close enough, was just making a point.
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how do you guys think about new DT system ?
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He Ang Erika wrote:
All I'm saying is DT requires incredibly fast reading across all modes except Mania because the scroll speed can be adjusted, therefore it doesn't deserve such a huge boost in pp reward as we are seeing now. Note density is irrelevant because DT increases the note density by the same percentage in every mode, it is not unique to Mania. However the ability to change "AR" to anything you prefer is unique to Mania, and it is undeniably an objective advantage when playing DT. In my opinion DT should only offer full pp-boost when the option "Scroll speed follows song BPM" is enabled.
Basically the main purposes of DoubleTime is to
1. Reduce minimum reaction time,
2. Increase input frequency/agility,
3. Increase accuracy requirements.
Mania lacks point (1) due to flexible adjustment of scroll speed, therefore DT bonus should be nerfed, but not removed because it provides point (2) & (3).
So technically if it gives about 2/3 of what it gives now, it will be more reasonable.
I guess at least he tried - no need to shit on him too hard
Besides, you can already see his inexperience in the mode
Besides, you can already see his inexperience in the mode
Can we direct our attention to thisShoegazer wrote:
Definitely a step in the right direction, though I think reducing the exponential curve of SR is also integral to band-aiding the PP formula for now. I feel that 850K should achieve about 75% of the maximum StrainBase (not directly PP, but it's a very major component of it anyway) and 925K for 90%.abraker wrote:
A step in the right direction, but tripped over its own feet and needs to get up. We also saw this bump from a mile away when we asked for this on the Feature Request subforum. Obviously the next step is to fix SR, but I don't that will come soon enough. Imo, the quick fix to this is to just make the score to pp curve steeper for now. While it won't fix underrated/overrated maps, it should fix players getting huge pp with unacceptable acc.
This leads to the following question(s):
Around what score/% would it be reasonable to achieve about 3/4 or of max pp on a map and 9/10 of max pp on a map?
(I'm currently fiddling with some numbers to properly scale StrainBase vs. SR and also StrainBase% and score, it looks fine for now but I probably need some practical tests first too)
StrainBase% vs Score formula should be dependent on the map.Shoegazer wrote:
Definitely a step in the right direction, though I think reducing the exponential curve of SR is also integral to band-aiding the PP formula for now. I feel that 850K should achieve about 75% of the maximum StrainBase (not directly PP, but it's a very major component of it anyway) and 925K for 90%.abraker wrote:
A step in the right direction, but tripped over its own feet and needs to get up. We also saw this bump from a mile away when we asked for this on the Feature Request subforum. Obviously the next step is to fix SR, but I don't that will come soon enough. Imo, the quick fix to this is to just make the score to pp curve steeper for now. While it won't fix underrated/overrated maps, it should fix players getting huge pp with unacceptable acc.
This leads to the following question(s):
Around what score/% would it be reasonable to achieve about 3/4 or of max pp on a map and 9/10 of max pp on a map?
(I'm currently fiddling with some numbers to properly scale StrainBase vs. SR and also StrainBase% and score, it looks fine for now but I probably need some practical tests first too)
For example:
Map A: A Marathon map that is relatively easy for the most part, except for 4 hard sections that have about 10% of the notes in total.
Map B: A cut of the previous map, only taking one of the hard sections.
Because most of Map A is easy, it's easy to get a relatively high score (~900k), but getting more than that requires much more skill, since it requires playing the hard parts properly; getting a near-perfect score is very hard.
In Map B, getting 900K requires considerably more skill than in map A (no easy parts to get easy score on), but getting a near-perfect score is slightly easier than in Map A. Getting a very low score shouldn't be rated high, since the map is so short it's likely to hit a relatively big portion of the notes by lucky mashing.
The score vs pp curve of the maps could look like this:
This is actually the most effective and sensible way to go at it and should be implemented immediately are u guys memeingHe Ang Erika wrote:
All I'm saying is DT requires incredibly fast reading across all modes except Mania because the scroll speed can be adjusted, therefore it doesn't deserve such a huge boost in pp reward as we are seeing now. Note density is irrelevant because DT increases the note density by the same percentage in every mode, it is not unique to Mania. However the ability to change "AR" to anything you prefer is unique to Mania, and it is undeniably an objective advantage when playing DT. In my opinion DT should only offer full pp-boost when the option "Scroll speed follows song BPM" is enabled.
Basically the main purposes of DoubleTime is to
1. Reduce minimum reaction time,
2. Increase input frequency/agility,
3. Increase accuracy requirements.
Mania lacks point (1) due to flexible adjustment of scroll speed, therefore DT bonus should be nerfed, but not removed because it provides point (2) & (3).
So technically if it gives about 2/3 of what it gives now, it will be more reasonable.
Erlkonig wrote:
This is actually the most effective and sensible way to go at it and should be implemented immediately are u guys memeingHe Ang Erika wrote:
All I'm saying is DT requires incredibly fast reading across all modes except Mania because the scroll speed can be adjusted, therefore it doesn't deserve such a huge boost in pp reward as we are seeing now. Note density is irrelevant because DT increases the note density by the same percentage in every mode, it is not unique to Mania. However the ability to change "AR" to anything you prefer is unique to Mania, and it is undeniably an objective advantage when playing DT. In my opinion DT should only offer full pp-boost when the option "Scroll speed follows song BPM" is enabled.
Basically the main purposes of DoubleTime is to
1. Reduce minimum reaction time,
2. Increase input frequency/agility,
3. Increase accuracy requirements.
Mania lacks point (1) due to flexible adjustment of scroll speed, therefore DT bonus should be nerfed, but not removed because it provides point (2) & (3).
So technically if it gives about 2/3 of what it gives now, it will be more reasonable.
Im done i think people like those Two just inside of the stuff are one of the major Point wy mania cant move forward! at least i got a few requests to help people with o2jam xD im not alone under a bunch of asians any more :3
That's the best way to go if SR isn't fixed, yeah. I assumed that the spikiness will be accommodated for in a future revision of SR and the PP formula will be modified in response to that, which is why I didn't consider it.Full Tablet wrote:
For example:
Map A: A Marathon map that is relatively easy for the most part, except for 4 hard sections that have about 10% of the notes in total.
Map B: A cut of the previous map, only taking one of the hard sections.
Because most of Map A is easy, it's easy to get a relatively high score (~900k), but getting more than that requires much more skill, since it requires playing the hard parts properly; getting a near-perfect score is very hard.
In Map B, getting 900K requires considerably more skill than in map A (no easy parts to get easy score on), but getting a near-perfect score is slightly easier than in Map A. Getting a very low score shouldn't be rated high, since the map is so short it's likely to hit a relatively big portion of the notes by lucky mashing.
The score vs pp curve of the maps could look like this:
Full Tablet wrote:
StrainBase% vs Score formula should be dependent on the map.Shoegazer wrote:
Definitely a step in the right direction, though I think reducing the exponential curve of SR is also integral to band-aiding the PP formula for now. I feel that 850K should achieve about 75% of the maximum StrainBase (not directly PP, but it's a very major component of it anyway) and 925K for 90%.
(I'm currently fiddling with some numbers to properly scale StrainBase vs. SR and also StrainBase% and score, it looks fine for now but I probably need some practical tests first too)
For example:
Map A: A Marathon map that is relatively easy for the most part, except for 4 hard sections that have about 10% of the notes in total.
Map B: A cut of the previous map, only taking one of the hard sections.
Because most of Map A is easy, it's easy to get a relatively high score (~900k), but getting more than that requires much more skill, since it requires playing the hard parts properly; getting a near-perfect score is very hard.
In Map B, getting 900K requires considerably more skill than in map A (no easy parts to get easy score on), but getting a near-perfect score is slightly easier than in Map A. Getting a very low score shouldn't be rated high, since the map is so short it's likely to hit a relatively big portion of the notes by lucky mashing.
The score vs pp curve of the maps could look like this:
Combine this with the SR pp rewards spread April put on twitter and it should be big step into the right direction
I love youRedon wrote:
You guys all seem to assume there are people in charge of mania development who are interested in putting actual effort into improving the mode in ways that don't involve porting over ideas from standard
why isn't this thread closed alreadyHe Ang Erika wrote:
All I'm saying is DT requires incredibly fast reading across all modes except Mania because the scroll speed can be adjusted, therefore it doesn't deserve such a huge boost in pp reward as we are seeing now. Note density is irrelevant because DT increases the note density by the same percentage in every mode, it is not unique to Mania. However the ability to change "AR" to anything you prefer is unique to Mania, and it is undeniably an objective advantage when playing DT. In my opinion DT should only offer full pp-boost when the option "Scroll speed follows song BPM" is enabled.
Basically the main purposes of DoubleTime is to
1. Reduce minimum reaction time,
2. Increase input frequency/agility,
3. Increase accuracy requirements.
Mania lacks point (1) due to flexible adjustment of scroll speed, therefore DT bonus should be nerfed, but not removed because it provides point (2) & (3).
So technically if it gives about 2/3 of what it gives now, it will be more reasonable.
Redon wrote:
You guys all seem to assume there are people in charge of mania development who are interested in putting actual effort into improving the mode in ways that don't involve porting over ideas from standard
TBH I sorta understand the staff's want to make mania more like other modes, it is all one game after all. Peppy said this in a tweet IIRC.
they're just wrong lol
ng? it's osu!mania you know? what's so weird?
I'm sure the guy who said
was joking too, no one can be that dumb. Since dev team doesn't listen to anyone and are bent on making this mode something like std on keys why are you guys still trying to keep on with the salty attitude.He Ang Erika wrote:
All I'm saying is DT requires incredibly fast reading across all modes except Mania because the scroll speed can be adjusted, therefore it doesn't deserve such a huge boost in pp reward as we are seeing now. Note density is irrelevant because DT increases the note density by the same percentage in every mode, it is not unique to Mania. However the ability to change "AR" to anything you prefer is unique to Mania, and it is undeniably an objective advantage when playing DT. In my opinion DT should only offer full pp-boost when the option "Scroll speed follows song BPM" is enabled.
I don't think being agressive about the dt is going to bring anything to those calling mania dead or straight up losing shit over it.
But at the same time, I gotta be honest, I don't expect any changes to be made, much less actually good ones.
This 3 years old sentence still fits perfectly to this day and that says a lot.
But at the same time, I gotta be honest, I don't expect any changes to be made, much less actually good ones.
This 3 years old sentence still fits perfectly to this day and that says a lot.
what are you doingHe Ang Erika wrote:
All I'm saying is DT requires incredibly fast reading across all modes except Mania because the scroll speed can be adjusted, therefore it doesn't deserve such a huge boost in pp reward as we are seeing now. Note density is irrelevant because DT increases the note density by the same percentage in every mode, it is not unique to Mania. However the ability to change "AR" to anything you prefer is unique to Mania, and it is undeniably an objective advantage when playing DT. In my opinion DT should only offer full pp-boost when the option "Scroll speed follows song BPM" is enabled.
Basically the main purposes of DoubleTime is to
1. Reduce minimum reaction time,
2. Increase input frequency/agility,
3. Increase accuracy requirements.
Mania lacks point (1) due to flexible adjustment of scroll speed, therefore DT bonus should be nerfed, but not removed because it provides point (2) & (3).
So technically if it gives about 2/3 of what it gives now, it will be more reasonable.
hihi pinecone
also guys, if you want to be heared by dev, might as well post at reddit? seems like it will get /more/ attention than at this thread too
also guys, if you want to be heared by dev, might as well post at reddit? seems like it will get /more/ attention than at this thread too
Not really, with fixed HR and fixed PP rewarding from SR, doing a DT + HR plays will be incredible hard even for top tier players, because of 2 things:juankristal wrote:
EDIT: Adding HR wont be even close to help this, as DT+HR plays will just be the same. Sure, it will be harder to smash into DT plays but still, it will just make it worse.
1. Passing a map will be already impossible for most of the players (HP10 on every map)
2. Even if you pass a map, doing a high score with that combination of mods will be extremely hard because of really tight timing windows.
"Farming" PP with that combination of mods will be nearly impossible on harder maps.
tbh this seems like the only way to get devs attention now.ArcherLove wrote:
also guys, if you want to be heared by dev, might as well post at reddit? seems like it will get /more/ attention than at this thread too
Anyways I don't see how getting DT the ability to give a pp boost is bad, I know that right now its broken and there shouldnt be this much of a pp boost but it gives the incentive to play mods more in one way or another. At least its different from all the same no mod plays that everyone has seem a million times imo.
this. idk why people bother. it's been clear since the beginning that o!m will always cater the already established osu!std community rather than the external vsrg community. and it's not like the dev team is a group of monkeys, it's a conscious decision. so trying to argue against it after all this time is as big a meme as the game itself.Redon wrote:
You guys all seem to assume there are people in charge of mania development who are interested in putting actual effort into improving the mode in ways that don't involve porting over ideas from standard
This sounds like Peppycpot wrote:
this. idk why people bother. it's been clear since the beginning that o!m will always cater the already established osu!std community rather than the external vsrg community. and it's not like the dev team is a group of monkeys, it's a conscious decision. so trying to argue against it after all this time is as big a meme as the game itself.Redon wrote:
You guys all seem to assume there are people in charge of mania development who are interested in putting actual effort into improving the mode in ways that don't involve porting over ideas from standard
We need some mania player devs over there.Redon wrote:
You guys all seem to assume there are people in charge of mania development who are interested in putting actual effort into improving the mode in ways that don't involve porting over ideas from standard
Interesting how reddit is becoming more effective than forums. For anyone who is good with coding, I also suggest to jump on the osu!dev bandwagon and start submitting pull requests as soon as they are up to implementing mania there.ArcherLove wrote:
also guys, if you want to be heared by dev, might as well post at reddit? seems like it will get /more/ attention than at this thread too
too long; didn't write:
I like the DT PP feature. Anything that allows better differentiation between player skill levels is a good thing when considering a ranking system. The caveat being that since DT bonus is reliant on SR, SR being broken as all hell means that DT will make those flaws that much more apparent.
And, as someone who'd been here since day 1:
I like the DT PP feature. Anything that allows better differentiation between player skill levels is a good thing when considering a ranking system. The caveat being that since DT bonus is reliant on SR, SR being broken as all hell means that DT will make those flaws that much more apparent.
And, as someone who'd been here since day 1:
This.-Kamikaze- wrote:
This 3 years old sentence still fits perfectly to this day and that says a lot.
I think it's a good idea, this way, 4k players have a chance to shine on the ranking ladder, and it makes "boring" maps (low star maps, low bpm maps, etc. Everyone have a different opinion of what it makes it "Boring") challenging again.
The bad side, it's that the PP system is broken of course, but also because of that, the greediness that every player has, it's what makes fun to rank again.
Still, most of the places every player have, it's going to stay relatively the same, unless you are kind of a DT monster or ET.
I started at 2.4k when the DT PP came up, and now im 2.3k, so there is no much difference.
The bad side, it's that the PP system is broken of course, but also because of that, the greediness that every player has, it's what makes fun to rank again.
Still, most of the places every player have, it's going to stay relatively the same, unless you are kind of a DT monster or ET.
I started at 2.4k when the DT PP came up, and now im 2.3k, so there is no much difference.
But you know that ranking at the current system is only about speed/vibro/stamina, both for 4k and 7k? Its not good idea and for sure not like this because another aspects of the game like LNs/acc/gimmicks means nothing.
this perceived mentality is what is ruining the game. there are plenty of low-star maps that are actually challenging, but people won't play them because if rank matters to them, it doesn't give them the output they'd want in terms of PP. it's why everyone flocks to the same high level maps to increase their performance points in the first place.artaban wrote:
I think it's a good idea, this way, 4k players have a chance to shine on the ranking ladder, and it makes "boring" maps (low star maps, low bpm maps, etc. Everyone have a different opinion of what it makes it "Boring") challenging again.
4k-only players don't deserve to shine a huge amount on the performance point boards at this point in time: until ratings are separated by per-key, they rightfully -should- be lower than the players who are higher up. until then, this just continues to be an even stronger highlight of the issue overall.
How is it ruining the game? Everyone plays the game for their own reasons, it's not like what that one player does effects how you play or the reasons you play. Just because the user decided to group lower star ratings for an example doesn't mean they don't play lower star maps that are challenging. Just because one person has an opinion about what they think of DT being ranked doesn't mean it's "Ruining the game" If it affects you that much to the point where you aren't having fun than just quit.Halogen- wrote:
this perceived mentality is what is ruining the game.
While I somewhat agree with you, this "mentality" is altogether subjective as some players (including myself) enjoy the process of climbing through the leader-boards to get higher and higher ranks. But I wish this process didn't have to come at the cost of maps made to break the SR such as the shittiest map ever ranked blastix, but then again, this is also my subjective opinion, as others can seemly enjoy the difficulty these maps present.Halogen- wrote:
this perceived mentality is what is ruining the game.
This I completely agree with, as most 4k players can't play other keymodes and shouldn't be anywhere near the top in the overall rankings that combines all keymodes together. If an extremely good 4k player is around the same ranking as a player who can play all keymodes at a slightly lower level, that isn't fair to the player who can play all keymodes, as their skill set is more varied.Halogen- wrote:
4k-only players don't deserve to shine a huge amount on the performance point boards at this point in time
Guess I'll throw in my 2 cents about this.
I think it's obvious that the majority of the people that unironically enjoy this abysmal implementation are the people that enjoy the thought of having more pp, the people that gain more recognition out of it, or the people that have no other skillsets than mashing through 7* maps. Let's just clarify that pp means absolutely nothing in this game atm, it doesn't reflect on your skill level, and you shouldn't be concerned about it right now. If you really enjoy having a nice big number next to a rank, go to ripple, you'll really feel better about yourself there. They shouldn't have even implemented any bonuses for pp until they fix the star rating algorithm. I don't even think HT should give pp for any game modes either, but that's another story...
This isn't a pp issue so much, it's the shit star rating system that ruins this more imo. This star rating algorithm has been around for how long now and they still haven't realized that it's broken to shit? I get that you genuinely don't care about this game peppy and that you'd rather have your people work on other useless projects, but at least make it seem like you trying, man. You guys impress me by making this game worse somehow, and I honestly didn't think that was possible. And to answer peoples' questions about Mina fixing it, Mina's not gonna submit all of his hard work to the other "developers" that will mooch off of it for free, because that's basically what they wanted him to do. So don't expect him to work with them because it's not going to happen.
By implementing this dt pp system, you're creating a cancerous meta for one trick pony players that play for 90-95's on maps they can barely play the maps in the first place, and it's supposedly worth giving more pp for? Fuck off. This is probably the worst thing I've seen on o!m yet and anyone who says otherwise doesn't have a clue about what's going on about this game. No, I'm not being some pessimistic Stepmania elitist fanboy. I'm being an observant individual that sees there is something wrong with this game.
This game would be better off not even having a pp system imo. Maybe people would actually learn a thing or two about this game instead of playing the same garbage ranked maps over and over again.
/salt
I think it's obvious that the majority of the people that unironically enjoy this abysmal implementation are the people that enjoy the thought of having more pp, the people that gain more recognition out of it, or the people that have no other skillsets than mashing through 7* maps. Let's just clarify that pp means absolutely nothing in this game atm, it doesn't reflect on your skill level, and you shouldn't be concerned about it right now. If you really enjoy having a nice big number next to a rank, go to ripple, you'll really feel better about yourself there. They shouldn't have even implemented any bonuses for pp until they fix the star rating algorithm. I don't even think HT should give pp for any game modes either, but that's another story...
This isn't a pp issue so much, it's the shit star rating system that ruins this more imo. This star rating algorithm has been around for how long now and they still haven't realized that it's broken to shit? I get that you genuinely don't care about this game peppy and that you'd rather have your people work on other useless projects, but at least make it seem like you trying, man. You guys impress me by making this game worse somehow, and I honestly didn't think that was possible. And to answer peoples' questions about Mina fixing it, Mina's not gonna submit all of his hard work to the other "developers" that will mooch off of it for free, because that's basically what they wanted him to do. So don't expect him to work with them because it's not going to happen.
By implementing this dt pp system, you're creating a cancerous meta for one trick pony players that play for 90-95's on maps they can barely play the maps in the first place, and it's supposedly worth giving more pp for? Fuck off. This is probably the worst thing I've seen on o!m yet and anyone who says otherwise doesn't have a clue about what's going on about this game. No, I'm not being some pessimistic Stepmania elitist fanboy. I'm being an observant individual that sees there is something wrong with this game.
This game would be better off not even having a pp system imo. Maybe people would actually learn a thing or two about this game instead of playing the same garbage ranked maps over and over again.
/salt
Again like everyone else that makes this point how does this affect you? People playing for their own reasons doesn't affect you at all as this is a single player game. Just because some people like to have a number beside their name as a sense of accomplishment doesn't mean anything. All that is going to happen is your rank is going to go down but since you don't care about rank anyways why make this point? The ranking system wasn't developed on ripple it was developed on osu!EtienneXC wrote:
If you really enjoy having a nice big number next to a rank, go to ripple, you'll really feel better about yourself there.
This is something I actually agree with. HT is a joke of a mod and takes no skill to use across any mode and the fact that it can give such high amounts of pp with such little skill needed is pretty annoying.EtienneXC wrote:
I don't even think HT should give pp for any game modes either,
If you have an idea on how to fix the star rating than please enlighten everyone. All I see is people complaining about it over and over and I get it's broken as fuck but no one has been coming up with any solutions for this at all. Make a feature request and if people like your idea than they will vote it up.EtienneXC wrote:
This star rating algorithm has been around for how long now and they still haven't realized that it's broken to shit?
/pepper
Algorithm based on pattern difficulty in different skillsets with a global indicator of the generale difficulty for example, like Mina is developping for SM, and It's already working way better than PPs. But, like Etienne said, he won't care about osu!, and currents osu! developpers don't want to make something complicated right? It's easier to just make the PPs system dumber and dumber.Cawub wrote:
If you have an idea on how to fix the star rating than please enlighten everyone.
Also, by saying HT is a joke you are basicly making fun of yourself because people can HT for the same reason they want to DT. Like you said, "Everyone plays the game for their own reasons, it's not like what that one player does effects how you play or the reasons you play."
while i do agree that
"why don't you guys just maek pp better since you guys keep complaining asdfasdf etc"
Thing is, it's not that simple to "maek pp better" or "SR more accurate"
We could get some people to help but it looks like the devs here are more into pressing random buttons to see how it affects mania
Really brings out the "we need help on osu!mania"
I'd be fine if DT was declared to mine more data to improve SR but it seems like not
I don't get the action of including DT if all it does is emphasize and make inaccuracies in rating the higher-end difficulties of mania maps even more significant
I'd be fine if like, no one touches this pp thing, ever, roll it back and though we still have relatively ok Performance Points ranking, it doesn't go haywire until after like 10k or something
(Some guy is probably going to come here and say this is just an experiment and whatever bla bla yada yada (expected))
"why don't you guys just maek pp better since you guys keep complaining asdfasdf etc"
Thing is, it's not that simple to "maek pp better" or "SR more accurate"
We could get some people to help but it looks like the devs here are more into pressing random buttons to see how it affects mania
Really brings out the "we need help on osu!mania"
I'd be fine if DT was declared to mine more data to improve SR but it seems like not
I don't get the action of including DT if all it does is emphasize and make inaccuracies in rating the higher-end difficulties of mania maps even more significant
I'd be fine if like, no one touches this pp thing, ever, roll it back and though we still have relatively ok Performance Points ranking, it doesn't go haywire until after like 10k or something
(Some guy is probably going to come here and say this is just an experiment and whatever bla bla yada yada (expected))
Honestly the only way to get them to even pay attention is if the players develop a good sustaining SR/PP system that checks out and is widely agreed upon. The way I see it is that they are too busy wrapped up in doing other tasks and just throwing some random unfinished unpolished features out into osu!
Which is why I say if players get something even close to acceptable that maybe the devs will take a look at it and help refine it etc etc.
Which is why I say if players get something even close to acceptable that maybe the devs will take a look at it and help refine it etc etc.
I mean it's pretty all right if you only play unranked for a majority of the time. Mostly Stepmania pack converts.EtienneXC wrote:
This game would be better off not even having a pp system imo. Maybe people would actually learn a thing or two about this game instead of playing the same garbage ranked maps over and over again.
/salt
There's some real good charts though that I want in stepmania from osu unranked and vice versa.
Oh and actual rates for every .1 interval would be nice so you don't have to look for weird shit like "Over the fullereneshift 1.1" and can just 1.1 the "kom susser tod" file.
Don't get me wrong Halogen-, I enjoy so much to play challenging maps (for my skill), I dont care if it doesn't give any pp.Halogen- wrote:
this perceived mentality is what is ruining the game. there are plenty of low-star maps that are actually challenging, but people won't play them because if rank matters to them, it doesn't give them the output they'd want in terms of PP. it's why everyone flocks to the same high level maps to increase their performance points in the first place.
Maps like Parachor's Finger VIP or NaxelCL's Brynhildr in the darkness (7k MX) as an example, I still play them aiming for an S, just for it's challenge. I know there is a lot of maps that are almost even played, like 8k maps, but I still like them, the thing is that, most of the 4k 4* ish maps are really easy, and DT gives them a new and challenging way to play them, but now with a little motivation that gives pp.
That's also true, for example, im at 2.3k rank, but I know some players from 11k rank that are better than me at 7k (my main key mode). But as a "new" player, PP really motivates me to play better, and the thing that DT started to give PP, it really motivated me to play DT and I started to play even better than before, and I know it's a kinda mediocre way of thinking, since if you really want to improve, PP as a reward doesn't really mean anything, but still, anyone can find motivation in anything they feel ok with.EtienneXC wrote:
Let's just clarify that pp means absolutely nothing in this game atm, it doesn't reflect on your skill level, and you shouldn't be concerned about it right now.
I still think the best way to fix SR is that every player give an aprox. rate before they submit it, and then when it gets modded and beyond, the modders decided manually the SR of a song, but thats something I dont really know how would it work.Evening wrote:
Thing is, it's not that simple to "maek pp better" or "SR more accurate"
We could get some people to help but it looks like the devs here are more into pressing random buttons to see how it affects mania
Really brings out the "we need help on osu!mania"
Since everyone finds different patterns more challenging, this would never work. Since SR means pretty much nothing, I think the best system would be to show what patterns the song contains and how heavy these patterns are scattered throughout the song. I doubt this would ever be implemented but it'd be interesting to see.artaban wrote:
I still think the best way to fix SR is that every player give an aprox. rate before they submit it, and then when it gets modded and beyond, the modders decided manually the SR of a song, but thats something I dont really know how would it work.
Most of the stuff you said I agree, but this is an over reaction. I've been following the game's developement progress on Discord and it's not that they don't care. It's that nobody cares enough to accelerate developement. The client is fucked. The web is fucked. The pp is fucked. The SR is fucked. Peppy's decision was to burn it all to the ground and start over from scratch. It's been a long 2 years, but he and some 6-8 other devs who are working on everything are almost there. The game is barely receiving updates, so the best they can do is knock out things many players asked for that is easy to implement. Then everybody expects fixes immediately when that doesn't go well, but they have shit to do. So don't offer players new features and have them wait or throw something up in the air for players to spend time with while they work on completing everything? It's justifiable when peppy says to go fuck yourself because they are going as fast as they can given their manpower. What can they do?EtienneXC wrote:
I get that you genuinely don't care about this game peppy and that you'd rather have your people work on other useless projects, but at least make it seem like you trying, man. You guys impress me by making this game worse somehow, and I honestly didn't think that was possible.
I have to agree that I don't think anyone on the dev team currently will come up with a good formula for SR. It won't happen unless they played VRSG and know what it feels to play VRSG. I'll give you that.EtienneXC wrote:
anyone who says otherwise doesn't have a clue about what's going on about this game.
Topic Starter
just try to get used to it . that's all xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxD
btw HEYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY ET MAPPERCuppp wrote:
pp = skill
ppy said in a tweet he'd be kinda cutting pp in half just to align it with other modes
i guess in his mind proportioning everything in half means that the issue is half as shitty, seems legitSoul Evans wrote:
ppy said in a tweet he'd be kinda cutting pp in half just to align it with other modes
before they're changing to ppv2 (old DT system) and ppv3 (before DT system right now)EtienneXC wrote:
This game would be better off not even having a pp system imo. Maybe people would actually learn a thing or two about this game instead of playing the same garbage ranked maps over and over again.
/salt
(some old player mania maybe still remember it, well more like they're changing pp system hence no ranks available)
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BTT :
travel back 1k rank still on-going.
now that a year has passed since this shitstorm how do you guys feel about this subject?
I rarely play pp maps, even ranked maps. So.... it doesn't effect me either way 
Well, if they fix the star rating, then I am fine with it (although I am at a disadvantage, being a slow player).