Llahmah wrote:

Sure there are faster ways of improving than just playing for fun. Some people try trial by fire, doing maps way too hard and then when they try what they were doing before it seems a lot easier. Because of high fail rate I imagine that's not too fun. Also like you said people might train a certain part of their game. But if you are bad at streaming in the first place and you try practice stream maps, it will probably take a while to improve. So mechanic training could(?) be effective, but unlike Starcraft and dota and other competitive games, there is pretty much no way to go pro. You could become a streamer, but there isn't a major osu! League with 10k prize pools, so all that practice doesn't accumulate to anything worthwhile.

Tl;dr, playing for fun lets you practice many different parts of osu! because most maps have jumps, streams and everything, and practicing streaming on its own and then trying to play a map, where there will be streams, jumps, etc. might seem unnecessary compared to just playing and getting all of the skills. Plus there is no real reason to get good and try for top 50 or whatever unless you are super talented or just really want it that bad.

N0thingSpecial wrote:

this is basically what "play more" and "plz enjoy game" in an elaborate way

DeathAdderz wrote:

I think the reason people start saying "enjoy game" is because rrtyui said it (see picture above).

As for "play more", well, it's just true. It's just the general term. I mean, when you do the so-called mechanics training, you also "play more", don't you?

DeathAdderz wrote:

Can't argue about that, but I often see that newbies ask stuff too general like "how do I get better?". When you ask a very general question, of course the answer will be a general answer, which is "play more".

I'm pretty sure if you ask something specific like "how to increase my stream speed?", you will get some good advice other than simply "play more".

My point is, why is it that everything requires training in specific areas and every training is almost not fun, yet the advice given here is "enjoy game", sure this is a video game, but improving in it is also a joy. You don't go around defining what is fun for people, maybe they find the competitiveness fun. Just a thought

Edgar_Figaro wrote:

DeathAdderz wrote:

Can't argue about that, but I often see that newbies ask stuff too general like "how do I get better?". When you ask a very general question, of course the answer will be a general answer, which is "play more".

I'm pretty sure if you ask something specific like "how to increase my stream speed?", you will get some good advice other than simply "play more".

Nah you will still get "Play more" or slightly more specific of "Play more stream maps"

Blitzfrog wrote:

I know many people ask the best way to improve here in G&R and lots of the response is to enjoy game, I think otherwise.

I base the assumption on the fact that people train in anything they do, and training is generally not fun.

For me, I play badminton, and had I just "had fun" and just enjoyed the sport, I would never be even close to my current standard.
Now you might argue that this is a video game, and video games are for fun, I would argue otherwise as well.
I base this on the fact that I personally know a few pro DOTA2 players and Starcraft players. They do not simply just "play more" and improve, instead, they focus on parts of the game and train in that area. They call it mechanics training, and I have had a taste of it, it is far from fun, 30minutes doing the same thing over and over again, but the results are astonishing.

Another example would be piano, do you think professionals just keep playing pieces they enjoy to improve? They don't, they play scales. Sure playing the pieces you love will improve your skills, but it won't take you far and you will end up with lots of technical flaws, e.g. tensing up too much or wrong fingering when descending ...etc.

My point is, why is it that everything requires training in specific areas and every training is almost not fun, yet the advice given here is "enjoy game", sure this is a video game, but improving in it is also a joy. You don't go around defining what is fun for people, maybe they find the competitiveness fun. Just a thought

M3ATL0V3R wrote:

From your post I can see three main points

1. Fun can be detrimental to improvement as it is a poor guide for what to train

This is true, what you find fun isn't always what you need to do to improve. Many people like to play what they are good at and familiar with which is bad because to improve the fastest you frequently need to do what is new or out of your comfort zone

2. Training generally is not fun and therefore fun doesn't really help you improve

I disagree with this, having fun engages the brain and speeds up improvement if done in the right way. However the fun has to be in the context of figuring out the game or feeling the rhythm not in the context of relaxing or habit.

Ok just want to clarify, I haven't seen any study about having fun engages the brain anymore than not having fun, nor have I found a study that shows that it does speed up improvement. However I have found plenty of studies that show an increase in motivation levels after having fun, which maybe the key to improving in long term, but as the title of this post is focused on best way to improve in general, I meant as in the fastest way to improve. Also another thing is, the fun you receive after training is just 10 times better really. The increased speed, the increased stamina by a dramatic amount, it really makes it more fun when you improve.

3. Pro starcraft and dota players do not just "play more" they train a specific area.

When people say play more they don't mean to just play whatever, they usually say this to people who are complaining about their lack of improvement while not putting in enough practice

I doubt that is what they meant. Also aren't we supposed to be as helpful as we can? Like Jukke wrote, writing "play more" you might as well have posted "be more specific" because at least the latter is of use.