N0thingSpecial wrote:

B1rd you're arguing for the sake of arguing

it's a real honor to meet you sherlock, i loved ur books

N0thingSpecial wrote:

B1rd you're arguing for the sake of arguing

Oh wait that's what mapping drama is supposed to be my bad

No.

I just try and convey my point about things I have thought for years.

Ephemeral wrote:

N0thingSpecial wrote:

B1rd you're arguing for the sake of arguing

it's a real honor to meet you sherlock, i loved ur books

Dafuq u just say u lil bitch, just because you have your fancy yellow name u think u can talk shit to me, fite me and my katana collection

:^)-type is no match for my impeccable candour

B1rd wrote:

Garven wrote:

I see lazy people are still crying over not wanting to cater to a wider audience with their maps. People never change.

Cater to a wider audience, also known as dumb down. It's good that certain niches can be filled by certain maps, not everything has to be for everyone.

Adding easier difficulties isn't dumbing down a mapset. Also remember this is a game, so the ranked section isn't really made for art projects and the ranking criteria was designed around that.

So if you want your mapset to join the ranked group, meet the established criteria. If you want to show off your art project, it's fine to leave it in the other map sections. People can still download and experience it.

Garven wrote:

If you want to show off your art project

"art project" is so demeaning compared to "work of art". It's almost offensive

Art is just an analogy. What I'm really talking about is maps that are good for a variety of reasons, not just how 'artistic' they are. What you are doing is making a distinguishment between good mapsets, and mapsets that are 'acceptable' to be ranked. Like I was saying, you seem to prefer mapsets that seem to come off of a factory line. It's not that mappers are being 'lazy', it's the simple fact that resources aren't infinite, and heaping a bunch of unnecessary work that mappers have to do to get their mapset ranked will inevitably reduce the amount of truly good mapsets.

So in the end, you are dumbing down the game by forcing the redistribution of time and effort onto making easy difficulties. You have yet to justify why every single mapset needs to have low difficulties. And I have already at length explained why this is unnecessary. And in my mind, tacking on easy difficulties reduces the appeal of naturally hard songs and mapsets. Yes this is a game, but what games allow you to fight super easy versions of the final boss at stage one? You can play games on easy mode or hard mode, and in osu! there are mods that emulate this by increasing or decreasing difficulty. In games there are easy stages and hard stages, and is osu! there are easy and slow songs, and fast intense songs. Slow songs don't need to be hard, and hard songs don't need to be easy.

I'm not saying that there shouldn't be easy maps, or that mappers should be able to get away with ranking a mapset with one or two 6* diffs in a tv-size anime map. I'm saying that hard mapsets should be able to stay hard, and easy ones can stay easy. We don't need to tack on undermapped maps that don't follow the music and aren't very good. Instead, mapsets should be ranked based on their own quality, as judged by humans, rather than following a rigid and uncompromising set of rules that are more detrimental than not.

Also, concerning unranked maps: if we're being real, one of the biggest driving forces for mappers to map is to have their maps get attention and be played. For the most part, they don't get this in the unranked section. It'd be like an artist having to keep their pictures in a dark basement instead of being previewed at an art gallery. And don't get on to me about the loved section, the loved section is more of challenge maps, gimmicky maps etc., rather than maps that deserve to be ranked.

B1rd wrote:

Art is just an analogy. What I'm really talking about is maps that are good for a variety of reasons, not just how 'artistic' they are. What you are doing is making a distinguishment between good mapsets, and mapsets that are 'acceptable' to be ranked. Like I was saying, You seem to prefer mapsets that seem to come off of a factory line. It's not that mappers are being 'lazy', it's the simple fact that resources aren't infinite, and heaping a bunch of unnecessary work that mappers have to do to get their mapset ranked will inevitably reduce the amount of truly good mapsets.

So in the end, you are dumbing down the game by forcing the redistribution of time and effort onto making easy difficulties. You have yet to justify why every single mapset Needs to have low difficulties. And I have already at length explained why this is unnecessary. And in my mind, tacking on easy difficulties reduces the appeal of naturally hard songs and mapsets. Yes this is a game, but what games allow you to fight super easy versions of the final boss at stage one? You can play games on easy mode or hard mode, and in osu! there are mods that emulate this by increasing or decreasing difficulty. In games there are easy stages and hard stages, and is osu! there are easy and slow songs, and fast intense songs. Slow songs don't need to be hard, and hard songs don't need to be easy.

So, I'm not saying that there shouldn't be easy maps, or that mappers should be able to get away with ranking a mapset with one or two 6* diffs in a tv-size anime map. I'm saying that hard mapsets should be ableTo stay hard, and easy ones can stay easy. We don't need to tack on undermapped maps that don't follow the music and aren't very good. Instead, mapsets should be ranked based on their own quality, as judged by humans, rather than following a rigid and uncompromising set of rules that do more harm than good.

Also, Concerning unranked maps: if we're being real, one of the biggest driving forces for mappers to map is to have their maps get attention and be played. For tHe most part, they don't get this in the unranked section. It'd be like an artIst having to keep their pictures in a dark basement instead of being previewed at an art gaLLery. And don't get on to me about the loved section, the loved section is more of challenge maps, gimmicky maps etc., rather than maps that deserve to be ranked.

This is OT, not Parliament,Flap your wings and just cchhhiiilllll

If you don't have anything of value to say, don't say anything at all. I don't need you commenting every time I say something serious.

B1rd wrote:

If you don't have anything of value to say, don't say anything at all. I don't need you commenting every time I say something serious.

Ahh ok

B1rd wrote:

Yes this is a game, but what games allow you to fight super easy versions of the final boss at stage one?

Virtually every single rhythm game ever.



The full spread emulates other rhythm games to appeal to people coming in from other games.

EDIT: Here's the Challenge chart for comparison.

B1rd if every mapper has your mindset I think we won't have as many great mapsets ranked. The mapper's intention is give the song exposure and give the community their interpretation of a song in the form of circles and sliders, presumably we would want to give our best for rank, so why only map one difficulty that would only fit a certain people at a certain skill level? Why can't we just do it for the song? Why can't we just do it for the community? Like I don't know if you've experienced this, but when I started playing osu! I tried to find an easier map to a song that has only one difficulty, and there was non cause of the marathon thing, and no one bothered to map a hard diff for it, so I had to forget about this one song which I really like, improve as a player then enjoy the song and the map for what it is later. the process itself was satisfying but why can't the process be me finding out this 5 minutes long song has a full spread, and as I improve I get to enjoy and more accurate interpretation of the song?

not trying to justify the current ranking criteria for mapping spread (tagent but seriously song length for ranking as marathon maps should vary with BPM as higher bpm has more objects it's just common sense), but from a perspective of a mapper that actually gives a shit about the community this spread thing wouldn't be an actual problem. I personally think of it like this "I like this song very much and I think the community should enjoy this, I will map this to cater to as much people as possible while staying true to the song"

B1rd wrote:

For the most part, they don't get this in the unranked section.

??

Good maps do get attention, see the number of favorites or being in the Loved section
Bad maps do not get attention and stays unknown.


I am unsure where did you pull that off.

Garven wrote:

If you want to show off your art project, it's fine to leave it in the other map sections. People can still download and experience it.

So what you're saying is to leave your art projects in another map, like so p/3575250 xD.

But yeah, find the target niche for your art project and just advertise the map to them. They're probably the ones who will give you the praise you want (In short, I bother Garven about my art projects). Ranking rarely gives you much more than a public scoreboard, and an easier way to download your map.

are you really creating mapping drama in the thread that's supposed to list out mapping dramas

hello i think you're missing the point

B1rd wrote:

If you don't have anything of value to say, don't say anything at all.

If only you practiced what you preach

Okorin wrote:

are you really creating mapping drama in the thread that's supposed to list out mapping dramas

hello i think you're missing the point

No,no this is perfect. It's what OT is truly about

abraker wrote:

Okorin wrote:

are you really creating mapping drama in the thread that's supposed to list out mapping dramas

hello i think you're missing the point

No,no this is perfect. It's what OT is truly about

it's so perfect i even stump people

wait..

alright forgot that ot has no point, carry on

So even QAT browse this sick forum at times

sometimes it's fun to get dirty


also b1rd is fucking nuts, i personally feel having lower diffs is great as a requirement but can get weird when you have to significantly change what the music is doing to cater to a weaker playerbase (but this is a problem mostly unique to the weird-ass shit you occasionally see like neurofunk and breakcore)

Shiirn wrote:

sometimes it's fun to get dirty

Especially with kids
mud fights yeah

Get in the van and I'll show you real fun

report: N0thingSpecial

reason: HES NOTHING SPECIAL

I am hoping moddingV2 will be interesting enough for me to get on the modding train for a longer time. I did a modding queue before, but I started to care less and less. It's not that it was too much work. Not that it was too time consuming; I could knock off 3 maps of the queue in an hour. It's just that it became to repeatative. It was starting to be a chore. Go into the thread, pick a map, download a map, play the map, judge the map, go into editor, fix the map, post the fix on the forums, rinse, and repeat. This is why I accept mod requests by chat only now. At least I can shake it up by talking to people this way, hopefully more than just about modding, and not just receive a kudoso, "thanks", reasons they are not applying my mod, and/or nothing at all.

Also a lot less people are willing to do modding via chat, which takes the load off me, but unfortunately it's far less than I thought.

Anxient wrote:

report: N0thingSpecial

reason: HES NOTHING SPECIAL

I LITERALLY DIED

Okorin wrote:

are you really creating mapping drama in the thread that's supposed to list out mapping dramas

hello i think you're missing the point

time to link this thread in the opening post.

Mapping dramaception

not really a follower of osu drama but im surprised this one's not on the list or is it? i remember that one had like a meteor-like impact back then

it is now

on topic, close to it

t/475012/start=0

Saturnalize wrote:

on topic, close to it

t/475012/start=0

translation of him being angry over this dq

"waaaa i wanted this rank, oh it got dq'd, fuck you all im quitting, cya next xmas haha"

when it literally is just a simple fix of maybe a difficulty added between hard and normal and the last two diffs are overmapped

i rated that map a 0

ColdTooth wrote:

Saturnalize wrote:

on topic, close to it

t/475012/start=0

translation of him being angry over this dq

"waaaa i wanted this rank, oh it got dq'd, fuck you all im quitting, cya next xmas haha"

when it literally is just a simple fix of maybe a difficulty added between hard and normal and the last two diffs are overmapped

i rated that map a 0

very true

I hate that kind of "mapper" who can't even make a proper diff spread but whines about DQ and pretend that it's not his fault, attentionwhoring every possible "fanboy" to spam *aww poor you hope it gets requalified soon* on their map thread

Saturnalize wrote:

on topic, close to it

t/475012/start=0

8 difficulties... each 4 minutes long... complaints about spread...

I know we need maps for novices, like said before, but mapping out 32 minutes total and having said to go add another 4 minutes that is between normal and hard would be like beating a that person's legs with a hammer because that person was 2 inches out of single file.

abraker wrote:

Saturnalize wrote:

on topic, close to it

t/475012/start=0

8 difficulties... each 4 minutes long... complaints about spread...

I know we need maps for novices, like said before, but mapping out 32 minutes total and having said to go add another 4 minutes that is between normal and hard would be like beating a that person's legs with a hammer because that person was 2 inches out of single file.

Tfw you had to run 5000 cus your clothes were sticking out slightly

abraker wrote:

Saturnalize wrote:

on topic, close to it

t/475012/start=0

8 difficulties... each 4 minutes long... complaints about spread...

I know we need maps for novices, like said before, but mapping out 32 minutes total and having said to go add another 4 minutes that is between normal and hard would be like beating a that person's legs with a hammer because that person was 2 inches out of single file.

They're free to remove at least two difficulties, up to five. We don't need dozen of Expert Difficulties either, where only a small number of users can play them properly. typical mapper shit

Stefan wrote:

They're free to remove at least two difficulties, up to five. We don't need dozen of Expert Difficulties either, where only a small number of users can play them properly. typical mapper shit

The only agreeable statement so far related to the recent link.

Also
effort to make shithard map =/= effort to make evenly distributed map

But
effort to make shithard map < effort to make evenly distributed map

I appreciate one who make ENHIX mapset rather than NHIXXXXXX
this is why we have more drama every year

Which feels soooooooo goooood

Stefan wrote:

Tell me, genius, how does having a lot of extra diffs negatively impact a mapset? Are you worried your precious casual players won't be able to find the easy diffs if there are too many?

I remember Mr. Color saying that mapsets should only have one map of each difficulty. Typical mod behaviour, they love enforcing completely pointless rules, probably just to be an annoyance.

Saturnalize wrote:

I appreciate one who make ENHIX mapset rather than NHIXXXXXX
this is why we have more drama every year

Actually I second this motion. I would have not done more diffs than required to avoid the pointless work if I needed to remove a diff or shift the spread around. If I wanted to make a specific diff and rank it, I would need to make a spread up until that diff and be done with it.

Though personally I would care more about the quality of that single diff I want to make than the rest of the mapset, but that's just me.


Uhhh ehhh what I meant to say... it's the mapper's mapset. The mapper wants to cater towards more pro players. So let be it. Jeez, it's not like the extra X diffs make them magically worse, right?

p/5794052

Was wondering when somebody will attempt to rank plagiarism

abraker wrote:

https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/p/5794052

Was wondering when somebody will attempt to rank plagiarism

I'm starting to think about quitting from this game again because the community isn't what I thought it was anymore. Everyone isn't being nice to one another, and they're all bashing at each other, either because of "competition" or their rudeness.

There's a reason why I stopped playing back in early 2015, mapping and playing jumped in difficulty, and school hitting me on one end of the perspective wasn't really helping me either. I've been having extreme difficulties trying to rank a map after my last map, which was back in late 2014. Sure, I've had a few gds in between that and today, like Gero's last christmas a few months ago, but I want to try and rank a map myself. Is it maybe I'm not finding the right people or does noone like my mapping style. I don't know this.

But enough of that small rant, this has nothing to do about me.

Saturnalize wrote:

Stefan wrote:

They're free to remove at least two difficulties, up to five. We don't need dozen of Expert Difficulties either, where only a small number of users can play them properly. typical mapper shit

The only agreeable statement so far related to the recent link.

Also
effort to make shithard map =/= effort to make evenly distributed map

But
effort to make shithard map < effort to make evenly distributed map

I appreciate one who make ENHIX mapset rather than NHIXXXXXX
this is why we have more drama every year

Which feels soooooooo goooood

Yeah right here. I third this motion, as it is so fucking annoying to see a normal difficulty at 1.94*, a hard around 3*, an insane around 4.7* and then millions of expert difficulties over 6* that not a lot of people can play. That's cool that people love to map these, but you have to have fucking diversity. And I've been seeing so many shitmaps in the past 2 years that it's starting to make me think more about our community. We can't just forgot quality.

Saturnalize wrote:

ColdTooth wrote:

translation of him being angry over this dq

"waaaa i wanted this rank, oh it got dq'd, fuck you all im quitting, cya next xmas haha"

when it literally is just a simple fix of maybe a difficulty added between hard and normal and the last two diffs are overmapped

i rated that map a 0

very true

I hate that kind of "mapper" who can't even make a proper diff spread but whines about DQ and pretend that it's not his fault, attentionwhoring every possible "fanboy" to spam *aww poor you hope it gets requalified soon* on their map thread

I don't know anything about fanboys because out of 3 maps and a few gds, I have none lol. I just map and play for fun. But yeah, it's like everyone has their favorite mapper, and whenever they see the map dq'd, they're all like "please requalify this! this is the best map!" on every one of their maps. If this is how people rank their maps, then I guess I'm not getting any map ranked in the future.

I went a little too serious in off-topic, but this thread is ok for that.