Sakura Hana wrote:

A better suggestion would be to remove the beatmap ratings and mapper rankings? since nothing we come up with will ever be fair

yeah ...
the only thing i could think of would be that people write a comment about the map.
But that is useless because you can use the Beatmap thread or just call it "after-modding"
And even if that would be implemented people would abuse it like
FIRST!!!!11 ( and i don't talk about the auto watch comments ^^ )
-.-

But removing it...
I don't know I mean the rating system works at least for the old beatmaps

Of course it will never be fair...

But atleast like/dislike system will improve it.
It will irredicate those idiots who just vote 10's or just vote 1's. They can only vote with the other majority who votes like/dislike now.

This way troll voters/10 voters will have less of an impact on the rating of the beatmap.

GladiOol wrote:

Of course it will never be fair...

But atleast like/dislike system will improve it.
It will irredicate those idiots who just vote 10's or just vote 1's. They can only vote with the other majority who votes like/dislike now.

This way troll voters/10 voters will have less of an impact on the rating of the beatmap.

So everyone is then a troll/fanboy ^^

nah just kidding. I admit this system would be better but i wouldn't be satisfied and also i hate likes/dislikes because the youtube kiddy community made it to an exhausting joke.
10 people (cause 10 dislikes) are gay ololol
10 people like justin bieber

and those stupid comments are always the best rated ones
I know this would be impossible in osu! (at least i hope so) but i got a hate for that system Dx
I would be happier with no rating system but then there would be something missing
So I would support this idea but i don't have any votes left

I never said everyone is a troll/fanboy.

I said that with this system troll/fanboys will have less of an impact on the rating of a beatmap.
A 'dislike' (equal to 1~5 with the current rating system) has less of an impact than a '1' vote has now.
That's the whole point of this system.

Irredicating the enite rating system is pretty much silly if you ask me. Everybody wants to express their opinion/feelings about maps (osu!), videos (youtube), movies (imdb), even your friends status' on facebook.
And seeing that lots of people complain about the rating system, and so do I, a change is needed.
This seems to be the best thing atm, and if we could also get the votes weighted that be sexy as hell also.

I think mostly like GladiOol, the only thing is that would be Good, but not really that good we really want...

I think a way to be more fair is, for vote Like/Dislike you'll need to had cleared the map 3 times (For taking out the 1st impressions that aren't so accurate, because we're humans...)

The Like/Dislike need to be a MUST VOTE...

Then, when you had cleared 10 times that map, optionally you can choose what was the point for you picking Like or Dislike...

So, there can be Creativity, Style, Difficulty/Challenge... and you may pick ONE of those...

So there we get a idea of what is the good point of the map, or what's the missing point of it... (Getting a +1 if you liked it and a -1 if you disliked it...

So there we have a % of Likes, and a Idea of in what point the votes were based...

So there we can Categorize beatmaps if we want, into Creatives, Uniques/Cools and Bad/Good/Insane Difficulty...

And there can be a beatmap achievements system too... for the 3 Points of view, Creativity Badge, Stylish Badge and Perfect Difficulty Badge...

Or things like that...

Who would play a map they didn't like 3 times just to vote for it? All that would come of that is overwhelmingly positive reviews.

The only problem I can see is that me (and probably other people) will be too nice about rating and will like the amazing as well as the okay...but not bad enough to dislike maps. I suppose there will also be people that tend to dislike more maps that will even the ratings out, so I would be fine with this change.

And also... about the playing 3 times before rating... DISAGREE. sometimes if I play through a really bad map I just want to finish it, give it the 7-star or whatever it deserves, and DELETE IT. Not torture myself even more D: The people who like the bad map will play it 3 times, give it a 10 star (or like, if the rating system is changed) while the people who don't like it will play one time and not bother with 3 more to give it a low rating or dislike. So, a bad map would end up with a higher score than it really deserves. Does that make sense or am I spouting nonsense again? o_o

GladiOol wrote:

I never said everyone is a troll/fanboy.

I said that with this system troll/fanboys will have less of an impact on the rating of a beatmap.
A 'dislike' (equal to 1~5 with the current rating system) has less of an impact than a '1' vote has now.
That's the whole point of this system.

Irredicating the enite rating system is pretty much silly if you ask me. Everybody wants to express their opinion/feelings about maps (osu!), videos (youtube), movies (imdb), even your friends status' on facebook.
And seeing that lots of people complain about the rating system, and so do I, a change is needed.
This seems to be the best thing atm, and if we could also get the votes weighted that be sexy as hell also.

sry if you didn't understand me
The troll fanboy thing was a joke .
I also don't wanna have no voting system. I think that like/dislike is better but also not perfect. And if we do that it would be fine to vote each difficulty because sometimes i play a "bad" Map but the map isn't horrible or so but the diff.
So you could vote guest diff. which are sometimes really good on a "bad" map.

bomber34 wrote:

I also don't wanna have no voting system. I think that like/dislike is better but also not perfect. And if we do that it would be fine to vote each difficulty because sometimes i play a "bad" Map but the map isn't horrible or so but the diff.
So you could vote guest diff. which are sometimes really good on a "bad" map.

i think own rating for every map is a good idea, but it will only work, if more people vote.
so there should be thumb up / thumb down, because it is faster, if you think that map is normal, then dont vote.
also the vote weight is a good idea too, because more people will vote to improve their raiting.

Nice post.

Support.

tl;dr

Support.

tl;dr

this will never get implented. no need to post on this guys.

GladiOol wrote:

tl;dr

this will never get implented. no need to post on this guys.

There's still hope. osu! needs this perfect idea implemented.

0_o wrote:

While we're at it, each difficulty should have its own separate rating as well.

I think so too. Having each difficulty its own separate rating and then creating an average percentage of likes for the beatmap.
Guess difficulties are very different compared to the other difficulties in the map set.

mm201 wrote:

Like/dislike systems need a huge number of votes to reduce the error to an acceptable level. That's why it works for Youtube.

osu! receives more ratings per play than a Youtube video receives likes/dislikes per view. You can always see the rating even though there's only a handful of likes/dislikes on Youtube. I don't see how these errors would be much of a problem. Isn't it suppose to be easy to generate a percentage from a few numbers?

I can't live in a world without this implemented.
This must, sooner or later be implemented.

Sure, i'd agree, because ppl like me tend to search for popular beatmaps (sorry), which we overlooked less popular ones due to the current rating system.
It'd be more fair to beatmappers for their hardwork.
Liked! Wham! ^^

Yes! Finally.....i'm tired of the 1-10 rating System

SonicFan344 wrote:

Yes! Finally.....i'm tired of the 1-10 rating System

Everyone should be tired of it by now.

I would rather rate beatmap difficulty off of how many fails it has than base it off the star system. Every song past a certain point (When players are considered fluent in osu!) is a 10. This means The Secret Garden's Insane is exactly the same difficulty as StrangeProgram's TAG4 difficulty. The hell.

Mithost wrote:

I would rather rate beatmap difficulty off of how many fails it has than base it off the star system. Every song past a certain point (When players are considered fluent in osu!) is a 10. This means The Secret Garden's Insane is exactly the same difficulty as StrangeProgram's TAG4 difficulty. The hell.

huh? rating beatmap difficulty?

this is RATING (liking/disliking) beatmaps, not rating beatmap difficulty.

Sounds good to me.

Support. Totally. I'm tired of rating.

Oh wow people are still posting in this. In my opinion the rating system should be completely banned because it doesn't even give the slightest reflection of the beatmap's quality.

GladiOol wrote:

Oh wow people are still posting in this. In my opinion the rating system should be completely banned because it doesn't even give the slightest reflection of the beatmap's quality.

You have a very good point there.

but then again, like and dislike is the simplest way to judge a beatmap, if a way to judge a beatmap should be present.

So... a couple of thoughts here from my side. (Though I have to admit, it's nearly 2AM here and I'm tired, so didn't read the thread entirely.)


Was discussing the ranking system with theowest in irc some, he referred me to this thread as we got some pretty conclusions (or I at least think we do).

To my experience, most normal users in osu! play this for fun and don't really think their rating through, unless they have a experience in modding/mapping and can underbuild their opinion properly and all - though that is a minority, let's be honest.
People - I admit, I was like that until I started mapping - often just rate songs because they want to continue to the next song or because they want to go do something else. That rating screen is just one extra that pops up (and to some people also annoys).


Therefore, I was thinking that, additionally to liking-disliking (which I think is SURELY enough for people who're not professional - professionals should've modded the map before it got ranked c;) discussed in this thread, the rating system should also be separated.

What do I mean by this?
I think it should not pop up when you get your score chart at the end of your song. Instead, it could for instance be placed with the local scores. The way it seems to me that the people who do vote, are at least slightly more behind their like/dislike, as they put a mere 2 seconds of thinking in it, more than what they would've otherwise.

Also, another question might be: how many times to vote?
After all, people could save their votes up by playing it a lot of times and then get quite some impact by voting all their votes. I don't think anything's wrong with giving people the amount of votes same as the amount of times finishing the song, as long as there is for example a 2 minute buffer in between every vote.


Apart from that. I personally also do agree with separate voting per difficulty~ Though it should be taken in account of one diff got a lot more votes than another, rather than just taking the average of the diffs.

I agree. However I think it shouldn't be in locals replays but just something you must unlock. You cannot vote if you haven't fully played it (like usual) but instead, outside the replay screen. People must notice it, or else the beatmap won't get enough votes.

I'm thinking of having like/dislike buttons instead of the user rating until you actually rate it (pressing one of the buttons). But when you haven't fully played it yet, it will remain greyed out and not possible to click. Ratings already displayed can affect your opinion.

RandomJibberish wrote:

Ratings will always suck, since most people rate for the song/mapper/NotaniNiSmapness rather than the actual map. We are moving to Like/Meh/Dislike system at some point though AFAIK - Posted: Sat Apr 02, 2011 9:12 pm (over 1 year ago)

Don't see why this is taking so long.

theowest wrote:

but then again, like and dislike is the simplest way to judge a beatmap, if a way to judge a beatmap should be present.

I'd say Bad/OK/Good would make more sense. If you implement just like and dislike it'll be almost same as current system where everything is 10 stars. Just make a green, yellow and red button or something. e.e

I agree with JappyBabes on this. +1

This ^

JappyBabes wrote:

Just make a green, yellow and red button or something.

Yeah!

Bumping that.

I personally would find it better to change the current Map Rating System as Like/Dislike System. 10 Stars are a quite big selection where many people often picks the wrong Rating. And I don't mean the 1-Star-Troll Votes or the I-like-the-Anime-10-Star Votes but these where people have played one Diff and judging it by only this Diff.

However, it's pretty dumb that if you give a Map six Stars that it still counts as positive.


It makes way more sense to say "I like it." or "I don't like it." instead of "Yeah maybe 8 Stars because xyz and abc.". And since some people are whining about every Rating under nine Stars it would be just the best to change it to a Like/Dislike System. OR to change it from 10 Stars to 5. At least you can say to five Stars great, to four good, to three okay, to two not so good and to one bad. How people judge the Map is subjective but I find it currently in that way bad how it is.

Stefan wrote:

Bumping that.

I personally would find it better to change the current Map Rating System as Like/Dislike System. 10 Stars are a quite big selection where many people often picks the wrong Rating. And I don't mean the 1-Star-Troll Votes or the I-like-the-Anime-10-Star Votes but these where people have played one Diff and judging it by only this Diff.

However, it's pretty dumb that if you give a Map six Stars that it still counts as positive.


It makes way more sense to say "I like it." or "I don't like it." instead of "Yeah maybe 8 Stars because xyz and abc.". And since some people are whining about every Rating under nine Stars it would be just the best to change it to a Like/Dislike System. OR to change it from 10 Stars to 5. At least you can say to five Stars great, to four good, to three okay, to two not so good and to one bad. How people judge the Map is subjective but I find it currently in that way bad how it is.

There should be at least 3 options, one for disliking, one for liking, and other for being indifferent about the map (equivalent to 5.5 stars in the 1-10 ranking system), that way you can still vote even if you didn't find the map anything special.

The problem here is that it seems that most people who vote positively vote 10 (even if the map wasn't awesome for them), since any other rating is considered bad.

A solution would be weighting each player's votes based on how they tend to vote for maps.

Examples:

Player A: 120 10-star ratings, 10 1-star ratings. (average: 9.3076923) (standard deviation: 2.407502).
10 Star ratings are 0.2876*StandardDeviation apart from the average.
Each 10-star rating therefore is weighted as: = 0.226 of a vote.
1 Star ratings are 3.45075*StandardDeviation apart from the average. Each 1-star vote is then considered as 0.999 of a vote.

Player B: 120 10-star ratings, 30 1-star ratings (average: 8.2 StandardDeviation:3.6121)
10-star ratings are worth 0.382 of a vote.
1-star ratings are worth 0.954 of a vote.

Player C: 10 1-star, 60 5-star, 40 7-star, 20 10-star- (Average 6.077 StandardDeviation: 2.2777)
1-star votes are worth 0.974
5-star votes are worth 0.364
7-star votes are worth 0.315
10-star votes are worth 0.915

Player D: 500 1-star, 1 10-star. Average: 1.017964. StandardDeviation: 0.40209
1-star votes are worth 0.036 of a vote.
10-star votes are worth 1 of a vote.

Player E: 100 1-star, 100 10-star. Average: 5.5 Standard Deviation: 4.51129
Each vote is worth 0.681 of a vote.

Player F: 100 2-star, 100 9-star. Average: 5.5 StandardDeviation: 3.50878.
Each vote is also worth 0.681 of a vote.

For that I would perfer the 5-Star-Rating-System. Giving a Map three Stars would be like saying "Okay, the map is fine but nothing special imo."

Good idea, support this.

I also propose add option to disable user's rating on map if mapper wants it like it was done on youtube.

Reason why i think its needed: User's rating may be important for some mappers, and some troll downvotes may look too unfair. We cant stop people from troll downrating but we can disable user's rating at all.

Comments/suggestions please.

Kodora wrote:

Good idea, support this.

I also propose add option to disable user's rating on map if mapper wants it like it was done on youtube.

Reason why i think its needed: User's rating may be important for some mappers, and some troll downvotes may look too unfair. We cant stop people from troll downrating but we can disable user's rating at all.

Comments/suggestions please.

I don't think censorship is the answer.

This is not "censorship", this is one of the ways how to stop troll voting 1.

Maybe first find the reason why those people are troll voting...

If it's just a few troll votes, it'll even out soon enough.
If it's a ton of "troll" votes, there's some reason for them voting like that.

Kodora wrote:

This is not "censorship", this is one of the ways how to stop troll voting 1.

People got different opinions if they vote 1 they got they reasons, same when some one vote 10, you make maps for all the players then all of they have they opinions about your work.

Luna wrote:

If it's just a few troll votes, it'll even out soon enough.
If it's a ton of "troll" votes, there's some reason for them voting like that.

This ^ and when you get alot of 1 you know somethink is wrong with the beatmap

bad english

https://osu.ppy.sh/b/260734?m=0

Not sure that something really wrong with beatmap, but it downvoted too much. Probably it will be fair to consider those downvotes as trollish.