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[Correction] Russian Cyrillic Metadata

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Topic Starter
Krfawy
Hi, as you know there was an update of the metadata ranking criteria, however, the very specific part of the Russian Cyrillic metadata was supposed to be fixed yet wasn't before uploading it.

The faulty and confusing part of it is as follows:
ё should be romanised to ye, however, use yo or o to avoid usage of special characters.
Firstly, the very romanization process went wrong and it can be said by everyone who knows how the Russian language works. Not only the very transliteration process can't be done properly, even the very reversed process is going to be an obstacle as it isn't going to be done correctly. The character "ё" should be romanized to "yo" (most people don't agree on the "o" part and the agreeing ones are rather the very very minority so I believe we can skip them unless they happen to be the real number of people) or "o" if the very letter stands after ж, ч, ш, or щ. Someone would say "it's just one stupid letter so what's the whole commotion about" yet if we use the very current rule some words might be transliterated as other words that do exist and actually have a very different meaning.

Secondly, the very sentence is absolutely too long and too complicated, and now people won't be able to just brainlessly and CORRECTLY romanize the titles by themselves without any QAT/BN required.

The corrected line would go as follows:
ё should be romanised to yo, however, use o if it stands after ж, ч, ш, or щ

Now I would like some constructive feedback and some discussion from the community!
Shmiklak
Yeah, I would agree with Krfawy that transliteration ё as o isn't a really good idea. As we know from Russian phonetics sounds ё consists of two different sounds й and о. For example word "ёлка". In Russian its transcription should be "йолка" what romanizates as yolka and not olka. Who is Olka tbh? Olka is a russian name. I guess my example shows the possible confuse because of using o as a way to romanizate ё.
Kyubey
I remember this topic being raised before, and I'm honestly surprised romanization of ё was accepted as ye instead of yo. It definitely has nothing in common with ye, however, simple yo won't be enough, as with some consonants it should be romanized as o, for example: чёлка would be rather romanized as cholka instead of chyolka.
AnatOWJIya
Pretty interesting subject. As Kyubey mentioned earlier, not every usage of ye is right. Like we have work "Йогурт" , which translated into Enlglish like "Yogurt", we have yo. "Ягода" - "Berry" we have ya. I'd like to raise times when we have multiple sound like this. For example "Люблю" - "love"will we have lublyu or lyublyu or lyublu? "Ежовый" - "Hedgehoged(?)" yejoviy ? "Девчонка" - "Girl" devchonka or devchyonka ?
Russian pronuncing isn't very that easy thing.
As well we have prulal like "Спортивные" - "Sport" should we use ie or ye?
Talking about letter "Ы" , in "Вы" will it be vy on vi ? "Собакой" - "Dog" oy or oi? And if we're talking about Russian, should we show softness of sound "ь" in word like "Соль" - "Salt" with ' , like sol'(I've seen several cases in ranked maps when it was used and it wasn't)
I wish i helped out somehow 0w0
I've might get the topic wrong, but it's just russian metadata so wrong sometimes because of Russian itself
Sieg
Krfawy asked me to post here, I already send feedback on this month ago

THIS >
ё should be romanised to yo, however, use o if it stands after ж ч ш щ.
also, Russian metadata again
semyon422
I think we should use something like this:
ёлка - y'olka
чёлка - ch'olka
актёр - akt'or
берёза - b'er'oza
йогурт - y'ogurt
девчонка - d'evch'onka
ягода - y'agoda
люблю - l'ubl'u
ежовый - y'ejovyy'
cпортивные - sport'ivnyy'e
быстрый - bystryy'
дальний - dal'n'iy'

So my name should be written as S'em'on instead of Semyon (
Topic Starter
Krfawy
Oh firetruck me, I can't remember my teachers telling me the same story with "yo" working similarly as "ye" after "zh", "sh", "sch" and "shch", that would explain why it is "e" and "o" after such letters. Thank you everyone, especially Sieg, for bringing me the phonetics that actually work in the grammar field of the Russian language too! I'm going to upload Sieg's definition in my first post.


semyon422 wrote:

I think we should use something like this:

ёлка - y'olka

чёлка - ch'olka

актёр - akt'or

берёза - b'er'oza

йогурт - y'ogurt

девчонка - d'evch'onka

ягода - y'agoda

люблю - l'ubl'u

ежовый - y'ejovyy'

cпортивные - sport'ivnyy'e

быстрый - bystryy'

дальний - dal'n'iy'



So my name should be written as S'em'on instead of Semyon (
semyon, I am sorry to say that yet the very apostrophe is used as a softening sign so that wouldn't be very obvious to use it after those letters as shown in your examples, especially when we are supposed to follow the BGN/PCGN Russian Cyrillic method.



So, what do you guys think now?
Sieg

Krfawy wrote:

So, what do you guys think now?
Should be fine to merge.
pishifat
i dont know russian, but it seems like everyone who does believes this change would be better.

anyone have last minute complaints before this is fixed?
Kurai
I did not have time to follow the original RC changes and yes, it should have been this way from the beginning, it should be fine to merge.
Topic Starter
Krfawy
I wanted to PM pishi about this being a thing and then I noticed he posted here himself. LOL

Shall we proceed?
pishifat
on the ranking criteria now
RoflanBatya

semyon422 wrote:

I think we should use something like this:
ёлка - y'olka
чёлка - ch'olka
актёр - akt'or
берёза - b'er'oza
йогурт - y'ogurt
девчонка - d'evch'onka
ягода - y'agoda
люблю - l'ubl'u
ежовый - y'ejovyy'
cпортивные - sport'ivnyy'e
быстрый - bystryy'
дальний - dal'n'iy'
ёб твою мать - y'ob tvoy'u mat'
So my name should be written as S'em'on instead of Semyon (
Miraui
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