Adding my two cents:
Why don't you guys suggest improvements to the CtB mode? I think it'd be fun to see more stuff implemented on the mode than just moving the plate from left to right.
Maybe by doing so, the game modes (or how they translate into each other when switching) will be different enough to make CtB specific maps rankeable on their own (not that I agree with that anyways).

So :P?

There are already many mappers that make osu maps with the express thought of them being enjoyable on catch the beat (just as often they worry about taiko as well) as well, however, these mappers are far and in between. Something like a ctb-only diff would be rather rare comparatively speaking since it's very possible to make a good CtB map with exclusively standard, however, it is not always feasible to make a pattern that follows the music, fits the mapping style used before, and fits both standard and CtB

whymeman: what's sad is that is exactly what many, many players and mappers, especially english-speakers, think about catch the beat. CtB has a very intuitive playing curve, you can start right off on insanes and do perfectly fine compared to other modes which leads to people thinking that it "is too easy" and "caters only to noobs / unskilled / can't-handle-the-other-modes" players, but it has just as much of a difficulty curve and skill plateau as standard or taiko, and just like the other two mods the number of players that have reached that plateau are increasing by the day.

Krisom: the main improvements that can be made to catch the beat as-is are, in order of severity:
> Improved hyperfruit coding (very low priority since only stupid crap bugs out the hyperfruit)
> Increased visibility on spinner fruits
> Clearer hitboxes for the notes (this can be skinned currently, actually)
> Make tiny droplets worth something. I can completely ignore these and get a B on a map and get a way higher score than an S if i catch more spinner fruits than him.

"just moving the plate left and right" is an opinion from someone that has not played the game mode past a vague interest.


These are mostly just idle thoughts, nobody actually expects ctb to become rankable since peppy is of the 90%, or seems to have grown into that sector.

Those are mostly bug fixes, what I'm proposing is a change (for minor it is) on the game mode to make it more original at the moment of converting standar to CtB (pretty much like taiko). You guys are the players so you should eb intrested on new stuff (like players of standard mode have been asking for the return of hold sliders, by example)
EDIT:
Good example of a good idea

Weezy wrote:

Only thing that can really be improved in my eyes are the spinners, maybe change the whole concept because right now ANYONE can pass a spinner (standard and taiko you can slip up.) Right now spinners are easy, an idiot can manage to catch falling fruits :T.

EDIT 2: I think I might also give my (other) 2 cents. Why not propose that the speed-ups / slow-downs affect smoething in-gameplay, like, the movement of the plate? Think of it, a slowdown comes near, a warning appears, the plate turns (by exaple) blue and you cannot move it as fast as you used to while the fruits fall slower and their placement is much closer. Wouldn't that be cool?

Shiirn wrote:

"just moving the plate left and right" is an opinion from someone that has not played the game mode past a vague interest.

Now, you're assuming stuff and being rude wihout a good reason.
Also, drop those "Oh all the english speakers hate CtB" argument, it makes you look paranoic :> (and it only enlarges a stupid western/eastern division I've never cared about and I think it's pretty silly to begin with)

Krisom wrote:

Adding my two cents:
Why don't you guys suggest improvements to the CtB mode? I think it'd be fun to see more stuff implemented on the mode than just moving the plate from left to right.
Maybe by doing so, the game modes (or how they translate into each other when switching) will be different enough to make CtB specific maps rankeable on their own (not that I agree with that anyways).

So ?

Only thing that can really be improved in my eyes are the spinners, maybe change the whole concept because right now ANYONE can pass a spinner (standard and taiko you can slip up.) Right now spinners are easy, an idiot can manage to catch falling fruits :T.

I do approve of what you guys are doing and agree fully on the set guidelines that has been made, but as stated before, standard maps play fine in CTB, unlike taiko where most standard maps are crap. That to me is whats stopping CTB maps on getting ranked (and the guidelines of course.) If someone can find a legit argument onto why standard maps don't play well on CTB, sadly to say I don't see it getting ranked :T

BUT if it happens to get ranked, I will jump on the idea and start making CTB maps for future projects! Hell I'll start now and add em to my map info

Unless you can answer my previous question with undeniable proof i don't think this will get very far, specially since you can focus on making a CTB diff that's playable on Standard gameplay as well.

Krisom wrote:

EDIT 2: I think I might also give my (other) 2 cents. Why not propose that the speed-ups / slow-downs affect smoething in-gameplay, like, the movement of the plate? Think of it, a slowdown comes near, a warning appears, the plate turns (by exaple) blue and you cannot move it as fast as you used to while the fruits fall slower and their placement is much closer. Wouldn't that be cool?

Now, you're assuming stuff and being rude wihout a good reason.
Also, drop those "Oh all the english speakers hate CtB" argument, it makes you look paranoic :>

1. Not really, that's akin to forcing the halftime mod for certain sections. Fruits falling slower would be like AR changes, which are very unreadable anyway (see taiko)

2. I'm sorry if I offended you, but it's the truth. I'm certain it's very much the same if i said "standard is simple, you just move your mouse and click circles"

Also weezy, whymeman has a point - spinners have their place as a purely bonus score item, while it's impossible to "fail" a spinner on catch the beat, you also do not gain combos or any formal, flat rate of score like you do in standard.

Sakura Hana wrote:

Let me reverse the question then, is there any reason why a CTB map shouldn't be playable in osu! standard?, and before you reply please provide something other than the fact that the Y axys on CTB can be ignored because that's just plain lazyness, as far as i know ryuuta moves slower than regular mouse movement, since the mouse can move as fast as your hand, i still haven't seen anything that can make a CTB map unplayable on osu! standard

Because hyperfruits can imply much, much harder jumps. Because you don't need to click. Because, and this is an example for the hyperfruits, i've made a simple ctb difficulty for the lolz that had a 1/8th stream at the end with a 1/4 hyperfruit jump across the entire screen. It played brilliantly on CtB (this was kanon-kanon, by the way) but was outright impossible for any human player (really, a 18x jump?) on standard.
For an example of the "don't need to click" example, take a look at chipscape. It needs a lot of clicking. Compare how many people easily FC chipscape on ctb. This is not because it is an easy map, but because it's a lot more possible to pass because...you're not clicking. This just means that streamier fuckfests are more viable on ctb.

Another thing.... don't point out that dislikes are a region biased matter.

Sakura Hana wrote:

Let me reverse the question then, is there any reason why a CTB map shouldn't be playable in osu! standard?, and before you reply please provide something other than the fact that the Y axys on CTB can be ignored because that's just plain lazyness, as far as i know ryuuta moves slower than regular mouse movement, since the mouse can move as fast as your hand, i still haven't seen anything that can make a CTB map unplayable on osu! standard

PLZ....look at the replies ....
I say it already there is a bug jump appear which standard can make it all 300's but CTB you only can get all misses...
I dont want to say it again and again so plz refer to my previous reply..


Also, there is an interesting thing happen.
Bloody tears(by Gabi)
plz look at this map, anything you need to do is turn on the Hard Rock and Auto mod and watch.
The hyperdash throw away the plate to make the plate which auto controls miss the note..
Is it a bug or just make it on purpose?

whymeman wrote:

"Only thing that can really be improved in my eyes are the spinners, maybe change the whole concept because right now ANYONE can pass a spinner (standard and taiko you can slip up.) Right now spinners are easy, an idiot can manage to catch falling fruits :T. "

Why change something that isn't broken and is already balanced? The "spinners" in CTB are converted into bonus drops which also allows a difference in player scores. Not only that, HOW are you going to catch all of the bonus drops, especially in short spinners?

I don't see how you could really change up the spinner in CTB anyway.

Weezy wrote:

If someone can find a legit argument onto why standard maps don't play well on CTB, sadly to say I don't see it getting ranked :T

Something Ephemeral said way back is that "A good insane will translate to a good CTB"
There are quite a few amazing insanes that do not translate as good to CTB.

I can only think of a few insanes that are equally hard for standard and CTB players.

ZHSteven wrote:

Sakura Hana wrote:

Let me reverse the question then, is there any reason why a CTB map shouldn't be playable in osu! standard?, and before you reply please provide something other than the fact that the Y axys on CTB can be ignored because that's just plain lazyness, as far as i know ryuuta moves slower than regular mouse movement, since the mouse can move as fast as your hand, i still haven't seen anything that can make a CTB map unplayable on osu! standard

PLZ....look at the replies ....
I say it already there is a bug jump appear which standard can make it all 300's but CTB you only can get all misses...
I dont want to say it again and again so plz refer to my previous reply..

And it looks like you didnt understand the question, i didnt ask if a standard diff can be translated into CTB, i asked if a CTB diff can be translated into standard

Krisom wrote:

Adding my two cents:
Why don't you guys suggest improvements to the CtB mode? I think it'd be fun to see more stuff implemented on the mode than just moving the plate from left to right.
Maybe by doing so, the game modes (or how they translate into each other when switching) will be different enough to make CtB specific maps rankeable on their own (not that I agree with that anyways).

So ?

I can not press more buttons because I only play with my left hand.

Sakura Hana wrote:

And it looks like you didnt understand the question, i didnt ask if a standard diff can be translated into CTB, i asked if a CTB diff can be translated into standard

first of all, I appologize that I havent recive your real meaning of the question.
I am not a native English speaker, so I may get misunderstanding of anying...forgiven me

So, I am thinking you are asking the unique patterns that CTB map can have but it is ugly and unplayable when it plays in osu?

if so, that will be my answer:

I think, unplayable means the map is totally cannot play, even auto cannot Full combo it. If that is the point, I can only say all the ctb patterns can be transfer into osu! standard so far as I know.

But if you are talking about the enjoyable of a map, I think I can give you some opinions. In ctb map, the most important patten is jump. How well you can put the jump, and how interesting you can put the jump will be the judge of a good ctb map. But sometime, these kind of jump cannot make standard enjoyable, because the jump could be sudden and extremely fast when playing in standard.

Please look at this map of mine: Kotoko- wing my way. This is my first map and first try of make ctb map. I know this is not good enough but I am sure there is a lot of CTB player enjoy it. In the map, I placed a lot of jumps to make it enjoyable and fun in CTB mode. In order to make it rankable, I tried so much time to make it an insane osu! standard diff but failed. Not only the patterns of max jump put in osu standard is boring and stupid, but also the high-speed small jump will make a lot of people wants to slap my face..

In my mapping experince, I think there is still some patterns that fit CTB mode very well, but is not good in standard mode.

"I think, unplayable means the map is totally cannot play, even auto cannot Full combo it. If that is the point, I can only say all the ctb patterns can be transfer into osu! standard so far as I know."

Please don't use Auto as a "true" guideline of what is rankable or not. Its not just the fact of the map giving the player the chance of having a full combo, but also how the maps are made as well (i.e.- Using 1/8 notes on a +200 BPM song to "make it harder"). Rules and guidelines are also built from common sense as well. This is why some mappers and modders bump heads often because of what they feel is rankable or not (also due to the lack of understanding).

whymeman wrote:

"I think, unplayable means the map is totally cannot play, even auto cannot Full combo it. If that is the point, I can only say all the ctb patterns can be transfer into osu! standard so far as I know."

Please don't use Auto as a "true" guideline of what is rankable or not. Its not just the fact of the map giving the player the chance of having a full combo, but also how the maps are made as well (i.e.- Using 1/8 notes on a +200 BPM song to "make it harder"). Rules and guidelines are also built from common sense as well. This is why some mappers and modders bump heads often because of what they feel is rankable or not.

pretty much this.

whymeman wrote:

"I think, unplayable means the map is totally cannot play, even auto cannot Full combo it. If that is the point, I can only say all the ctb patterns can be transfer into osu! standard so far as I know."

Please don't use Auto as a "true" guideline of what is rankable or not. Its not just the fact of the map giving the player the chance of having a full combo, but also how the maps are made as well (i.e.- Using 1/8 notes on a +200 BPM song to "make it harder"). Rules and guidelines are also built from common sense as well. This is why some mappers and modders bump heads often because of what they feel is rankable or not (also due to the lack of understanding).

That is my fault...I misunderstand the question again...TAT

So please just ignore that point...

using 1/8 on anything over 140 BPM shouldn't be allowed. It's certainly possible to do, but seriously, so few people can do it accurately there's no point.

Also, There should be a second auto mode for CTB: the current one which hits everything on spinners and can show the true "maximum" point value, even though that score is entirely unattainable, and another which can't move faster than ryuuta. Make ryuuta move at his maximum speed all the time, and starts to move to catch the next note at the last possible second to catch the fruit on the very edge of the plate. Or Center, since that would give some leeway. If auto 2 can't SS it, the map is unrankable (there are other stipulations, but this would be a very easy way to check to see if the most awesome player ever (ie a robot) could pass it).

Personally I don't have a problem with anything that is theoretically possible. There is always someone crazy enough to figure out how to do it.

But then it still wouldn't be "humanly possible" right? Its better to do extensive testing than to use something to cut corners since even if Auto can "find" the playability problems, it doesn't mean its going to find everything for you.

Just because osu can do it, doesn't really mean a human can.

So yeah like whymeman said, thorough testing is probably the best answer.

Although I feel like this is sort of flowing off topic.

Support, but I would love some impossible CtB maps. Mainly verdi mixes. ;x

I'm almost sure that this thread has just failed.

Oh well.

Its not the fact of the thread failing, but its how you present something you want to address. Its like going to court with nothing to support your case vs. taking the time to do the research and provide evidance to support your reasons.

Also, its not just the fact of just trying to get CTB only difficulties to be rankable, but to include the fact of the process of how it is going to be done and how much sense is it going to make. Also, there will be that problem of "I can't mod CTB maps" from modders as well and that alone was a big problem with Taiko. Besides that, if a great amount of osu! standard maps were crafted from hell and couldn't be played properly in CTB then this matter might haven flown differently.... but its just my thoughts on it to let you know.

Another thing, did anyone re-read the Rules & Guidelines recently? viewtopic.php?f=6&t=439

whymeman wrote:

But then it still wouldn't be "humanly possible" right? Its better to do extensive testing than to use something to cut corners since even if Auto can "find" the playability problems, it doesn't mean its going to find everything for you.

What cookiezi does was not humanly possible either until he did it. I've seen what I presumed to be completely impossible actually happen in rhythm games. Full combo a 240 1/4th stream 16 notes long with 3 ms accuracy. Hitting an impossible to hit stacked note by hitting it exactly 30 ms early. etc...

By that logic we shouldn't bother having AImod. Using the term "cut corners" is a very poor choice. It's called efficiency. And the mappers who don't map CTB can then use that auto to find out if their regular osu map is SSable on CTB.

I don't think it's a problem to make a map that no human can SS right now. Just look how long it took people to FC Guitar Hero 2.

if it's theoretically possible, it is possible.

ziin wrote:

whymeman wrote:

But then it still wouldn't be "humanly possible" right? Its better to do extensive testing than to use something to cut corners since even if Auto can "find" the playability problems, it doesn't mean its going to find everything for you.

What cookiezi does was not humanly possible either until he did it. I've seen wh-......

(I stopped reading after that since the logic made no sense at all). What does Cookiezi have to do with how maps SHOULD be made? Don't build a concept off of ONE person. You have to think in a more wider range than "the pros". If you try to build something out of bad concepts or using "idols" to make a point, you're not going to get far.

Shiirn wrote:

The meta for catch the beat players is largely based in languages other than english (chinese, korean, and japanese players have a much higher concentration of ctb players to standard than, say, england or the united states) while those other-native-language players most likely do not speak english well enough to formulate something like this. If you take a look at some of the ctb threads in other languages you'll see they're far more involved and don't have the "LOL CTB IS RETARDED" mentality that 90% of english-native (or certain russians i won't mention) osu! players have.

Thing is you can translate your caps quote into "CtB is easier and boring because it's easy", which is the actual meaning of it. Because seriously, I've got a few friends (really a few) who switched to CtB because they got frustrated at standar and CtB looked easier and more friendly, it's a fact that it is easier than the other two mods, you can say it in many ways, one of those is "CtB IS RETARDED LOLOLOLOL".

whymeman wrote:

(I stopped reading after that since the logic made no sense at all). What does Cookiezi have to do with how maps SHOULD be made? Don't build a concept off of ONE person. You have to think in a more wider range than "the pros". If you try to build something out of bad concepts or using "idols" to make a point, you're not going to get far.

I think he means some people here might be talking about "impossible maps" when they are not impossible but just too hard. Of course in CtB there ARE impossible to FC maps, but I'm really sure some "impossible" maps are actually doable but just too hard for any player to do them.

I don't even play CtB but I definitely support CtB-Diffs being rankable, so I'd like to adress the question why CtB maps should not be available for standard play as well.
As was mentioned before, CtB would use horizontal spacing and probably use rather large spacing/jumpy patterns to make it more entertaining. A few people have argued that mostly or even exclusively using horizontal spacing would be lazy since exactly the same patterns could be achieved with osu! mapping.
There is one problem I see, though. If you keep the horizontal spacing (x-coordinates) and add vertical spacing (y-coordinates) as well, you get even larger spacing (Pythagorean theorem - or just common sense). So, with the already high horizontal distance snap, this would result in ultra-high spacing maps for osu! mode. Sure they would be "playable", but really not all too fun for the majority of players.
Also, it would be pretty hard to create patterns that play out nicely in osu! from a base of x-axis spacing - basically the only patterns where hitcircles would not be positioned at the same angle would be those patterns that don't use 100% horizontal-only spacing in the CtB-diff (Streams for example). This is because every time you use 100% horizontal spacing, it leaves a fixed percentage of that distance to y-spacing if you obey distance snap, resulting in patterns repeating the same angle over and over again. Wow, that sounds confusing... Did anyone get what I mean? Probably not lol I'll see if I can create a picture or two for illustration later on xD

I think the reasons why standard osu! maps don't usually translate into good/challenging CtB maps and can even contain impossible patterns have been sufficiently discussed.
So a osu! -> CtB transition usually results in boring/too easy maps and a CtB -> osu! transition would usually result in boring/annoying patterns and awful spacing. I think that's reason enough to justify the need for CtB-only diffs.

@^: That was exactly what I want to say, support.

I guess we have enough theoretical appropriateness, but how about practical? I mean, does CtB player really enjoys CtB-only map more? (Please don't mention about difficulty problem if you want to explain this, lots of previous efforts failed cause they made expert-exclusive CtB maps and that couldn't be tolerated by osu community enough.) Does mappers can make enough differentiated CtB map from osu standard one with CtB mode? Is there any different mapping techniques or restrictions(I guess this one is being ready)? We need to discuss these too, but if CtB players don't actively participate this, this will be definite failed. To be honest what I feel interesting is, lots of participants of this discussion are actually non-CtB players, even key-men.

There are still many ways to go.

_Void_ wrote:

I think the reasons why standard osu! maps don't usually translate into good/challenging CtB maps and can even contain impossible patterns have been sufficiently discussed.
So a osu! -> CtB transition usually results in boring/too easy maps and a CtB -> osu! transition would usually result in boring/annoying patterns and awful spacing. I think that's reason enough to justify the need for CtB-only diffs.

So basically you want CTB rankable so you can make insane jumps?

Even now there's rarely any Taiko maps that catter new Taiko players, and you want CTB to be rankable, to make even MORE insane CTB maps eh?

Sakura Hana wrote:

So basically you want CTB rankable so you can make insane jumps?

You should allready understand that this isn't the importand point at all.

Sakura Hana wrote:

Even now there's rarely any Taiko maps that catter new Taiko players, and you want CTB to be rankable, to make even MORE insane CTB maps eh?

To be honest, where is the meaning/logic of making easy maps, if the maps are allready easy when you are playing in your play-mode the osu! maps, "eh?"

No, I'm not asking for insane jump-spam maps.
I just said that horizontal spacing would generally be rather large because it's the only way you can move in CtB. If it was close spacing only, it would be really boring, right? If you then add vertical distance to that horizontal spacing in order to make it playable in osu! mode, you'd create even wider spacing to the point where it really cannot be considered decent osu! mapping.

whymeman wrote:

(I stopped reading after that since the logic made no sense at all). What does Cookiezi have to do with how maps SHOULD be made? Don't build a concept off of ONE person. You have to think in a more wider range than "the pros". If you try to build something out of bad concepts or using "idols" to make a point, you're not going to get far.

Why can't we make challenging maps for the pros?

Sakura Hana wrote:

Even now there's rarely any Taiko maps that catter new Taiko players, and you want CTB to be rankable, to make even MORE insane CTB maps eh?

There are no easy taikos because easy osu maps are easy on taiko and ctb. The harder osu maps do not transfer nearly as well.

lepidopodus wrote:

@^: That was exactly what I want to say, support.

I guess we have enough theoretical appropriateness, but how about practical? I mean, does CtB player really enjoys CtB-only map more? (Please don't mention about difficulty problem if you want to explain this, lots of previous efforts failed cause they made expert-exclusive CtB maps and that couldn't be tolerated by osu community enough.) Does mappers can make enough differentiated CtB map from osu standard one with CtB mode? Is there any different mapping techniques or restrictions(I guess this one is being ready)? We need to discuss these too, but if CtB players don't actively participate this, this will be definite failed. To be honest what I feel interesting is, lots of participants of this discussion are actually non-CtB players, even key-men.

There are still many ways to go.

cant agree more.

As a ctb mapper, I think I can answer your question.
For me, the first 2 maps by me is aiming for rank because there is no such "rules" being set. I promise the map is not aiming for pros. it is making for the whole ctb player. I believe the ctb standard player can enjoy those map.
But after DJpop's map, I noticed that ctb map is unrankable.

So I think there is no point for me to do sth that aiming for rank. I think, making a rank you need to consider what jump is possible, what jump could be strange, or is the standard player can enjoy or not. I do this 2 map by 1 whole month.
Different from unrank map , you can place whatever you like, just need to care about the map is beautiful, and FCable.

If ctb map is unrankable, what is the point I do such a lot of work just for 1 map testing again and again?
So I quit...now only doing some funny map, and enjoying with players who play my map, enjoy my map.
But dont worry~ I promise I will only stop my mapping only when there is no people like my map.

that is only my point of view.
BTW, Maybe the problem that CTB players not active about this thread I think, is they dont even know this thread, or just they dont even know how to map(that is why the CTB maps are almost all like hell). That doesnt means that CTB player dont want a specific map~~
So I think we should try our best from now~~lol

ziin wrote:

whymeman wrote:

(I stopped reading after that since the logic made no sense at all). What does Cookiezi have to do with how maps SHOULD be made? Don't build a concept off of ONE person. You have to think in a more wider range than "the pros". If you try to build something out of bad concepts or using "idols" to make a point, you're not going to get far.

Why can't we make challenging maps for the pros?

What does Cookiezi have to do with how maps SHOULD be made? Don't build a concept off of ONE person. It is just like what I said. Also, whoever said CTB maps are NOT FCable should take a lot of time to study their concept before saying something like that. If CTB maps are going to be non-FCable, then I might as well use ninja spinners to destroy people in standard, or use extreme speeds to make Taiko too hard, and even do sliders that overlap themselfs because "it looks good". Seriously, sometimes the idea of what a "pro" is can get overrated and out of hand to the point we forget about those that can't play as well. osu! shouldn't be a game exclusive to highly skilled players.

And like I said, if you try to build a concept of getting CTB rankable using "idol/pro" players as an excuse to make it rankable, you're NOT going to get far. Start thinking outside that box at least.

WHY do you want it ranable?

HOW will it work?

WHAT guidelines will support this?

Questions like that you need to sit and think through before blurting out answers that will only make the suggestion more unreasonable.

Can someone explain with sensible logic why CTB is easier than the other two modes? Because I fail to see this point.. and it seems a rather important point for supporting CTB difficulties.

whymeman wrote:

WHY do you want it ranable?
Because especially on high difficulties, osu! maps don't translate into awesome CtB maps most of the time. While low difficulties usually work decently, many insane osu! maps are way too easy in CtB (heck, even I can beat most insanes and I'm hopelessly bad at CtB lol) and in other cases there is often the issue with impossible patterns (read the posts in this thread about hyperdash fruits and pixel jumps). Also, many patterns that work well in CtB are unrankable/feel awkward in osu!
It's similar to Taiko, where osu! diffs do not usually translate into good Taiko diffs.

HOW will it work?
What exactly do you mean?

WHAT guidelines will support this?
That's what is (or was) being discussed in this thread. If you take a look at the OP, there is a huge list with suggestions and many posts after that add to or discuss these guidelines in order to guarantee maps of rankable quality. For example, there has been quite some analysis on how to avoid impossible patterns like can be found in some osu! -> CtB transitions. Or suggestions on difficulty settings. Guidlines on the use of sliders etc.
I really don't understand why you ask about what guidelines would be used in a thread dedicated to exactly that topic where simply reading the OP already answers this question almost completely...

@KRZY: Why would anyone need to prove that CtB is "easier" to justify CtB-only diffs? Taiko has rankable diffs as well and they didn't need to prove that their game is "easier". It's simply a matter of if or if not maps translate well from osu! - and that's often not the case with CtB. The simple fact that impossible patterns can occur is almost reason enough IMHO

Nice suggestions. and i like where this thread is going~

_Void_ wrote:

whymeman wrote:

WHY do you want it ranable?
Because especially on high difficulties, osu! maps don't translate into awesome CtB maps most of the time. While low difficulties usually work decently, many insane osu! maps are way too easy in CtB (heck, even I can beat most insanes and I'm hopelessly bad at CtB lol) and in other cases there is often the issue with impossible patterns (read the posts in this thread about hyperdash fruits and pixel jumps). Also, many patterns that work well in CtB are unrankable/feel awkward in osu!
It's similar to Taiko, where osu! diffs do not usually translate into good Taiko diffs.

HOW will it work?
What exactly do you mean?

WHAT guidelines will support this?
That's what is (or was) being discussed in this thread. If you take a look at the OP, there is a huge list with suggestions and many posts after that add to or discuss these guidelines in order to guarantee maps of rankable quality. For example, there has been quite some analysis on how to avoid impossible patterns like can be found in some osu! -> CtB transitions. Or suggestions on difficulty settings. Guidlines on the use of sliders etc.
I really don't understand why you ask about what guidelines would be used in a thread dedicated to exactly that topic where simply reading the OP already answers this question almost completely...

@Void:
For the what part I'm sure whymeman is asking something quite different then what you just said.

for the how part i dont/t quite understand either.

and for your stated why part. That has been stated at least 50 times in this thread already.

OnosakiHito wrote:

Sakura Hana wrote:

So basically you want CTB rankable so you can make insane jumps?

You should allready understand that this isn't the importand point at all.

Sakura Hana wrote:

Even now there's rarely any Taiko maps that catter new Taiko players, and you want CTB to be rankable, to make even MORE insane CTB maps eh?

To be honest, where is the meaning/logic of making easy maps, if the maps are allready easy when you are playing in your play-mode the osu! maps, "eh?"

The only problem i see with that taiko issue Sakura Hana is the "who wants to actually make a guest taiko futsuu?"
Most taiko mappers like myself try to go all out with sensible logic of don kat patterns.

Same could go for CTB.
No one wants to make an easy one.