on the first slider. Maybe you could curve 02:17:674 (1) more.
    
14. 02:27:609 (3) - Move to (332,236) plays really nice and fits with your style here.
    
    Example

    
15. 02:28:979 (1) - 3/4 slider feels bad here because it's inconsistent with patterns before like 02:20:757 (1,2,3) where the music was the same. I'd like you to shorten this slider by 1/4.
    
16. 02:30:007 (1) - Same idea, the 3/4 doesn't fit, it would play much better if you extended this slider by 1/4.
    
17. 02:50:562 - Add a note and move the spinner 1/4 forward plays really nicely. Try it.
    
    Example

    

1. 00:03:473 (1) - What's the reason for 1/3 snap here? Oh you fixed that.
   
2. 00:56:482 (5,6,7) - That pattern is ridiculous if you ask me. It's more logical to read that spacing as 1/2 and not 1/4. It might be alright if this was the second appearance of that rhythm, but because it's the first, I think you should go for lesser spacing like 01:00:593 (4,5,6).
   
3. 01:44:786 - Two timing sections on the same spot here.
   
4. 01:59:175 - How about end the break here like the other difficulties?
   
5. 02:34:118 - Why do you reduce volume so much here for the second half of kiai? It's pretty strange, I wouldn't reduce volume until 02:48:507 or so when the music starts to fade.

1. 00:22:224 (1) - Remove whistle sounds much better for me.
   
2. 00:20:571 - Resnap delayed break.
   
3. 01:59:175 - Resnap the break ending.

UnitedWeSin wrote:

Hi Broccoly.

AR9 is necessary imo. agreed

[Insane]

1. 00:20:571 - Make sure to resnap the delayed break. done
   
2. 00:32:501 (1,1) - If you could reduce some distance there, that would be great. placed white 1 in a different place
   
3. 00:49:202 - Needs to be 15% volume on the end like the other sliders. fixed
   
4. 01:03:676 (1) - Whistle missing on head? fixed
   
5. 01:04:704 (1,2) - I'd like it moved up a bit for nicer flow. Try it. real nice. thanks!
   
   Example

   
6. 01:15:667 (3) - Needs 1 grid left to equalize the spacing in this anti-jump pattern.fixed
   
7. 01:17:037 (1) - Missed whistle on the head. Also if you don't like this placement, you can revert back and try something more like this:tried reverting back.. dunno if that's good enough..
   
   Example

   
   I think it played better this way tbh. It's nice to have some spacing between them. yeah same
8. 01:29:713 (1,1) - For consistency purposes I'd like to move the slow down slider to 01:30:055. That's what the player will be expecting here. Mainly it's consistent with 01:32:111 (1). for this I'd like to keep it since it plays well nevertheless, and i really like the pattern myself...
   
   Example

   
9. 01:30:226 - Something strange going on with the volume here, I think you forgot to bring it back up. my bad
   
10. 01:43:791 (1) - Could be nicer if you started the spinner in 1/4 at 01:43:834. i don't like that empty feeling between 1/4... that's why i used 1/8 to minimize that..
    
11. 01:44:615 - Don't change the SV in the middle of the spinner. It would be nicer to move this timing section to 01:44:786. done
    
12. 01:59:175 - Need to resnap the ending of the break to here. good catch
    
13. 02:17:332 (1,1) - If you could reduce some spacing there it would be nice, it's extremely difficult not to get a 100 on the first slider. Maybe you could curve 02:17:674 (1) more. curved 02:17:674 (1) more
    
14. 02:27:609 (3) - Move to (332,236) plays really nice and fits with your style here. fixed
    
    Example

    
15. 02:28:979 (1) - 3/4 slider feels bad here because it's inconsistent with patterns before like 02:20:757 (1,2,3) where the music was the same. I'd like you to shorten this slider by 1/4. I'd like to keep this.. it gives a rather refreshing and not-boring flow imo..
    
16. 02:30:007 (1) - Same idea, the 3/4 doesn't fit, it would play much better if you extended this slider by 1/4. this i fixed
    
17. 02:50:562 - Add a note and move the spinner 1/4 forward plays really nicely. Try it. added a note, but spinner 1/8.
    
    Example

    

[Normal]

1. 00:22:224 (1) - Remove whistle sounds much better for me.
   
2. 00:20:571 - Resnap delayed break.
   
3. 01:59:175 - Resnap the break ending.
   
   normal all fixed

For the most part I'm alright with the slowdowns because you mark them with the grey color. I just found some of your 3/4 to be overmapped and not so great. Other than that just watch the spacing after those slowdowns because it can get pretty tricky. This is pretty much it from me. I'm not sure if Shiro wants to mod it or not. Call me back I'll do a recheck.

ktgster wrote:

[SoftBoxer]

This is honestly really hard to read and thats due to AR 7 and very random spacing that honestly don't make sense in the first place. It's more of a soft insane than a hard and if its suppose to be that, wheres the hard?
Honestly, you need to learn to have some sort of consistant spacing. This is modded as soft insane otherwise half of your notes would have been changed.

AR +1 as its just hard to read in the first place.

00:03:103 (1) - just stack this on the next 1
00:04:622 (3,4) - looks like 1/2, AR 7 makes this really look like 1/2
00:13:736 (3,4) - ^
-Have newcombo, problem? that's won't make player confuse because have NC and enough AR
00:20:191 (7) - dumb overlapping nazi fixed
00:20:666 (1) - end your spinner here. If its too short, just don't map it then where? you didn't give me your timing
00:23:080 (3,4,5) - please don't do this why? please give me your reason, I don't want make my diff only follow the flow
00:42:093 (3,4) - very tight spacing yet you forced it. If anything, you should move the 2 to the right more and create space for this part k
00:48:089 (3,4) - please make this spacing farther no, make spacing farther will break my graph
00:56:482 (5,6,7) - this is a part where you pretty much call it soft insane, its not even a hard anymore with this pattern
01:00:593 (4,5,6) - couldn't you do something like this to the one above
01:31:083 (1) - why NC? make 01:30:398 (1,1) - more clear to read and follow the music, problem?
01:44:786 (1) - random clap k remove
02:05:341 (1,2,1) - no, 1 covers the next 1 due to the combo colors, its pretty much not readable and requires reaction or memory to do well on, practically unrankable ahahah what? or why other BAT can bubble it or ranked it? even they aren't mention it? sorry, but it's rankanle.
02:24:868 (4,5,6,7,8,9) - this is pretty much forced in as its not really readable to begin with keep it, as I said before I don't want make the diff "only follow the flow" make follow the flow only it's very bored. you can copy other mapper's Hard to apply it... It's not have any sense imo
02:50:562 (5) - bad overlap keep

Even with me modding it as soft insane, probably half of your map would have been changed regardless. NCing makes no sense and is not consistent, spacing is inconsistent. What I see in this difficulty is more of neatness and how it looks but this also has to be playable at a certain degree.

ktgster wrote:

Even with me modding it as soft insane, probably half of your map would have been changed regardless. NCing makes no sense and is not consistent, spacing is inconsistent. What I see in this difficulty is more of neatness and how it looks but this also has to be playable at a certain degree.

HelloSCV wrote:

make sure you modded this map because you want to improve map's quality, not express your dissatisfaction. If you think some patterns are really bad, write down the solution, NOT posting like "this looks like shit"

ktgster wrote:

Going to have to disregard all things here.

[General]

I really don't see the needs to name your insane "Broccoly" as it really just doesn't say anything about and its your own map in the first place.
What is Softboxer suppose to be, soft insane, hard, if its the former, then you don't have a hard completing the set. naming's free. i had this discussion with the former map. softboxer's hard+

[Broccoly]

AR -1, this is pretty much AR 10 with your note density, AR 8 plays fine already plus this is pretty calm to warrant AR 8. ar9 plays better

00:24:279 (1) - now this isn't even worth asking, its pretty much unreadable as it camouflages looking like a 1/2 slider. Even if you do NC with a specfic color, it just feels forced in and the SV change doesn't even make sense in the first place. To this pitch, wouldn't you increase it instead? This applies to all other sliders like this wait, increase the sv on those sliders? i don't think that fits the music
00:27:362 (3,1) - I really don't understand this extended slider here, it plays off and its overmapped too plus it feels forced to begin with the pitch that starts on 00:27:362 - is continuous till the next pitch comes in. If i were to make it 1/2 then there'd be an awkward pause between that and the next slider
00:32:501 (1) - same as 00:24:279 (1) fun rhythmic variation
00:35:927 (1,2) - bad overlap plz explain when you are using subjective words like bad. how am i supposed to fix when i mapped it thinking that's good?
00:37:297 (3,4) - same as 00:27:362 (3,1) ^
00:43:806 (1) - this is also a dumb usage of slider but even worse. You are literally using a slow SV on this part which doesn't even change pitch at all. It makes no sense in the first place and what you did before is a circle here before. Remove it music is subjective to interpretation; i think it fits decently to the music
00:48:945 (1) - again, don't do this
00:52:371 (1,2,3) - this is the only time you do this for this whole map, 00:52:714 (2) - is also the only linear 3/4 slider here which I don't get why you do this, at least make them all 1/2's or make (2) a 1/2 using something other than linear what's wrong with linear 3/4? also they fit well to the music
00:54:426 (1,2) - remove 2 and extend 1 to where 2 was. Also no point for this slow down ehh.....that looks rather silly

lol

00:56:482 (1) - I don't mind this at all but I don't see any usage of streams as they do fit quite nicely stream feels more rigid than a repeat slider, which gives more soft texture
00:56:482 (1,2) - horrible spacing, use 1.28x spacing instead when using a fast-multiple-repeated slider, the player can't expect as well when to let go; the close spacing is to prevent sliderbreaking during that letting-go process
01:02:648 (1,1) - ^ ^
01:04:704 (1,2) - probably the most fitting for a stream ^
01:09:843 (1) - nazi but stack this slider end more properly they don't even overlap when playing, but fixed
01:10:870 (1) - why clap at the end of the slider sounds good to me
01:13:611 (1) - zzzz the sliders again
01:14:981 (1,2,3) - I honestly think this ruins the pacing as you're pretty much waiting when the whole time you have been moving your cursor nonstop pace variation; refreshing effect
01:16:694 (1) - no just no
01:21:833 (1) - yet again
01:24:916 (1,2) - ^ but the 2 doesn't really warrant a slow down ya but i want to use it
01:28:856 (2,3) - this breaks your flow pretty badly, something like this will work well good suggestion actually, but 2 easy like that

Example

01:29:713 (1) - again
01:32:111 (1) - remove due for the same reasons as 00:43:806 (1)
01:37:935 (1) - yeah...
01:43:416 (1) - just replace this with 2 1/1 circles, this is just a dumb slider usage in the first place who defines dumb
01:43:801 (1) - make it start 1/4 early instead of 1/8 ok
02:11:165 (1) - .... modding is easy
02:15:961 (1) - do something other than this as this also just plays bad
02:17:332 (1) - now this is just trolling here. If you were consistant with the other parts like this, why the sudden change and for little reason at all the 'hold' moment right before the climax; builds up tension
02:19:387 (1) - the song goes stronger in this kiai, you're still doing tricks here when the fact that for the rest of this kiai, you did no such thing making this the only slider in this kiai thats like this yeah that part isn't strong yet enough even though it's kiai. i didn't use it after that because it ruins the excitement
-------
02:21:100 (2) - reverse 2 with slider end (Ctrl + G)
02:24:526 (3) - ^
02:28:979 (1,2) - this plays bad and breaks your flow. It also feels forced too. Just reverse the 2
02:35:831 (2) - try doing something where this thing doesn't overlap, heck circles might be a viable option here
02:42:854 (1,2,3) - I really don't get why you do this, you just put a random pattern there and be done. This is also the only part where this may require AR 9 but AR 8 already plays well for the whole map that its better to find something different for this
------ already discussed with uws. no fix-----
02:44:053 (3) - can't you find somewhere else to place this i'll ask broccoli
02:50:562 (5) - NC fixed
02:50:605 (1) - make this 1/4 apart fixed

ktgster wrote:

Going to have to disregard all things here. I'm just here giving my own opinions, not aiming at anyone
[Broccoly]

AR -1, this is pretty much AR 10 with your note density, AR 8 plays fine already plus this is pretty calm to warrant AR 8.

HabiHolic wrote:

오프셋도 전에꺼하고 10 을 올렸을때하고 별 차이는 없는것 같아요
근데 왜 언랭인건지 모르겠네요.. 이건 너무 어이없게 내려간 듯 합니다

Shiro wrote:

- the spacing feels completely erratic
- the map uses AR9 for a song that is described by the mapper themselves as "calm"
- the map uses highly inconsistent extended sliders some of which are slowed down and with jumps afterwards which makes the map extremely confusing to read and awkward to play

Vpalach wrote:

i just wish, that some day there won't be any unranking ever

Broccoly wrote:

is that how you decide unrankable stuff?

Broccoly wrote:

I never described the map as 'calm'

op wrote:

So beautiful that I had to map even though I usually don't map slow songs"

Broccoly wrote:

There were tons of FCers and SSers

Broccoly wrote:

Also, the map has once already been ranked

Come[Back]Home wrote:

People should accept other mappingstyles. Otherwise every Map would be the same, with always the same patterns etc.

Ephemeral wrote:

A map may be unranked by any BAT if there are elements within the map that are of particular concern from either a subjective or objective standpoint.

Zarerion wrote:

Hi, my humble opinion:
The map is awesome, but like Shiro said, far too inconsistent when it comes to the slowdowns. Please listen to her and take your time to rework your structure a bit.
Also when taking a look at your NCs, please keep in mind how NC spam affects the HP drain of your map. The more dense you put NCs the higher gets the Drain for the overall map, so in order to make this playable HR for not only thelewa, reducing the NC spam a bit will be a huge improvement.

About the AR: 9 is okay, this is 175 BPM and has rather complex patterns, why would anyone enforce AR8 here?

Very fun map whatsoever, please rerank fast.

Garven wrote:

Zarerion misinterpreted how HP Drain and new combos work. Basically when you have a new combo, the last note of the previous combo gives an HP boost. So if you have tons of new combos in a short amount of time, it gives a huge boost to HP, not increases the rate of HP drain. This causes an imbalance of drain and actually makes the map artificially easy unless you have a large span of section that is sparse in rhythm. Using new combos to highlight some new portion of a pattern that would be harder to read otherwise is frowned upon since it's indicative of poor design rather than trying to highlight a certain part of the song (you'll want your new combos to be consistent throughout your own maps like Kiai toggles).

Zarerion wrote:

The more dense you put NCs the higher gets the Drain for the overall map, so in order to make this playable HR for not only thelewa, reducing the NC spam a bit will be a huge improvement.

Shiro wrote:

You can just call your own circle of friends and ask them all to post in this thread insulting BATs, but it will never do anything.

Dark Fang wrote:

btw, I have no idea why this is has been unranked.
Were the thoughts objective? or were they only a few BAT's subjective thought?
i can't find unrankable reason except offset -it's possible use online offset- there are also problems in the unranked post.

the First reason that - "the spacing feels completely erratic", that's true. but why is it unrankable? we should respect the mappers. Broccoly diff has been already ranked once, and the problems are not significantly serious. do the mappers have to map being pressured like this?

the Second reason that - "the map uses AR9 for a song that is described by the mapper themselves as "calm", certainly Broccoly wrote "slow song" on creator's word. but is AR must follow that? it's stereotypes. I can say "AR 9 is proper for this map". it's hard to read? do blame your eye-hand coordination. most players feel AR 9 is fun more than AR 8. and this is not unrankable reason.

the Third reason that - "the map uses highly inconsistent extended sliders some of which are slowed down and with jumps afterwards which makes the map extremely confusing to read and awkward to play", ah. be honest, I don't even know what to say. it's a little bit unplayable to some of the few players, but not unrankable. at least not unplayable for me. Actually, most people enjoyed and were interested in this map

Ephemeral wrote:

Unranking was often considered as a negative event or something shameful or harmful for a map in the past. Starting today, that is no longer the case. A map may be unranked by any BAT if there are elements within the map that are of particular concern from either a subjective or objective standpoint.

What this means in layman's terms is that if there is a problem which requires an unrank to fix and your map has not been ranked for at least a week, it may be unranked temporarily in order to fix the issue. If discussion reveals that there was no issue in the first place for whatever reason, your map will be reranked as it was. This will all be carefully watched to ensure that maps with problems are resolved in a timely fashion, and mappers are not left hanging.

Mashley wrote:

Glad to see BATs finally having the balls to step in and unrank maps that don't meet the standards that we should expect in the Ranked category. I take no issue with having different styles used, but it is simply ludicrous to expect that every style can fit with every song and unfortunately the case with this map is that the mapper has used a style which cannot possibly work with the song in question.

An example I have used when discussing this map in #modhelp is that while fast slider speed changes work for example in TrigonometrY's map of Knife Party - Fire Hive (http://osu.ppy.sh/s/102597) due to the nature of the song, Cry More is a slow paced song with a pretty consistent rhythm and therefore it is illogical to be changing slider speeds so wildly. The Broccoly difficulty is beyond saving, and will honestly require a full remap to be up the standard that I would expect from ranked. On a fundamental level, the map does not fit the song and that is central to how mapping works.

dkun wrote:

What this means in layman's terms is that if there is a problem which requires an unrank to fix and your map has not been ranked for at least a week, it may be unranked temporarily in order to fix the issue. If discussion reveals that there was no issue in the first place for whatever reason, your map will be reranked as it was. This will all be carefully watched to ensure that maps with problems are resolved in a timely fashion, and mappers are not left hanging.

dkun wrote:

Ephemeral wrote:

Unranking was often considered as a negative event or something shameful or harmful for a map in the past. Starting today, that is no longer the case. A map may be unranked by any BAT if there are elements within the map that are of particular concern from either a subjective or objective standpoint.

What this means in layman's terms is that if there is a problem which requires an unrank to fix and your map has not been ranked for at least a week, it may be unranked temporarily in order to fix the issue. If discussion reveals that there was no issue in the first place for whatever reason, your map will be reranked as it was. This will all be carefully watched to ensure that maps with problems are resolved in a timely fashion, and mappers are not left hanging.

Shiro wrote:

First of all, the slow sliders. I like the idea of using 3/4 for some beats. It extends the beat in a nice and fitting way, but the fact that almost every single of the 3/4 used is a slowdown+jump kills this idea and makes it less important, not to mention that it's used inconsistently which makes it feel worse. Here's what I suggest: keep the slowdown+jump on a certain rhythm to emphasize it and keep the other 3/4 at a normal length and spacing. The 3/4 does feel good numerous times, but the fact that everything is emphasized means that nothing gets actually emphasized anymore and that feels awkward. So I suggest to keep the slowdown and jump on some of them, keeping the jumps at the same spacing for consistency and because it gives the map a pattern it follows, which gives it a nice structure, like a spine bone it's attached to. I'm talking about this pattern: 00:24:279 (1,1) - (let's call it the bone pattern) which I think should be used for every single of these rhythms for the reasons I described in this wall of text. The idea that you should basically copypaste the pattern is important because it makes the structure perfect. In the song, the same exact notes come back roughly every 8-9 seconds and I firmly believe that if the map follows that it would feel a lot better. That means all of these:
00:32:501 (1,1) -
00:40:723 (1,2) - turn the second beat into a 1/1 slider like 00:24:279 (1,1) - fixed
00:48:945 (1,1) - the first one should be reversed to be consistent I like the flow now regardless of the consistency; tho I did move 00:49:288 (1) this closer to the white slider
00:57:167 (1,1) -
01:05:389 (3,1) - Turn this one into a slowdown+jump like 00:24:279 (1,1) - this one i didn't use slowdown because there is a drum beat on 01:05:560 - which would sound weird if I used 3/4 slowdown slider
01:13:611 (1,1) -
01:21:833 (1,1) -
01:30:055 (1,2) -
01:38:277 (1,2) -
02:02:943 (1,1) -
02:11:165 (1,1) -
02:19:387 (1,1) -
02:27:609 (3,1) - didn't use slowdown because it would get in the way of the ongoing excited flow
02:35:831 (2,1) - ^same reason
02:44:053 (3,1) - ^
02:48:164 (2,1) - Used a single circle instead, to create the similar effect; same logic with this 01:31:768 (2)

Any other 3/4 should not be slowed down to make sure that these get particular emphasis. Let's see every 3/4 use in the map that I didn't already point out:
00:27:362 (3,1) - this 3/4 is good. The rhythm at this point is similar to the ones you've tried to highlight, but it's not the one you try to highlight, so the fact that this isn't slowed down makes it feels less emphasized than those while still having its own unique feeling. That's good and that's what you should have gone through
00:37:297 (3,4) - This one however doesn't follow anything and feels out of place. The song doesn't go for anything special at this point, so there's no point in emphasizing something that doesn't exist. You should have kept this a 1/2 slider. I wanted to give some rhythmic variation, to make it not boring by keep using the same rhythm. I am aware that there's nothing special going on in the song; I didn't try to emphasize anything. I used white sliders where I wanted to emphasize, but the ordinary(colored) 3/4 sliders like those are used to add flavor to the rhythm, not to emphasize.
00:43:806 (1,1) - If you look at how the song is made, you'll realize that this is exactly the same rhythm as 00:27:362 (3,1) and as such, it should follow the same train of thought. However, you decided to slow down this one which is inconsistent and breaks the slowdown pattern you've been trying to use. A 3/4 here would be awesome and fit, just like 00:27:362 (3,1) - but the slowdown+jump is out of place. Please remove it and use normal spacing, like 00:27:362 (3,1) - Fixed. Makes sense.
00:52:371 (1,2,3) - inconsistent spacing here and that looks absolutely horrible. the problem here is that the use of 3/4 is inconsistent within those three objects. Listen carefully to the song: it has some kind of microbreak right on 00:52:371 (1) - then goes fur sustained, flowy notes for 00:52:714 (2,3) - . Your map goes for sustain, slowly notes for 00:52:371 (1,2) - and a microbreak with 00:53:056 (3) - . What I suggest is to make 00:52:371 (1) - a 1/2 slider and 00:53:056 (3) - a 3/4 slider to follow the song more accurately The pitch that starts on 00:52:371 (1) is sustained until the next pitch 00:52:714 (2) comes in without a break. If I were to use a 1/2 slider for (1) then that doesn't fit to the music; the slider would just stop when the pitch is keep being sustained. Same reason goes for (2); the pitch is being sustained w/o a break until the next pitch (3) comes in. I used 1/2 slider for the slider (3) because I wanted to emphasize that big downbeat on 00:53:399 through utilizing the jump from the end of the slider (3). If I were to use 3/4 for the slider(3), then I'd have to place 00:53:056 (3) - this and 00:53:399 (1) - this closely together, which would be less effective at emphasizing the downbeat on 00:53:399
01:16:694 (1,1) - See 00:27:362 (3,1) - . The song basically restarts at this point - why does your map follow completely different ideas ? Just look back at what you did in the beginning and follow the same logic. I'm not asking to copypaste, and you can make the spacing a bit wider or change the jump configuration because this part is a bit more emphasized in the song, but the logic behind it should stay consistent 01:16:523 (2,3) - replaced white slider with ordinary 3/4 slider like 00:27:362 (3,1) -
01:29:713 (1) - why not. It feels a bit anticlimatic and inconsistent because you never used 3/4 before the pattern I pointed out first, and shifts the focus from it onto this kickslider+slider, which feels quite wrong if you want to follow and consistent pattern and structure. I'd suggest to make this a 1/2 slider, but at least remove the slowdown I think it doesn't feel 'wrong', both from the perspective of fittingness to music and playablility. I am am well aware and admit that I didn't use those patterns before that part, but rather than feeling 'wrong', I intended the players to feel 'fun', 'refreshing', and 'interesting' through that variation; a modder actually liked that pattern a lot and told me that it's creative. I don't want the map to be too much consistent to the point which it doesn't feel fun anymore but boring, mostly by overused-expected rhythm pattern.
01:31:768 (2) - This should be a 3/4 slider. Notice how the song builds a momentum into 01:32:111 (1) - ? You don't translate that momentum because of this lone circle which breaks your flow and doesn't let the map continue and build into the slider. Having a 3/4 slider here would keep the flow going and build the momentum into the bone pattern of the map I see what you mean, but having a lone circle followed by a NCed slider straight below (which elicits the brief stop moment after hitting the circle) works as well in building the momentum. Good suggestion however.
01:37:935 (1) - See 01:29:713 (1) -
02:15:961 (1,1) - You're using the bone pattern at a place where it doesn't fit, and that screws your attempt to build momentum. A slowdown could work here, but only if it's a 1/1 slider, otherwise you're adding the bone pattern at a wrong point and it screws the structure of the map. I honestly suggest using a slowed down 1/1 slider with a circle at 02:16:475 - and then use jumps for 02:16:475 (2,1,2,3,4) - fixed; used 1/1 slowdown slider with a circle after; added jumps
02:17:332 (1,1) - once again you use the bone pattern where it doesn't belong, and right before its righteous place too, which makes the actual bone pattern feel insignifican. The first slider should be 1/2 and not slowed down to make sure that this doesn't happen replaced the slider with two circles
02:29:322 (2) - this slider being reversed is very confusing and plays awfully because you have to rush to its head, then go back to where it ends, and then you jump back to the right into (3) that goes back to the left again. Reversing this one would make the flow 02:28:979 (1,2,3) - a lot better because you'd get a standard flow from (1) to (2) and then an oval flow from (2) to (3) which leads properly into (1) and that's absolutely awesome. Let me draw you pics to show you what I mean because it's important: what you have and what I suggest Yeah.. Of course i know that way the flow will be better, but at the same time that forms a flow which is used in tons of other maps, which I think is boring. I wanted to try something new and playable at the same time, even though it might not flow as well. Numerous testplayers I saw didn't have any problems..

That's it for the 3/4. Now let's have a look at your comboing, which is highly inconsistent as well. If you listen to the song you'll realize that the main theme, repeated through the entire song, fits in two stanzas, which means that the best comboing you could go for would be one new combo every second white tick. The beginning follows this in the first few seconds, then you get lost and starting adding unneeded new combos.
00:03:483 (2) - you could add a new combo on this but it's not needed
00:11:457 (1) - remove
00:16:014 (1) - remove
00:19:432 (1) - remove

Now that we got this pattern in mind, let's have a look at the rest of the map. It should follow the same pattern because the song doesn't change the way it's made, so neither should the map and the comboing. Before you say that you're breaking the comboing of the bone pattern, please follow this until the end - let's do this step by step. first, let's make the entire comboing consistent regardless of the bone pattern:
00:22:224 (1,1) - whatever you choose for this, make sure it's the same as 00:03:103 (1,2) -
00:23:594 (1,1) - remove these
00:25:649 (1) - remove
00:27:705 (1) - remove
00:29:760 (1) - remove
00:31:816 (1,1) - remove
00:33:871 (1) - remove
00:35:927 (1) - remove
00:37:982 (1) - remove
00:40:038 (1,1) - remove
00:41:066 (9) - add a new combo here and remove 00:41:408 (1) -
00:42:093 (1) - remove
00:43:806 (1,1) - remove
00:46:204 (1) - remove
00:48:260 (1) - remove
00:48:945 (1) - remove
00:50:315 (1) - remove
00:52:371 (1) - remove
00:54:426 (1) - remove
00:56:482 (1,1) - remove
00:58:537 (1) - remove
01:00:593 (1) - remove
01:02:648 (1,1) - remove
01:04:704 (1) - remove
01:06:759 (1) - remove
01:08:815 (1) - remove
01:10:870 (1) - remove
01:12:926 (1,1) - remove
01:14:981 (1) - remove
01:16:694 (1,1) - remove
01:19:092 (1) - remove
01:21:148 (1,1) - remove
01:23:203 (1) - remove
01:24:916 (1) - remove
01:27:314 (1) - remove
01:29:370 (1,1) - remove and add a new one on 01:30:398 (2) -
01:31:425 (1,1) - remove
01:33:481 (1) - remove
01:35:536 (1) - remove
01:37:592 (1,1) - remove
01:39:647 (1) - remove
01:41:703 (1) - remove
01:43:416 (1) - remove
02:02:258 (1,1) - remove
02:04:313 (1) - remove
02:06:369 (1) - remove
02:08:424 (1) - remove
02:10:480 (1,1) - remove
02:12:535 (1) - remove
02:14:591 (1) - remove
02:15:961 (1,1,1) - remove
02:18:702 (1,1) - remove
02:20:757 (1) - remove
02:22:813 (1) - remove
02:24:868 (1) - remove
02:26:924 (1) - remove
02:28:979 (1) - remove
02:31:035 (1) - remove
02:32:405 (1,1) - remove
02:35:146 (1) - remove
02:37:201 (1) - remove
02:39:257 (1) - remove
02:41:312 (1) - remove
02:42:854 (1,1) - remove
02:45:423 (1) - remove
02:47:479 (1) - remove
02:49:534 (1) - remove

--------comboing all fixed---------

Okay, now that we have the basic structure of the song pinned done through the comboing, let's take a look back and look at where I asked you to use the bone pattern. If you count combos by groups of four, you'll realize that the bone pattern is always used on the second of those four new combos. This is because it's how the song is made the structure I asked you to add through the comboing and bone pattern emphasizes it perfectly. Now, if you want to add a specific comboing for it (like make a new combo for each slider of it), you can, and it will still be consistent.

I think I'm going to stop there, that's already a lot of work. I'd have a lot more to say in terms of patterns and rhythm, and I haven't even looked at the other diffs yet, but you can use everything that I said here and apply it to the other diffs. Please do not hesitate to call me back if you want me to mod the rest of it (including patterns and stuff), I will happily do so. Good luck.

dkun wrote:

This will all be carefully watched to ensure that maps with problems are resolved in a timely fashion, and mappers are not left hanging.

Ephemeral wrote:

A map may be unranked by any BAT if there are elements within the map that are of particular concern from either a subjective or objective standpoint.

3483,379.746835443038,3,2,0,100,1,0
20951,588.235294117647,3,2,0,100,1,8
21539,342.583076396026,3,2,0,100,1,8
22566,342.583076396026,3,2,0,100,1,0

popner wrote:

00:24:279 (1) - generally we may think the movement should be the blue path(in the example), but actually not. Consider the direction of previous slider /00:23:937 (7)/, players tend to move in the red path, and then they have problem to move to next slider /00:24:622 (1)/. They will do a quick move (the green path). Quick move + slow down slider = 100.

example

Here comes the solution: Fixed. Hopefully less slider 100s..

SPOILER

00:29:247 (3) - the stanza becomes smooth by moving this note like: I really like it, thanks for such awesome suggestion

SPOILER

00:32:501 (1) - this is just the opposite situation of 00:24:279 (1), so this one is fine c:

00:57:167 (1) - try to change the bending like: hmm I don't think it matters that much due to slider leniency.. although the shape might affect how the players approach it minimally, I like how it is now..

SPOILER

01:25:259 (2) - split it? I'd like to keep it as now. Spliting breaks the tension of the music imo.. sorry.

SPOILER

02:30:007 (1,2) - the flow from (1) to (2) is really broken. This is better: hmm. I guess this depends on the player, but I like the cross-criss movement, which elicits dynamic feeling.

SPOILER

Konei wrote:

02:28:979 (4) - Ending of this Slider sounds badly overmapped, if you want to do this for the emphasis, I'd rather make the end quiet.
Good catch~ Fixed!

Good luck on your way!

Storyboard is awesome too!

Xyridian wrote:

some of the notes in the broccoly diff seem, i don't know how to put it... accidental? they just feel a little overmapped to me, and with a fresh bubble, i'd rather these potential inconsistencies get noticed. i don't want to be a pain, but i'm just curious at to your intent with some of them as the general map is really well done.

SPOILER

• 00:18:862 (6) i simply don't hear anything.
  00:56:995 (6) this circle just seems really unnecessary. it feels as if it is present only for difficulty, as i don't hear anything that would express an intent to map this beat. anyway, adding little pauses in your map that compliment the pauses in the music emphasize how the music isn't entirely monotonous, as well as expressing the uniqueness of your slow sliders and long jumps. The circle serves to reestablish and keep the consistent rhythm to prepare for the slowdown after the fast repeat slider, which could cloud the original rhythm. Adding little pauses is a good idea, but I actually did throughout the map like you said, in 01:14:981 (4,5,6) / 00:42:779 (7,6,5,2) / etc..
  01:21:661 (8) this is pretty much the same, but this circle breaks my cursor's flow much more irrationally. Same reason as above, and there's actually a musical context if you hear more carefully.. I understand that if this was hard diff or under, that note wouldn't make sense, but in insane diffs or above I think things like that are fine imo.. To add, if I were to delete that note, the effect and the emphasis of the slowdown would much more be less than it conveyed originally.. plus, the flow isn't that bad either, at least to me and to the testplayers i've seen so far
  01:33:309 (4) similar, but it doesn't break flow, and instead helps stay on beat. yes, helps staying on beat, that is the same reason for 00:18:862 (6)
  02:19:215 (7) i just don't see the point to this. it could play well, but not in this map at this time (right before another slowdown). The point is to induce a larger and more dynamic cursor movement in order to express the excitement of the kiai. (but yeah I actually reduced the distance after getting mods from others.) Also, this time it actually has musical context to put a circle.

of course, i love this map, but i'm just curious, as well as want to see it become the best it can be! Hey Thanks a lot, although I'm pretty much set to keep it the way as it is now... i'm sorry if you're disappointed.. I will refer to it in future mapping tho

Zero__wind wrote:

nice to see this rebubbled fast
btw, 01:25:943 - such a lonely clap `w`

Broccoly wrote:

Re-Thanks!! haha

HabiHolic wrote:

Congratz!

리랭 축하드려요!!!