I found this same problem a long while ago which is why i once suggested this: t/64765 for mappers, but you can see that the mappers like having circles at the very start of songs with no musical cue beforehand so... that didn't go well...
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[added] Show the very first approach circle in Hidden-Mode
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I find this idea really stupid, hidden is a really old mod and it always been like it is, change it now would be unfair. I'm 99% sure this won't happen.
the first note is not that hard to catch, try 2,3 times the map and that's all.
the first note is not that hard to catch, try 2,3 times the map and that's all.
silent notes???Ataman wrote:
There are people who play for fun, not for practice and highscore. Trying to hit silent notes is not fun.
i play without hitsounds with a fully transparent 300.png and i barely ever have trouble with the first note when playing with hidden.
and yes, i also play for fun. so imo, this isn't needed at all
^yeah Agree to the above[CSGA]Ar3sgice wrote:
retry.
that's all
I can not agree this requests. I even the first play, it possible hit in the feeling, it is fact experience. I think this will be a factor lowering the clear level of hidden.
Topic Starter
Yeah, it will lower the difficulty of hidden-mode a lot if the very first note of hundreds remains visible.
Whoa, I'm so stupid, thinking this community could be any more reasonable than others.
I didn't see one single counter-argument till now. Looks like this gets buried again without proper discussion. gj
Whoa, I'm so stupid, thinking this community could be any more reasonable than others.
I didn't see one single counter-argument till now. Looks like this gets buried again without proper discussion. gj
It needs no discussion. The request is somewhat reasonable, but not at all plausible. Sure, it could make things easier, but that doesn't at all make it necessary and neither viable. Just retry up until you get it right. Its not that big of a deal, and certainly isn't a widespread enough "issue" for such drastic measures. You can't expect something to be made easier simply because its too hard for somebody.Ataman wrote:
Yeah, it will lower the difficulty of hidden-mode a lot if the very first note of hundreds remains visible.
Whoa, I'm so stupid, thinking this community could be any more reasonable than others.
I didn't see one single counter-argument till now. Looks like this gets buried again without proper discussion. gj
I could see this being a bit disorienting. Like, it'd be a brief mental switch from nomod to hidden mode. Then I'd probably occasionally get a 100 on the second circle instead of the first. 
I guess that point considered, things are probably better off the way they are in that regard. At least to me.
I guess that point considered, things are probably better off the way they are in that regard. At least to me.
This is a pretty cool idea. It could be something subtle, even, like a slight lighting effect in the background or something that lasts for a measure before the first circle appears. Basically like the countdown but not as big or loud.Ataman wrote:
Another solution for those who don't like the approach circle: You could make the BPM somehow visible or even audible at start. The mainscreen is a perfect example for it. Draw a transparent circle on the screen, let it beat to the BPM at start.
Where is this going?? Having an approach circle to indicate the first sounds like something that would throw me off, especially knowing that circle sizes vary from map to map.
Thinking about it further, metronome or forced countdown would be out of the question. I would instead suggest something that involves the pie-bar or HP bar since they both tell you how much time you have until the beatmap starts, except the HP bar fails to do so when skipping to the start of a song due to long intro. Ideas anyone?
Thinking about it further, metronome or forced countdown would be out of the question. I would instead suggest something that involves the pie-bar or HP bar since they both tell you how much time you have until the beatmap starts, except the HP bar fails to do so when skipping to the start of a song due to long intro. Ideas anyone?
I think this should be addressed.
I've seen it too often where you literally need to guess when to hit the first node, both from myself and from watching other people.
Some songs start by having complete silence until the first node. Not that that's bad, but even with 100 retries you can still get it wrong a lot.
I feel this kills the song if you have to retry several times before you can finally start.
I've seen it too often where you literally need to guess when to hit the first node, both from myself and from watching other people.
Some songs start by having complete silence until the first node. Not that that's bad, but even with 100 retries you can still get it wrong a lot.
I feel this kills the song if you have to retry several times before you can finally start.
Learn to play the song before you try it with Hidden. If you can't read the approach rate even at the first circle, then you shouldn't be playing Hidden.
I can play on hidden just fine after the first circle on songs with a silent start, and even get the first circle after breaks, but this is literally guesswork.
I just watched a stream of a person playing hidden and got SS, while trying to improve his spinners after every retry, but each time he played he had to retry like 10 times because he couldn't get the first circle right.
Why you'd want a rhythm game to have a flaw like that is beyond me...
I just watched a stream of a person playing hidden and got SS, while trying to improve his spinners after every retry, but each time he played he had to retry like 10 times because he couldn't get the first circle right.
Why you'd want a rhythm game to have a flaw like that is beyond me...
My argument is that the issue is not just with the first circle, but maps can have this problem through the whole map such is the case with most Easy difficulties that are mapped in 2/1. It's not guess work, it's reading the fade work. If one has a problem reading the first circle of a map, that person will fare no better in a slow Easy without double time enabled.
I see it more of a player problem rather than a game problem.
I don't support this idea, but it doesn't really bother me if it were implemented.
I see it more of a player problem rather than a game problem.
I don't support this idea, but it doesn't really bother me if it were implemented.
Hidden should be hidden simply lisen to the song and press that first note like a sir 
I don't think you get the point. There is no music until the first circle; there's nothing to listen to. All you get is a sudden flashing node.
Ofcourse only some songs are like that.
Ofcourse only some songs are like that.
Look at the timer. It will indicate when to hit the first circle
Never mind, I guess I'm the only one who sees how impractical this is.
Yes, because everyone wants to look at a pie chart in the corner of their screen just to be able to hit the first note with SOME consistency.Valentiino wrote:
Look at the timer. It will indicate when to hit the first circle
I support this feature.
Supporting only for songs with lead-in set.
Really guys, learn to play :<
You can read fading circles the same way you can read approach circles.
You can read fading circles the same way you can read approach circles.
i can read when to click the first note in hidden when its the first sound of the song, but it requires some concentration.
basically what tshemmp said
basically what tshemmp said
HD + HR should be fine
I see how problematic the first note can be on hidden but I don't think an approach circle is the way to go. Hidden wouldn't be called hidden. There ought to be a better solution...
Support.
It would make it look very inconsistent. You should be able to improve your skill to know when to press without any guidelines, in most cases this isn't even needed. Just retry a couple of times.
Hidden mod is meant to increase difficulty, having the first approach circle visible will reduce it, and a lot in many maps.
If you get mad for getting a 100 in the first note a lot of times while retrying, then keep retrying, play the song without HD at least once to "memorize", or don't use it at all.
I love HD mod as it is now, even for songs without lead-in music, makes it more challenging.
Just asking for something that would make easier a mod that is supposed to be hard an challenging doesn't make sense.
If you get mad for getting a 100 in the first note a lot of times while retrying, then keep retrying, play the song without HD at least once to "memorize", or don't use it at all.
I love HD mod as it is now, even for songs without lead-in music, makes it more challenging.
Just asking for something that would make easier a mod that is supposed to be hard an challenging doesn't make sense.
pretty much this. so tempted to just deny this now ._.DakeDekaane wrote:
Hidden mod is meant to increase difficulty, having the first approach circle visible will reduce it, and a lot in many maps.
If you get mad for getting a 100 in the first note a lot of times while retrying, then keep retrying, play the song without HD at least once to "memorize", or don't use it at all.
I love HD mod as it is now, even for songs without lead-in music, makes it more challenging.
Just asking for something that would make easier a mod that is supposed to be hard an challenging doesn't make sense.
The timing isn't always consistent, though. Maps have differing approach rates, which also affects Hidden.Shiro wrote:
The fade-in of the note acts as an approach circle. With enough experience, you'll learn to read this as well as an approach circle. This isn't needed.
Yeah, either AR8 or AR9. It's not many to choose from. If you're good enough you should be able to adapt very quickly anyway.Teraku wrote:
The timing isn't always consistent, though. Maps have differing approach rates, which also affects Hidden.Shiro wrote:
The fade-in of the note acts as an approach circle. With enough experience, you'll learn to read this as well as an approach circle. This isn't needed.
I wonder what the purpose of hidden really is: learning to read fading hitcircles or learing to follow the flow of the music WITHOUT reading any circles.
If it's the latter, I think this can help improving it.
If it's the latter, I think this can help improving it.
i think the purpose is just to make the beatmap the little bit harder :/yoyomster wrote:
I wonder what the purpose of hidden really is: learning to read fading hitcircles or learing to follow the flow of the music WITHOUT reading any circles.
If it's the latter, I think this can help improving it.
bothyoyomster wrote:
I wonder what the purpose of hidden really is: learning to read fading hitcircles or learning to follow the flow of the music WITHOUT reading any circles.
If it's the latter, I think this can help improving it.
this.DakeDekaane wrote:
Hidden mod is meant to increase difficulty, having the first approach circle visible will reduce it, and a lot in many maps.
If you get mad for getting a 100 in the first note a lot of times while retrying, then keep retrying, play the song without HD at least once to "memorize", or don't use it at all.
I love HD mod as it is now, even for songs without lead-in music, makes it more challenging.
Just asking for something that would make easier a mod that is supposed to be hard an challenging doesn't make sense.
Learn to read the AR. I sometimes have similar problems, but if I actually focus on the circle, I can get it right.
this is just another "make it easier cuz' I can't do it" request IMO.
While I don't mind reading the timing for the first circle, I do admit that it's an annoyance sometimes.
Let's put the "inconsistent look" aside for a sec and look at this from another angle. The OP's intention is aimed at the first circle that needs to be hit without aid of music. OSU is a rythmn game after all so having to side-read or even memorise the timing of the first note is somewhat against the theme of the game. I remember in another recent thread about "playing with music off," in which many community members expressed their dislikes for this mode of play. The first circle with a silent intro is essentially the same thing - relying ONLY on your eyes to catch the beat. I think we need to give this problem more thought.
The first circle with silent intro is different from the circle immediately after a break, since the player can time it with the aid of music for the latter. IMO I think having some sort of timing aid for hidden mode with silent intro will reduce reliance on eyes/memorisation and should be considered seriously. If an approach circle looks inconsistent, then alternatives can be considered, such as do a countdown on the first circle (so instead of "1," it will read "3" "2" "1" "Go" and then the usual "1"). I'm sure there are better ideas out there but the bottom line is, having some sort of indication will be nice. Just my 2 cents.
EDIT: Here's a good read on Fake Difficulty. No offence intended to any community member, just something to consider.
Let's put the "inconsistent look" aside for a sec and look at this from another angle. The OP's intention is aimed at the first circle that needs to be hit without aid of music. OSU is a rythmn game after all so having to side-read or even memorise the timing of the first note is somewhat against the theme of the game. I remember in another recent thread about "playing with music off," in which many community members expressed their dislikes for this mode of play. The first circle with a silent intro is essentially the same thing - relying ONLY on your eyes to catch the beat. I think we need to give this problem more thought.
The first circle with silent intro is different from the circle immediately after a break, since the player can time it with the aid of music for the latter. IMO I think having some sort of timing aid for hidden mode with silent intro will reduce reliance on eyes/memorisation and should be considered seriously. If an approach circle looks inconsistent, then alternatives can be considered, such as do a countdown on the first circle (so instead of "1," it will read "3" "2" "1" "Go" and then the usual "1"). I'm sure there are better ideas out there but the bottom line is, having some sort of indication will be nice. Just my 2 cents.
EDIT: Here's a good read on Fake Difficulty. No offence intended to any community member, just something to consider.
^ That's a situation given by the mapper, not by the game itself, complain to them.
A countdown will be annoying each time you retry the map.
If you have enough experience, looking at the timer or even memorize the timing of the 1st note isn't necessary, just watch the circle/slider and the fade out will do the rest, you only have to feel it, it's just practice.
A countdown will be annoying each time you retry the map.
Well, one also have to memorize stacks and notes hidden by hitbursts, it's a very low sacrifice for a 1.06x multiplier.Oinari-sama wrote:
OSU is a rythmn game after all so having to side-read or even memorise the timing of the first note is somewhat against the theme of the game.
If you have enough experience, looking at the timer or even memorize the timing of the 1st note isn't necessary, just watch the circle/slider and the fade out will do the rest, you only have to feel it, it's just practice.
I think the people who support this should just learn to play, you can't just change everything that you're not good at
What Oinari-sama said.
Didn't know there was a term for it, but fake difficulty is pretty much spot on.
Sure it's harder as it is, even if it's minuscule, but you could just as well give yourself other handicaps and play with no music if you want a challenge.
Avoiding flaws and implying people aren't good players or need training, because they'd rather avoid the "fake difficulty"; it's pretty apparent you're scared of change. Of-course you can state your opinion, but stop blaming other people for what you can't comprehend.
Didn't know there was a term for it, but fake difficulty is pretty much spot on.
Sure it's harder as it is, even if it's minuscule, but you could just as well give yourself other handicaps and play with no music if you want a challenge.
Avoiding flaws and implying people aren't good players or need training, because they'd rather avoid the "fake difficulty"; it's pretty apparent you're scared of change. Of-course you can state your opinion, but stop blaming other people for what you can't comprehend.
I'd like to quote myself.
This is basically the skill required for HD. If you can't do this you should learn it.Tshemmp wrote:
You can read fading circles the same way you can read approach circles.
I Agree with it.Tshemmp wrote:
I'd like to quote myself.This is basically the skill required for HD. If you can't do this you should learn it.Tshemmp wrote:
You can read fading circles the same way you can read approach circles.