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Require only 1 bubble for a map to get Approved.

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48
This is a feature request. Feature requests can be voted up by supporters.
Current Priority: +3
Natteke
6,538 posts
Joined August 2009
Topic Starter
Natteke
Most of the time, maps for approval are just longer than usual and have a higher maximum score than ranked maps.

A typical ranked map would contain 3 diffs, each of them is around 2 to 3 minutes long, so checking one map that is going for ranking is about the same as checking 1 map for approval which only has 1 difficulty. I think maps for approval only need 1 bubble, instead of 2.
marshallracer
1,601 posts
Joined December 2010
marshallracer
Darn, this makes so much sense ...

... but then again, Approval maps have to be checked more thoroughly so the 1-bubble-thing would be ok, I guess ...
Natteke
6,538 posts
Joined August 2009
Topic Starter
Natteke
Why do they have to be checked more thoroughly if they are not very different from other maps?
Mashley
2,042 posts
Joined September 2008
Mashley
Agreed, there is really no need for it to take so long.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
Actually I would go for make high-score maps or no-low-diff-maps just get ranked and change Approval into a special criteria where you can go with "screw the rules" basically. I really don't see the point in making some maps go to a special category just because... they give "too much" score or they are "too hard". Not like anybody will care if Lesjuh's Dragonforce maps get ranked. I understand the reasons behind this when the game was like much smaller and there were way fewer maps than now, but I think those reasons don't make any sense tbh since you got like... 4500 ranked maps? Getting about 50~70 maps with no easy/normal diffs and a lot of score won't really ruin the game.
Jenny
2,200 posts
Joined November 2010
Jenny
I agree with this topic's creator! o/
Enna Alouette
6,376 posts
Joined February 2011
Enna Alouette
i do think this possible too, so +support <3
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn

Wishy22 wrote:

Actually I would go for make high-score maps or no-low-diff-maps just get ranked and change Approval into a special criteria where you can go with "screw the rules" basically. I really don't see the point in making some maps go to a special category just because... they give "too much" score or they are "too hard". Not like anybody will care if Lesjuh's Dragonforce maps get ranked. I understand the reasons behind this when the game was like much smaller and there were way fewer maps than now, but I think those reasons don't make any sense tbh since you got like... 4500 ranked maps? Getting about 50~70 maps with no easy/normal diffs and a lot of score won't really ruin the game.
And then a good chunk of mappers will never make easier difficulties and new players wouldn't reliably be able to grab [insert random song] and be assured that there's likely a diif easy enough for them.


Besides, getting 2 bubbles rather than 1 isn't that hard. It just means you're going to need to put just a bit more effort in - and unfortunately, all i see this as is a way to make approval "easier" which is something it was never intended to be in the first place - you're specifically making a map that is meant to be rigorously tested to make sure that it's fine despite breaking score/length/whatever rules. Because longer and higher score maps are prone to more errors.
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201
Agree with Wishy, minus the "no easy/normal" thing. I don't see any reason why long or difficult maps can't be ranked.
The original purpose of Approval was for unique, crazy maps which break the rules but are still somehow awesome. They need that extra BAT because it's harder to assure the map is of a high quality without rules to back that up.

We should let long and hard maps into ranking (but require easier difficulties, the usual difficulty count rules) and use Approval for crazy gimmick maps, like it was originally intended for.
Musty
2,252 posts
Joined February 2010
Musty
Agreeing with Wishy, maybe make another section should be better.
Sakura
osu! Alumni
7,979 posts
Joined March 2010
Sakura

mm201 wrote:

Agree with Wishy, minus the "no easy/normal" thing. I don't see any reason why long or difficult maps can't be ranked.
The original purpose of Approval was for unique, crazy maps which break the rules but are still somehow awesome. They need that extra BAT because it's harder to assure the map is of a high quality without rules to back that up.

We should let long and hard maps into ranking (but require easier difficulties, the usual difficulty count rules) and use Approval for crazy gimmick maps, like it was originally intended for.
Totally agree with this
Natteke
6,538 posts
Joined August 2009
Topic Starter
Natteke
So you will remove the "NO TAG MAPS" newrule? That's awesome.
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
>make Easy/Normal/Hard for ascension to heaven
fffff
akrolsmir
606 posts
Joined November 2010
akrolsmir
Where would maps that produce really high scores but otherwise play regularly go? I thought one reason for approval was if a map went long, due to the nature of combos as score multipliers, you'd want to make it approved so that it doesn't affect the player rankings too much.
peppy
19,311 posts
Here since the beginning
peppy
I don't think high scoring songs really matter anymore at this point. It's not like ranked score is a good metric anyway? Might as well do away with the approved category altogether.
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201
Scoreboards are good fun, and graveyarded maps eventually get archived. :?
Backfire
3,204 posts
Joined February 2010
Backfire

peppy wrote:

I don't think high scoring songs really matter anymore at this point. It's not like ranked score is a good metric anyway? Might as well do away with the approved category altogether.
This is big news man.
peppy
19,311 posts
Here since the beginning
peppy
To clarify, I propose merging approved into ranked. Some exceptions may have to be made, but most could be waived as "previous standards".
Backfire
3,204 posts
Joined February 2010
Backfire
This is huge.

No but seriously, this will seperate the boys from the men, now.
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
I approve.
Backfire
3,204 posts
Joined February 2010
Backfire

Shiirn wrote:

I approve.
Best pun ever.
Mismagius
9,257 posts
Joined July 2008
Mismagius
YES. Do it.
Zelos
1,111 posts
Joined May 2010
Zelos
so alltogether if that were to happen, what kind of guideline/rule changes would we see?
yeahyeahyeahhh
osu! Alumni
2,850 posts
Joined December 2008
yeahyeahyeahhh

peppy wrote:

To clarify, I propose merging approved into ranked. Some exceptions may have to be made, but most could be waived as "previous standards".
Would existing approved maps be merged into ranked as well? Or would they have to be unranked/reranked and such under new rules for this?

Also, +1.
Gaba
900 posts
Joined May 2011
Gaba
Really good news from peppy.

I also agree with op.
Sakura
osu! Alumni
7,979 posts
Joined March 2010
Sakura
That would be nice
Soaprman
1,392 posts
Joined January 2008
Soaprman
Please keep the approved category around for gimmick maps (maps breaking rules besides score/length/diff spread) that don't belong in ranked. :(
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1
Oh damn. I would assume scores are carried over, and then everyone will have quite a huge jump in their ranked score ._. coughcookiezicough

i would definitely support tho.

Soaprman wrote:

Please keep the approved category around for gimmick maps (maps breaking rules besides score/length/diff spread) that don't belong in ranked. :(
I'm wondering about tag4 maps too. I never really saw a problem with them being part of a mapset
Sakura
osu! Alumni
7,979 posts
Joined March 2010
Sakura
So does this mean that all currently "Going for Approval" maps should start including easier difficulties and go for rank? o.o *me is confused*
Natteke
6,538 posts
Joined August 2009
Topic Starter
Natteke
Imagine mapping them easies for 5, 10, 15 and more minute long songs. Are you srs? Mapping one diff like that takes a hell lot of time even without N, E, H diffs.
Shiro
Global Moderator
4,984 posts
Joined May 2009
Shiro
In that kind of case I don't think shortening some diffs would be really that bad.
Mismagius
9,257 posts
Joined July 2008
Mismagius

Odaril wrote:

In that kind of case I don't think shortening some diffs would be really that bad.
Oh damn, so my 25-minute marathon will need a 2-minute Easy difficulty!
ziin
2,632 posts
Joined January 2010
ziin
On FFR, each 50k points got you 1 credit, up to a maximum of 40 per song. If you were credit hunting during that time, the best songs to FC were the ones that gave you 40 credits exactly.

On osu!, we don't have anything like credits, but we do have score limits. What if all maps were "ranked" up until 18 million points? If you go over this limit, it is recorded on the scoreboard, but only 18 million goes towards your ranked score? This would remove the point skewing of approved maps, and could (hopefully) be retroactively applied (for early maps like marisa stole the precious thing)

Obviously mods would/should increase this maximum point value as well.

If you want to do the "traditional" approved map which is very long, it should still be rankable with only one difficulty. However if you have a difficulty which is under the 18 million limit, you must go through the traditional ranking process with at least one more difficulty under 3.0 stars.

Obviously I would like scoreboards for gimmick maps as well, but would prefer if they didn't count for accuracy.
Last edited by ziin , edited 1 time in total.
Eirene
577 posts
Joined December 2008
Eirene

Odaril wrote:

In that kind of case I don't think shortening some diffs would be really that bad.
There still are tons of e/n/h maps anyway ... why map easier diffs that don't fit the song ? ._.
sounds good to me *.*
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1

ziin wrote:

On FFR, each 50k points got you 1 credit, up to a maximum of 40 per song. If you were credit hunting during that time, the best songs to FC were the ones that gave you 40 credits exactly.

On osu!, we don't have anything like credits, but we do have score limits. What if all maps were "ranked" up until 18 million points? If you go over this limit, it is recorded on the scoreboard, but only 18 million goes towards your ranked score? This would remove the point skewing of approved maps, and could (hopefully) be retroactively applied.

Obviously mods would/should increase this maximum point value as well.
At a certain point it kinda renders spinner bonuses as useless then. Even tho it makes a lot of sense, something about the idea just doesn't really feel right to me.

edit: oh wait, you said the score is still recorded on the scoreboard. derp. nevermind. well, in a way, spinner bonuses are a little less important at a certain point still, i guess.
Shiirn
2,896 posts
Joined August 2010
Shiirn
I approve of ziin's suggestion - except make the cap 20mil for even ability, possibly even retroactively applied such that maps that are approved right now and pull in to rank can drag their scores with them, increasing the respective scores of the players to a cap of 20m.
YodaSnipe
1,378 posts
Joined February 2011
YodaSnipe
Why are caps on maps anyways?

Will previously completed approved map scores be automatically added onto the ranked score?
ziin
2,632 posts
Joined January 2010
ziin
the exact number of the max wouldn't matter to me. The last rules I read say 18m max.

Caps are on maps because once you get 1000 combo, each circle adds a huge amount to maximum score. The difference between 10 million and 18 million is only 200 circles or so.

The only reason I would support retroactively ranking these approved maps is because it's that, clear the scores, or don't rank them.
YodaSnipe
1,378 posts
Joined February 2011
YodaSnipe
I haven't heard a negative reason for having a high score on a map applied to your overall ranking :/
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
Most of those long high-scored maps are hard and most people can't FC them so they complain that they can't rankwhore because of that, I guess?
Natteke
6,538 posts
Joined August 2009
Topic Starter
Natteke

Blue Dragon wrote:

Odaril wrote:

In that kind of case I don't think shortening some diffs would be really that bad.
Oh damn, so my 25-minute marathon will need a 2-minute Easy difficulty!
ziin
2,632 posts
Joined January 2010
ziin

YodaSnipe wrote:

I haven't heard a negative reason for having a high score on a map applied to your overall ranking :/
It's so someone can't play 24 maps and get into the top 5000.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy
Actually it'd be fine, if you can FC some of those sick approved maps then you do deserve being top ranked you know.
ziin
2,632 posts
Joined January 2010
ziin
There's already a pretty serious split between the top few players of osu. Letting the full score would just mean that there would be an even larger split.
Ekaru
3,617 posts
Joined July 2008
Ekaru

Wishy22 wrote:

Most of those long high-scored maps are hard and most people can't FC them so they complain that they can't rankwhore because of that, I guess?
The decision to make Approval maps not count towards ranked score was made when it was feasible for people to play every single map because there was only like 40 beatmap packs, so there was a balance concern because maps like Parapara could increase your total rank by an amount of points that would be broken for that time.

So yeah, it's kinda outdated and I really, really, really doubt it's an issue anymore.

EDIT: So yeah, what peppy said. I support this.
Wishy
2,974 posts
Joined September 2010
Wishy

ziin wrote:

There's already a pretty serious split between the top few players of osu. Letting the full score would just mean that there would be an even larger split.
Actually most top players have shit ranks, I'm not that good and I'm like 600 ranks over TTTL or Iris, no shit.

But yeah what Ekaru says makes sense, it's true that Parapara must been giving like half the possible score you could get by FCing everything lol.
YodaSnipe
1,378 posts
Joined February 2011
YodaSnipe
The way I see it, if you're good enough/have the stamina to play some of these approved maps you shouldn't be deprived of the score you earned.
bmin11
5,438 posts
Joined October 2008
bmin11
I'm thrilled to see all those gimmick maps as approval maps :D
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