Loki - Interlude

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Topic Starter
Chewin

negusver wrote:

NM as requested

[Easy]

The movement in this diff feels a bit concerning. The 0.8 distance snap create a stop and go movement that doesn't really emphasize anything.
Examples are everywhere - compare movement from 00:00:155 - to 00:00:840 - wtih movement from 00:00:840 -
to 00:01:526 - the same theme repeats itself, but movement is drastically different. I get it that you want to create a patternized style as a gimmick that repeats itself, just as the music does, but that doesn't mean that emphasis should be neglected as much as it is.
I get that on higher difficulties the high sv combined with low ds is supposed to make the sliders carry movement entirely by themselves, but I don't think that gimmick works with the given rhythm.
My advice would be to decrease the overall sv and use 1.0 ds This would mean a full remap of the diff and I don't want to do it. Furthermore the decrease of SV and increase of DS wouldn't change that much the concept you wanted to point out: higher pitches > major spacing. The map would be anyways constant in its structure that players wouldn't even notice the difference between the actual map and an ipotetic one with higher DS and lower SV. The difference would be minimally perceptible that makes it not worth to full remap the diff.

I think the rhythm from 00:00:155 - to 00:10:440 - is way to dense comparatively
Also compare movement from 00:11:126 - to 00:00:155 - - the former is the actual part where the main instrument kicks in and therefore should offer more movement, but the opposite is the case ^ I will not apply changes that would mean to make a movement inconsistent with the rest of the patterns. The best choice for the easiest diff is to keep the same spacing/sv/structure on its patterns indipendently from the intensity of some parts of the music.

00:04:269 (3) - wouldn't let it end on 00:04:955 - , I think circles on 00:04:955 - and 00:05:297 - would create better emphasis - given that the theme alternates, I think it makes sense to break ou t from th e structural gimmick You are actually right here. This can be a very valid option to apply but the one I applied is valid too: if you compare this 00:02:897 (1,2,3) - to 00:08:383 (1,2,3) - and all next parts they are all consistent keeping the structure of "first element - circle - second element (similar to first element)" like I did for 00:00:155 (1,2,3) - and 00:05:640 (1,2,3) - respectively. This is a personal idea that I do not want to change. So, to be clear: if I removed the repeating arrow from 00:04:269 (3) - I would break the consistency with 00:09:755 (3) - (that doesn't have the higher pitch on the tail) and with the 00:00:155 (1,2,3) - (concept of: "first element - circle - second element (similar to first element)".

00:22:097 (1,2) - offers more movement than 00:24:840 (1,2,3,4) - and should therefore be used in in the second part instead of the first Mh.. it doesn't lol I mean, the movement is just following sliders' bodies while on second part that has to be emphasized the movement is much "intense" with 4 unstacked circles actually xD I didn't get you on this

why is the rhythm from 00:24:840 - to 00:26:897 - much less dense even though intensity of the music increases Because it's an easy diff and I explained you why some lines upward

The same things repeat themselves over the entire difficulty, so I'll let you figure things out


[Normal]

I'm not gonna comment on structure, because it really doesn't matter with 0.8 ds, so rhythm and movement mod only yay

I think this diff suffers from random pattern variation, that doesn't really reflect on much movement-wise.

I think non-repeat sliders only starting 00:00:155 - offer too much movement compared to 00:11:126 -
stacking 00:18:669 (3,4) - seems inappropriate It's because the 00:18:669 (3,4) is actually filling the flute melody not the piano one..
00:22:097 (1,2,3,4) - would use 1/1 sliders instead of circles and 00:23:469 (5,6) - circles instead of repeats, because of inappropriate stop movement implied by 00:23:469 (5,6) - The repeating sliders (5) and (6) have been mapped to open the next section with an 1/2 rhythm instead than the usual 1/1 circles. An other option would have been to use an 1/2 slider and a circle immediately afterwards but I dislike to use it for Normal diffs because it's too hard to play. The 1/1 circles are made to fill the piano melody of the music since this part has an higher intensity than previous ones. This means that if I used 1/1 slider like you say I would lose that major intensity I want to give while playing these sections.
00:46:783 (1) - I'd control j this for consistency with 00:35:126 (4,1) - also I think emphasis would be better (I know I said I wouldn't be commenting on structure but I'm not perfect) The flow would become less smoother actually. Maybe you didn't get why I decided to make this slider like this so I will try to explain: the previous 00:46:097 (3) - is directed on top side and now it's followed by 00:46:783 (1) - that is directed bot side and the following 00:48:155 (2) - is directed on top side again while the next is directed on bot side and so on. This is a mapping technique I use veeery often to make the flow smoother during gameplay
00:51:583 (3,4,1) - wouldn't stack these, I know you did the same on 00:18:669 (3,4) - but the latter should offer more movement because more tension The stack leniency would destroy the curved slider in all its shape
01:00:497 (1,2,3,4,5) - I don't think is a good variety to 00:55:012 (1,2,3,4) - because movement is too different with the change of angles Nice catch, it's even inconsistent with all previous parts with the same rhythm where I didn't use any kind of stack. Fixed in a different way
01:05:297 (2) - would turn into circles to reduce movement (man I'm using "movement" a lot, I guess thats just what I pay attention to, sorry) Why should I be inconsistent here with all previous parts like 00:59:126 (1,2) - ?
01:05:983 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6) - not so keen on this idea, I get it you try to emphasize white ticks because new sound, but because of 0.8 ds it would be emphasized anyway. Its less dense than the intro I didn't try to emphasize ticks lol I just love this kind of change in pattern structure
01:18:669 (5,6) - don't like it, theres no movement but loud sounds, would prefer 3 1/2 sliders
01:21:412 (5,6) - dito
01:27:926 (1,2) - stop implied by music so stack these (I think structure break is good because of drastic music change) I dislike stacks between sliders in mostly of my maps. This kind of pattern are very smooth and cool to see and play
01:33:412 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - I would stop using these circle patterns with given rise of tension, because of 0.8 ds The tension is given because of the highest part of the music I guess? :\

[Hard]

no comments on structure either due to small ds

Kinda like this diff, I think the gimmick fits well with given rhythm, so not much to say here.
Although there's still some random pattern variation that doesn't make much sense movement wise. Oh wow I see you hate my patterns movement so hard xDDD

00:00:155 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - why do you use more movement here instead 00:02:897 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3) - I think the other way around would make much more sense
same for 00:11:812 (1,1) - and 00:14:555 (1,1) - It wouldn't change anything from my point of view
00:19:355 (1,1,1,1) - I would use similar sliders to 00:16:612 (1) - given the decrease in pitch it doesn't change that much and making some changes on sliders' shapes sometime can be less annoying to play imo
00:26:555 (2) - don't like this slider ending there, would just move the douplets 1/2 earlier This pattern is full symmetric and then this slider is symmetric to 00:24:840 (1) - . Also this slider fills better the lower pitch on its tail
00:46:783 (1) - slider shape seems unfitting, theres no stop in music (red anchor this way implies stop) All sliders I used to open these sections (on previous parts) are made at the same way with red waypoints ehm..
00:49:526 (1,1) - music is continuous, slider arrangement implies break The structure of rhythm pattern is still based on consistency with all other parts.
00:55:012 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - increased movement of this would be more fitting at 00:57:755 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1) - Same of before
00:59:640 (2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - i don't like this entire part, you tried to change the rhythm, due to changed theme, but it doesn't feel intuitive, I think some more variation with circles would do the trick The rhythm is always 1/2 .. I only changed the way I mapped the patterns because it must be different from previous one since it's closing the section
01:08:726 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1,2,3) - why didn't you use this kind of movement in earlier similar patterns that weren't emphasized structurally You are actually right but if I used this kind of rhythm on the previous section the star rating would be much higher than this and the H symbol would swap to I (it was the same rhythm before indeed!) and I prefered to keep it harder only here because it's the further part of the music that anticipates the kiai section. I would change this but I can't because of star rating
I would stack 01:16:955 (1,2) - for better emphasis given how harsh new sounds are, dito for similar spots in the kiai, because I don't think movement difference to 01:22:440 - is enough Stacks don't mean "emphasize" to me, it means the opposite actually xD Stacking it would decrease the intensity of the beginning of kiai section
01:26:212 (5,6) - this variation seems pretty random, theres no decrease in pitch nor stop implied by the music Mh you are right. I tried to fix this without destroying the connection between previous and next patterns (I mean 01:24:840 (4,1) - ) but I didn't find anything else to apply. If you have any idea, or any pattern, I am here to see and fix it. For now, since I didn't find any solution, I will keep it like this.

[Insane]

I'm not really good enough to judge this diff properly as I can't really play it, but it seems that similar issues of movement variation that doesn't really make sense may be applied here. Also it's too late rn, I may edit this later who knows. Oh you are still complaining about this "movement" xD Do you maybe mean flow? Well. You can't talk about bad flow on my Insane and Extra maps, sorry. Flow is my stronger skill while mapping xD

[Drama]

refer to Insane
I appreciated your time and your help and even your explanations. Even if I just fixed one single thing it was a good mod (ignoring the "movement" you mentioned so much times xD). Stuff I rejected have been explained by me as well. Thank you very much!
pishifat
gonna be pointing out more general things since specific object arrangements are pretty okay

cut out the ~10ms delay on soft-hitfinish4

normal:
01:38:897 (1) - when both 1/1 and 1/2 spacing overlap, things look way more crowded than necessary. go with .9x spacing for this whole end section and you'll be good

insane
first half of the kiai is way harder than the second half and the music supports otehrwise :( should nerf the first half so there's smaller spacing and more 1/2 sliders
01:26:040 (2,3,4) - if these are kept as circles, spacing should be higher. has the same pitch peaking thing as 01:19:183 (4) - 01:21:926 (4,5) - etc

extra:
01:43:012 (1,1,1,1) - similar to normal, might want to buff spacing to the point of not overlapping. overlapping 1/2 feels like an unnecessary stop in motion


feel like the spread could work if that first point on insane is addressed, so if you can manage that call me back!!
Topic Starter
Chewin

pishifat wrote:

gonna be pointing out more general things since specific object arrangements are pretty okay

cut out the ~10ms delay on soft-hitfinish4 I think I fixed it with audacity, let me know pls I am not sure about this

normal:
01:38:897 (1) - when both 1/1 and 1/2 spacing overlap, things look way more crowded than necessary. go with .9x spacing for this whole end section and you'll be good I decided to use 1.0x so I could stack the 01:39:926 (2) - with 01:38:555 (4) - Much better now thanks!

insane
first half of the kiai is way harder than the second half and the music supports otehrwise :( should nerf the first half so there's smaller spacing and more 1/2 sliders I tried to make it easier with more stacks and using some sliders. I hope it's ok now ><
01:26:040 (2,3,4) - if these are kept as circles, spacing should be higher. has the same pitch peaking thing as 01:19:183 (4) - 01:21:926 (4,5) - etc with first point I remapped the previous part so it's now the same of the previous pattern with same pitch you mentioned

extra:
01:43:012 (1,1,1,1) - similar to normal, might want to buff spacing to the point of not overlapping. overlapping 1/2 feels like an unnecessary stop in motion Well.. These sliders were structured like that to create a violin key with their shape but I guess they just destroy the last part that should be emphasize with a crescendo spacing related to the increase of SV. So I decided to change this with some cool sliders (I hope xD)!


feel like the spread could work if that first point on insane is addressed, so if you can manage that call me back!!
Thank you very much pishifat :3
pishifat
1/2 patrol
Topic Starter
Chewin
Thank you Pishi ♥
Nozhomi
Can I know why Drama as diffname ? Seems quite not related to anything from album or artist, would put smth more related or just Extra.

[Normal :]
  1. Overall you have some small spacing variation who could be a bit adjusted like 00:27:926 (2,3) - ? A small check wouldn't be bad?
  2. 01:12:155 (2,3) - Rotate this by -5° to avoid the small overlap with 01:11:469 (1) - and gain in aesthetic.
  3. 01:44:383 (1,1) - You should do the gap between them as other are 01:43:012 (1,1,1) - , because with that small gap it could be readed like a 1/1.


[Hard :]
  1. 00:11:126 - Imo that's not because you change the rhythm than all these NCs are necessary. Having it on 00:15:926 (1) - make sense but not others. And apply for 00:44:040 - .
  2. 00:22:097 - This part confuse me about how you choose to stack your 1/2 and not. Will give some example.
    1. 00:22:440 (3,4) - why this one is stack and not 00:23:812 (2,3) - ?
    2. Why 00:26:897 (3,4,5,6) - and 00:28:269 (3,4,5,6) - are both stacked when melody have a different tension in the music ?
    3. How you structured the two same parts (00:22:097 - / 00:27:583 - ) and how you build emphasis work sometimes (like 00:29:640 (3,4,5,6) - ) but then why 00:24:155 (4,5,6) - is different why less music emphasis ? That's kinda the point why this part is 50/50. You did some good choices, but by doing something different, you killed how it could work the best with the song imo.
  3. Also 00:55:012 - this one who have same rhythm is much more boring due to overuse of 1/2 sliders, but at least it's consistent all along.


[Insane :]
  1. Imo the diff is still going a bit crazy at some points. That kind of patterns 00:27:583 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - is going too wild when the Hard had like zero jumps on that section. Also this pattern don't work that well with the music and would benefit more from the music if you swaped it with 00:28:955 (1,2,3,4) - , since the music gains in intensity here, would work pretty well with it. Apply to next similar section as well.


[Drama (pls change that name) :]
  1. 00:11:126 - No idea from where this spacing change is coming. I mean it's basically the same rhythm all over again so why suddenly create a diffspike when the music don't suggest it ? Change or at least nerf that (smth like 00:35:812 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - feels a lot more raisonable).
  2. 00:41:297 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - They should share the same spacing, and then increase it for 00:42:669 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - since music gains in intensity with piano.
  3. Jumpscreen zzz why.

Mukyu~
Topic Starter
Chewin

Nozhomi wrote:

Can I know why Drama as diffname ? Seems quite not related to anything from album or artist, would put smth more related or just Extra. we talked about this via irc

[Normal :]
  1. Overall you have some small spacing variation who could be a bit adjusted like 00:27:926 (2,3) - ? A small check wouldn't be bad? Nice eyes! xD Fixed and checked all the other elements
  2. 01:12:155 (2,3) - Rotate this by -5° to avoid the small overlap with 01:11:469 (1) - and gain in aesthetic. I moved it a bit on the left so i can stack the 01:13:526 (4) - with 01:11:469 (1) 's tail with constant spacing. W/e it's not perfectly symmetric with previous slider anymore
  3. 01:44:383 (1,1) - You should do the gap between them as other are 01:43:012 (1,1,1) - , because with that small gap it could be readed like a 1/1. there is no way it can be confusing because there is a crescendo with SV and so it's a crescendo in the spacing as well and, being the last element of the section, it's kinda predictable as 1/2 xD


[Hard :]
  1. 00:11:126 - Imo that's not because you change the rhythm than all these NCs are necessary. Having it on 00:15:926 (1) - make sense but not others. And apply for 00:44:040 - . It's more about aesthetic honestly because every slider here is following the flute so I wanted to warn about this in a different way and comboing makes this so good imo
  2. 00:22:097 - This part confuse me about how you choose to stack your 1/2 and not. Will give some example.It's more about related to the timeline than the music melody that makes the parts consistent to each other: every stack I used starts on a white tick that connects the next elements in the same way of unstacked patterns.. If I had used some stacks where the first element was snapped on the red tick I could have understand your confusion but here there is no way it can confuse players while playing the map. Also since it's all distance snapped this would mean remap all this part and I don't want to honestly
    1. 00:22:440 (3,4) - why this one is stack and not 00:23:812 (2,3) - ?
    2. Why 00:26:897 (3,4,5,6) - and 00:28:269 (3,4,5,6) - are both stacked when melody have a different tension in the music ?
    3. How you structured the two same parts (00:22:097 - / 00:27:583 - ) and how you build emphasis work sometimes (like 00:29:640 (3,4,5,6) - ) but then why 00:24:155 (4,5,6) - is different why less music emphasis ? That's kinda the point why this part is 50/50. You did some good choices, but by doing something different, you killed how it could work the best with the song imo.
  3. Also 00:55:012 - this one who have same rhythm is much more boring due to overuse of 1/2 sliders, but at least it's consistent all along. It would be annoying to make it the same of the previous part ._.


[Insane :]
  1. Imo the diff is still going a bit crazy at some points. That kind of patterns 00:27:583 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - is going too wild when the Hard had like zero jumps on that section. Also this pattern don't work that well with the music and would benefit more from the music if you swaped it with 00:28:955 (1,2,3,4) - , since the music gains in intensity here, would work pretty well with it. Apply to next similar section as well. it's actually constant with 00:22:097 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - that have the same intensity of the music but fits well there so.. anyways I don't think this insane is too hard compared to the hard diff because even if the hard diff is full distance snapped it has more variation in the choice of elements (so more sliders in the sections with circles) while in the insane the variation is compensated with some little jumps


[Drama (pls change that name) :]
  1. 00:11:126 - No idea from where this spacing change is coming. I mean it's basically the same rhythm all over again so why suddenly create a diffspike when the music don't suggest it ? Change or at least nerf that (smth like 00:35:812 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - feels a lot more raisonable). yea that was exhagerated. Fixed in an easier pattern
  2. 00:41:297 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - They should share the same spacing, and then increase it for 00:42:669 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - since music gains in intensity with piano. I made it more interesting : 3
  3. Jumpscreen zzz why.

Mukyu~
Thank youuuh~
Seijiro
ti servo ancora? xD

(saresti il prossimo sulla mia list )
Topic Starter
Chewin

MrSergio wrote:

ti servo ancora? xD

(saresti il prossimo sulla mia list )
Non ti preoccupare Sergio, già ti dovevo una mod per ricambiare il favore, tranquillo v_v
Grazie comunque!
Nozhomi
Cool~
Hope you won't regret this diffname tho XD
Mir
time to start drama
Topic Starter
Chewin

Nozhomi wrote:

Cool~
Hope you won't regret this diffname tho XD

Mir wrote:

time to start drama
LOL YEA MY BODY IS READY
meii18
congratz bia!!!
Worminators
shouldn't osu! be in source??
alacat

Worminators wrote:

shouldn't osu! be in source??
when the song is for osu! official contest (MBC, Aspire), osu! theme song, its compulsory to use osu! as source
when the song is featured on the webpage, its up to the creator to choose whether to put osu! as source
Nhawak
nice! congrats chewin :3/
Topic Starter
Chewin
Thank you guys

:)
Yooh
Isn't Loki is Thaehan? I think is better to add thaehan to tags.

Source: https://loki2.bandcamp.com/track/interlude
Topic Starter
Chewin

Yooh wrote:

Isn't Loki is Thaehan? I think is better to add thaehan to tags.

Source: https://loki2.bandcamp.com/track/interlude
I have already checked it by myself and he's a different artist.
BTW the metadata is already set in the .osz file you can download on the official osu! page at: https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmaps/artists/7
Yooh

Chewin wrote:

I have already checked it by myself and he's a different artist.
BTW the metadata is already set in the .osz file you can download on the official osu! page at: https://osu.ppy.sh/beatmaps/artists/7
Well, I thought he's not, but whatever...

Congrats on qualify! <3
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