Let me say, I intended to make a bit difficult Normal because Satellite asked me to make that one for settling between Easy and Hard gaps. This is the answer for your first and second examples. And 02:31:878 (1,2,3,4) - I already had fixed these easily patterns after getting mods. We have an Easy diff for this mapset so these flow and stacks are OK. Third point you mentioned is nonsense.Bakari wrote:
I have a few things to mention, as I believe they could improve the map a lot.
[Normal]
- The excessive amount of overlaps makes the difficulty way too hard for a Normal, there is no way for the players to comfortably read a difficulty when 90% of it are overlapped patterns.
To make things more clear, let's add a few examples:I'm trying to explain that you need to either increase the spacing and reduce the amount of 1/2s, so that things are properly readable and the spread is unharmed, or you can just get rid of some 1/2s to make chains shorter and re-arrange your patterns to make things more readable. Either way should be fine, though increasing spacing should also help to make things look neater, so I would go for it.
- 02:31:878 (1,2,3,4) - stacks like these in the middle of 1/2 patterns give little time for the players to read them properly and are generally hard to read due to the excessive amount of overlaps that confuse the eye and make stacks a lot harder to notice and understand. There are more patterns where staacks become a serious issue in the end of 1/2 chains, like 01:09:996 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4) - 01:57:996 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,1,2,3)
- 02:12:113 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,5,6,1) - this pattern itself feels too heavy for a difficulty labled as Normal. Stacks combined with dynamic flow and everything is supposed to be read really quickly, as there are no 1/1 gaps for players to read things properly.
- 00:30:290 (4) - a lot of players use skins with the empty slidertail, so they can easily misread the tail for another circle. Try to use less agressive angles, as this one was practically the only slider curved in such way.
This is 170bpm mapset. I solved normal-hard-easy gaps. Satellite also thinks this is "Normal". No problem I guess.Lanturn wrote:
Normal plays more like what we describe an Advanced than anything imo. Probably could be renamed as one, and then Easy as Normal (A light normal, but would still pass for one). I do agree with Bakari though. I still think there is a bit of a gap between the Easy/Normal. Doing what Bakari suggested though would definitely help.
I'll take a peek afterwards again if you apply Bakari's mods.
https://osu.ppy.sh/wiki/Difficulty_appropriate_gameplay_elements
You've never provide a single point to justify the spacing used in Normal. You keep referring to the same difficulty spread rule, that does not really explain anything. Just because it is something that does not go against the RC directly, it does not mean that it can be ranked withouth further considertaion and improving.Satellite wrote:
There is nothing wrong with it about quality. that is is your opinion, and there are at least two people who do not share the same point of view
If you say a problem about overlap, It is your opinion, and we do not agree. the problem is in the way overlaps influence difficulty and playability, and this is not an opinion, this is a concern that is based on reasons and provided with examples. If you disagree with that, I would like to explain what makes you think the overlaps work for the difficulty.
Is it a game?? gather people with the same opinion :<Bakari wrote:
Satellite wrote:
There is nothing wrong with it about quality. that is is your opinion, and there are at least two people who do not share the same point of view
If you say a problem about overlap, It is your opinion, and we do not agree. the problem is in the way overlaps influence difficulty and playability, and this is not an opinion, this is a concern that is based on reasons and provided with examples. If you disagree with that, I would like to explain what makes you think the overlaps work for the difficulty.
E <<<<<<<<< N <<< HIndeed the set does not violate any rules, but the whole difficulty is beyond a common standard of a Normal. It is too hard and challenging, which is not suitable for players on such level. So, changing Normal to Advanced and adding a real Normal may be the last resort other than nerfing Normal on a large scale.