2017-07-07 02:04 Seto Kousuke: np your map
2017-07-07 02:05 randomous: ACTION is listening to [https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1348181 Junichi Masuda, Go Ichinose - Mt. Pyre Peak]
2017-07-07 02:06 Seto Kousuke: ok so
2017-07-07 02:06 Seto Kousuke: as shiirn said, at your level you can't ''fix'', but learn what you must not do
2017-07-07 02:07 Seto Kousuke: for example
2017-07-07 02:07 Seto Kousuke: the first big issue i'll tell you, is about your ''Ear choices''
2017-07-07 02:07 Seto Kousuke: you're focusing way too much on specific sounds to map
2017-07-07 02:07 Seto Kousuke: and forget that this is a rythm game
2017-07-07 02:07 Seto Kousuke: for example
2017-07-07 02:08 Seto Kousuke: 00:25:065 (1) -
2017-07-07 02:08 Seto Kousuke: you're focusing waaay too much on that high pitch sound, you see?
2017-07-07 02:08 Seto Kousuke: whenever it stops, you simply stop the notes
2017-07-07 02:08 Seto Kousuke: and leave that weird blank
2017-07-07 02:08 randomous: hang on let me get in edit mode. Thank you btw
2017-07-07 02:08 randomous: Ah
2017-07-07 02:08 Seto Kousuke: np, we all gotta start somewhere, but not everyone wants to help newbies
2017-07-07 02:09 Seto Kousuke: i struggled a lot too, so i feel you
2017-07-07 02:09 Seto Kousuke: when you ok, tell me to continue
2017-07-07 02:09 Seto Kousuke: brb, getting soda
2017-07-07 02:11 randomous: So is it OK to focus on the main part in a song like this and then jump to other parts when the main part goes away, or should I try to melt everything together? I figure people will want to hit the notes on the melody in a song like this.
2017-07-07 02:12 Seto Kousuke: ok back
2017-07-07 02:12 Seto Kousuke: so
2017-07-07 02:12 Seto Kousuke: to not confuse you, i wont answer your question directly
2017-07-07 02:12 Seto Kousuke: but i'll explain what I wanted to say
2017-07-07 02:13 Seto Kousuke: and then you can ask again if you still think you need the answer
2017-07-07 02:13 Seto Kousuke: ok?
2017-07-07 02:13 randomous: Sure
2017-07-07 02:13 Seto Kousuke: oks, so
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: you've chosen there to follow the high pitch sound, that's ok, you had a plan and you followed it, nice
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: but you left too many empty places
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: and those empty places, have important sounds, don't you agree?
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: strong beats
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: important rythm
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: and it's not fast, it's a looong empty time
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: that's bad
2017-07-07 02:14 randomous: Ah, I see
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: ''so, I can't leave empty spaces?''
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: yes, you ''can''
2017-07-07 02:14 Seto Kousuke: but to do that
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: you must know what're you doing
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: the song must give a reason
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: and your overall structure must make it ''ok''
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: it's doable? yes, but not for a newbie, understand?
2017-07-07 02:15 randomous: So it's acceptable to follow the high part most of the time as long as it flows with the beats I start adding in between the high parts (the beats I didn't add)?
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: yes
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: you could follow it
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: but instead of the empty space
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: place filler rythm
2017-07-07 02:15 Seto Kousuke: that matches the song
2017-07-07 02:16 randomous: Yeah, I see
2017-07-07 02:16 Seto Kousuke: do not try to make these weird ''breaks'' during important sounds
2017-07-07 02:16 Seto Kousuke: try to make a playable map first
2017-07-07 02:16 Seto Kousuke: learn how to make a good flow, good rythm
2017-07-07 02:16 Seto Kousuke: and then, when you have enough experience, you can try more ''weird'' stuff
2017-07-07 02:16 Seto Kousuke: but that'll take a long time, be warned
2017-07-07 02:16 Seto Kousuke: mapping requires time
2017-07-07 02:17 randomous: Heh I'm fine with that
2017-07-07 02:17 Seto Kousuke: continuing
2017-07-07 02:17 Seto Kousuke: 00:02:481 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-07-07 02:17 Seto Kousuke: i got your point, I know what you wanted to do
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: rythmcally, you got it right
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: but the playability is reaaaally bad
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: it hurts a lot the player's aim
2017-07-07 02:18 randomous: is it the spacing?
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: no
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: it's this 00:02:924 (3,4) -
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: 00:02:481 (1,2,3,4) - straight line
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: straight line movements are usually ''hurtfull''
2017-07-07 02:18 randomous: Ah
2017-07-07 02:18 Seto Kousuke: because the player must keep a ''constant'' speed in a ''constant'' flow
2017-07-07 02:18 randomous: I was trying to do a "back and forth" kinda thing
2017-07-07 02:19 Seto Kousuke: yeah, i got your point
2017-07-07 02:19 Seto Kousuke: but this way, it has poor playability
2017-07-07 02:19 Seto Kousuke: one suggestion:
2017-07-07 02:19 Seto Kousuke: (w8)
2017-07-07 02:19 randomous: I thought it felt weird to play too
2017-07-07 02:20 Seto Kousuke: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/8529311
2017-07-07 02:20 Seto Kousuke: tried not to change too much your pattern
2017-07-07 02:20 Seto Kousuke: but that would have a similar effect
2017-07-07 02:20 Seto Kousuke: but a 10x better flow
2017-07-07 02:20 Seto Kousuke: because the angle from 3->4 is bigger
2017-07-07 02:20 Seto Kousuke: it's not ''straight'' anymore
2017-07-07 02:20 randomous: Ah, yeah
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: and one other thing
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: 00:03:072 (4) -
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: can you hear that strong sound on the 4?
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: it has a more impactfull sound
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: doesn't it ?
2017-07-07 02:21 randomous: the drum hit in the song?
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: yes
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: 00:02:481 (1) - has the first ''BUMP'' of the drum
2017-07-07 02:21 Seto Kousuke: 00:03:072 (4) - has the stronger ''PA''
2017-07-07 02:22 Seto Kousuke: so 4 needs to feel stronger
2017-07-07 02:22 Seto Kousuke: that's when you increase the DS
2017-07-07 02:22 Seto Kousuke: so, placing it below like the example i showed you
2017-07-07 02:22 Seto Kousuke: not only makes it play better
2017-07-07 02:22 Seto Kousuke: but also increases the DS and makes it feel more ''into the song''
2017-07-07 02:23 randomous: Ah, that makes a lot of sense
2017-07-07 02:24 Seto Kousuke: now that we're talking about intensities
2017-07-07 02:24 Seto Kousuke: do you know what a transition is?
2017-07-07 02:24 Seto Kousuke: musically speaking
2017-07-07 02:24 randomous: yes
2017-07-07 02:25 Seto Kousuke: k
2017-07-07 02:25 Seto Kousuke: these transitions, are the big white tick on the timeline (up there
2017-07-07 02:25 Seto Kousuke: 00:04:843 (1) - here's a transition
2017-07-07 02:25 Seto Kousuke: in other words, it's strong
2017-07-07 02:25 Seto Kousuke: and as you've learned already just now
2017-07-07 02:25 Seto Kousuke: there are 2 big mistakes here at 00:04:548 (6,7,1) -
2017-07-07 02:25 Seto Kousuke: first, straight line movement
2017-07-07 02:26 Seto Kousuke: straight lines on impactfull sounds are bad
2017-07-07 02:26 Seto Kousuke: unless you're a experienced mapper and know what you're doing
2017-07-07 02:26 Seto Kousuke: and second, since it's a transition AND an important sound
2017-07-07 02:26 Seto Kousuke: 00:04:843 (1) - needs more DS
2017-07-07 02:26 Seto Kousuke: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/8529328
2017-07-07 02:27 Seto Kousuke: this for example, would be an ''fix''
2017-07-07 02:27 Seto Kousuke: still bad because of the whole structure
2017-07-07 02:27 randomous: Ah yeah, that totally makes sense
2017-07-07 02:27 Seto Kousuke: but a better thing
2017-07-07 02:27 Seto Kousuke: you kind of got it right
2017-07-07 02:27 Seto Kousuke: right here 00:07:057 (7,1) -
2017-07-07 02:27 Seto Kousuke: it has a bigger DS
2017-07-07 02:28 Seto Kousuke: but still a bad flow , linear motion and stuff
2017-07-07 02:28 Seto Kousuke: now, the third major mistake your map has
2017-07-07 02:28 Seto Kousuke: is something a lot of beginners have
2017-07-07 02:28 randomous: even though it's going up and down, it's still bad? Is it because it's still basically just moving in a straight line across the screen?
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: yeah, the problem isn't the ''whole pattern''
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: it's that exactly straight line
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: on an impactfull note
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: you're applying too much tension on the player
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: it's not ''wrong'' to do that, you can
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: but since your whole map lacks structure
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: and experience
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: the entire flow will feel bad
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: you ''can'' do it...but don't try for now
2017-07-07 02:29 Seto Kousuke: gather more experience, learn how to make a good flow, a good and playable map
2017-07-07 02:30 randomous: oh sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt your third point. Don't worry, I won't try weird stuff until I get the hang of the fundamentals
2017-07-07 02:30 Seto Kousuke: nah, don't worry, you can stop to ask whenever
2017-07-07 02:30 Seto Kousuke: ok, so, continuing
2017-07-07 02:30 Seto Kousuke: 00:17:242 (4) -
2017-07-07 02:30 Seto Kousuke: it looks really terrible hahaha xD
2017-07-07 02:30 Seto Kousuke: and i'm sure you know it
2017-07-07 02:30 Seto Kousuke: xDD
2017-07-07 02:31 randomous: yeah it does
2017-07-07 02:31 Seto Kousuke: 3 things to talk about this
2017-07-07 02:31 Seto Kousuke: first:
2017-07-07 02:31 Seto Kousuke: it has way too many anchor points
2017-07-07 02:31 Seto Kousuke: ''usually'' when you have so many
2017-07-07 02:31 Seto Kousuke: it will suck
2017-07-07 02:31 randomous: Ah
2017-07-07 02:31 Seto Kousuke: specially when you don't know what you're doing
2017-07-07 02:31 Seto Kousuke: stuff that requires many anchor points
2017-07-07 02:32 Seto Kousuke: usually require the Red one somewhere
2017-07-07 02:32 Seto Kousuke: and you're doing some complex stuff
2017-07-07 02:32 Seto Kousuke: and as you figured out already
2017-07-07 02:32 Seto Kousuke: you'll never make it with the experience you have currently
2017-07-07 02:32 Seto Kousuke: so, do not try to make these huge sexy sliders
2017-07-07 02:32 Seto Kousuke: not for now at least
2017-07-07 02:32 Seto Kousuke: second thing
2017-07-07 02:32 randomous: It was originally justa 3 point slider lol
2017-07-07 02:33 Seto Kousuke: lol
2017-07-07 02:33 Seto Kousuke: anyway
2017-07-07 02:33 Seto Kousuke: second thing, that slider makes sense? yes
2017-07-07 02:33 Seto Kousuke: it would fit into a nice map for the song? absolutely
2017-07-07 02:33 Seto Kousuke: but you don't know how to do it yet, and it's kinda complicated atm for you
2017-07-07 02:33 Seto Kousuke: so deleting it, and making a normal 1/2 slider
2017-07-07 02:34 Seto Kousuke: would be the best choice
2017-07-07 02:34 Seto Kousuke: making a 1/2 slider and keeping the rythm simple
2017-07-07 02:34 Seto Kousuke: it would still play nice and feel good
2017-07-07 02:34 Seto Kousuke: (do you know what means 1/2 ?)
2017-07-07 02:34 randomous: So I should just steamroll over the high synth and do some background beats?
2017-07-07 02:34 randomous: 1/2 is the tick
2017-07-07 02:34 randomous: the red tick, right?
2017-07-07 02:34 Seto Kousuke: ''yes''
2017-07-07 02:34 Seto Kousuke: it's not exactly this, but yeah
2017-07-07 02:35 Seto Kousuke: and yes for your question
2017-07-07 02:35 Seto Kousuke: it would be better for you to just keep the constant rythm
2017-07-07 02:35 Seto Kousuke: and here 00:17:242 (4,1) - we already discussed about these empty gaps
2017-07-07 02:35 Seto Kousuke: so no reason for me to repeat
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: and the last thing now
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: remember what I said about your ''ear choices''
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: that you focus too much on one thing
2017-07-07 02:36 randomous: Yes
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: you're still tunelling too much your vision
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: example : 00:21:080 (4) -
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: that's actually a triplet sound
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: but you was so focused and tunelling that you probably didn't notice
2017-07-07 02:36 Seto Kousuke: 00:23:442 (1) - yet you did that here 00:23:442 (1) -
2017-07-07 02:37 Seto Kousuke: but only because it lasted more
2017-07-07 02:37 Seto Kousuke: so it was easier for you to notice
2017-07-07 02:38 randomous: IDK why I didn't map the triplet lol. I knew it was there, I just kinda... it's probably what you said lol the tunnel vision
2017-07-07 02:38 Seto Kousuke: yeah
2017-07-07 02:38 Seto Kousuke: ok, so
2017-07-07 02:38 Seto Kousuke: with that, you already got A LOT of information
2017-07-07 02:38 Seto Kousuke: if I talk more, you'll wont aborb everything
2017-07-07 02:38 randomous: Yeah, that's definitely super helpful already
2017-07-07 02:39 randomous: I mean it's up to you. I can absorb a lot lol
2017-07-07 02:39 Seto Kousuke: nah
2017-07-07 02:39 Seto Kousuke: you have motivation
2017-07-07 02:39 Seto Kousuke: but I know how this works
2017-07-07 02:39 Seto Kousuke: this is enough for now
2017-07-07 02:39 Seto Kousuke: use that motivation to map another thing
2017-07-07 02:39 Seto Kousuke: without having the same mistakes
2017-07-07 02:40 Seto Kousuke: be warned, your first 15 maps will be really bad
2017-07-07 02:40 Seto Kousuke: so don't focus on mapping 7 minutes stuff
2017-07-07 02:40 randomous: I unfortunately won't be able to map this weekend, but I'll definitely take what you said and try another map. And yeah, I figured lol. It looks like everyone who has at least 1 ranked map has tons in the graveyard
2017-07-07 02:40 Seto Kousuke: map 1-2 minutes things, get feed back, learn, move to another one
2017-07-07 02:41 Seto Kousuke: :p
2017-07-07 02:41 Seto Kousuke: https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/613893 that's a modding queue with a lot of people
2017-07-07 02:41 Seto Kousuke: i'm there too, different from the others, i have no rules
2017-07-07 02:41 Seto Kousuke: once a month you can post a map there and i'll check it for you
2017-07-07 02:42 Seto Kousuke: so, when you have a map, post it there, say you're requesting me and i'll talk to you when possible
2017-07-07 02:42 randomous: I posted there actually lol. I'll keep yours in mind if I feel like I'm getting the hang of it more and I have a map that isn't absolute beginner trash lol
2017-07-07 02:43 Seto Kousuke: oh lol
2017-07-07 02:43 Seto Kousuke: kdsopakdospad
2017-07-07 02:43 Seto Kousuke: didn't saw, i closed mine already lmao
2017-07-07 02:43 Seto Kousuke: kalindraz is a newbie helper too
2017-07-07 02:43 Seto Kousuke: so it may be good for you if he decides to check
2017-07-07 02:43 randomous: I was actually going to ask you first, but I saw that you were closed
2017-07-07 02:44 randomous: That's why I was surprised (and happy) to see you pm me
2017-07-07 02:44 Seto Kousuke: ohhh xDD
2017-07-07 02:44 Seto Kousuke: lucky lucky i couldn't sleep and decided to log on osu lmao
2017-07-07 02:44 randomous: definitely
2017-07-07 02:45 Seto Kousuke: well, but your map has good points tho
2017-07-07 02:45 Seto Kousuke: for a 2nd map, it's not as bad as I usually see
2017-07-07 02:45 Seto Kousuke: so gj, keep up
2017-07-07 02:45 randomous: Ah, thank you!
2017-07-07 02:47 randomous: Is there an easy way to save a chat history? I saw people posting IRC logs as mods for maps, so I figure there's just a way
2017-07-07 02:47 Seto Kousuke: yes
2017-07-07 02:47 Seto Kousuke: press ctrl + O
2017-07-07 02:47 Seto Kousuke: it will open the settings
2017-07-07 02:47 Seto Kousuke: go all the way down
2017-07-07 02:47 Seto Kousuke: there'll be an option for you to mark
2017-07-07 02:47 Seto Kousuke: something like ''automatically log chat''
2017-07-07 02:47 Seto Kousuke: or something
2017-07-07 02:48 Seto Kousuke: this will create a .txt file on your osu folder for everyone you talk automatically
2017-07-07 02:48 Seto Kousuke: and keep logging
2017-07-07 02:48 randomous: aha yes
2017-07-07 02:48 Seto Kousuke: which reminds me, i should post this irc chat there
2017-07-07 02:48 Seto Kousuke: i don't really care about kudosus
2017-07-07 02:48 Seto Kousuke: but sadly i need numbers on it to become a BN
2017-07-07 02:48 Seto Kousuke: so meh
2017-07-07 02:48 randomous: Well you'll still get one lol. This was super helpful