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Stream Skill Loss

posted
Total Posts
56
Kethsar
85 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Kethsar
Hey all. Have you ever suffered from a sudden loss of your stream speed, endurance, or skill? It happened to me recently, about 2-3 weeks ago. For the 6 months before it happened, I was fine. I wasn't great, but I could beat most of the songs I played, such as Taketori Hishou, rog-limitation, and even the Goreshit Compilation.

According to the stream speed tester, I was getting ~180 BPM speeds with my fingers, when testing with 50 presses. I use a BlackWidow keyboard (previously a Dell factory default one, I switched in April). Now, I get around 130 (I can bring this up to 150 with a few hours of constant stream map play). I can't think of anything that would've caused this. I play on a regular basis. Even in the past when I took a couple week long breaks from osu!, I came back just as good, and sometimes better than before. Normally I would think nothing of my sudden skill loss, as it's happened before, but I could usually get back to my previous levels within a few weeks of practice like I have been doing. This time around, however, I've gained no skill. I've also only lost my streaming speed. I can single click as fast as before, and I can control my cursor as well as before. I feel like raging at myself over this. T_T
Jinxy
2,777 posts
Joined February 2009
Jinxy
Can't help you there, since my streaming endurance is horrible in the first place.

I'm just here to say you've probably posted this in the wrong place, Off-Topic is the last place you want to be in
Ephemeral
Inland Empire
3,963 posts
Joined April 2009
Ephemeral
RSI
thelewa
3,537 posts
Joined August 2010
thelewa

Ephemeral wrote:

RSI
most likely
Tanzklaue
1,151 posts
Joined December 2010
Tanzklaue

thelewa wrote:

Ephemeral wrote:

RSI
most likely
would suck, RSI and carpal tunnel syndrom are basically the death of any atempt of competitive gaming.

also a lot of other things get really uncomfortable

do you have pain while playing? normally RSI comes with quite a lot of pain. if you have pain, then you should get checked by a doc, because it could seriously damage your wrist.
Kethsar
85 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Kethsar
From what I've read of RSI, I would most likely be feeling pain, and I do not. I also read, though, that it can be associated with reduced motor skills and endurance. I do have the reduced motor skills, when streaming, but I still have my endurance. Another thing, when testing how fast I can single click, the little program gave me a result of 120 BPM.
Tanzklaue
1,151 posts
Joined December 2010
Tanzklaue
try single tapping with the other finger. if you are equally fast with both fingers, then I would assume either a mental block or something llike RSI in its beginning stages.
thelewa
3,537 posts
Joined August 2010
thelewa
or then you singletap with your wrist like everyone else
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo
how did you pass rog-limitation with 180bpm

ontopic~ it might actually be a hardware or software issue with some level of input drops. Try a different PC with a different keyboard and see if you can still stream like you always have. You said you get 120 with singletap. You might get the 2nd key blocked for some reason on your PC/keyboard. If your keyboard doesn't support ghosting/nkro it might be the issue, although with just 2 keys this shouldn't be an issue... but it seems to be the case here.
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
Another hardware issue that you can have is a change in FPS. If you were suddenly playing on an average laptop, for instance, then you'd get a bad frame rate. The same goes for if you changes your overall FPS settings. I'm not saying that this is what is causing your problem, but it came to mind along with the other suggested hardware problem.
Kethsar
85 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Kethsar
It's not a hardware or software issue, I can assure you guys that. It's genuinely me not being able to alternate between my fingers fast enough. That's why I'm so confused, cause one day I was fine, the next my fingers didn't want to work with me.

Also, it's not hard passing rog-limitation with 180 BPM. The health drain is decently forgiving, and there's really only 3 or 4 areas in the map that may put one at risk of failing, if the cause is stream speeds.
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
Ok, could be psychological, then. I find that sometimes, in the process of improving at a skill, I first show a marked decrease in my ability at it before showing a great increase. I figure it's something to do with how the mind learns by deviating from what it already does until it finds better ways to do things. Secondly, there is such a thing as overoccupation with a problem. If you are focusing too much on the streams, then you may actually cause yourself to fail them by creating anxiety. Too, sometimes one may place their expectations above their actual performance, because they believe that they should be performing at a certain level, which is in reality just above their current level. This is a natural component of self challenging, however, and would lead to greater skill.

Don't wear your hands out by playing excessively to prove that you can still stream. Play hard, but don't obsess about it. You'll get there again naturally. The only thing to watch out for is signs of RSI. I often play beyond my limit, and often have a sore or tired hand when I am done, but I've never experienced the warning signs for RSI, nor have I felt that I've caused excessive strain. One thing that you can do, if you feel like strain is creating a problem, though, is increase your resolution, and failing that you can decrease your DPI. All of this makes it easier on your muscles after time to adjust. I have a good idea of where my limit is and how far I can go beyond it when I want to keep going. Be sure to gauge yourself.

I hope you are able to get back on track.
Kethsar
85 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Kethsar
My first thought was that it's psychological as well. I almost never feel sore after playing osu! for long periods of time anymore. I don't think I've ever experienced the warning signs of RSI either, and I try to minimize the strain I cause myself. I do have a feeling that if I practice in the correct way, I should be back up to speed within a couple of months. It just really sucks, cause most of the songs I like need the skill I had to pass them.
Valentiino
1,945 posts
Joined June 2011
Valentiino

thelewa wrote:

or then you singletap with your wrist like everyone else
I singletap on my main finger by using wrist, and when I use my index finger, it's finger only. And it has much greater speed, accuracy and endurance than compared to my middle finger. Still I can't make my index finger my main finger ;w;
Tanzklaue
1,151 posts
Joined December 2010
Tanzklaue

Valentiino wrote:

thelewa wrote:

or then you singletap with your wrist like everyone else
I singletap on my main finger by using wrist, and when I use my index finger, it's finger only. And it has much greater speed, accuracy and endurance than compared to my middle finger. Still I can't make my index finger my main finger ;w;
everything he said, except that my indexfinger is slow as shit
Floks
82 posts
Joined October 2011
Floks
You might take a break? A week off won't kill.
Ekaru
3,617 posts
Joined July 2008
Ekaru

Floks wrote:

You might take a break? A week off won't kill.
This. Give your fingers a rest. I highly recommend this, actually; if it's a physical issue, which it very well could be, then it's very important for your fingers to take a break before anything happens. Better safe than sorry.
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
I actually had to stop playing for about a month during a trip, and when I started playing again I was playing better than I ever did before. Funny how that works.
Valentiino
1,945 posts
Joined June 2011
Valentiino
I wonder if Finnish people are somewhat inferior when it comes to breaks. Whenever some1 takes a break that's longer than a week and they come back, they only play worse than they did b4 the break.
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
Clearly their midichlorian count is too low
lolcubes
osu! Alumni
4,437 posts
Joined November 2010
lolcubes

thelewa wrote:

or then you singletap with your wrist like everyone else
Real men singletap with mouseclicks. :D

Ontopic, you should probably wait a few days and try again. Sometimes I am not able to even stream 170bpm 1/4 because my fingers just "don't work", usually warming up or relaxing helps, or I just skip a day.
Kethsar
85 posts
Joined September 2010
Topic Starter
Kethsar
My initial plan was taking a week break, but I feel like I have nothing to do without osu!. ;-; Guess I'll hit the VNs and anime I have backlogged.
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
Lol. This happens to me every time I try to take a break for a day. XD I end up wanting to play so bad that I end up playing anyway. Honestly, I don't think it hurts to keep playing. You just can't strain yourself, if you think your hands have had it. If I really feel like I need a break, then I just beat something I know is no trouble for my muscles, but which might take some repetitive retrying.
nomen
539 posts
Joined March 2012
nomen

Valentiino wrote:

I wonder if Finnish people are somewhat inferior when it comes to breaks. Whenever some1 takes a break that's longer than a week and they come back, they only play worse than they did b4 the break.
Lets see if same thing happens to latvian people when I get back home at 26th.
Yme
5 posts
Joined November 2011
Yme
Same like OP, I lost my speed one day out of nowhere. However, what I did to recover back my speed was to take a short break, then later replay the most comfortable maps to regain speed. Start with slow streams until you're able to get used to (psychological affects your fingers too), then begin by playing faster beatmaps. I know how you feel. :p
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
I am currently in a slump myself. Just started doing wrist stretches to try to keep from getting too tense. Sometimes that can help if your hand has been getting too stiff.
Jordan
1,037 posts
Joined December 2010
Jordan
I never had stream skill ):
thelewa
3,537 posts
Joined August 2010
thelewa

Jordan wrote:

I never had stream skill ):
silmarilen
5,582 posts
Joined February 2010
silmarilen

Jordan wrote:

I never had stream skill ):
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,560 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
^
Big Yikes
57 posts
Joined April 2011
Big Yikes
.
Last edited by Big Yikes , edited 1 time in total.
druidxd
170 posts
Joined May 2011
druidxd

lolcubes wrote:

thelewa wrote:

or then you singletap with your wrist like everyone else
Real men singletap with mouseclicks. :D

Ontopic, you should probably wait a few days and try again. Sometimes I am not able to even stream 170bpm 1/4 because my fingers just "don't work", usually warming up or relaxing helps, or I just skip a day.
^This

I sometimes fell like my fingers aren't responding as well as they used to a couple days before, either I just don't play seriously that day (play WAY less and not competitive, just relaxing and warming up I guess) or take a couple days off to let my fingers rest, otherwise they won't be on good shape whenever I want to rank a couple of beatmaps, and it's really really annoying when that happens lol.
Jordan
1,037 posts
Joined December 2010
Jordan

druidxd wrote:

lolcubes wrote:

Ontopic, you should probably wait a few days and try again. Sometimes I am not able to even stream 170bpm 1/4 because my fingers just "don't work", usually warming up or relaxing helps, or I just skip a day.
^This

I sometimes fell like my fingers aren't responding as well as they used to a couple days before, either I just don't play seriously that day (play WAY less and not competitive, just relaxing and warming up I guess) or take a couple days off to let my fingers rest, otherwise they won't be on good shape whenever I want to rank a couple of beatmaps, and it's really really annoying when that happens lol.
Now I know I'm not the only one <3
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r

Jordan wrote:

druidxd wrote:

I sometimes fell like my fingers aren't responding as well as they used to a couple days before, either I just don't play seriously that day (play WAY less and not competitive, just relaxing and warming up I guess) or take a couple days off to let my fingers rest, otherwise they won't be on good shape whenever I want to rank a couple of beatmaps, and it's really really annoying when that happens lol.
Now I know I'm not the only one <3
This happens to me too. I have a great day where I rank better on every map that I play, and my PP shoots up, and then sometimes I continue on that way, but other times I'll have a day or more where I just feel like I can't get up to speed, I can't click fast enough, or I'm just not on my game with accuracy. On those days I normally try to take it easy and not take things so seriously. I go back and just FC some stuff I previously skipped over, or I HD something long and slow. Sometimes those periods can last for a while, though. I find, however, that if I get really into reaching some goal, like HD HR on a map I couldn't do that on before, then sometimes I snap right back into playing well again. It's like sometimes I need that challenge to build up my energy and loosen up my muscles.
Wishy
2,972 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
Losing streaming speed/endurance is normal, I'm not as fast as I used to be when I played a few hours every day. It takes time to get fast again.

If you can't even do low BPMs (180) then it's probably just a bad day/your fingers are too tired. That happened to me and I couldn't stream even 180 BPM (I can reach 270+) at all, took 2 days off osu! and after that I could stream again.
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,560 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
180BPM -> Low
:( :( :(
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
I think 180 BPM is where it starts to get fast. It's like the threshold. Some 180 BPM maps feel faster than 200 BPM maps to me. I guess it depends on what sort of notes you are using.
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo

G0r wrote:

I guess it depends on what sort of notes you are using.
It depends on the stream spacing and OD :p

180 is definitely not slow. 140 is slow
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r
I've also heard in a previous discussion that the timing of the notes can differ depending on the rhythm to make them actually occur faster without changing the BPM. I never quite understood the concept, despite my researching.
Jordan
1,037 posts
Joined December 2010
Jordan

CXu wrote:

180BPM -> Low
:( :( :(
nomen
539 posts
Joined March 2012
nomen
180 BPM is slow? ;_;
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo

G0r wrote:

I've also heard in a previous discussion that the timing of the notes can differ depending on the rhythm to make them actually occur faster without changing the BPM. I never quite understood the concept, despite my researching.
You mean like, 1/6 streams? Which gives like 240 stream speed on a 160bpm map. Usually it's the other way around... people put 1/3 streams on 280bpm maps so that they'd be playable (i.e. only 210 speed)
silmarilen
5,582 posts
Joined February 2010
silmarilen
the only beatmap close to 280 that has real streams is mad machine, and thats pure 1/4th afaik (not talking about unranked shit)
Icyteru
535 posts
Joined August 2011
Icyteru
It purely depends, I start off at 160bpm, but after 3 hours of continuous playing, I can hit around 240, then the next day, it's back to 160
Wishy
2,972 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy

G0r wrote:

I think 180 BPM is where it starts to get fast. It's like the threshold. Some 180 BPM maps feel faster than 200 BPM maps to me. I guess it depends on what sort of notes you are using.
Fast switches between 1/2 and 1/4 makes it really tiring, like triplet 1/2 triplet 1/2 triplet triplet triplet 1/2 etc may be more tiring than a 12 hit long 200 BPM stream. Which is why some maps are COMPLETELY insane, even when the BPM is not THAT high.
G0r
389 posts
Joined September 2011
G0r

Wishy22 wrote:

Fast switches between 1/2 and 1/4 makes it really tiring, like triplet 1/2 triplet 1/2 triplet triplet triplet 1/2 etc may be more tiring than a 12 hit long 200 BPM stream. Which is why some maps are COMPLETELY insane, even when the BPM is not THAT high.
I believe that this is exactly what I meant. Some day I will learn how to judge and discern these values of 1/2s 1/3s 1/4s and 1/6s from each other.
Wishy
2,972 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
It's kind of constantly 1/2, "streams" are 1/4 and those not so fast but not so slow streams are 1/3, 1/6 are rare since on any 160 BPM map, using them already makes them quite insane (160 BPM 1/6 = 240 BPM 1/4).
djjsixpack
162 posts
Joined September 2011
djjsixpack

Wishy22 wrote:

Losing streaming speed/endurance is normal, I'm not as fast as I used to be when I played a few hours every day. It takes time to get fast again.

If you can't even do low BPMs (180) then it's probably just a bad day/your fingers are too tired. That happened to me and I couldn't stream even 180 BPM (I can reach 270+) at all, took 2 days off osu! and after that I could stream again.
If I could stream 180 bpm I'd be so happy. I cap at about 170 after hours of playing.
Sanae Kochiya_old
25 posts
Joined December 2011
Sanae Kochiya_old
Play DT on everything.
Maneuver
112 posts
Joined October 2010
Maneuver
Wash your hand and you can't stream as fast as before you wash your hand, in air-conditioning room when it is too cold, you stream slower too~ Is it possible to to put hand into hot water or electrify it as warm up ? xD
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