Taiko ScoreV2 Discussion

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5urface
For me the finisher display bug still persists. While being able to get the hit and score of the two button Finisher it displays and shows up in the stats at the end of the song as Finisher only if I hit both notes on the same frame (which at 2000 fps isn't happening often).
Finisher bug on end screen

Kiai time is still being ignored - Why is that?

Drumrolls with the removed notelock are actually fun to play and with that removed making them hitobjects is actually balanced so no issues here.

I still need more time to see if HP is balanced

The miss on Finishers needs to go though. 4x score should be enough reason to play them properly.
Conor
finishers for some reason can be 300'd in 2 different ways. they're kinda like 300/MAX notes on mania but on taiko you get awarded with the same points for both outcomes. this is how it works in scorev1 and i'm guessing that's how it works in scorev2 because i can't think of anything that would change it.

i believe it has something to do with the ms difference between your 2 key presses. if you hit them close enough to each other you get a MAX hit instead.
5urface

Conor wrote:

finishers for some reason can be 300'd in 2 different ways. they're kinda like 300/MAX notes on mania but on taiko you get awarded with the same points for both outcomes. this is how it works in scorev1 and i'm guessing that's how it works in scorev2 because i can't think of anything that would change it.

i believe it has something to do with the ms difference between your 2 key presses. if you hit them close enough to each other you get a MAX hit instead.
I actually investigated this a while back, within a hit window of about +-15ms you get the Finisher hit awarded without it showing as a real Finisher on screen and in stats. For me it only awards the real Finisher hit if I hit both notes on the same frame which is framerate dependant and therefore stupid. When I limited my framerate to 120 fps I could consistently hit Finishers that showed up in stats as well.
Loctav
Resolution scaling is having the sideeffect of altering the scroll speed on different resolutions, so I am currently trying to figure out a solution for that.

Kiai time/Go-Go time is currently not giving any benefits, but that might change. Let us figure out the bases first before we go into multipliers and other elements.

The display bug on fnishers, I dunno, it seem to be gone but now it is back, so I am a bit puzzled. But at least it is registering the input and doesn't break combo in case of it showing just the normal hit.

I am not sure about HP, I feel that right now it is not scaling properly, being way too easy as of currently.

HDHR turns out to be pretty easy once you play the fixed version, so I might consider buffing HR to be really worth to be on par with DT, because right now, HDHR is just cheap in comparison to DT. (as in, DT demands way more for the same score bonus, e.g. in terms of hit window)
Gezoda
Is there a rounding error on per-note score?
Map composition: 873 circles (a few big notes, but they're not the question), 0 slider, 0 spinner.



Edit: I think I know what caused the +159 points:


Side note, I don't know if this is just me, but the scrolling speed was faster. Is this the inception of ratio-based scrolling speed scale?

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About big notes, have you considered that not every player has keyboards that register big notes (either perfectly or with the delay)? I mean, having misses due to having hardware that don't register big notes correctly should not be acceptable in tournament setting, as this passively tells "have a correct keyboard to play". I see no one willing to do that in the middle of a tournament, and even less if they're too young.

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Conor
whoa you're right about the low frame rate

i always thought the display was based off ms difference because auto plays with a hit error of +/- 0.00 and gets perfect hits on them all

i can agree with the HP being too easy right now

the fixed HDHR is simply HD with higher OD (but DT should have a higher score multiplier than HDHR imo)
k3v227

Loctav wrote:

HDHR turns out to be pretty easy once you play the fixed version, so I might consider buffing HR to be really worth to be on par with DT, because right now, HDHR is just cheap in comparison to DT. (as in, DT demands way more for the same score bonus, e.g. in terms of hit window)
Perhaps HDHR could have x1.1 instead of x1.12?
karterfreak
We discovered a bug (visual) where non frame perfect finisher hits will give +2 combo instead of +1. Frame perfect finishers will give +1 as expected. Score isn't affected as far as I can tell.

Might be related to visual bug about finisher score / hit graphic not being displayed correctly if not hit frame perfect (including result screen display having the same issue)
Loctav


I already found out about that and requested a fix for it

scroll speed currently alters with used resolution, so we need to rethink this and make resolution stop having any impact on scroll speed or visible notes altogether.
frukoyurdakul
There is a SV change (well, less SV to be precise) happening at the end of the sliders (drum rolls). I think it's not intentional and needs to be fixed.
karterfreak
Doesn't it kinda make sense for higher resolutions to have a faster scroll if you're aiming for them to have identical amount of notes on the screen? 16:9 is obviously wider than 4:3 so 16:9 notes should scroll faster shouldn't they? What are you guys aiming to do here?

Also sliders visibly slow down at the end now.

edit: ninja'd by frukoyurdakul

edit x 2: SLIDERS SLOWING DOWN IS ALSO HAPPENING IN SCOREV1
_yu68
Isn't scroll speed changing intended?

I think same scroll speed as 4:3 should be applied even at 16:9 resolution.
5urface

_yu68 wrote:

Is scroll speed changing not intended?

I think same scroll speed as 4:3 should be applied even at 16:9 resolution.
That would be unfair for 4:3 screen users as they would see less notes at the same time and it would be horribly unfair on higher SV
Same scroll speed on different screen aspect ratios could only be achieved if the length of the taiko bar was limited on wider resolutions.

I think the double hit finisher/not registering as real finisher bug happens as follows: Taiko registers a hit on a finisher immediately as the first button is pressed. If the second button is pressed on the same frame it registers as proper finisher. If the second button is pressed later but still within the acceptable time frame, it will add another hit, add the score of the second hit and internally count the finisher as hit by two buttons. But as the finisher was already registered as not being hit with two, but one button it wont revert that.
To fix this you would have to change how hit registration works on finishers, only registering the single/double button press after the 30ms timeframe for successfully hitting both buttons has passed.

Currently hitting the finisher buttons on different frames also seems to award more points:

Auto SS score with perfect finishers
My SS score with finisher hits on different frames
_yu68

5urface wrote:

That would be unfair for 4:3 screen users as they would see less notes at the same time and it would be horribly unfair on higher SV
Same scroll speed on different screen aspect ratios could only be achieved if the length of the taiko bar was limited on wider resolutions.
Can't players change resolution by option?

The disadvantage by 4:3 monitor is like the disadvantage by pc specs.
Should not restrict 16:9 players due to such problems.

Osu!taiko models "Taiko no Tatsujin", 16:9 scroll is closest to it.
So osu!taiko should follow with it.

To maintain fairness, It is best to slow 4:3 scroll on scorev 2 with 16:9 scroll as reference.
Nwolf
osu!taiko is not Taiko no Tatsujin. It doesn't have to follow it and scorev2 is a step in the direction of REALLY not following TnT mechanics.
_yu68
Anyway, I think it's better to slow 4:3 scroll speed
XK2238
played for a bit, can confirm


1. result totals show correctly despite combo screwing up. I'm not seeing how the finishers are 4x worth though; for example, in the first screenshot, regular notes were worth 1200~1350, while finishers had only around 2000 or 2200 (the first note being a finisher had ~1300, wat). Also, the >1m thing.
2. kiai time still has its +20% absent.
3. HR is slower now! E.g. in 4:3 reso, the circles would still overlap a bit on the borders, compared to being exactly adjacent like it was before. Haven't looked at 16:9 reso, but some people say it's relatively even slower than in 4:3, although very slightly. Also, HD visibility area got scaled along with the reso width?

there's most likely more to be found along the way, but so far it's going pretty well. Isn't it nice to have the same on-screen time of notes across different widths though? I mean, widescreen has been quite overpowered in non-HD/HR ever since the widescreen update back in late 2012 or early 2013.

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alright, go on
Loctav
yeah, but right now you can factually shift your scroll speed with resolution, which sort of makes HR and HD trivial. We are revising our changes here.
Bramble
HDHR turns out to be pretty easy once you play the fixed version, so I might consider buffing HR to be really worth to be on par with DT, because right now, HDHR is just cheap in comparison to DT. (as in, DT demands way more for the same score bonus, e.g. in terms of hit window)
Other than the part where HDHR is cheap in comparison to DT, this statement just genuinely confuses me :? What do you mean by "buffing HR to be really worth to be on par with DT"?

EDIT:
Upon completion of a drum roll, a miss will be given if the player has hit less than 15% of the ticks, a 100 will be given if the player has hit between 15% and 30% of the ticks, and a miss will be given if the player has hit more than 30% of the ticks.
"and a miss will be given if the player has hit more than 30% of the ticks" Please tell me this is a typo -w-
karterfreak
So something that should be pointed out...

Scrolling differences per mod
Nomod = ScoreV2 is faster
DT = ScoreV2 is faster
HR = ScoreV1 is slightly faster?

All three of these should be unchanged from V1 if you based things off 16:9 and rescaled them to 4:3 (to make up for 4:3's smaller width). What we have now with ScoreV2 is Nomod and DT both being harder while HR got easier. Kinda throws the balance of the mods out of whack a little bit.

On the positive side of things... OHGODYESTHANKYOUFORHDHRPLSMAKEAVAILABLEINSCOREV1ASAPKTHX.
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