I am sick and tired of seeing so many speedranks. They have always been a thorn in my eye. I am aware that many popular mappers obviously release high-quality maps on a regular base. And because people are aware of it, those maps often get ranked within a week or even shorter. Of course, it's impossible to control something like this, but it still doesn't change the fact that a map of equivalent quality has to wait indefinitely longer because the mapper is less popular.

Speedranking can also cause a lot of trouble for both players and mappers. It doesn't allow for a lot of people to check it and make suggestions to improve the quality of even a seemingly flawless map. This is just like wine. It needs time to be good!

Now, here is what I am suggesting.

We need a new rule specially designed to eliminate the problem at hand.
The solution I thought of is rather simple. All that needs to be done is to add a timelimit before a bubble or rank can be handed out.
I was thinking of making that timelimit no shorter than 2 weeks, this will give people time to find and check the map out and make suggestions on how to improve it further before every single available MAT or BAT out there jumps out and bubbles/ranks it. The longer the mapper has to wait the better it is.

This will, in my opinion, highly increase the chance of having to unneccesary unrank a map because some critical flaws have not been found or were previously ignored, and it will make the world of osu! for mappers a little bit more fair.

Additionaly, I was thinking of adding a maximum number of kuduso stars that can be shot to a map by everyone else but the mapper.
By doing this, it will be harder for a bubbled map to reach first page and thus, slow down the process of ranking overly hyped maps.
It is, in the first place, already some form of "abuse" if a single person can shoot unlimited stars to whatever map there is.

A single person should not be able to shoot more than 3-5 stars to a map. This directly works hand-in-hand with my previouly mentioned timelimit for ranking maps because this way, for a map to be popular you either need to have multiple people shoot stars to your map, or you have to work for your maps' popularity by mapping other maps yourself.


And yes, I am serious. So please take this idea seriously, too.

I do agree with most points Tenshi-nyan has mentioned. It does happens often.
Also this wouldn't be bad for Taiko mappers to have a bit more time to improve there diffs as well, or to find at least more mods.
There were some issues in the last days/weeks before, this could prevent it.

This is unnecessary. The staff is currently working on modding by priority.
Also, there should be no limit to the number of stars you can give to a map. One earns kd by modding, and it is then up to that person to do whatever s/he wants with them.
Be assured, however, we will try to do what we can to minimize the number of necessary unranks.

First of all they arent speed ranks, they are "flawless maps" if a map gets ranked so fast and still has flaws then it's on the MAT/BAT that Bubbled/Ranked it, and will most probably get unranked so it can get fixed.

Also if your maps are getting ignored just increase the map's SP, there's plenty of ways to increase it, by kudosu, mod posts, or even your own bubble going pop from a MAT/BAT mod.

those wrote:

Also, there should be no limit to the number of stars you can give to a map. One earns kd by modding, and it is then up to that person to do whatever s/he wants with them.

Are those words really yours, or just the words from peppy? I mean, it is right that the mapper should be able with his own kudosu to star his map, but there should be at least a border since this dosen't really show the quality of the map? I mean, wasn't the the star priority there, to show the quality of a map? Or just to move it up, so BAT's can recognize it faster? Because I would see 10 stars from Mapper A just as one star, since it is just one person.

(Well, the new modding-star system has been implemented, so whatever)

EDIT: Oh, Sakura has answered one of my questions before. hehe

^
peppy did say it.

SP is to show how much attention a map needs, it's unrelated to quality, hence the "higher SP, higher chance of it being looked at." There's also no guarantee a map that has been longer in pending will be of higher quality either, you cant tell from the point of upload, to the point of ranked (or the actual date) how much has that map been taken care of to begin with, i've seen maps that "take 8 months" but only have the mapper active for like 5 days every 2 months.

those wrote:

This is unnecessary. The staff is currently working on modding by priority.

I don't agree. The staff should not solely focus on the amount of stars someone spammed to a map.
Take a look at those maps:


Those maps have not received a single response since MONTHS only because their priority is lower. And they are all bubbled. How can that be just?

NoHitter wrote:

^
peppy did say it.

I said it's OK if the mapper himself shoots the stars to his own map. But I think it's not OK if anybody else can shoot like 20 stars to some random map to make it ultra popular.

OnosakiHito wrote:

those wrote:

Also, there should be no limit to the number of stars you can give to a map. One earns kd by modding, and it is then up to that person to do whatever s/he wants with them.

Are those words really yours, or just the words from peppy?

If you give me a map with +80 I'll prioritize modding it, regardless of quality. I mean, that's what modding is for. Throwing a high priority map at the modding teams means "Please look at me"; it doesn't necessarily mean "Please look at me, I'm really good".

those wrote:

If you give me a map with +80 I'll prioritize modding it, regardless of quality. I mean, that's what modding is for. Throwing a high priority map at the modding teams means "Please look at me"; it doesn't necessarily mean "Please look at me, I'm really good".

Mh, I understand. Valid reason.
But it depends on if it is bubbled or not, right? Since a bubbled 12 star map has allready higher priority then a 80 star map.

If you want this map to get attention then shoot a star in it's direction.

If you really think those bubbled maps should be looked at by a BAT, then what are you waiting for standing there doing nothing instead of throwing stars at them?

Also now SP required for Rank/Bubble is 12, if a map has lower than this ammount and the BAT needs to use an icon they'll have to spend their own kudosu doing so, so these maps wont have much of a chance of they even being peeked at.

And then tell me what magical machine should i use to discover a map's quality just from the thread's name?

OnosakiHito wrote:

But it depends on if it is bubbled or not, right? Since a bubbled 12 star map has allready higher priority then a 80 star map.

I don't have a specific ratio that puts bubbles ahead of stars/non-bubbles. Though, if it's 12 and bubbled then either one of the MAT members is doing something wrong, or the map really needs more stars.

Tenshi-nyan wrote:

Those maps have not received a single response since MONTHS only because their priority is lower. And they are all bubbled. How can that be just?

What's your argument, exactly? I'm not too sure what you're trying to bring up.

those wrote:

Tenshi-nyan wrote:

Those maps have not received a single response since MONTHS only because their priority is lower. And they are all bubbled. How can that be just?

What's your argument, exactly? I'm not too sure what you're trying to bring up.

I'm trying to explain here that it is not fair that there are maps which can be ranked within 5 days after being submitted while there is already a high number of maps ready to be ranked, sitting around there because nobody gives a damn about them.

You know, this could be avoided if time would be added as a factor of priority - the longer a bubbled map has to wait the more it's priority will increase.

Please do not forget about the 2 week minimum time a map has to be in pending before it can be bubbled or ranked.
I did not quite intend this thread to turn into a discussion of the purpose of star priority. This is a matter of fairness.

Tenshi-nyan wrote:

You know, this could be avoided if time would be added as a factor of priority - the longer a bubbled map has to wait the more it's priority will increase.

Please do not forget about the 2 week minimum time a map has to be in pending before it can be bubbled or ranked.
I did not quite intend this thread to turn into a discussion of the purpose of star priority. This is a matter of fairness.

So, forcing us not to mod 3 day old maps will magically force us to mod low priority bubbles, even with the amount of high priority stuff out there? I don't think this makes a lot of sense.

Usually, speedranks don't have too many stars to say "Yeah, mod me and rank me".

2 Examples.

t/84715
t/83025

Yeah

No, setting a time limit will just slow the whole process down and is counter productive.

Sakura wrote:

No, setting a time limit will just slow the whole process down and is counter productive.

It will only shift your focus to rank older maps.

xsrsbsns wrote:

It will only shift your focus to rank older maps.

But that's not the point. It will only shift focus to rank other maps with higher priority, while older is already a given.

those wrote:

xsrsbsns wrote:

It will only shift your focus to rank older maps.

But that's not the point. It will only shift focus to rank other maps with higher priority, while older is already a given.

like thats ever going to happen

xsrsbsns wrote:

Sakura wrote:

No, setting a time limit will just slow the whole process down and is counter productive.

It will only shift your focus to rank older maps.

Actually, it would just cause the people in question to wait until the day the time limit's up to ask a MAT to check their map. It really wouldn't change much.

I agree on most of this.

I doubt that two weeks is enough time for the proper modders to suggest alterations to a beatmap. Remember there are patterns that aren't technically flawed, but just not as good as other patterns. If there isn't enough time for modders who actually know how to make a good suggestion to post and reply, then that beatmap could very well go through the ranking process with patterns that could be better than they are.

We are trusting that a MAT, and a single BAT have the knowledge and expertise at critiquing that they can safely say that a beatmap could not be made any better. We cannot guarantee that stars are any indication that the beatmap has been properly modded, so rushing through the ranking process should be even more of a non-option. I know that even XATs make mistakes and I know some MATs don't speak their mind as much as they should. I don't think a map should be bubbled unless it has been properly checked over by a minimum number of people that have experience in modding maps. Or we should at least limit being able to bubble unless x number of unique players have stared the map, so that self-priroritizing will have less of an pronounced effect on actual priority based on quality.

It's still a flawed system though.

Sakura wrote:

No, setting a time limit will just slow the whole process down and is counter productive.

Maybe I'm wrong, but this is not about the productivity. This is about the quality of the maps.

Kurokami wrote:

Sakura wrote:

No, setting a time limit will just slow the whole process down and is counter productive.

Maybe I'm wrong, but this is not about the productivity. This is about the quality of the maps.

Not really, i have 2 maps in the graveyard that i mapped 2 years ago, if i revived them, would you say that their quality is higher than a 2 week old map?

those and Ekaru have already explained why this wont work, a mapper could very well sit 2 weeks doing nothing and there wouldnt be any difference than looking for mods since day 1 and getting it ranked in less than 2 weeks.

TheVileOne wrote:

I agree on most of this.

I doubt that two weeks is enough time for the proper modders to suggest alterations to a beatmap. Remember there are patterns that aren't technically flawed, but just not as good as other patterns. If there isn't enough time for modders who actually know how to make a good suggestion to post and reply, then that beatmap could very well go through the ranking process with patterns that could be better than they are.

We are trusting that a MAT, and a single BAT have the knowledge and expertise at critiquing that they can safely say that a beatmap could not be made any better. We cannot guarantee that stars are any indication that the beatmap has been properly modded, so rushing through the ranking process should be even more of a non-option. I know that even XATs make mistakes and I know some MATs don't speak their mind as much as they should. I don't think a map should be bubbled unless it has been properly checked over by a minimum number of people that have experience in modding maps. Or we should at least limit being able to bubble unless x number of unique players have stared the map, so that self-priroritizing will have less of an pronounced effect on actual priority based on quality.

It's still a flawed system though.

This is a good idea. Additionally to the minimum required time, there should be a minimum number of mods required before a map can be bubbled.

Sakura wrote:

Not really, i have 2 maps in the graveyard that i mapped 2 years ago, if i revived them, would you say that their quality is higher than a 2 week old map?

Those maps aren't finished, so they wouldn't even qualify. A map needs to be completed and in pending for the new rule to apply.

And how do you tell?

Edit: How do you tell since when it was completed and in pending i mean, if the thread is revived, there would be no evidence of it ever going to the graveyard.

Sakura wrote:

Not really, i have 2 maps in the graveyard that i mapped 2 years ago, if i revived them, would you say that their quality is higher than a 2 week old map?

those and Ekaru have already explained why this wont work, a mapper could very well sit 2 weeks doing nothing and there wouldnt be any difference than looking for mods since day 1 and getting it ranked in less than 2 weeks.

If you mean these 2
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/15546
http://osu.ppy.sh/s/14675
You don't even care about them. They just got a few mod and nothing else.
I'm not on the same side with the time limit. I'm on the side of a maps with good quality. Time limit is good as long as the mapper is get mods but when they are just sitting and waiting for the time limit to be over, meh...
If the addable SP get a limit to 1 then the mapper must wait until his/her maps get more mods/SP, this way the time limit will be unnecessary since when the map is already has +12 SP, possible the map is already 2 weeks old.

Actually i meant this: http://osu.ppy.sh/s/15408 and http://osu.ppy.sh/s/16392 this =P