2017-07-26 19:13 Doyak: btw, don't get me wrong
2017-07-26 19:13 Doyak: I'm an anime mapper and I like anime maps
2017-07-26 19:13 h4d0uk3n1: Oh
2017-07-26 19:13 h4d0uk3n1: Didn't know that tbh
2017-07-26 19:14 h4d0uk3n1: as for normal - i consider making changes here
https://i.imgur.com/9VMx7pi.png2017-07-26 19:14 h4d0uk3n1: last post on beatmaps thread
2017-07-26 19:16 Doyak: Normal is fine
2017-07-26 19:17 h4d0uk3n1: I guess, but it would be better with those changes I think
2017-07-26 19:17 Doyak: my first concern about Hard is the raw jumps
2017-07-26 19:17 Doyak: the jumps tear patterns apart
2017-07-26 19:18 Doyak: 00:13:084 (1) - so let's see here
2017-07-26 19:19 Doyak: that one is more related to 00:11:713 (1,2,3,4) - instead of 00:13:427 (2,3) -
2017-07-26 19:19 h4d0uk3n1: Hm, beginning of this on is aligned with previous slider
2017-07-26 19:19 Doyak: the vocal starts at 00:13:427 - here
2017-07-26 19:20 Doyak: (1) is barely related to (2) and (3), musically
2017-07-26 19:20 Doyak: but the way you divided the pattern
2017-07-26 19:20 Doyak: makes it look like 00:13:084 (1,2,3) - are strongly related in some way
2017-07-26 19:21 Doyak: but you had to put the jump 00:13:084 - only because it has a strong additional sound
2017-07-26 19:21 h4d0uk3n1: as for vocal - i agree with you, but stressed syllable is on click here
2017-07-26 19:21 h4d0uk3n1: 00:13:770 -
2017-07-26 19:21 Doyak: that's not what I mean
2017-07-26 19:21 Doyak: that should be clickable in either way
2017-07-26 19:21 Doyak: the problem is that 00:13:084 (1,2,3) - are working together
2017-07-26 19:21 Doyak: while they have no relation to each other whatsoever
2017-07-26 19:22 h4d0uk3n1: Yes, I agree that this is kinda forced, but i thought it would be a good visual filler between 00:11:713 (1,2,3,4) - and 00:14:455 (1,2,3) -
2017-07-26 19:23 Doyak: there could be a better way, just saying
2017-07-26 19:23 Doyak: not like you have to do everything
2017-07-26 19:24 Doyak: next is 00:18:227 (4,1) -
2017-07-26 19:24 Doyak: because these two are very close to each other, they look like a single pattern
2017-07-26 19:24 Doyak: looks more closely related than 00:17:884 (3,4) -
2017-07-26 19:25 Doyak: and because of how slider jump works, 00:18:227 (4,1) - actually feels much weaker than 00:17:198 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-07-26 19:26 h4d0uk3n1: i can explain things to you, right?
2017-07-26 19:26 Doyak: sure
2017-07-26 19:26 h4d0uk3n1: i thinks bonds between these 00:17:198 (1,2,3,4) - make it much more related, then these even with such visual distance
2017-07-26 19:27 h4d0uk3n1: also 00:18:227 (4,1) - shaped differently
2017-07-26 19:27 Doyak: Yes, that could be a justification
2017-07-26 19:27 Doyak: but still
2017-07-26 19:27 Doyak: 00:18:227 (4,1,2,3) -
2017-07-26 19:27 Doyak: you need to think how they are united
2017-07-26 19:28 Doyak: by same spacing between each other
2017-07-26 19:29 Doyak: 00:21:998 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - also this
2017-07-26 19:29 Doyak: 1-2 and 4-5 are raw jumps
2017-07-26 19:29 Doyak: makes them looks like just separate patterns
2017-07-26 19:29 h4d0uk3n1: i still think that these bonds are quite weak since 00:18:227 (4,1,3) - this pattern looks really forced to me in terms of consideration as "pattern" - straight sliders pointed randomly, 4 and 1 shaped differently
2017-07-26 19:30 h4d0uk3n1: I use connection between slider shapes there
2017-07-26 19:30 h4d0uk3n1: I explained it once to someone
2017-07-26 19:30 Doyak: but you can avoid it as well, it's possible
2017-07-26 19:30 Doyak: this can be quite significant to other people
2017-07-26 19:31 h4d0uk3n1: But im not sure if I want to since I really use this 00:23:198 (5,6) - kind of shape a lot
2017-07-26 19:31 h4d0uk3n1: 00:22:684 (4,5) - but as for this - i agree, i can make better bonds
2017-07-26 19:32 Doyak: then you can make some more strong relation between 00:21:998 (1,2,3,4,5) -
2017-07-26 19:32 h4d0uk3n1: Yes
2017-07-26 19:32 Doyak: Raw jumps weaken bonds
2017-07-26 19:33 h4d0uk3n1: I see term "raw jump" for the first time. Good to know something new
2017-07-26 19:33 Doyak: that's just what I use lol
2017-07-26 19:33 Doyak: I made that word to explain things easier
2017-07-26 19:33 h4d0uk3n1: oh
2017-07-26 19:33 h4d0uk3n1: ok)
2017-07-26 19:33 Doyak: 00:25:427 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - I can ask you the same thing as before
2017-07-26 19:34 Doyak: The only connection between 1 and 2 is the blanket
2017-07-26 19:34 Doyak: but others have strong bond by close spacing
2017-07-26 19:34 Doyak: only 1 is being 'alone'
2017-07-26 19:34 Doyak: and you know what, 00:25:941 (2) - is not stronger than others
2017-07-26 19:35 h4d0uk3n1: Hmmm. I can see your point, but for some reason I still think that visual connection (not distance) is still a great to organize relation between objects
2017-07-26 19:36 h4d0uk3n1: a great way*
2017-07-26 19:37 Doyak: 00:29:198 (5,6) - these two could just be a little more closer so that they feel same as 00:28:170 (3,4,5) -
2017-07-26 19:37 h4d0uk3n1: Agree
2017-07-26 19:37 h4d0uk3n1: Nazi, but still
2017-07-26 19:39 Doyak: 00:31:427 (1,2,3,4,5) - these could have some more meaning behind the pattern
2017-07-26 19:39 h4d0uk3n1: Absolutely agree
2017-07-26 19:41 Doyak: 00:37:715 (7,1,3) - these very-slight slopes trigger me, it feels like it's trying to be vertical or horizontal, but failed
2017-07-26 19:41 Doyak: well it's probably just my preference
2017-07-26 19:41 Doyak: but the map itself doesn't feel like these
2017-07-26 19:41 h4d0uk3n1: lmao, i really don't like perfectly horizontal vertical sliders
2017-07-26 19:42 h4d0uk3n1: ill rotate them a bit
2017-07-26 19:42 Doyak: I use 8 degree-rotated sliders
2017-07-26 19:42 Doyak: that feels optimal for me
2017-07-26 19:43 h4d0uk3n1: ill rotate by 2 (so it probably would be 3 in total lol)
2017-07-26 19:43 Doyak: 00:40:088 - any particular reason to skip these beats?
2017-07-26 19:44 Doyak: the sound on the middle is pretty obvious imo
2017-07-26 19:44 Doyak: both vocal and instruments
2017-07-26 19:44 h4d0uk3n1: in parts with back vocal i just want to keep object density a bit lower
2017-07-26 19:45 Doyak: but is that much needed, 1/1 is already lowered enough
2017-07-26 19:45 Doyak: because you already rested 00:38:732 - , resting another 1/1 feels quite underwhelming
2017-07-26 19:46 h4d0uk3n1: Hm. I guess ill try to change this place and see how it feels
2017-07-26 19:46 Doyak: 00:52:292 - and this one should be same as 00:41:444 - ?
2017-07-26 19:47 h4d0uk3n1: I little bit of variety, i use such thing in all future choruses
2017-07-26 19:47 Doyak: good
2017-07-26 19:48 Doyak: 00:53:308 (3,1,2,1) - here's a little contradiction
2017-07-26 19:48 Doyak: 00:54:325 (2,1) - you probably overlapped these because 00:54:664 - doesn't strong enough
2017-07-26 19:48 Doyak: sound*
2017-07-26 19:48 h4d0uk3n1: yes
2017-07-26 19:49 Doyak: 00:53:308 (3,1) - but this is spaced equal as the previous notes, even though you think 00:53:986 - is strong
2017-07-26 19:49 Doyak: how's that sound?
2017-07-26 19:49 h4d0uk3n1: you mean these? 00:53:986 (1,2) -
2017-07-26 19:49 Doyak: no, 3 to 1
2017-07-26 19:50 h4d0uk3n1: these are not space enough?
2017-07-26 19:50 Doyak: I mean
2017-07-26 19:50 Doyak: 00:52:970 (2,3) - and 00:53:308 (3,1) - have same spacing
2017-07-26 19:50 Doyak: then does that mean 00:53:308 - is as strong as 00:53:986 - ?
2017-07-26 19:50 h4d0uk3n1: Good point, it deserves changing
2017-07-26 19:51 Doyak: and my suggestion is
2017-07-26 19:51 Doyak: to just space 00:54:325 (2,1) - out too
2017-07-26 19:51 Doyak: because, you only notice the change in the music after hitting the slider
2017-07-26 19:51 Doyak: 00:54:325 (2,1) - this can cause readability issues
2017-07-26 19:51 h4d0uk3n1: But this space can give you a hint about music change
2017-07-26 19:52 h4d0uk3n1: Hm. Kinda agree with that tho
2017-07-26 19:52 Doyak: another thing is that the sound of 00:54:495 - lasts until 00:54:664 -
2017-07-26 19:52 Doyak: the actual change occurs when 00:54:664 - is played
2017-07-26 19:53 h4d0uk3n1: Yeah, now im 100% sure
2017-07-26 19:53 h4d0uk3n1: I should space it
2017-07-26 19:53 h4d0uk3n1: because even in future section this spacing used differently 00:55:864 (2,3,4) -
2017-07-26 19:53 h4d0uk3n1: ih
2017-07-26 19:53 h4d0uk3n1: oh
2017-07-26 19:53 h4d0uk3n1: not differently lol, but still
2017-07-26 19:55 h4d0uk3n1: i think best solution would be to ask someome to testplay
2017-07-26 19:55 h4d0uk3n1: and see if its causing any reading issues
2017-07-26 19:55 Doyak: nobody would really miss it, because it's a slider
2017-07-26 19:55 h4d0uk3n1: because 00:55:864 (2,3,4) - overlaps here pretty justify 00:54:325 (2,1) - overlap here
2017-07-26 19:56 h4d0uk3n1: (spacing is a bit wrong tho)
2017-07-26 19:57 h4d0uk3n1: if nobody would miss it or lose score for no reason, is that really an issue?
2017-07-26 19:57 h4d0uk3n1: also the whole poing - misreading is under questioning
2017-07-26 19:57 h4d0uk3n1: Its possible to guess that something is different because of combo colours
2017-07-26 19:57 Doyak: Well you can FC jump training maps even though it doesn't make any sense with the music?
2017-07-26 19:58 h4d0uk3n1: But here it makes sense with music tho
2017-07-26 19:58 h4d0uk3n1: 00:54:664 - start of section with different intensity
2017-07-26 19:58 Doyak: well I guess this is also fine then
2017-07-26 19:59 Doyak: not a big issue, I just don't like the fact that 00:54:325 (2,1) - two notes with whole different sections are overlapped
2017-07-26 19:59 Doyak: therefore seems to be related somehow
2017-07-26 20:00 h4d0uk3n1: I like overlaps sometimes. This one is not ugly I may assume
2017-07-26 20:00 Doyak: it's not about aesthetics, though
2017-07-26 20:00 Doyak: anyway I can understand your points
2017-07-26 20:00 h4d0uk3n1: Im glad
2017-07-26 20:01 Doyak: 00:55:864 (2,3,4) - 01:01:349 (2,3,4) - I wouldn't say they are bad patterns, but it seems to have only the flow and nothing else
2017-07-26 20:02 Doyak: as you're putting notes only occasionally, I would expect something nice to appear every time
2017-07-26 20:02 h4d0uk3n1: uh, ill draw a picture
2017-07-26 20:03 h4d0uk3n1:
https://i.imgur.com/F5wsPP5.png i follow this logic
2017-07-26 20:03 h4d0uk3n1: its quite nice to me lol
2017-07-26 20:04 Doyak: ha
2017-07-26 20:04 Doyak: great
2017-07-26 20:04 Doyak: but, they're not exactly parallel
2017-07-26 20:04 Doyak: 00:56:035 (3) - is rotated by 3 degree
2017-07-26 20:04 Doyak: while 00:55:864 (2,4) - is around 5
2017-07-26 20:05 h4d0uk3n1: im quite confused because i can't see it
2017-07-26 20:06 h4d0uk3n1: i guess ill draw a picture again to prove myself that they are not parallel
2017-07-26 20:06 Doyak: lol just use Ctrl Shift R
2017-07-26 20:06 h4d0uk3n1: yes, they are not
2017-07-26 20:07 h4d0uk3n1: ill fix
2017-07-26 20:08 Doyak: and another reason I feel those not tidy is because of the way 00:56:378 (4) - goes
2017-07-26 20:08 Doyak: not really important, meh let's just skip it
2017-07-26 20:09 h4d0uk3n1: ok, ill think about this tho
2017-07-26 20:09 Doyak: anyway you'd better take the whole pattern, to the very end of the last slider, into consideration next time
2017-07-26 20:09 Doyak: actually, I think
2017-07-26 20:10 Doyak: what if you just did
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/mdtC1qKG for those
2017-07-26 20:10 Doyak: that makes a straight relation
2017-07-26 20:10 Doyak: which I like to use
2017-07-26 20:11 h4d0uk3n1: Im not really a big fan of those
2017-07-26 20:12 Doyak: 01:29:806 (1) - this also stands alone
2017-07-26 20:13 h4d0uk3n1: 01:29:292 (6,1)
2017-07-26 20:13 Doyak: Yes, but they're in different combo color?
2017-07-26 20:14 Doyak: From what you said before, the color shows the bond strongly
2017-07-26 20:14 h4d0uk3n1: uh, yeah, but these are also connected
2017-07-26 20:14 h4d0uk3n1: 01:29:806 (1,2) -
2017-07-26 20:15 Doyak: probably in flow, yes
2017-07-26 20:15 Doyak: but let's take a look from a distance
2017-07-26 20:15 Doyak: 01:28:092 (2,3,4,5,6) - are together
2017-07-26 20:15 Doyak: 01:30:149 (2,3) - are together
2017-07-26 20:16 Doyak: 01:29:806 (1) - is just in the middle of them
2017-07-26 20:17 h4d0uk3n1: 01:29:292 (6,1,2) - i think this is kinda good abstract slider section
2017-07-26 20:17 h4d0uk3n1: which sounds really dumb and not justifiable
2017-07-26 20:17 h4d0uk3n1: but
2017-07-26 20:17 Doyak: abstract lol
2017-07-26 20:17 h4d0uk3n1: in bad in english, im sorry
2017-07-26 20:18 h4d0uk3n1: i just like bend sliders. at least in this map
2017-07-26 20:20 Doyak: this is why I try to avoid raw jumps
2017-07-26 20:20 Doyak: and always to make close relation between each notes in a pattern, with a consistent spacing
2017-07-26 20:21 Doyak:
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/2YuF4Xbc2017-07-26 20:21 h4d0uk3n1: i tried to stick to this logic in final diff pretty closely, but in this one i sometimes let myself do relatively big visual distance
2017-07-26 20:21 Doyak: because there's so much can be done without using wide spacing at all
2017-07-26 20:22 h4d0uk3n1: i understand
2017-07-26 20:22 h4d0uk3n1: tho i don't like this pattern at all
2017-07-26 20:22 Doyak: (but that resembles the bg)
2017-07-26 20:23 h4d0uk3n1: its absolutely personal thing, i try avoid using it. i like things to be perfectly imperfect (tho im bad in this lol)
2017-07-26 20:23 h4d0uk3n1: eh, but does it resemble how music sounds tho?
2017-07-26 20:23 h4d0uk3n1: its quite furious
2017-07-26 20:23 Doyak: lol no, that was just a visual pattern
2017-07-26 20:24 Doyak: 01:34:778 (5,6,1) - I wouldn't say much about these, up to you
2017-07-26 20:25 h4d0uk3n1: ill think about this
2017-07-26 20:25 h4d0uk3n1: this thing is used in the map sometimes tho
2017-07-26 20:25 Doyak: 02:06:927 (2,3) - lol you said you don't like this
2017-07-26 20:26 h4d0uk3n1: ill change this.
2017-07-26 20:28 h4d0uk3n1: can i go afk for a 5 minutes? neck really hurts
2017-07-26 20:28 Doyak: 03:16:793 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6) - I like this part
2017-07-26 20:28 Doyak: dat neck, same as mine
2017-07-26 20:28 h4d0uk3n1: bakari loved it too
2017-07-26 20:28 h4d0uk3n1: tho its very very simple
2017-07-26 20:28 Doyak: not really fond of the next part, but I guess it's fine
2017-07-26 20:29 h4d0uk3n1: im proud of same part in final diff more tho
2017-07-26 20:29 h4d0uk3n1: i started using curved sliders just to make variety
2017-07-26 20:30 h4d0uk3n1: i think its pretty needed since in what you pointed i used only straight sliders
2017-07-26 20:30 Doyak: not only sliders, but the angle also changed a lot
2017-07-26 20:30 Doyak: I prefer simple things
2017-07-26 20:31 Doyak: and repeating things
2017-07-26 20:31 h4d0uk3n1: ill be right back
2017-07-26 20:35 Doyak: also 01:15:064 (1,2,1,2,1,2) - this won't be not easier than what you did on Insane, I'd suggest either just using non-jump circles, or rather
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/ugqz5qGQ this
2017-07-26 20:36 h4d0uk3n1: im here
2017-07-26 20:37 Doyak: would* be not easier
2017-07-26 20:37 h4d0uk3n1: uh, i didn't get it, is this right picture?
2017-07-26 20:38 Doyak: It is?
2017-07-26 20:38 Doyak: the important sounds are 01:15:235 - 01:15:749 - 01:16:264 -
2017-07-26 20:38 Doyak: plus 01:15:064 - is the start beat, unavoidable
2017-07-26 20:39 h4d0uk3n1: i think it fits. also this makes yellow-orange-red thing possible
2017-07-26 20:40 Doyak: I don't mean it doesn't fit
2017-07-26 20:40 Doyak: I mean it's too hard to interpret
2017-07-26 20:40 Doyak: because the spacing is inconsistent
2017-07-26 20:40 Doyak: In Insane, you only used circles and skipped the last beat of each
2017-07-26 20:41 Doyak: so adding slider tails on Hard doesn't make sense in terms of the spread
2017-07-26 20:41 h4d0uk3n1: got it
2017-07-26 20:41 h4d0uk3n1: now im thinking
2017-07-26 20:42 h4d0uk3n1: i think using sliderends on hard makes reading easier
2017-07-26 20:43 Doyak: 01:15:064 (1,2,1,2,1,2) - the way I read these at my first look
2017-07-26 20:43 Doyak: was that the sliders are 3/4 sliders
2017-07-26 20:43 Doyak: because the spacing is inconsistent
2017-07-26 20:43 Doyak: it's natural to read them like that
2017-07-26 20:43 h4d0uk3n1: but why tho? spacing is the same as everything blue on previous section
2017-07-26 20:44 h4d0uk3n1: 01:12:321 (2,3) - same as this for example
2017-07-26 20:44 h4d0uk3n1: oh
2017-07-26 20:44 h4d0uk3n1: sorry
2017-07-26 20:44 Doyak: then why would one read 01:15:064 (1,2) - as a 1/2?
2017-07-26 20:45 Doyak: you even used different colors to show that this part is different
2017-07-26 20:45 Doyak: referencing the previous part doesn't work anymore
2017-07-26 20:45 h4d0uk3n1: its to show progression in music
2017-07-26 20:45 Doyak: and the problem is that it's inconsistent within the pattern itself
2017-07-26 20:46 h4d0uk3n1: this pattern is used as transition between previous part and next, to show that something is coming up
2017-07-26 20:46 Doyak: that makes sense if this was Insane+
2017-07-26 20:46 h4d0uk3n1: and spacing too. sounds are pretty strong
2017-07-26 20:46 Doyak: but Hard players are not capable of switching between two spacings every time
2017-07-26 20:47 h4d0uk3n1: hm
2017-07-26 20:47 h4d0uk3n1: i guess changing to circles would make it easier
2017-07-26 20:47 Doyak: sure
2017-07-26 20:47 h4d0uk3n1: stacked circles
2017-07-26 20:47 Doyak: stacked circles look good
2017-07-26 20:47 h4d0uk3n1: makes sense
2017-07-26 20:49 Doyak: ok let's do this
2017-07-26 20:49 Doyak: I don't think I'll nominate this myself
2017-07-26 20:50 Doyak: but I'm sure this map will be appreciated by some t2 BNs
2017-07-26 20:50 Doyak: I'll briefly give you a mod on the rest of the diffs too
2017-07-26 20:50 h4d0uk3n1: Ok, good
2017-07-26 20:51 Doyak: Let's move on to Insane
2017-07-26 20:52 Doyak: 00:13:255 - feels quite empty to leave this beat
2017-07-26 20:52 Doyak: it's same as 00:18:741 -
2017-07-26 20:53 h4d0uk3n1: Not quite same
2017-07-26 20:53 h4d0uk3n1: in first case theres a some kind of noise in music
2017-07-26 20:53 Doyak: but similarly strong
2017-07-26 20:53 Doyak: Well, you at least represented it on Hard though
2017-07-26 20:55 h4d0uk3n1: Also this long slider makes good connetion to 00:12:741 (4) -
2017-07-26 20:56 Doyak: then there might be something like
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/8EGtC4M62017-07-26 20:57 Doyak: 00:19:941 (1,2) - I saw you rejected this, but well, it's not unrankable, but would still be better to make it more visible
2017-07-26 20:57 h4d0uk3n1: Ill consider this
2017-07-26 20:58 Doyak: 00:25:941 (2,3,4) - the stance is a little unstable, maybe try making a perfect symmetry?
2017-07-26 20:59 h4d0uk3n1: thought about that, tried to make ot with 00:25:941 (2,4) - , but would be great if 4 was upper than 3 so the whole pattern is simmetrical, not just sliders
2017-07-26 21:00 Doyak: 00:51:953 (1,2,3,4) - rather than vaguely separating them, looks better if you make 4 to have same spacing with 2 as the others like
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/Nu35ABTr2017-07-26 21:00 Doyak: how's that symmetric tho
2017-07-26 21:01 Doyak: I mean if the pattern is going to be symmetric
2017-07-26 21:01 Doyak:
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/CfT0qztB it should be like this
2017-07-26 21:02 h4d0uk3n1: yeah, i meant that
2017-07-26 21:02 h4d0uk3n1: willing to do so
2017-07-26 21:02 Doyak: then do it
2017-07-26 21:04 Doyak: 00:57:921 (2,3,4,5,6,7,1) - something you could try without separating patterns visually:
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/t0wWIRH82017-07-26 21:06 Doyak: 01:04:264 (3,4,5) - you would notice the spacing between notes are inconsistent
2017-07-26 21:06 Doyak: even though the ds is the same
2017-07-26 21:06 h4d0uk3n1: Yeah
2017-07-26 21:06 Doyak: 01:05:292 (5,1) - also this antijump hmm
2017-07-26 21:07 Doyak: antijumps loses all the emphasis
2017-07-26 21:07 Doyak: even more than a stack
2017-07-26 21:08 Doyak: because, stacks are hitting the same point twice, which gives an impression of focusing on that spot
2017-07-26 21:08 h4d0uk3n1: I make it like this in next section too
2017-07-26 21:08 Doyak: but antijumps are just slowing down the flow
2017-07-26 21:08 h4d0uk3n1: Hm
2017-07-26 21:08 h4d0uk3n1: I agree
2017-07-26 21:08 h4d0uk3n1: (i don't know what is antijump, but i got your point
2017-07-26 21:09 Doyak: antijump is just about barely moving between notes
2017-07-26 21:09 h4d0uk3n1: Ok, good
2017-07-26 21:10 h4d0uk3n1: stack would be better solution in these cases
2017-07-26 21:10 Doyak: yes
2017-07-26 21:10 h4d0uk3n1: or maybe change 01:05:292 (5) - 1/2 slider
2017-07-26 21:10 Doyak: that works too
2017-07-26 21:11 h4d0uk3n1: i think it would be better since i dont stack notes like you mentioned throughout this difficulty
2017-07-26 21:11 Doyak: good
2017-07-26 21:12 Doyak: alright now about 01:50:074 (2,3) - these
2017-07-26 21:12 Doyak: 00:33:647 (2,3) -
2017-07-26 21:13 Doyak: you did a sharp flow at least there
2017-07-26 21:13 Doyak: but 01:50:074 (2,3) - is just way too plain
2017-07-26 21:13 h4d0uk3n1: Good point
2017-07-26 21:13 h4d0uk3n1: I agree
2017-07-26 21:14 Doyak: 02:10:870 (5,1) - same thing here as you would know
2017-07-26 21:14 h4d0uk3n1: Yes-yes
2017-07-26 21:15 Doyak: 02:53:727 (1) - I don't think you need too much 1/4s here
2017-07-26 21:15 Doyak: even though there exists some sounds, doesn't mean they're as important as the others
2017-07-26 21:16 Doyak: I would find a way to not put a note on 02:53:813 -
2017-07-26 21:18 Doyak: about the overlaps on the last kiai
2017-07-26 21:18 Doyak: it'll be more consistent if the proportion of the overlaps were equal
2017-07-26 21:18 Doyak: for example, compare 03:23:912 (2,4) - and 03:24:590 (4,1) -
2017-07-26 21:18 Doyak: these are overlapped "no matter what"
2017-07-26 21:19 Doyak: so it's kinda untidy
2017-07-26 21:19 Doyak: there's no meaning behind the overlaps
2017-07-26 21:20 Doyak: If the amount of overlapped proportion was equal, that could work as another concept of the overlaps
2017-07-26 21:20 h4d0uk3n1: I think if we consider kiai as a whole, it makes sense. Since overlaps used there quite often
2017-07-26 21:20 h4d0uk3n1: Oh
2017-07-26 21:20 Doyak: it's same as spacing
2017-07-26 21:20 Doyak: random spacings are just random
2017-07-26 21:21 Doyak: random overlaps are random too
2017-07-26 21:21 h4d0uk3n1: Hm, ill try to make these propotions equal
2017-07-26 21:21 Doyak: nice
2017-07-26 21:22 Doyak: 03:37:810 (1,2) - and finally this
2017-07-26 21:22 h4d0uk3n1: i hate final jumps
2017-07-26 21:22 Doyak: I see that you don't prefer consecutive jumps
2017-07-26 21:22 h4d0uk3n1: but
2017-07-26 21:22 h4d0uk3n1: Yeah, ill make them
2017-07-26 21:22 h4d0uk3n1: lol
2017-07-26 21:22 Doyak: but 1/2 sliders can't really emphasize the red ticks
2017-07-26 21:22 Doyak: yes
2017-07-26 21:23 Doyak: *hate final jumps*
2017-07-26 21:23 Doyak: *looks at the top diff*
2017-07-26 21:23 h4d0uk3n1: I KNOW
2017-07-26 21:23 Doyak: *screen jumps*
2017-07-26 21:23 Doyak: xD
2017-07-26 21:23 h4d0uk3n1: I thought it anoidable in final diff
2017-07-26 21:24 h4d0uk3n1: Now i think its anoidable in insane too
2017-07-26 21:24 Doyak: lol
2017-07-26 21:24 Doyak: emphasis comes from differentiating things
2017-07-26 21:24 h4d0uk3n1: I understand this quite well
2017-07-26 21:24 h4d0uk3n1: But it just seems unfair
2017-07-26 21:25 Doyak: so when every 1/2 tick is strong, consecutive jumps work good
2017-07-26 21:25 h4d0uk3n1: Right in the end
2017-07-26 21:25 Doyak: you don't really need to make big jumps there
2017-07-26 21:25 h4d0uk3n1: Yeah, I know
2017-07-26 21:25 Doyak: just fair amount of spacing
2017-07-26 21:25 Doyak: the click actions will do pretty good jobs by themselves
2017-07-26 21:28 h4d0uk3n1: When I first asked you for a check, I went to forum thread of the beatmap which you were modding and was quite afraid after that tbh
2017-07-26 21:28 Doyak: lol afraid of what
2017-07-26 21:29 h4d0uk3n1: Of wall of text xd
2017-07-26 21:29 h4d0uk3n1: But
2017-07-26 21:29 Doyak: xDD
2017-07-26 21:29 h4d0uk3n1: Im interested in making my set better
2017-07-26 21:29 Doyak: my wall of texts are unreadable
2017-07-26 21:29 Doyak: some about Normal
2017-07-26 21:30 Doyak: You could use some 1/2s here actually
2017-07-26 21:30 Doyak: just ocassionally
2017-07-26 21:30 Doyak: right now the difficulty gap between Hard is quite large
2017-07-26 21:30 Doyak: you can see that through the total amount of notes
2017-07-26 21:30 h4d0uk3n1: I dont think i want to since this works as easy
2017-07-26 21:31 Doyak: the lowest diff doesn't need to be an easy
2017-07-26 21:31 Doyak: we allow a proper Normal
2017-07-26 21:31 h4d0uk3n1: Oh
2017-07-26 21:31 h4d0uk3n1: Didn't know that
2017-07-26 21:31 Doyak: and you need to consider that your Hard is like Hard+ already
2017-07-26 21:31 Doyak:
t/6025802017-07-26 21:32 Doyak: we're working on this additional guideline, if you wonder
2017-07-26 21:32 h4d0uk3n1: Ill read this
2017-07-26 21:33 h4d0uk3n1: Thats all from you?
2017-07-26 21:33 Doyak: no, we should move on to the top diff
2017-07-26 21:34 h4d0uk3n1: I thought you may say that youve already looked and everything is ok, which would be really surprising lol
2017-07-26 21:34 Doyak: lol
2017-07-26 21:34 h4d0uk3n1: since this diff is the most controversial
2017-07-26 21:35 Doyak: one thing I would be asking is about things like 00:23:198 (2,3,4) -
2017-07-26 21:36 Doyak: because they really look unbalanced
2017-07-26 21:36 Doyak: something feels very empty around the center
2017-07-26 21:37 Doyak: and 00:24:570 (2,3,1) - too, it doesn't look very structured in any way
2017-07-26 21:37 h4d0uk3n1:
https://i.imgur.com/7XLJxkz.png something like this would work?
2017-07-26 21:37 Doyak: things like 00:26:113 (4,5,6,7,8) - are very good
2017-07-26 21:38 Doyak: blankets are mostly good, simple and clean
2017-07-26 21:38 Doyak: (and I abuse it too much)
2017-07-26 21:39 h4d0uk3n1: )
2017-07-26 21:39 h4d0uk3n1: 00:25:427 (1) - i may work on this slider (rip future blanket)
2017-07-26 21:39 Doyak: 00:31:598 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - love this
2017-07-26 21:40 Doyak: 00:41:444 (2,3) - any reason why only this is a jump
2017-07-26 21:40 Doyak: 00:40:088 (2,3,4) - close, 00:41:783 (3,4) - close
2017-07-26 21:41 h4d0uk3n1: for yellow sections i jump to bass drum and snare srum
2017-07-26 21:41 Doyak: then what about 00:50:936 (2,3) -
2017-07-26 21:41 Doyak: should be similar to 00:40:088 (2,3) -
2017-07-26 21:42 h4d0uk3n1: 00:40:088 (2,3) - close visually, but ds is as 00:41:444 (2,3) -
2017-07-26 21:42 h4d0uk3n1: and 00:50:936 (2,3) - too
2017-07-26 21:42 Doyak: ds doesn't really matter though
2017-07-26 21:42 Doyak: the nature of sliders are quite different from the ds
2017-07-26 21:42 Doyak: and it's also related to the pattern constructing
2017-07-26 21:42 h4d0uk3n1: I understand that
2017-07-26 21:42 Doyak: if you put a raw jump there, it just becomes a separate pattern
2017-07-26 21:43 Doyak: make them consistent, I'd suggest
2017-07-26 21:43 Doyak: 01:05:292 (3,1) - this is also an antijump
2017-07-26 21:44 h4d0uk3n1: ill look through choruses and see if its too inconsistent
2017-07-26 21:45 h4d0uk3n1: hm, i actually have reason to these antijumps - i don't want to make sliders to keep object density and dont want to stack because i don't use stack in general
2017-07-26 21:45 h4d0uk3n1: so i may think about a proper solution
2017-07-26 21:45 h4d0uk3n1: or maybe even keep these
2017-07-26 21:45 Doyak: hmm the problem is
2017-07-26 21:45 Doyak: that the similar spacing has been just used as 1/2 jumps
2017-07-26 21:45 Doyak: then 01:05:635 - is a cymbal sound
2017-07-26 21:45 Doyak: should be more important than the previous 1/2s
2017-07-26 21:46 h4d0uk3n1: Hm
2017-07-26 21:46 h4d0uk3n1: is making space bigger sounds like proper solution?
2017-07-26 21:46 Doyak: also it's a whole new section, don't need to be mixed up with the previous pattern
2017-07-26 21:46 Doyak: I use that solution sometimes too
2017-07-26 21:47 Doyak: like
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/pMJ1KoTZ2017-07-26 21:47 h4d0uk3n1: I find it the most optimal
2017-07-26 21:47 Doyak: It's not very efficient, but works at some point
2017-07-26 21:48 Doyak: actually, why not just use a 1/2 slider for 01:05:292 (3) -
2017-07-26 21:48 h4d0uk3n1: well, i think there no other choice
2017-07-26 21:48 h4d0uk3n1: as i said - i want to keep overall object density for blue sections
2017-07-26 21:48 h4d0uk3n1: relatively low since they are pretty calm
2017-07-26 21:49 h4d0uk3n1: i don't want extra clicks and even slider ends for no reason
2017-07-26 21:50 h4d0uk3n1: osu lagged, rip log. saved most of the lines tho
2017-07-26 21:50 Doyak: dw
2017-07-26 21:51 Doyak: I have all of it
2017-07-26 21:51 h4d0uk3n1: Cool
2017-07-26 21:51 Doyak:
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/TkrreCZH2017-07-26 21:51 Doyak: I save all the logs automatically
2017-07-26 21:51 Doyak: (this is since last summer)
2017-07-26 21:52 h4d0uk3n1: Thats handy
2017-07-26 21:52 Doyak: anyway, it's up to you how to fix it
2017-07-26 21:52 h4d0uk3n1: What exactly? D:
2017-07-26 21:52 Doyak: the antijump thing
2017-07-26 21:52 h4d0uk3n1: ah, yes
2017-07-26 21:53 Doyak: ofc same for 02:10:870 (5) -
2017-07-26 21:54 h4d0uk3n1: Yes
2017-07-26 21:55 h4d0uk3n1: Actually I went up the dialog to see how much time did you spend on my map
2017-07-26 21:55 h4d0uk3n1: and yep, it crashed xd
2017-07-26 21:55 Doyak: lol
2017-07-26 21:55 Doyak: 02:53:470 (1,2,3,4) - not sure why the stream turns around suddenly
2017-07-26 21:56 Doyak: the downbeat is here, everything before that should work as one
2017-07-26 21:56 Doyak: here, I mean 02:53:727 -
2017-07-26 21:56 h4d0uk3n1: vocal + drums are loud at 02:53:642 (3,4,3,4) -
2017-07-26 21:56 h4d0uk3n1: i think these turns show that quite well
2017-07-26 21:58 Doyak: and as I said on Insane, 02:53:813 (1) - this is not really needed
2017-07-26 21:58 Doyak: and if you care about the vocals, then I'd rather put the NC on 02:53:556 - instead of 02:53:470 -
2017-07-26 21:59 Doyak: makes more sense with when the sound actually starts
2017-07-26 21:59 Doyak: so it'll be like this
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/y8CR6yvY2017-07-26 22:01 h4d0uk3n1: the thing is that how it sounds here 02:53:813 - and here 02:54:156 - its different for me
2017-07-26 22:02 Doyak: It doesn't feel that different for me
2017-07-26 22:02 Doyak: at least then a full stream
2017-07-26 22:02 Doyak: which blends with all the "obvious" drums
2017-07-26 22:02 h4d0uk3n1: I don't want to feel it like triples, honestly, so the biggest thing i can do in this case is 02:53:813 (1) - put sliderend here
2017-07-26 22:02 Doyak: not a bad idea
2017-07-26 22:02 h4d0uk3n1: because these triples would ruin emphasize here 02:54:413 (2,3,4) -
2017-07-26 22:02 h4d0uk3n1: and i would be sad.
2017-07-26 22:03 Doyak: why would it ruin it?
2017-07-26 22:03 Doyak: the last triplet is heavily spaced, I think that's enough for the emphasis
2017-07-26 22:04 h4d0uk3n1: ruin because there would be jumps between triples
2017-07-26 22:04 h4d0uk3n1: actually
2017-07-26 22:04 h4d0uk3n1: i may toy with this place a bit and see
2017-07-26 22:05 Doyak: not really need to put jumps, just a regular spacing is fine
2017-07-26 22:06 h4d0uk3n1: i like this thing a lot 02:53:813 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - and don't want to ruin it
2017-07-26 22:06 h4d0uk3n1: but ye, as i said - ill figure something out
2017-07-26 22:07 Doyak: good
2017-07-26 22:08 h4d0uk3n1: for somewhat reason i want to explain too - im not an anime hater or something
2017-07-26 22:08 Doyak: lol
2017-07-26 22:08 h4d0uk3n1: I watch them occasionally too
2017-07-26 22:08 Doyak:
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/41FrhOSL2017-07-26 22:08 Doyak: I thought you are xD
2017-07-26 22:09 h4d0uk3n1: Nah
2017-07-26 22:09 h4d0uk3n1: Even if i wrote that
2017-07-26 22:10 Doyak: anyway, not much else to say, but I hope you would review the map by yourself as well, and try to put more meaning to all those slider jumps
2017-07-26 22:10 h4d0uk3n1: Yes
2017-07-26 22:10 Doyak: since they barely are balanced or create meaningful patterns
2017-07-26 22:11 Doyak: for close objects, you're pretty good at patterning them
2017-07-26 22:11 Doyak: now need to apply it to wider patterns
2017-07-26 22:12 h4d0uk3n1: Got it
2017-07-26 22:12 Doyak: so yeah, that's all from me
2017-07-26 22:12 Doyak: I'll post the log on the thread
2017-07-26 22:12 h4d0uk3n1: So.. How much time did you spend?
2017-07-26 22:13 Doyak: around 3 hours
2017-07-26 22:13 h4d0uk3n1: god
2017-07-26 22:13 h4d0uk3n1: being qat is hard
2017-07-26 22:13 Doyak:
https://doyak.s-ul.eu/HNJU6chT