Deadline is May 23, 4:30PM EST
This is 28.5 hours from now, by the way

Can we just all vote Sakura she literally asked us to lynch her.

i dont see how 2 votes on me and sakura are wagons


honestly i dont think we can reach consensus anyway

@Haneii: No i have literally no idea.

Also yes i rather be lynched than go NL.

that's just spiteful play rather than town or scum aligned, imo

just don't go self-hammering yourself in the future

"i'd rather be lynched d1 than go nolynch" means you're only in it for the control rather than playing the game


as a side note, yay mafiascum wiki is backup

Shiirn wrote:

that's just spiteful play rather than town or scum aligned, imo

just don't go self-hammering yourself in the future

Meh I treat it as scum aligned play actually. We clearly have enough time in the day phase to lynch someone else (Like Tess or Mbomb) but this feels more like scum AtE then anything else.

beeboy123 wrote:

We clearly have enough time in the day phase to lynch someone else (Like Tess or Mbomb)

Why magic bomb?

consider the fact that, if only briefly, tess considered the possibility of Sakura and i intentionally double-bussing one another on day 1 without any provocation, that should tell you how wantonly crazy our playstyles are. Logical fallacy claims aren't going to slow it down.

I don't see how it's a scummy Appeal to Emotion either way. I do agree "ok fuck it vote me then" boistering is pretty scummy, but this is sakura, she's insane. But then we get into circular reasoning and wifom and oh man do i enjoy that.

basically I'm personally not entirely convinced of her status as scum but at the same time rationally and logically she is the most likely scum candidate and this I am sticking to my vote.

Haneii wrote:

beeboy123 wrote:

We clearly have enough time in the day phase to lynch someone else (Like Tess or Mbomb)

Why magic bomb?

He is apathetic and isn't actually doing anything in my opinion. Maybe he really is having trouble getting into this game but I don't like how a large chunk of this posts are about how he can't read anyone or about his post restriction.

beeboy123 wrote:

If you can say why I am scum reading you I may change my mind

I don't need your approval though. I was just telling you that mafia is a game of reasoning. You can't just say "This one's scum and that one's town" without some explanation as to why, because, well, if you do that for too long, you'll end up being suspicious yourself. I don't really care if you change your mind because as far as I'm aware none of my posts indicate anything other than null which is fine.

Trying to aggressively seem town D1 is a bad move regardless of whether you're scum or town because people will just assume it's either a noob scum move, or if it's a skilled player they might think it's some reverse psychology shit and we just end up in a massive WIFOM fiesta and I don't want that. Most people are null for me right now, with some null-town and null-scum among them. Which also seems to be the case for other players since everyone is saying we don't have any strong leads to go off of, hence Shiirn's proposal for a nolynch D1. I'm still not sure about whether I want a nolynch myself though, but Shiirn's reasoning is kinda getting to me. We could always PL Jess since she hasn't been contributing much so, that'd give us some info, if she's scum then fine, that's one scum less, and if she's town she probably wasn't gonna contribute much anyway.

Shiirn wrote:

can i take a moment to point out that the level of social manipulation and perfect wording of even the most innocent phrase necessary to pull that off is absolutely terrifying

and i take it as a big compliment you think we're capable of that

Of course it is, but that's no reason to think it's out of the question~

Depending on the scum team there can be some really good synergies around so I try to tackle those first to see if I can get anything out of it. Sadly with you you just gave the most reasonable response so both you and Sakura are still null to me, with Sakura leaning scum, ever so slightly.

Zaphkael wrote:

Tess I came from voting you and really, it wouldn't be a great deal if i did again.

lol is this a vote threat or something

Zaphkael wrote:

No, what is worrying me is that of you have constantly been trying to say othe other one is scum, but when sakura was getting within hammer range you suddenly stopped everything and went on the hunt for me

Well duh. I didn't wanna hammer Sakura, I was just poking her with the vote to see how she'd react, and her reaction wasn't scummy enough to justify a hammer for me. Why on Earth would we hammer Sakura that soon into D1? Anyone pulling the last vote on her would be guaranteed to be lynched D2, and whether they're scum or town that's just a way too stale start of the game and I don't want that. On top of which, Sakura is a good player and if she's town I'd rather not risk lynching a good town.

Zaphkael wrote:

Now,there is a 9/11 chance town gets lynched + nightkill

Why do you keep mentioning NK? Do you have an NK ability? Also how do you know there's only two scum? If that has been confirmed somewhere I must've missed it, can anyone link me to a post where it was confirmed we have two scum? 9 town to 2 scum seems a bit much, unless scum has NK, in which case you just blew your cover.

Zaphkael wrote:

and its way too early to point fingers.

This is mafia. The whole game is about pointing fingers. We even have an FoS for crying out loud. What's the logic behind this?

Zaphkael wrote:

The only ppl that would really benefit from a lynch right now are scum, since that basically gives them a free kill. And surprisingly - sakura and tess are the ones really wanting that.

What, lol. I've already been saying I see Shiirn's reasoning and am juggling the idea between lynch or nolynch. Sakura's the only one who really wants a lynch - and for good reasons at that. Just what are you trying?

Zaphkael wrote:

And if it isnt - you should all know where to look with your experience, no?

Yeah, I'm looking at you. My vote is absolutely staying and I hope you get lynched, especially if no one can point me to a confirmation that the fact that there's only two mafia has been made public.

- Magic Bomb - wrote:

But after last game, I'm scared I'm trusting a new player too much again, damn.

Please remember that Jess was scum like, every game in the past. I know it's hard for new players but that doesn't mean they should be excluded from scumhunting, that'd only harm the game. People have to learn the hard way like in any other game.

beeboy123 wrote:

Can we just all vote Sakura she literally asked us to lynch her.

Stuff like this along with your other posts is really making me think you're the other scum alongside Zaphkael (assuming that what he said about there being two scum being true). Why do you keep randomly calling people scum without providing any reasoning for it and the moment Sakura says "I'd rather be lynched D1 than have a nolynch happen" you wanna jump on her and lynch her. Hell no. If anything, her saying that is pretty fucking town indicative because that's way too risky a play to make. I mean, she could've assumed that that would make her seem town and it could be some reverse psychology shit, sure, but that still doesn't make her a viable lynch. That'd just be wifom and like I said, I'm not looking for a wifomfest right now. (By the way, yes, Sakura changed from leaning slightly scum to leaning town for me as I was writing this post. I've just been reading the thread and replying to things as I go)

Shiirn wrote:

i dont see how 2 votes on me and sakura are wagons
honestly i dont think we can reach consensus anyway

I don't know why people keep mentioning wagons either, but I'd rather not lynch either of you today. That just seems like a bad move. If there are any lynchable candidates for me it's Jess, Zaphkael or beeboy. I'm not sure if we can reach a consensus either but I really really want to lynch Zaphkael, his posts are just too fishy for me to deal with.

Shiirn wrote:

"i'd rather be lynched d1 than go nolynch" means you're only in it for the control rather than playing the game

If she's only in it for control it means she's town because that'd be an absolutely horrendous scum play to make, no? She's basically saying she'd rather give town an advantage than do nothing. I can understand that somewhat, though I wouldn't rather be lynched than have a nolynch d1. That said I'll probably get killed n1 so eh. Big difference.

beeboy123 wrote:

Meh I treat it as scum aligned play actually. We clearly have enough time in the day phase to lynch someone else (Like Tess or Mbomb) but this feels more like scum AtE then anything else.

For the love of god could you please stop calling people scum without explaining why? It's a really bad habit.

Shiirn wrote:

consider the fact that, if only briefly, tess considered the possibility of Sakura and i intentionally double-bussing one another on day 1 without any provocation, that should tell you how wantonly crazy our playstyles are. Logical fallacy claims aren't going to slow it down.

I don't see how it's a scummy Appeal to Emotion either way. I do agree "ok fuck it vote me then" boistering is pretty scummy, but this is sakura, she's insane. But then we get into circular reasoning and wifom and oh man do i enjoy that.

It's happening ;; This is why I don't want to lynch you or Sakura. There's way too many ways both of you could be playing for any assumptions to be made right now. I'd still really like to know if there's a confirmed scumcount because that'd make things a lot easier.

Lastly I'd like to say that Haneii seems pretty town to me so far. His posts actually make sense.

beeboy123 wrote:

He is apathetic and isn't actually doing anything in my opinion.

That's you, actually.

beeboy123 wrote:

Maybe he really is having trouble getting into this game but I don't like how a large chunk of this posts are about how he can't read anyone or about his post restriction.

But everyone has been complaining about that. He's not alone and there's nothing wrong with his posts. I'd also be annoyed by post restrictions (btw, he only complained about that for like one or two posts or so).

I really don't know how to feel about your posts, they're fishy as hell.

Also sorry for the wall but I like to reply to what I can if possible.

My whole problem with Sakura is how she has literally given up when she has 2 kinda weak votes on her. Shiirn is saying that there is a good chance Sakura is flipping town and he has nothing better to do. All I have said is that she is incredibly apathetic and she doesn't feel genuine. I also don't think anyone else has declared a strong negative opinion on her as well.

After all that I have a lot of trouble seeing someone from a town POV go. "oh shit looks like I am dead and there is no way I am not being lynched today" It just feels so fake it isn't funny.

Tess wrote:

beeboy123 wrote:

He is apathetic and isn't actually doing anything in my opinion.

That's you, actually.

beeboy123 wrote:

Maybe he really is having trouble getting into this game but I don't like how a large chunk of this posts are about how he can't read anyone or about his post restriction.

But everyone has been complaining about that. He's not alone and there's nothing wrong with his posts. I'd also be annoyed by post restrictions (btw, he only complained about that for like one or two posts or so).

I really don't know how to feel about your posts, they're fishy as hell.

Also sorry for the wall but I like to reply to what I can if possible.

First part) I actually have scum reads.


Second part) Other people are putting more effort into scum hunting which is why I am calling him out in particular because I don't see that effort being put in.

first post

Setup

11 players. 9 Town, 2 Mafia
You will either be a Partygoer (Town) or Partyspoiler (Mafia)

Tess I originally thought a lot of your ideas where filler instead of actual points thought would benefit town.
I am starting to think that is more of a part of your play style and I like the last set of walls you made.

beeboy123 wrote:

First part) I actually have scum reads.
Second part) Other people are putting more effort into scum hunting which is why I am calling him out in particular because I don't see that effort being put in.

First part) Your scum reads are "This one's scum" "Why" *crickets*

Second part) Putting more effort into scumhunting doesn't necessarily make someone town, it could just as well be scum trying to seem town while forcing an "oopsie" mislynch or earn towncred by joining a bus wagon. That reasoning is wifom as hell and it's not gonna cut it.

beeboy123 wrote:

Tess I originally thought a lot of your ideas where filler instead of actual points thought would benefit town.
I am starting to think that is more of a part of your play style and I like the last set of walls you made.

Why thank you~

Shiirn wrote:

first post

Setup

11 players. 9 Town, 2 Mafia
You will either be a Partygoer (Town) or Partyspoiler (Mafia)

rip I'm dumb then. That makes Zaph a whole lot less suspicious to me, but I'd still like to know why he's so persistent about NK.

Shiirn wrote:

first post

Setup

11 players. 9 Town, 2 Mafia
You will either be a Partygoer (Town) or Partyspoiler (Mafia)

Not to mention the mafia sample role doesn't mention a faction kill. It could have just been left out. However, considering the flavour I don't think anyone dies.

*shrug* Not like speculating over the setup does us any good atm, but I'm bored and curious :p

Tess wrote:

First part) Your scum reads are "This one's scum" "Why" *crickets*

I was legitimately curious to see if you could identify the fact that you where commenting on things that weren't 100% driving the game forward at times because it could help me identify if it truly was a play style issue which you answer did help me realize.

Second part) Putting more effort into scumhunting doesn't necessarily make someone town, it could just as well be scum trying to seem town while forcing an "oopsie" mislynch or earn towncred by joining a bus wagon. That reasoning is wifom as hell and it's not gonna cut it.

^.^ It's ok we are lynching Sakura today and if Mbomb continues to not sufficiently scum hunt for 2 day phases he should be obv scum.

a key part of mafia playing, i find, is to be careful not to buy your own bluster. "What if Sakura flips town, what did I do wrong, who does that implicate?" should be questions on your mind as well. We don't want you getting ahead of yourself.


also i'm the only one here who apparently thrives on wifom so uhhhh maybe i'll cut it back this time. Playing both sides of the field is just so fun, though.

beeboy123 wrote:

Tess wrote:

First part) Your scum reads are "This one's scum" "Why" *crickets*

I was legitimately curious to see if you could identify the fact that you where commenting on things that weren't 100% driving the game forward at times because it could help me identify if it truly was a play style issue which you answer did help me realize.

Alright, that's fair enough. I'm actually glad you gave this answer because now I can focus on Zaphkael who's been my target since early D1 and with every post of his I'm starting to feel more and more like he's not innocent. Mbomb could be right though, and it could just be the fact that he's a beginner. I'm kind of surprised I'm the only one with a vote on him at this point.

beeboy123 wrote:

^.^ It's ok we are lynching Sakura today and if Mbomb continues to not sufficiently scum hunt for 2 day phases he should be obv scum.

I am not for lynching Sakura at all, and I have no significant read on Mbomb to make me want to lynch him either.

Shiirn wrote:

also i'm the only one here who apparently thrives on wifom so uhhhh maybe i'll cut it back this time. Playing both sides of the field is just so fun, though.

Haven't I been kinda wifom though? I just don't want it D1 because D1 is already uncertain enough as it is. D2 and beyond you can knock yourself out.

Why am I the only one that finds it odd that Sakura's thought process of "There is a gut vote and scum vote on me, guess I am lynched this was a fun game while it lasted" is really messed up.

That isn't a town thought process at all. :/
She shouldn't have 2 votes she should have 10.

Even if she does flip town a thought process like that makes her a huge target for scum and I honestly don't want to deal with given how strong of a scum read I have on her.

Tess wrote:

Shiirn wrote:

also i'm the only one here who apparently thrives on wifom so uhhhh maybe i'll cut it back this time. Playing both sides of the field is just so fun, though.

Haven't I been kinda wifom though? I just don't want it D1 because D1 is already uncertain enough as it is. D2 and beyond you can knock yourself out.

Fair enough. I also dislike wifom D1 because there's no evidence to shove into people's faces or intentionally mislead people with (town and scum respectively).


As long as you're confident in why you're voting for Sakura, that's fine, you do you. Like you said, I'm probably under "gut" vote quality there. I don't know much about Sakura's mafia playstyle other than "she's good" (from a few people i asked). I know far more about her actual personality than her mafia play, and am simply extrapolating what i know about her into the vein of mafia play.


Which is "crazy insane". i love it

Second half of post meant for beeboy. I hate not being able to quickedit T_T

Im apathetic because there's people laying low and i get attacked for asking them to contribute.
Im apathetic because literally the whole D1 phase is being centered around me.
Im apathetic because of the above im literally the only viable lynch, and so ppl should lynch me so they get to see my alignment and proceed from there, if im not lynched today and we end in a no lynch, nothing will change tomorrow and ppl will still suspect me and D2 will become a repeat of D1 (Debate centered on me).

I could honestly see Zaphk as scum as well with his play tbh, but im not that good at reading newbie players.
As for Jess im always happy to see her die, regardless of her alignment.

you intentionally caused D1 to be centered around you by going around FoSing everyone and being crazy aggressive. Once I showed up and started countering your aggression, you crawled into the fetal position and cried "why me why me".

Whether it was a viable strategy or bad play remains to be seen.

When are you going to learn to live with the fact that being crazy aggresive is my personality. Oh right you dismissed it every single time i mentioned it, yet keep going back to it as a form of accusation.

That's all you've done, you've centered your attack on me based on my aggresiveness.
I offered to show you that's my personality, you rejected it.
I offered to show you it's my meta and at most a null tell, you rejected it.
You just WANT to have a reason to suspect me, that's why im voting you, you're not scumhunting me, you're just assinging me an alignment and go from there.

I'm fine with you voting for me. It means you're essentially OMGUS. I accept that your aggression is part of your personality - but it is also within your capabilities to use that to your advantage as a mafia player. You're self-aware, in that respect.


There is no circular reasoning here. If anything, it's a compliment that I consider you a serious threat regardless of either of our alignments.

The day phase isn't revolved around you though, me and Shiirn maybe but not the entire game. I shouldn't have to explain this to you.

Also if you disappear and start to AtE how do you expect my read on you to develop?

^ if it wasn't clear that was directed at Sakura

Sakura seems town to me for reasons Tess has already stated (unless I misunderstood her words), as in that acting overly aggressive seems really bad for a scum to do, but I'd especially like to expand on that by saying that on this website most people are able to get away with lurking fine, acting overly aggressive simply isn't needed, scum could very easily hide under the radar by not really contributing at all.

For these same reasons, I also townread Shiirn and Tess for now.

Not revealing anymore reads for today, though, except if I get a reason to.

*nya*

Sakura please night kill me if you survive this day phase.

Just say you are being framed and AtE this town will eat it up.

Ok fine im a vengeful townie, now lynch me so i can kill scum.

I am down.

This is kind of getting out of hand. Why is everyone camping Sakura? The only one whose reasoning makes sense to me is Shiirn, and it's still not enough for me to want to vote her. I've already prodded her and the more she posts the less scummy she seems to me. Maybe I'm just naive though.

I didn't really intend to camp Sakura, except that she's the only person who actually initiated anything, and is the only person I can really read right now as her extremely overblown actions are such obvious markers even I, who relies on logic and predictions rather than tells, can make some inferences.

The most I have right now are some null scums, sakura being the most obvious one, but even that isn't nailed. There's only my and beeboy's votes on her, after all.

and sakura, D1 gambits are shit mmmk

beeboy123 wrote:

Why am I the only one that finds it odd that Sakura's thought process of "There is a gut vote and scum vote on me, guess I am lynched this was a fun game while it lasted" is really messed up.

That isn't a town thought process at all. :/
She shouldn't have 2 votes she should have 10.

Why am I the only one that sees how off this thought process is :/

AtE isn't alignment indicative as well. Come on guys...

Also i have the ppl that are coasting near deadline on my cross hairs.
But one of them is Zexion that's all fine and dandy with my reads.

Also Shiirn is either scum or just town that's too stubborn to acknowledge making a mistake or being wrong.
I'm pretty sure there's at least 1 scum among the loud ppl (Tess, Beeboy, Shiirn, Zapck) and 1 scum among the others who are coasting.

Being wrong about what? I've been as neutral in my claims as I think as is physically possible. I laid out the possibilities and my opinions on them, I've not made a single outright claim to be considered 'wrong'. Unless you're saying you're not aggressive and insane, in which case you should be looking at a mirror real hard and reconsidering.

Calling your playstyle aggressive and insane isn't being stubborn, it's being honest. :^)

It's nice to see that you're going back to your hyper-aggressive personality, though. I wonder how many times we'll swap between the two?

You're not being as neutral as you claim to be.
You've been claiming that

You see all posibilities but you dont believe any of them except the one that im scum.
You see that im scummy but "still consider the possibility im not" yet keep calling me scum in almost every other post.
Your words and actions dont match.

"nullscum with sakura being the most obvious".... is calling you scum? Well, I guess when you turn up every little tell up to 11, i guess it can be pretty strong

Everyone is scum until proven otherwise. That's how I play. I'm Properly Paranoid. I consider every single possibility. There are no hard facts or hard interactions between roles, actions, or tells that confirm you as town, as such, I will treat you as a potential scum player. Constantly aggravating that fact - "How dare you consider me scum!" - only makes me tick you harder into the scum category, if purely out of spite.

I'm not going to get into any further argument with your aggressive personality. The friendly one holds conversations better.

Sakura wrote:

I'm pretty sure there's at least 1 scum among the loud ppl (Tess, Beeboy, Shiirn, Zapck) and 1 scum among the others who are coasting.

There's always at least one scum among the loud people. Who's most likely out of those to be scum to you?

Shiirn wrote:

I'm not going to get into any further argument with your aggressive personality. The friendly one holds conversations better.

This seems kinda personal.. I don't think that's healthy in a mafia game. Even though I think Sakura's aggressive play makes her a potential scum, she's also said plenty of things which are indicative of town, which puts her in the same ballpark as you in my opinion.

If shiirn is town, i bet he's one of those ppl that blames mislynches on the lynchee instead of themselves.

I mean, it's personal but I don't mean it to be offensive, just halting.

(Unchanged)

Deadline is in 22.5 hours

Tess wrote:

There's always at least one scum among the loud people. Who's most likely out of those to be scum to you?

If it wasnt obvious.
It's the person im voting.

It's day 1 and we have people voting for eachother out of spite ^^''

bodies havent even hit the floor yet!

Shiirn wrote:

It's day 1 and we have people voting for eachother out of spite ^^''

bodies havent even hit the floor yet!

Where in the everliving fuck did you ever get this from. Now you're making up reasons out of thin air?

Wait why is my vote on shiirn, idk why but the logic of "one of the loud ones is always scum" seems off to me.

Unvote

*mew*

So what i've learned from this game is...
osu! has backtracked so much in time that everything that's mafia has turned upside down.
Things like
"No lynch D1 is better"
"Scumread for wanting to lynch someone D1"
"Scumread for having an aggresive persnoality, completely unrelated to alignment"
"Town lays low and anyone hunting is scum with an agenda"
All those things are the complete opposite of anything that anyone has any knowledge of mafia.
However this game has gotten to the point that im not enjoying playing on it.
People are too stubborn and stuck up on their decissions and wont come up to a lynch.
This is going to bite you in the ass later, but of course, no one ever listens to me.
Oh and dont forget the fact that i always get mislynched as town and always get perfect wins as scum.

I really wanted to play with you guys gain, but i just can't, this is too much BS for me to take in, and apparently ppl here dont wanna learn, tho you're always welcome to go to MS and get lynched for following all the psychologies listed above. I'm done sorry.

@Mod: I'm replacing out

Oh cool, people have been posting. I like that.

Tess, MagicBomb, Hanilli, and Sakura are all town.
I won't be lynching em today.

Sakura wrote:

So what i've learned from this game is...
osu! has backtracked so much in time that everything that's mafia has turned upside down.
Things like
"No lynch D1 is better"
"Scumread for wanting to lynch someone D1"
"Scumread for having an aggresive persnoality, completely unrelated to alignment"
"Town lays low and anyone hunting is scum with an agenda"
All those things are the complete opposite of anything that anyone has any knowledge of mafia.
However this game has gotten to the point that im not enjoying playing on it.
People are too stubborn and stuck up on their decissions and wont come up to a lynch.
This is going to bite you in the ass later, but of course, no one ever listens to me.
Oh and dont forget the fact that i always get mislynched as town and always get perfect wins as scum.

I really wanted to play with you guys gain, but i just can't, this is too much BS for me to take in, and apparently ppl here dont wanna learn, tho you're always welcome to go to MS and get lynched for following all the psychologies listed above. I'm done sorry.

@Mod: I'm replacing out

I'mma copy your hardcore personality from the beginning of the game.
Grow up and play the game.

Just because people do not understand your perspective gives you no right to quit out. Take the comments directed at you a different way, so like who has been pointing fingers back at you with weak sheep claims, then when/if you die from lynching, before you die post a final reads list so people will respect your reads more and go from there.

The whole methodology of replacing out to prove a point is complexity bullshit and would have to have subbed into a game where that's literally one of the first things I gotta deal with, and if you are a vet here on this site you should know better.


I see you as town, I am willing to defend you hard today. I'll reconsider you tomorrow. Don't give up.

vote:Zephkael

People who make large posts explaining rules instead of giving opinions makes me want to kill them.

Xiz wrote:

Oh cool, people have been posting. I like that.

Tess, MagicBomb, Hanilli, and Sakura are all town.
I won't be lynching em today.

Even if I disagree I can see why you would be town reading Sakura, but please explain this MBomb read to me.

unvote

This is never gaining traction.
Zeph feels like a mislynch though but I am going to have to reread.

- Magic Bomb - wrote:

Sakura seems town to me for reasons Tess has already stated (unless I misunderstood her words), as in that acting overly aggressive seems really bad for a scum to do, but I'd especially like to expand on that by saying that on this website most people are able to get away with lurking fine, acting overly aggressive simply isn't needed, scum could very easily hide under the radar by not really contributing at all.

For these same reasons, I also townread Shiirn and Tess for now.

This falls in line with my current reads. I don't have any opinions on MB otherwise. I'd say MB would be better to look at D2 then D1.

beeboy123 wrote:

unvote
Zeph feels like a mislynch though but I am going to have to reread.

I think I remember reading someone saying that Zeph is new. Usually newer mafia fill posts with game mechanics instead of reads.

I like Xiz' posts so far. Also I'm not surprised Sakura is leaving. I wanted to pressure her a bit early but that would've been a bit much for me too. I wish she stayed though.

Sakura, quit being such a bitch whenever things don't go your way. You can't expect everyone to have read the entirety of mafiascum wiki and memorized all of the theories, a lot of players just wing it and that's perfectly fine on its own.

But then you run into other players who are just as good at mafia, if not better, and then you decry that their playstyles are stubborn or counter-intuitive and whine that they're bringing the average up.


Pick a fucking side. Do you want to lord over newbies or do you want to have a challenging game that involves more than pointless dickwaving on day fucking one. Nobody's even died yet and you're crying foul.

You're misinterpreting and misrepresenting my playstyle of playing with raw logic and handling everything with a grain of salt with outright accusing you of being mafia just because i have my eye on you. That is so incredibly arrogant and bitchy I can't even believe it. It has to be an act.

It's absolutely disgusting that you seriously think everyone needs to agree with you or they're clearly playing wrong. If you want to get out, [i]please do[/b]. I for one think this game would be better if you weren't throwing hissy fits.


I don't vote for lurkers, so regardless of what's happening, we're probably not going to have a wagon.

Why is everyone replacing out o_o. I also had a game where someone quit because he/she couldn't get his points across.

Unvote.

- Magic Bomb - wrote:

Zexion apparently doesn't read my posts enough to understand my reasoning behind them. Like I've said multiple times, I'm having far too much problem reading this game, so I'm just trying to help as much as I can, but my mind is just not working right. Would request a replacement but with so many it seems really bad.
*meows*

I've read your post, and I can only conclude that doing that is totally not a problem when it isn't me doing it. I really don't understand why nobody sees an issue - but anyway, may be a personañ thought no to post fluff.

Sakura wrote:

beeboy123 wrote:

Sakura votes will help this problem

You know, you're right.
At this point i rather be lynched than deal with this town that doesn't want to scumhunt.

Not agreeing with you is the same as not scumhunting? Some of your points are valid, but this kind of attitude isn't going to help.

Shiirn wrote:

-long post about possible Sakura roles-
p/5151475

Why was this needed? I mean I totally get you try to justify Sakura's playstyle via roles but why it needs to be justified this way? Pretty sure I could play anyway I want regardless of my role, this whole point may lead to nowhere.

Also it does seems like rolefishing.

Zaphkael wrote:

Depending on who gets NK without even lynching reveals a lot too and doesn't put more townies at risk.

Id see zexion as scum but reading everything through i noticed tess and sakura seem to be teaming. If thats from scum perspective or town perspective, i dunno. Thats why i agree to wait with lynching; depending on who gets NK will most likely reveal if above duo is scum or town, unless (what is a viable option) scum decides to kill off lurkers instead of potential dangers

So yah unless someone makes a terrible move by tomorrow no lynch almost reveals as much as a bad lynch

Totally not wishy-washy. I honestly don't agree a lot with these kind of posts being scum-indicative, but this is just stating facts and then a bunch of possibilities.

Oh, I was writing in two different replies x_x

Zaphkael wrote:

Tess I came from voting you and really, it wouldn't be a great deal if i did again.
No, what is worrying me is that of you have constantly been trying to say othe other one is scum, but when sakura was getting within hammer range you suddenly stopped everything and went on the hunt for me - i kinda started the sakura wagon and yes, my terrible and confusing playstyle allowed you to do so easily. Now,there is a 9/11 chance town gets lynched + nightkill (if there is one anyway, or multiple like shiirn suggested) and its way too early to point fingers. The only ppl that would really benefit from a lynch right now are scum, since that basically gives them a free kill. And surprisingly - sakura and tess are the ones really wanting that.
Now this game is messed up and both might really think that its the best thing to do and thats whats really bothering me, hence the no vote.
Also, even if a lurker gets killed, we have a body to discuss and we still have items to try and make stuff easier. And if it isnt - you should all know where to look with your experience, no?

I know Tess addresed this post already but I want to take a different look at it, why do you need to point out all the obvious? There are two parts which are personally bothering me.

The only ppl that would really benefit from a lynch right now are scum, since that basically gives them a free kill. And surprisingly - sakura and tess are the ones really wanting that.

I would push for a lynch too, basically everyone who wants to have a little more information will push for a D1 lynch, why does this have to be scum indicative?

Also, even if a lurker gets killed, we have a body to discuss and we still have items to try and make stuff easier. And if it isnt - you should all know where to look with your experience, no?

Do you mean is possibly better to lynch lurkers? I don't really get this point, but a lurker kill won't probably bring much to discuss - if they were just lurking, their interactions with other players would probably be null and not much is learnt by that.

- Magic Bomb - wrote:

This quote from Nyaphkael didn't really look good to me either, being too heavily assosciated with a scumpartner d1 is a really bad idea, and Sakura and Tess are both really good players, so I doubt they would do that as scum. However, the main reason Zaph isn't overly suspicious to me is because he is a new player, so this sentence seems quite logical from the perspective of someone who hasn't played before.

But after last game, I'm scared I'm trusting a new player too much again, damn.

Would you vote Zaph if he wasn't a new player? (This question may be redundant, but I really want to see how much being new affects your vote).

Also this is a filler but, remember you were also scum on your first game here and we gave you the town pass

Sakura wrote:

Im apathetic because there's people laying low and i get attacked for asking them to contribute.

Hey wait a sec, when did this happen?

Sakura wrote:

Also i have the ppl that are coasting near deadline on my cross hairs.
But one of them is Zexion that's all fine and dandy with my reads.

Forgive me for having two crazy days IRL x_x

No seriously I would have liked to come back sooner.

------------

Xiz is making sense, I pretty much had the same idea before I read his posts. I need to place a more useful vote right now.

Vote: Zaphkael

Will probably check back in some hours.

Since this is a closed setup game, but it's DAY MOFOKIN' ONE and nobody has claimed ANY sort of abilities, my assumptions about Sakura were listed assuming vanilla setups.

I was trying to make the point that my logical style of play does very little when there is no information to go off of, because any one of the four cases could have been true, or they could all be wrong, and I'd have no idea. So I was asked what my gut feeling was, and i went with my gut feeling, but apparently that is illogical. Can't win with Sakura. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Shiirin you should start posting about others

Shiirn wrote:

It's absolutely disgusting that you seriously think everyone needs to agree with you or they're clearly playing wrong. If you want to get out, [i]please do[/b]. I for one think this game would be better if you weren't throwing hissy fits.

This statement is more disturbing then Sakura wanting to replace out.
This is just a game, nothing said in game should be taken seriously.

If you really truly cared about playing and winning, instead of being disruptive you would attempt to work with Sakuya. Also, nothing you have said on this page has moved the game on at all due to it already being said or irrelevant banter.


If we don't kill Zap, I would say we should consider Shiirn.
I'm going to read through Shiirns posts from the beggining and see what he/she's done.

sure why not

uhhhhh since this is day one this is 100% purely conjecture and shoudl not be taken as fos or eye on yous, i'm just very paranoid and there will likely be a lot of nullscums

mbomb: null-null, lurking and confusion and hesitation to post, i believe his post restriction gag but the rest i dunno

Tess: null-scum, because she's always null-scum to me because her townie-aligned play is nearly perfect. Also by virtue of her "one of the loud ones" fact, she's gonna be a bit scum.

Jess: No clue, 100% lurker right there

Zexion: walls of text but somehow manages to not be a "loud one" due to inactivity spikes. Again, seems to just be wagoning on the rationale of me/sakura/tess. This, for me, produces a nullnull or nullscum result.

Haneii: conf town for cuteness. jk, null null. Haneii's got issues being a modded-in person and likely can't play at full effectiveness, but seems to be just watching the party for right now

Xiz: Same as haneii, except for the cuteness part. Players who simply agree with other player's reasonings are the hardest to read. nullnull.

beeboy: nullscum, for his insistence on sakura with little explanation. I have my suspicions as to what's going on with him in this game but i can't confirm them until bodies start hitting the floor, just hope mine doesn't.

Zaphkael: also nullscum, but fairly weak as he was just attacked by sakura and flailed in panic which isn't a scum nor a town tell. the fact that he started lurking afterwards is more scummy than town, though.

Shiirn: hahahahahahaha

AutoMedic: Who?

Sakura: I think i already beat that particular horse to death.

I'd work with sakura if her style of "Day 1 scumhunting" wasn't "attack people just to see how they react". That's not scumhunting, that's just being a dick. You can't possibly predict with any amount of certainty how people will react to being FoS'd or OMGUS'd or RV'd. I want logic and reasoning, not a barbaric brawl. (Also note my use of buzzwords, accurate though they are)

(freaking hit ctrl enter instead of enter)

The kind of reasoning sakura uses is likely to end up the same as a literal random vote wagon except she gets to "lead the charge" as it were and it just feels to me like it's just ego-stroking in that case. I already went over why I feel this style of play is extremely scummy and anti-town as it does nothing but add stress to the game.

Tess and Shiirn are town btw.

wow im not cute? you are not sexually attracted to cubones?


If I change my avi to an anime cutie would you love me

Thanks for the reads list shiirn, but what I meant for you to do is start questioning other people. I don't care about your reads until I see you actually trying to solve the game besides tunneling on one person.

also beeboy looks towny to me today.

ok

You were saying I'm scum like one page ago, what happened

Make that two pages, forgot to refresh.

Me?

Yes

Is I changed my mind an acceptable answer?

It's a shame you're leaving Sakura. Your work has been/will be appreciated :3 - if this game ever sees an end.

Dw shiirn i havent been lurking bc of my argument with sakura, i just cant be as active during weekends due to probs with parents
Ill put a bigger post in a few mins/hours, when i arrive at dorm

ok so
i have not replied a lot lately cuz of parents and bc it seems that whatever i say eventually becomes 'hes noob dont mind him' so why should i try

then; im pretty convinced of a nightkill since its a 9/2 game with gadgets, it seems highly unlogical that we are just required to lynch each other off
Tess: why am i suddenly less scummy if there are only 2 scum people in play

Oh and, i dunno but tess, not knowing that there are 2 scums here is a bit weird, no? you should know what you are hunting for, so either you didnt prepare well as a town or u tried to look like 'well i cant chat with other scum if im town so i dont know how much scum there is'

also, sakura did a genius move either way: either she really is tired of this game (which is the most likely), or she tried to get everyone off of her with emotional arguments, and if thats the case: well done, it worked surprisingly well.

beeboy: can you please explain your reads? im not getting them if you just say 'is town, is scum'
xiz: do you have good reasons of voting for me

(ok why am i even asking my play is horrible)

why i am insisting on NL is because it doesnt help town, but it surely delays scum a lot (so yeah, its a desperate try of proving im town and i dont really mind doing so cuz i have no clue about who is what, and with those replacements it gets even harder)

@Zexion: Yes, I would be voting Zaphkael if he wasn't new. But at the same time, I'd also be voting Jess if I didn't know she played like that all the time anyway.

*nya*

Zaphkael wrote:

Oh and, i dunno but tess, not knowing that there are 2 scums here is a bit weird, no? you should know what you are hunting for, so either you didnt prepare well as a town or u tried to look like 'well i cant chat with other scum if im town so i dont know how much scum there is'

I've played so much discord mafia lately that I got kinda used to not having mod confirmation of who was mafia or not. I also rarely care about the flavor and stuff, I tend to just jump in the game and post reads and figure things out as I go. And how on Earth do you think that is a possible scumtell on me when all I said was "I'm not aware of this and if no one can confirm this, that makes you suspicious."

A post like that doesn't really mean much other than that I'm claiming not to know, and I'm saying that if nobody else knows, then you knowing it is an instant scumtell on you. It's just null. Just think about it. Why would I post such a thing as scum, a role where you need to be paying a whole lot more attention to what you say and how you act than town? I would KNOW that if you know there's 2 scum, then all other towns know, because I'd know your role. And it doesn't make me town either because I could also be SK trying to figure out how many mafia there are.

Basically: What you said doesn't make sense to me.

Zaphkael wrote:

Tess: why am i suddenly less scummy if there are only 2 scum people in play

What
Where did I say that?

Also I just woke up and I'm groggy as hell so I'm sorry if I sound rude or said something stupid. I still want to lynch Zaphkael, don't really care that he's a beginner. For all we know he's just using that as an excuse to be able to say whatever he wants and get away with posts that would seem scummy on anyone else.

Also is it just me or are all these reads on Sakura really bad?

I wonder how SK would even fit within the confines of flavor. Drunk-off-their-ass party guy who doesn't care?

A lot of my reads are gut and a lot of them change over a short period of time so me not explaining reads will happen until the ball starts to roll....


Anyway once I realized my problems with Tess where originally just something I didn't like about his play style and once I reread his posts keeping that in mind I think Tess is making good strides to solve this game. I also don't think Shiirn as scum would attempt to mislynch Sakura day 1 over any of the other mislynch options for obvious reasons.


You don't have to respect them but a lot of my reads will be gut reads this game so.... >.>

That's fine, as long as you mention they're gut reads so I can take them with a grain of salt. Also I'm a her

Sorry >.<

Shiirn wrote:

first post

Setup

11 players. 9 Town, 2 Mafia
You will either be a Partygoer (Town) or Partyspoiler (Mafia)

rip I'm dumb then. That makes Zaph a whole lot less suspicious to me, but I'd still like to know why he's so persistent about NK.[/quote]

ok tess you did say that xd

oh and to those people that do this: you dont have to refrain from lynching just because i am new, you have to lynch me if you think that im scum
but tess, i never, ever stated that im new and that i can say whatever i want because of that. I only mentioned it once, every time you heard 'zaph is newb so dont mind that' wasnt said by me at all. its no excuse for me.

lol i ruined that quote but it was said by you tess, here

Why is Zaph the current leading wagon?

I have been trying to get an excuse to go on his wagon for awhile but I don't see anything scummy coming from his slot. Can someone enlighten me so I can hopefully leach off someones vote.

Back,reading now

Deadline in 5 hours!
I will try to find a replacement for Sakura first in case AutoMedic comes back after his 5 day leave

Lynching requires 6 votes!

So d1 is almost over and I am the people who are just sitting here and watch,just talk real quick.
I don't get about what the heck Zaph 's post is talk about,seen like panicing for me. And I don't like the over-aggressive scumread .It get a very bad result of town.I also hearing about people about lynching me for my attitude,this won't help in this situation.It can let scum get a free kill for this.
I won't voting zaph because i can't find a better reason to following this wagon.