beeboy123 replaces Birdy, effective immediately

Deadline remains unchanged at May 23, 4:30 PM EST
This is still over 5 days from now, so plenty of time for party

vote: Sakura

Town is so lucky to have me honestly.

Don't want her to be in hammer range, either way.

Sakura was at L-2 silly.
I wouldn't put someone at L-1 like that.

I haven't read her walls yet but I honestly don't think any of the "scum hunting" she has done so far comes from a town point of view.

I would explain now but I have a lot of time tomorrow so you guys are out of luck!

Frostings wrote:

beeboy123 replaces Birdy, effective immediately

Deadline remains unchanged at May 23, 4:30 PM EST
This is still over 5 days from now, so plenty of time for party

So I'm guessing Sakura's kill was fake?

What's with these walls. Oh my god.

I'll read them a bit later. Need to rest right now.

No killing anyone in the party
You're just politely kicked out

ok since i have time

town: nobody really

nulltown: mb bc he didnt do shit so far
zxion bc he isnt that active either and well, his last comment seemed more town rather than scum to me
quill seems harmless too, but i should wait with that judgement
automedic i need more to get a real opinion but for now imma put him here
jess i dunno he didnt make any real moves either and idling is rather a town thing, correct me if im wrong
nav read sakura thing
beeboy read sakura thing

no idea at all
sakura: naz and birdy beeboy are pretty convinced that shes town. if only 1 person said that it would have been a terrible duo scum move but now that theyre with 2 believing it i dunno

[nullscum
shiirn seemed town for sure to me a while ago but now i dunno anymore since hes kinda just blindly following me in my horrible playing and thats just ehhh
tess same hes following shiirn

ok i might be horribly wrong but + i dont think sakura is gonna make a mistake this early so

b]/unvote[/b]
/vote tess

rip bbcode does that still count? im not a ninja, unlike shiirn

i have no problems with a jess lynch, she'll just harm town if we miss a shot, altho we really need to get that one mafia. we're at a disadvantage since were pretty much shooting in the dark

im pretty much speculating a zexion/navziel or zaphkael/zexion team, but zaph trying to seperate with zexion isnt mafia behaviour

Shiirn wrote:

@Tess I hate the concept of cops claiming day 2 after scumhunting day one. it's a practice that is incredibly scummy to me, but it might just be really meta. I apologize if it's too meta. It'd be better for all involved for a cop to finger someone day 2 with a reveal having said next to nothing, it's far less risky and agressive than scumhunting day 1 and risking a nightkill just to get rid of an annoyance. Basically, if sakura's scum, she's playing super aggressively and vying for a cop call, and i want to cut off her chances of doing that, and if she's townie, she's playing very suicidal for a cop, which means she'd need to have some sort of assured protection or she's just making a big blunder. I'm of the opinion that the scum chance is much higher.


"I'm not gonna self-read because I'm not Shiirn." self-reading is important. Regardless of whether i'm townie or scum, I need to properly paint myself town for the rest of my reads to play off eachother.

Alright, that's fair enough. I can understand the reasoning behind that. Also eh.. I don't like painting myself as town because that's something that'd be good for me to do both as town and as scum, and as such when someone accurately paints themselves as town I end up just reading them as null because it tells me nothing about them.

Sakura wrote:

While i agree that town generally is more reckless than scum, lack of intent doesnt equal town, while having intent doesnt equal scum, the type of motivation is what counts, you'll have a lot of playstyle clashes if you continue to think this way.

I agree with this 100%, town or scumpainting someone based on a generalized assumption won't really get you too far in this game.

Sakura wrote:

apparently i have to meta dive every player without knowing where they play to begin with before the game starts?

Sakura wrote:

Oh gee is like you've never seen me play before, now im even more convinced you're scum.

???

Wait, so, you don't want to meta dive others, but we have to meta dive you? How does that make sense at all? Also what about my play after I posted again was passive? I just don't understand your reasoning behind trying to scumpaint me. Also did you see the size of my post once I did get back? How do I not care?

Sakura wrote:

Or they aren't falling for your trickery, You scumhunt, in your own way, not wait for D2 to see if anything happens just to sit and fiddle your thumbs with the exact same information you had before game started.

Uh, well..
1. What trickery? What about my posts would you describe as "trickery"?
2. No one said I'm waiting for D2 to scumhunt. I said I'm waiting for D2 to scumhunt in a specific way. I won't do certain things without having the necessary information because I don't want to give scum any advantage whatsoever if I can help it. So, once again, not sure what you're trying to say here but it feels like you're not really reading my posts and just tunnelvisioning on what you're trying to paint me as rather than what I've actually said.

Sakura wrote:

"Entering Excuse here to jump off the wagon later"so far

Wow, yeah, let's act like we have strong and meaningful reads in early D1 rather than try and pressure people to get info out of them and see where we're going from there. Yeah, totally an excuse for me not wagoning. In case you didn't know, I never really need an "excuse" to vote or unvote someone. If I feel they're worth voting, I'll vote them, if not, I'll unvote. I'll explain my reasoning sure, but there's never a need for a setup to do so. That'd just be silly.

To be completely honest I'd rather be voting Zaphkael right now but eh.. I really don't like how Sakura is playing this game. Among others.

Zaphkael wrote:

[nullscum
shiirn seemed town for sure to me a while ago but now i dunno anymore since hes kinda just blindly following me in my horrible playing and thats just ehhh
tess same hes following shiirn

ok i might be horribly wrong but + i dont think sakura is gonna make a mistake this early so

...Okay, wait, so

Shiirn is following you
I'm following Shiirn
And you're voting me.

Do you see the flaw in this little circle of reasoning? For one, I don't see how Shiirn is "Blindly following" anything, he seems to have an opinion of his own and whether it's correct or not is something we've yet to find out. For another, how on Earth am I following Shiirn? I just said he understood the purpose of certain playstyles and that as usual I'm having a hard time reading him. All he's really done so far is just prod people for info and try to figure things out about our little trinkets we got in the mail, which doesn't say much imo.

About Sakura not making a mistake this early, where does that reasoning come from? Meta? Like, what's the purpose of even saying that? It's not about her making mistakes, town has ways to figure out if someone is scum even if they pretend to be town extremely convincingly. If Sakura's scum, I'm most certainly not praying she makes a mistake so we can figure her out. Instead you just look at her behavior and try thinking about which faction it would benefit. If it benefits both or neither factions, you read someone as null. Pretty straightforward, and no mistakes involved.

Also, I'm a she.

AutoMedic wrote:

i have no problems with a jess lynch, she'll just harm town if we miss a shot, altho we really need to get that one mafia. we're at a disadvantage since were pretty much shooting in the dark

im pretty much speculating a zexion/navziel or zaphkael/zexion team, but zaph trying to seperate with zexion isnt mafia behaviour

There's no reason to lynch Jess right now, it'd be a waste of a lynch and if she's town we're just digging ourselves a grave. No info would be taken from that whatsoever. Right now I'd rather lynch Sakura/Zaphkael. Could you provide reasoning behind suspecting Zexion/Navizel?

Also pressuring Sakura is fine but let's not hammer her now. There's still plenty of time left to discuss and she's far from suspicious enough to be worth hammering atm.

Unvote

Vote: Zaphkael

finally holy shit
ppl have been suspecting me as scum since i blamed sakura and it has to take this long until I even get a single vote on my head? thats quality guys

also tess what are you basing your vote on?

Read my posts, I explained why I wanted to vote you twice or thrice

Well I got after sakura for no reason at all and suddenly she is the main target (ok maybe i am the main target now but w/e)
also voting me right after i voted you isnt the best thing you couldve done, it makes you even more suspicious
o and btw it is inexperienced (town) play, this is my first game ever

Why put town in parentheses? Also me voting you after you voted me isn't "suspicious" since I had already mentioned you earlier, to which Sakura responded that I was setting up for detaching from the wagon on her. I mean, it could be viewed that way, but really I just didn't wanna keep beating at a dead horse and you seemed like a better target than her.

Anyway, adding "(town)" to your post does not make you look more town. Just for the record. My vote stays for now.

Zaphkael wrote:

nulltown: mb bc he didnt do shit so far
zxion bc he isnt that active either and well, his last comment seemed more town rather than scum to me
quill seems harmless too, but i should wait with that judgement
automedic i need more to get a real opinion but for now imma put him here
jess i dunno he didnt make any real moves either and idling is rather a town thing, correct me if im wrong

Shouldn't these all be null, not nulltown? Not doing anything isn't a sign of town, it's a sign of being null at best.

Yeah Zaph's reads are kinda weird but if he's a beginner it's okay I guess

mbomb where's the nya-ing

Fucking hell I've got the memory of a fucking goldfish and I'm a cat nya nya nya~

Literally hate fucking post restrictions so much especially when they make me have to be cringy as kittylitter.

sign,being a autism suck
unvote
i won't promise to post the read now,my mind changed.even I post the read,it won't help the game.

- Magic Bomb - wrote:

As much as it annoys me to say it, we can not really do anything about Jess's attitude, she acts the same in all games, and it's not really a town or scum tell. It'd be best to PL her at some point, but for now it's probably best to ignore her as it's D1 and we're nowhere near deadline.

Why do you want me to get PL?Am I the easiest person to get a lynch by town?

about why I didn't move now:
It is too dangerous to do a move and make a vote now.I am not good at express about my thought.Also In this situation,it is neither vote or follow a wagon that someone create.

I have highly suspect on people who want to PL me,I know I am a annoying person.but idk why they said that even they know i am a annoying person.

everything i want to said is already by another people.
sleep now,vote later

You should have asked the mod to not let Jess sign up.
I am not supporting a PL nor do I have problems with Jess so far this game.

Right... how did so many walls appear. To be honest I've got no interest in partaking in Sakura's and Tess discussion, so I'll address other stuff. I'm keepping my vote on Navi for now btw, specially to avoid something stupid happening.

Navizel wrote:

Zexion wrote:

@Navi: are you voiting Quill just beacuse the last game?

That's one reason I guess. Second is I don't trust Frostings and so-called friends.

I'm gonna ask you to elaborate on that, unless you were not being serious and that's really not a moment to do that. Also that post was a whole lot of nothing, you are certanly slipping under the radar it seems.

Quill is also lurking quite effectively.

Shiirn wrote:

largely because such intensive scumhunting with literally no basis other than casual discussion is something even I'd hesitate to do without an ulterior motive. me and tess didn't get to really dig into our omgus or start up rounds of wifom because of sakura's crazy tornado of fingerpointing and town analysis.

Dangerous assumption. While I really don't understand this aggresive scumhunting I also can't claim it's comletely anti-town, I don't really think scum benefits that much for attracting a lot of atention. I don't want to go into meta so I'll just analyse what I see.

Sakura wrote:

Let's now add wishy washy stances to the reasons i think you're scum.

I'm gonna asumme "wishy washy" was refering to weak claims or something like that. Are you talking about the post restriction thing or your townread on AutoMedic? Or do you just want to be vague in what you say? (Seems I was wrong about the post-restriction anyways).

AutoMedic wrote:

i have no problems with a jess lynch, she'll just harm town if we miss a shot, altho we really need to get that one mafia. we're at a disadvantage since were pretty much shooting in the dark

im pretty much speculating a zexion/navziel or zaphkael/zexion team, but zaph trying to seperate with zexion isnt mafia behaviour

Is that only because I haven't walled that much? Thanks for the insightful conclusion by the way.

Jess stance on voting really reminds me of my first game. I'll probably get nothing by adressing it tho.

beeboy123 wrote:

I am not supporting a PL nor do I have problems with Jess so far this game.

Fullly agree. It's like the typical excuse for both town and scum has become to lynch Jess when people have no idea where the game is going.

Zexion wrote:

I'm gonna ask you to elaborate on that, unless you were not being serious and that's really not a moment to do that. Also that post was a whole lot of nothing, you are certanly slipping under the radar it seems.

I really can't tell you anything right now.

Will read walls later.

actually, replace me

I don't have time for mafia

Looking for a replacement for Navi

Zaphkael with two votes? op

You what

Zexion, the discussion between me and Sakura is very relevant though. Also, I talked about more people than just Sakura.

yeah why do I have 2 votes o:

proly because I ripped my bbcode on the /unvote and frostings didnt see that
frostings: i removed vote for sakura

Vote: Zexion
Too tired to reply to everything in detail right now.
But i don't like how Zexion's been playing since the beginning with all the fence sitting and wishy washy stances (he asked what wishy washy was, it means when you go like "They may be scum, but they may not" or something like that, it's different from fence sitting where you dont take a stance at all). Nor i like how he's ignoring the complete debate between me and Tess.

Probably more tomorrow.

Sakura wrote:

Vote: Zexion
Too tired to reply to everything in detail right now.
But i don't like how Zexion's been playing since the beginning with all the fence sitting and wishy washy stances (he asked what wishy washy was, it means when you go like "They may be scum, but they may not" or something like that, it's different from fence sitting where you dont take a stance at all). Nor i like how he's ignoring the complete debate between me and Tess.

Probably more tomorrow.

You're desperate, aren't you? How can you accuse me of both having no stances and having dubious stances at the same time? If I just wanted to fence-sitting all game I would probably be saying stuff like "Guys let's policy lynch Jess because I don't like how she plays" or posting obvious things like "we're in a disadvantage since were pretty much shooting in the dark" which is something no one has done at all... oh wait.

I really don't get how my comment on MB's play is "wishy-washy" (why is it wrong that I didn't know this phrase applied to mafiia?) since I said I reached a conclussion, which is totally not like "I'm not sure". Here's my literal comment on that if you want to double-check, because I don't really see where I'm doubting.

Zexion wrote:

I was thinking and came to the conclussion that I don't really see how a scum would benefit for speaking like if you were post-restricted. It's totally non alignment indicative. I refuse to believe its an actual post restriction.

Also, I didn't say I ignored your discussion with Tess, I merely said I didn't want to reply it, unless you wanted me to go line by line replying something that had already been said.

Zexion wrote:

You're desperate, aren't you?

Lol. She doesn't come off as very desperate to me. I can understand why she's voting you.

Zexion wrote:

Also, I didn't say I ignored your discussion with Tess, I merely said I didn't want to reply it, unless you wanted me to go line by line replying something that had already been said.

Zexion wrote:

Right... how did so many walls appear. To be honest I've got no interest in partaking in Sakura's and Tess discussion, so I'll address other stuff. I'm keepping my vote on Navi for now btw, specially to avoid something stupid happening.

Okay, it's true that you said you didn't want to reply to it, but that's what ignoring is. You ignoring our discussion only makes it look like you're cherrypicking posts you can work off of more easily, which yeah, does make you look suspicious. I'm not voting you yet but I think Sakura's vote is entirely justified.

Tess wrote:

Zexion wrote:

You're desperate, aren't you?

Lol. She doesn't come off as very desperate to me. I can understand why she's voting you.

She's desperate because she stacked contradictory reasons together just to make her accusation look stronger.

Tess wrote:

Okay, it's true that you said you didn't want to reply to it, but that's what ignoring is. You ignoring our discussion only makes it look like you're cherrypicking posts you can work off of more easily, which yeah, does make you look suspicious. I'm not voting you yet but I think Sakura's vote is entirely justified.

I don't get it. If I totally ignored those posts I wouldn't have addressed the "Wishy-washy" stuff because it was on the middle of one of those walls. Why are you accusing me of working with some posts more easily if none of those (save the one I mentioned) were adressed to me? What specifically did you want me or were expecting me to comment about? The reason why I said that is because I found no point in quoting some stuff and replying to something which had already been said, and in scumhunting purposes I really couldn't reach a conclussion by just reading that. (Except on Zaphkael)

Also it's kinda funny. People accusing me of ignoring such walls when half of the players haven't even mentioned such discussion, yet I'm the only one being accused for it because I said it?

Zexion wrote:

Also it's kinda funny. People accusing me of ignoring such walls when half of the players haven't even mentioned such discussion, yet I'm the only one being accused for it because I said it?

Yep.

You stated a wishy washy stance on MB.
You are fence sitting on my discussion with Tess, and other players.
Not contradictory

I find it odd that I am the only one with a Sakura vote.

beeboy123 wrote:

I find it odd that I am the only one with a Sakura vote.

Honestly, I'm having nya lot of trouble reading this game, but Sakura seems pretty town to me. Then again I'm having a lot of trouble getting any proper reads right now.

Sakura seemed scum to me bt well, after some stuff (i wrote that a few posts ago) im not sure anymore
same for tess, id see him scum but hes against zexion and he too seems pretty scum to me so uhh yah hard to read game
we'll see when the lynch is almost there and the person at the top is gettin stressed i guess

- Magic Bomb - wrote:

beeboy123 wrote:

I find it odd that I am the only one with a Sakura vote.

Honestly, I'm having nya lot of trouble reading this game, but Sakura seems pretty town to me. Then again I'm having a lot of trouble getting any proper reads right now.

Her scum hunting doesn't feel genuine to me.

IM SO SORRY I MEANT 'SHE' urgh
Anyone else female so im not stupid anymore?

Mbomb is a cat girl this game.

beeboy123 wrote:

Her scum hunting doesn't feel genuine to me.

To me neither. Don't I have a vote on her as well?

Guess SOMEONE doesnt know how to detect genuine and fake scumhunting.
Tho at least that's a better reasoning than "her scumhunting is too aggresive" which is part of my personality.

Sakura wrote:

Guess SOMEONE doesnt know how to detect genuine and fake scumhunting.
Tho at least that's a better reasoning than "her scumhunting is too aggresive" which is part of my personality.

Don't worry that is my second reason for voting you

That doesn't make it less silly of a reason

I was kidding!

Haneii joins the party, replacing Navizel, effective immediately
QuillGill and AutoMedic have been prodded


Deadline is May 23, 4:30 EST

Frostings wrote:

Vote Count 1.6

(1) Zexion: Sakura
(1) Tess: Zaphkael
(1) Sakura: beeboy123
(1) Zaphkael: Tess
(1) Shiirn: - Magic Bomb -
(1) Haneii: Zexion
(1) QuillGill: Haneii


Not Voting: QuillGill, AutoMedic, -[Jess]-, Shiirn

This vote spread is sad

holy shit i am really busy with some side projects, sorry :c

and holy shit these are lots of walls

Sakura wrote:

Guess SOMEONE doesnt know how to detect genuine and fake scumhunting.

Sakura at her finest

I dont think she's harming town with her aggressive playstyle. Sakura and Shiirn both stood up head on to try weed out scum, but Tess' rebuttals seems interesting

Jess wrote:

Meta much? I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean. I wouldn't be reading Sakura as town just yet. Aggressively scumhunting doesn't say all too much other than that the person is aggressively looking for someone to lynch. That's just a full on null indicator because it could benefit either side. If you're gonna give such a definitive read as "this person is town" or "that person is scum" you have to have better reasoning for it than "Oh their gameplay wildly differs from their scumplay" or anything similar. For the record, you're still null for me too, leaning scum because that post was a bit too positive towards Sakura which might mean you two are working together, but it's really not enough for me to find you suspicious. Just my gut not sitting right with that one.

There isn't anything that stops her from being aggressive early on. In fact, he's more townlike because he's not letting himself getting scumpainted by obv scum zaph. You need to be brave and have a stance, and that stance should be for town's benefit, not just oneself

beeboy123 wrote:

Her scum hunting doesn't feel genuine to me.

Then tell me what's the definition of genuine scumhunting? Passive-agressive lines? Cherrypicking? Both options sounds scummy to me, so I have my complete trust on cop sakura. I've seen him play town before (medical mafia, i was pretty stupid back then, but not as stupid as jess) and he is probably the best option, even if we miss first shot at town

my best guess is that im going to get killed first by scum, but before that, i'd like to pull out a couple of predictions (this is in the perspective of sakura town btw)
d2 sakura claim cop, adjusts targets, im dead and zaph/zexion/tess is on suspicion (one of these three)
nav plays town, rides sakura's peepee. will follow his leads
d3 either one of the three scummiest people in the list die, lock in to two options
town goes trigger happy and once again, i dont know how the rest will go because it is up to d3 on what will happen. or maybe im just spouting words out of my butt and this info isnt needed

@mod does FoS work here?
and if so FoS: zaph

im not gonna cherrypick or anything, because everyone should be aware that the zaph scum hates being questioned. mafia hates being questioned.

my reads are still the same however, but i still dont have enough information to solidify someone to scum status

im really tempted with the quill choo choo, but i'll wait

if sakura and quill flips scum i will stop playing mafia for three years

AutoMedic wrote:

@mod does FoS work here?

There's no official vote count for "FoS" if that's what you're asking. But you can point fingers all you want

lel Automedic i have my vote on tess and I'm thinking about changing it to zexion, and zexion is suspected by tess too so where is ur logic that we all are possible scum?

also yeah, the spead is sad but the four main suspects are zexion, tess, sakura and me and we all have a vote, why the others guys arent following any of those is weird but they might be waiting for smth

Tess wrote:

beeboy123 wrote:

Her scum hunting doesn't feel genuine to me.

To me neither. Don't I have a vote on her as well?

no lel ur on me

so lemme get this straight tess is on me, shiirn+sakura think im scum, medic points finger of suspicion ehhhh...ok i think this is my first and shortest game evah lel i know that i shouldnt play the random style ive been using for wherewolves here i guess

Thanks for reminding me why I voted you.

AutoMedic, what makes me suspicious?

may not be able to play for the next few days and I'm already behind on everything

requesting for replacement

sorry for being inactive,I have many things to do
@mod: V/LA for 3 days

Automedic when d fux did Sakura claim cop?

-[Jess]- wrote:

sorry for being inactive,I have many things to do
@mod: V/LA for 3 days

Got it
Looking for a replacement for Quill

Nya lot of replacements this game, wow. Hopefully replacements can at least help my reads somewhat.

Trying to read this game, but I really can't, I don't know what's up with my reading ability this game.

*licks paws*

I wonder where Shiirn has been, he's one of the reasons i joined this game =(

Sorry, I promise to post in some hours. Been kinda crazy IRL.

Sakura wrote:

I wonder where Shiirn has been, he's one of the reasons i joined this game =(

:< same

unvote

Alright. I think I'm all caught up.

And now I feel terrible for replacing in when I don't have much to contribute. I think I've read enough to form an opinion on most players, though.

@beeboy: You're still parked on Sakura. Why?

Got nothing but nulls on Quill-slot, Jess, or Medic.

I have no idea where sakura is, but I'd likely keep my vote on her as long as there is no close-to-hammer number of votes.

in other words i'm just voting as a means of "i see u" rather than "let's kill u"

i still think nolynch would be best overall for this

Nolynch d1? Why?

Tess wrote:

Nolynch d1? Why?

He explained why earlier, but I disagree with him, nya~.

Shiirn wrote:

When it comes down to it, scumhunting day 1 is almost always a shot in the dark, as experienced players are quite good at playing their roles flippantly while newer players generally are content to stay in the background to limit the amount of potentially-suspicious stuff they say.


That said, day 1 lynches tend to leave a bitter taste in most people's mouths. Either you lynch a townie and lower your chances, or you get a lucky guess and lynch mafia and the remaining scum is pretty much screwed. Although, day roles would make this more interesting.

I'm content with no-lynching such that we don't likely kill off a townie. Killing a mafia would just feel unfair unless they make a serious error blunder and we make a righteous victory. A shot in the dark feels cheap.

Here.

*licks paws*

Shiirn wrote:

i still think nolynch would be best overall for this

Then what do you suggest we do now? Just wait until deadline?

simply because d1 has been nothing but OMGUS. Nobody's made any blunders enough to paint themselves as seriously scum, even sakura's activities are just scummy to me, not raw scum, so i feel like it'd be boring to lynch day 1 as we'd either kill a townie and give advantage to mafia, or kill mafia by what is essentially a shot in the dark and that just feels cheap. in irc mafia it's fine since a game takes like fifteen minutes but for this month-plus long game it'd be disappointing to neuter mafia so early.

Even a "shot in the dark" gives more information than no lynch.
You can analyze who voted for who and why, who hammered, who didn't care about claim (in case of PR) who voted despite townreading, who seemed to know the person was -Insert Alignment Here-

Haneii wrote:

@beeboy: You're still parked on Sakura. Why?

Because i like voting scum.

Seems like I was gone for a year.

Sakura wrote:

You stated a wishy washy stance on MB.
You are fence sitting on my discussion with Tess, and other players.
Not contradictory

Fair enough. Tho I disagree in your fence sitting description.

-----

I don't really have much to contribute, either that or my headache is not letting me think properly.

AutoMedic wrote:

Then tell me what's the definition of genuine scumhunting? Passive-agressive lines? Cherrypicking? Both options sounds scummy to me, so I have my complete trust on cop sakura. I've seen him play town before (medical mafia, i was pretty stupid back then, but not as stupid as jess) and he is probably the best option, even if we miss first shot at town

AutoMedic seems to be just "going with the flow" of Sakura's argument without questioning it too much. Basically if you abide by this thought no scumhunting will feel fake to you.

MB apparently loves making filler posts.

Hopefully Haneii does something else. (Hi Haneii!)

NL D1 is stupid. It doesn't matter how cheap the shot felt, it would still help in the long run.

yeah well, as much as lynching someone would help a lot, I have to agree that this game is proly gonna last a long while so we don't lose anything with NL rn, and so far everyone has a different opinion on who's scum.
also, when scum nightkills someone, we know who to look for and that costs us only 1 town instead of having the possibility of losing 2.

and
@frostings: we supposed to figure out what the gadgets are for ourselves or will we get some flavour texts after D1?

forgot to add

that said
/unvote

(hi Zexion o/)

I see where you guys are coming from, but NL just makes things boring. From my experience, telling posts usually result from wagon/competing wagons discussion.

The game just feels like its at a standstill now.

Sakura votes will help this problem

Mbomb votes are decent but not as good of an idea.

Do any of the current votes have an intent to lynch?

I can't really do much with those pressure votes (they've done their job so why are they still up? If not, why have you stopped pushing) or votes for the sake of voting :/


Not to mention we have 2 players unaccounted for.

because wagon votes are risky for mafia to partake in as if the resultant flips townie all the voters have potential-scum paint, unless both scum sit out the entire vote chain. If the resultant flips mafia, it means whoever didn't vote is potential-scum paint as no scum would willingly take part in a D1 self-lynch

on that note,

Vote: Sakura

since she's no longer in hammer range (I think? can't be assed to go count) and i do want pressure on her since I find her play pretty scummy.

sorry frostings kun but I am running a cs source tourney and I have to make sure the the servers are good so I'll br away for about five days :c

/replace

also I really hope that this is the the last replacement to take place in this game c:

@shiirn: You're going to take your vote off as soon as she's in danger of being lynched. Where's the pressure in that?

AutoMedic wrote:

I am running a cs source tourney

When does it start?

because i like having my finger point at ~someone~

and maybe i'll just keep it this time. I seem to be the only one overthinking the whole D1 lynch agenda thing anyway

its gonna be a local cs tourney that's aiming to promote our city underdogs

I'm gonna be setting up computers overnight, set them up in the morning, do a couple of playtests and see if everything is working and we'll start tommorow night

we've already filled the brackets for the three day tournament sched

AutoMedic wrote:

sorry frostings kun but I am running a cs source tourney and I have to make sure the the servers are good so I'll br away for about five days :c

/replace

You can go VLA for 5 days that is a reasonable amount of time
Don't go

Shiirn wrote:

because wagon votes are risky for mafia to partake in as if the resultant flips townie all the voters have potential-scum paint, unless both scum sit out the entire vote chain. If the resultant flips mafia, it means whoever didn't vote is potential-scum paint as no scum would willingly take part in a D1 self-lynch

on that note,

Vote: Sakura

since she's no longer in hammer range (I think? can't be assed to go count) and i do want pressure on her since I find her play pretty scummy.

If you really think that you really arent putting any effort in scumhunting.
If you depend on night actions to find scum, you aren't a good scumhunter.

beeboy123 wrote:

Sakura votes will help this problem

You know, you're right.
At this point i rather be lynched than deal with this town that doesn't want to scumhunt.

My scumhunting capabilites come from drawing the raw logic of events that have transpired and interpolating them with all of the possible states of every person vis a vis scum/town. Reading actions is something that can help this venture, but isn't really necessary.

it does not include fingerpointing for the fuck of it or the very imprecise art of 'tells'.

Yeah, my scumhunting day 1, with literally no evidence to go on, is fairly poor. It's like playing chess except everyone controls no piece and has no idea of the capabilities of the other pieces - a very social battle. Once patterns start emerging, then I take over.


Who knows, between you and me, Sakura, any scum in existence might be fucked.

And instead you decide to vote me, because you find my aggro playstyle scummy instead of seeing what other ppl are doing like Zexion who was fencesitting between me and Tess waiting to see which side to jump on.

precisely!


because i still think you're scum

And pray tell why?
And don't come with the "Your playstyle's too aggresive" i've already explained that's part of my personality and i can back it up with over 60 games of meta for your perusal.

i try not to get too meta


i've already explained how day 1 scumhunting with lots of omgus is something i consider inherently unfair as without the raw logic of dead bodies or claimed actions, all you have to go on is social cues and other flimsy bits of reasoning. experience or not, you're not going to have a very effective strategy on your hands.

as such, this kind of aggression lends to self-fulfilling prophecy styles of roles - you accuse someone of being mafia either because you're a cop and will confirm it/deny it day 2 with a claim, or because you're mafia yourself and want heat off your back, both styles of which can be "smoothed over" by simply claiming 'im super aggressive so those aren't tells'

it's why i've called into doubt any possible cop day 2 claim from you, because doing so would firmly cement you as scum in my book.


to bring raw logic into my reasoning, here are my raw mental markers for "possiblities" for Sakura:
A) Vanilla townie, hyper aggression is for the lols, extremely unlikely
B) Doctor townie, hyper aggression is to lure N1 kill pressure whilst protecting self (Can you self-protect in osu mafia? Not clear on this.) This is by far the least likely as a suicidal doctor is just stupid
C) cop townie, hyper aggression is to cement a playstyle and give herself a good target to inspect N1. Still stands as a suicidal cop, but dumber things are possible. i'd say this is somewhat likely.
D) Scum, acting under the guise of C. This removes all possibility of her playstyle being 'suicidal' as she's the one who decides who dies every night.

That's the biggest kicker for me - hyper-aggressive play is suicidal, especially day 1, as it is begging for a N1 kill just to get rid of an irritation, and by doing so I have to assume that the person has some measure in place to defend themselves from either N1 kills or scrutiny. I don't want to make broad assumptions as to what roles or abilities exist, so I'm just assuming vanilla within my predictions until proved otherwise. And within a vanilla purview, the most likely action a suicidal playstyle has to protect itself is to be scum.

Zexion wrote:

MB apparently loves making filler posts.

Zexion apparently doesn't read my posts enough to understand my reasoning behind them. Like I've said multiple times, I'm having far too much problem reading this game, so I'm just trying to help as much as I can, but my mind is just not working right. Would request a replacement but with so many it seems really bad.

*meows*

also re:zexion (and whoever else has yet to catch up) on possible fence-sitting or wagon-waiting or other colorful terminology, i don't really find those kinds of things to be good enough reasoning to glean allegiance.

I'd much rather start having fun once the bodies start dropping, as that's when logic really steps in. This is possibly why beeboy is so firm on you being scum as well, but i won't claim to understand his reasoning as he's simply been very firm on his "sakura is scum" stance, which is all fine and good to me, it's a playstyle i can respect.

also mbomb this is kind of the problem with D1 scumhunting with such vicious players like sakura and stalwart walls like me and cuties like tess - everyone else is left in our wake


just jump in with your own reasoning or opinions as you see fit - sidelining is kind of inevitable sometimes (I sidelined for a few days, even) but it's no reason to give up.