Let me ask you then, why did he say such a quote. If by having fun is the best way to improve, why tell others to push through the hard and tedious training, why not say "enjoy boxing," Or for that concern, why is there so many quotes of push hard and become champion in the first place when according to you, the best way to improve is have fun.
About quote itself - same thing like with milion other quotes said in twisted way to humanity. It's your interpretation of it what matters and it can be either good or bad. That's the point of philosophy.
Now i could ask you: please take one activity which you don't like, don't enjoy and please - push hard, be a "so called champion". Can you do this? I doubt it, even if - every single person who enjoys this activity will be better than you, no matter how much you will force yourself. It's complex mindset which force people to train, explore new posibilities by being better at something but to do this, first of all - you need to enjoy what you are doing, you need to feel constant "wind in the sails" to not get mentaly exhausted by this.
Wise people tend to give their knowledge in way that humanity can make interpretations, put it into not one certain situation but many different, yet they always have one proper message. In case of your quote from M.Ali, it's "never give up, push yourself more and more to be better, you will not achieve the very top by sitting on your ass" or "there is no glory without hard training", both are true.
The other truth proved by both - psychology and medicine is that you will never do better at something what doesn't give you some kind of joy.
Ok just gonna addres the thing you're talking about first. Did you leave out Beethoven on purpose? Probably the most famous composer of all time, father of romantic period basically, and amazing compositions of symphonies. If you didn't, then I just want to say, his background is exactly the opposite of what you said. Forced by his dad to play piano even at night, he was beaten by his dad. If you are gonna say he likes piano at the start, I'm gonna proceed to kill myself because nobody is that dumb.
Also one more thing, I hated badminton when I first started. Now I love it, so these are just why I believe you can start liking something simply by doing it.
I commend though, that information I did not know and I will look into it more deeply, thanks.
In classical music, many critics will tell you that "X" is most famous composer of all time. I could say - Brahms and Schubert are the very great for my taste. There is no thing like "one best of all". Yes, i left him on purpose since i done research before and i knew his story. Back to middle school i liked history. There will be always separated examples from main theory but they are always in minority. In actual world, you make assumptions and prove them in term of majority which in this case - it's what i am trying to explain you.
https://youtu.be/wKhuovIMa8k
Check 1:40
Rafis didn't said he hated it, he said it was boring and majority of people find begining of osu! journey fuckin boring. Almost nothing to click, always same boring patterns, zero creativity and retarded blankets forced by QAT/BN because "fuck playability, map should look nice", etc. Nothing more wrong from your side.
I'm talking about when you want to do something, you gotta train which isn't always very fun.
Training is part of activity. As far as your activity gives you fun and you find yourself enjoying it and being forced by this joy to get better and discover new posibilities, that what you call "training not being fun" goes into second plane.
Counter-argument - training in something what doesn't catch you, doesn't give you fun at all - yes, then training is anti-fun, painfull and mostly wasted.
No, not necessarily. The misconception of fun makes you improve faster lies by the fact that people think its logical that fun improves learning speed directly. It doesn't. What it does is elevate motivation and concentration, the latter is the real requirement to speed learning. Why is it that taking breaks between practises is considered the best way to improve? Its because of concentration.
Fun improves learning speed a lot and it's proved by people way more smart than you and me. You cannot deny this.
I already gave you example for this.
Target of argument:
Person A, fan of water sports, not interested at all in martial arts.
Person B, fan of martial art sports, not interested at all in water sports.
Rule of experiment:
Perfect training shedule for both - water sport called "swimming" and martial art called "Juji-tsu".
Amount of training time is same for both targets.
Amount of mental and physical effort is same for both activities.
Proof of argument:
Person A will never achieve target B skill level in Juji-tsu due mental disability to accomodate martial arts activity.
Person B will never achieve target A skill level in swimming due --``-- water sports activity.
But what if I told the other guy I will kill him if he doesn't beat the other guy, he will focus more, he will not waste any time. Some of you might say, hey he is going to be frustrated, which will reduce hisbabiloty to learn, ill say no. When under threats like these, adrenaline comes into play. You start reacting faster, muscles become faster due to increased blood flow, you enter deep breathing, allowing more oxygen to be taken on and used by the muscle. Basically you go into superman mode. Disclaimer, this is not the same adrenaline level as close to FCing something, it is much more intense due to it being life threatening. Sure enough, he may not like osu, but at the end of the day he is going to learn faster.
Invalid point - critical force for achievement is dictated by human body and mind limits. Each person have different. I can assure you that if you threat someone by putting gun to his mother head and telling him to stand on one finger, he will not do this unless his body allows him. There is too many variables in this calculation which negate whole point of this discussion. This one argument can be discussed in term of particular person and end result is pinned to this one particulat test subject.
If your point was valid, in WWII nazi germany could create tons of super-human soldiers but they failed by simply going exacly your way of thinking. I recommend you to get into whole Nazi germany human experiments topic, especially part of test subject mentally forced to do something by situations of seeing their family being "killed on their eyes when they fail". It's interesting experiment and gives a lot of knowledge about humanity limits to do certain things.
Seeing this does make me feel somewhat sorry for you, which is probably the emotion you were trying to give to me, and I do see where you're coming from but I want to say that this is not the same case. And the reason I say that is because a job choice, and job choices generally you only get 1 degree, you would obviously want something you love. For games its different, you are not bound by something, you're not forced to pick, therefore you have the option to try everything, allowing you to fall in love with something you hated at the start.
My point was - I didn't gave a fuck about what my parent wanted, i was doing what i loved, i studies what i love, now i am doing what i love which is programming in category of database and network security applications, mainly backend logic alghorithms. So why this little story - to bring into light that even for me, when I love programming it took time to learn things, i spent a lot of time in IDE creating code from scratch, testing it, trying different algorithms to solve problems. One could say this wasn't fun from 3rd person perspective. It was fun from my own perspective and despite spending lots of time pretty much wasted on creating something which later on i just deleted due being retarded, it ended up giving me stronger understanding of language itself. Nothing was wasted.
Oh well, dunno if i will add something to this, I don't like to split things which are pretty much logically obvious in term of majority as test subject.
hf