xi - Halcyon -Long Version-

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Kibbleru
02:19:661 (1,2,3) - this is fine, but since its such a special rhythm part isnt is kinda bad to be inconsistent with it? 04:03:890 (1,2,3,4) -

also guys stop trying to force ur opinion on natsu, he gave his fair reasoning, just wait for the QATs to judge it.
also stop saying his rhythm is 'incorrect' since there is no objectivity in that, his opinion is his hence he expressed it his map, ur opinion is urs.
Free Hong Kong

Natsu wrote:

hitsounds aren't mean to be 1/1 with the music, but to decorate it, most of maps do this, ofc if add a random clap for decorating the song every 2 and 4 no one will complain, then again I love the current ones, why kill something that the mapper and some people love.

Drastic difficulty spikes? the map is consistent, the stream space the jumps etc, yes there are some hard parts, but is still at same level of difficulty, then again no one complain about tv sizes having a random full screenjumps at the end of the map.

00:12:242 (1,2,3) this is a really simple pattern man, is just for add variation at the slow part of the map.

00:36:004 (2,3,4,5) same ^


Kiai have undermap beats yes, but 01:09:923 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - I think anymapper would map to the strong beats instead of everytiny sound in parts like that, since those are the soul of the chorus.

what I mean of overmodding is to change things that are fine, but other that also are fines, I made the mistakes of change things in my past maps just for the sake of ranking them and i feeld bad about those now tbh, Modding should be fore improving understanding what the mapper is trying to do, not to change things that are fine, take for example shiirn I explained him my points 6 months ago, then I remapped 2 times and I keeped the things I love about my map, then I explained him like 3-5 times again.

We should respect mapper choice tbh, your points are valid, but also try to understand I'm not you and you would express the music different than me, take this as example: https://osu.ppy.sh/s/527661 https://osu.ppy.sh/s/522857 , one maps almost everything while the other don't, they both get love, people tried to make monstrata's map in a way that he don't want, but thanks god he keep it in the way he want, what people are trying to do here is basically the same, make me change things that I really don't want to change. Check the previous DQ post or mods, I take a lot from them, because I think they improve my map, ofc I deny things that I don't think would improve it. There is a point were mods makes more bad than good and in my experience that's starting to happen here.
I think you misread what I said, YOUR map has difficulty TROUGHS, while other ranked maps have SPIKES, which I did say people complained about.

I also believe you have a false sense of how object placement affects difficulty, something linear and evenly and lowly spaced is much easier to play than something with the same or higher spacing and sharp angles. The closer a map can be to expressing a song in a consistent manner the better. Its inappropriate to not consider factors that change the map itself difficulty.

I also must say the objective of keysounding is accuracy, and I already pointed out the inaccuracy of how you created it.

It's also worth mentioning its possible to map strong beats while complimenting other occurring sounds.
Topic Starter
Natsu

bor wrote:

Natsu wrote:

hitsounds aren't mean to be 1/1 with the music, but to decorate it, most of maps do this, ofc if add a random clap for decorating the song every 2 and 4 no one will complain, then again I love the current ones, why kill something that the mapper and some people love.

Drastic difficulty spikes? the map is consistent, the stream space the jumps etc, yes there are some hard parts, but is still at same level of difficulty, then again no one complain about tv sizes having a random full screenjumps at the end of the map.

00:12:242 (1,2,3) this is a really simple pattern man, is just for add variation at the slow part of the map.

00:36:004 (2,3,4,5) same ^


Kiai have undermap beats yes, but 01:09:923 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4) - I think anymapper would map to the strong beats instead of everytiny sound in parts like that, since those are the soul of the chorus.

what I mean of overmodding is to change things that are fine, but other that also are fines, I made the mistakes of change things in my past maps just for the sake of ranking them and i feeld bad about those now tbh, Modding should be fore improving understanding what the mapper is trying to do, not to change things that are fine, take for example shiirn I explained him my points 6 months ago, then I remapped 2 times and I keeped the things I love about my map, then I explained him like 3-5 times again.

We should respect mapper choice tbh, your points are valid, but also try to understand I'm not you and you would express the music different than me, take this as example: https://osu.ppy.sh/s/527661 https://osu.ppy.sh/s/522857 , one maps almost everything while the other don't, they both get love, people tried to make monstrata's map in a way that he don't want, but thanks god he keep it in the way he want, what people are trying to do here is basically the same, make me change things that I really don't want to change. Check the previous DQ post or mods, I take a lot from them, because I think they improve my map, ofc I deny things that I don't think would improve it. There is a point were mods makes more bad than good and in my experience that's starting to happen here.
I think you misread what I said, YOUR map has difficulty TROUGHS, while other ranked maps have SPIKES, which I did say people complained about.

I also believe you have a false sense of how object placement affects difficulty, something linear and evenly and lowly spaced is much easier to play than something with the same or higher spacing and sharp angles. The closer a map can be to expressing a song in a consistent manner the better. Its inappropriate to not consider factors that change the map itself difficulty.

I also must say the objective of keysounding is accuracy, and I already pointed out the inaccuracy of how you created it.

It's also worth mentioning its possible to map strong beats while complimenting other occurring sounds.
yes what I meant is mapping the 1/12 would be super hard to play you really don't have idea how bad it was (that's why the hitsounds are only decorating that part and not doing a 1/1), that's why I decide to map it with 1/8s, this is my way of expressing the song after 8 months of work 2 remaps 1 dq and multiple mods and test plays. People are trying to DQ this so badly for any reason, there are no correct rhythms that is up to the mapper and their interpretation of the song, yes those pattern are different placed and no linear, linear things are harder to play than zigzag movements and is just the slow part of the song.

I gave my reasons to everything I don't want to change, just wait for a QAT and their decision.

For the people who say I don't want to improve this map, I remapped it 2 times, ask to Okorin I personally requested a DQ from him to improve this map, I asked multiple people for mods and test plays,



I can post tons of screenshoots from players who tested it, so don't say I didn't want to improve it, right now i just want to keep the integrity of my map and the patterns i love, for example see how a post wanted me to change a slider because is ugly, but I think is awesome, subjective things like that shouldn't be taken as issues. Just to add the music provide beats and is up to us the mappers to map them as we feel, if x mapper would map an easy diff only that's fine, if I want to map all the constant 1/4s is also fine.

to end this is fun how a modder want me to undermap the streams in the kiais while the other want me to map everything, see how subjective are the rhythm choices.
Free Hong Kong
there is no point in me continuing this "discussion" when it seems like you misinterpret what concerns.
Mun

Kibbleru wrote:

stop trying to force ur opinion on natsu, he gave his fair reasoning, just wait for the QATs to judge it.
also stop saying his rhythm is 'incorrect' since there is no objectivity in that, his opinion is his hence he expressed it his map, ur opinion is urs.
There are many correct rhythms for any given song which are defined upon the creation of the song.
There are many incorrect rhythms for any given song which are created by misinterpretations, mistakes, and ignorance.

It's not all a gray area, and a lot of small parts of this set fall into the "incorrect" side.
Kite
cool map
Kibbleru

Mun wrote:

Kibbleru wrote:

stop trying to force ur opinion on natsu, he gave his fair reasoning, just wait for the QATs to judge it.
also stop saying his rhythm is 'incorrect' since there is no objectivity in that, his opinion is his hence he expressed it his map, ur opinion is urs.
There are many correct rhythms for any given song which are defined upon the creation of the song.
There are many incorrect rhythms for any given song which are created by misinterpretations, mistakes, and ignorance.

It's not all a gray area, and a lot of small parts of this set fall into the "incorrect" side.
because ur not openminded :)
Topic Starter
Natsu

Mun wrote:

Kibbleru wrote:

stop trying to force ur opinion on natsu, he gave his fair reasoning, just wait for the QATs to judge it.
also stop saying his rhythm is 'incorrect' since there is no objectivity in that, his opinion is his hence he expressed it his map, ur opinion is urs.
There are many correct rhythms for any given song which are defined upon the creation of the song.
There are many incorrect rhythms for any given song which are created by misinterpretations, mistakes, and ignorance.

It's not all a gray area, and a lot of small parts of this set fall into the "incorrect" side.
because you are not open to other ideas, I put my interpretation here as I did in any of my maps, you are free to like it or dislike it that's fine, but also learn that no everyone do things as u like
Fycho
Please focus on the actual discussion on the map objectively, we will review the discussion soon.
Mapper
cool map!
polka
Yo natsuuuu congratulations!

I've been waiting for this map to get approved for a long time. This was my favorite pending map to play since you've submitted it, and it's actually helped me grow as a player, as it's helped me to better play streams at higher bpm and intensity.

As one of my favorite mappers, I thank you for fighting so hard to get this map where it is <3
Nuolong
Oh my gosh I don't think I've ever seen a map that had such nice and developed hitsounds omg so aesthetic. Also really fun IMO! I like being aesthetic but I dont know how to manage to make it so fun AND aesthetic at the same time TwT
Kuo Kyoka
But what about the title?
I know there got an album name "Groundbreaking -BOF2010 COMPILATION ALBUM-"
but from Parousia (xi's 1st album)
The title should be: Halcyon
https://diverse.direct/diverse-system/100sr-a013/

A little confused right now.
Topic Starter
Natsu
Check alacat post, she explained it, wait let me check it, is so hidden atm LOL

Here: p/5624657
Kuo Kyoka
so Parousia came after Groundbreaking album
I think the lastest is the most correct tho

But since they have 2 conflicted song name, then just keep what you think is the best.
Topic Starter
Natsu

Kuo Kyoka wrote:

so Parousia came after Groundbreaking album
I think the lastest is the most correct tho

But since they have 2 conflicted song name, then just keep what you think is the best.
yeah that's what we discussed there.
Shiranai
I have concern on human diff, due to this rule:

Slider anchors/nodes must not be used to manipulate slider speeds (whether they are normal nodes or red ones). Using extra nodes to make a slider "wiggle" is usually fine, but using so many that the slider gets scrunched up (which also makes the sliderball go crazy) or become a "hold slider" is abuse of the hitobject's intended use and is not allowed. AIMod (shortcut ctrl+shift+a) will also point out sliders that move in an "abnormal" way, so make sure to check that if you're unsure of a slider.
Isn't this kind of wiggle are not allowed 02:09:295 (2) - , 03:53:524 (2) - and 04:14:257 (7) - ? Let's we compared the length of these (2) and (3) http://puu.sh/t3kml/3003703f0b.jpg literally they both use 7/4 slider but by using so many red nodes on (2) it will make its length shorter about half than it supposed to be without having slow sv manipulation on it, which I think that against the current rules above

And why using 1/4 slider stream here 03:12:750 (4,5) - ? yet on demigod and deity use more simple rhythm, a bit questionable to me when the easier diff use denser rhythm choice than higher diffs. The comparison,




Just my two cents when I played the diff :)
Topic Starter
Natsu

Mako Sakata wrote:

I have concern on human diff, due to this rule:

Slider anchors/nodes must not be used to manipulate slider speeds (whether they are normal nodes or red ones). Using extra nodes to make a slider "wiggle" is usually fine, but using so many that the slider gets scrunched up (which also makes the sliderball go crazy) or become a "hold slider" is abuse of the hitobject's intended use and is not allowed. AIMod (shortcut ctrl+shift+a) will also point out sliders that move in an "abnormal" way, so make sure to check that if you're unsure of a slider.
Isn't this kind of wiggle are not allowed 02:09:295 (2) - , 03:53:524 (2) - and 04:14:257 (7) - ? Let's we compared the length of these (2) and (3) http://puu.sh/t3kml/3003703f0b.jpg literally they both use 7/4 slider but by using so many red nodes on (2) it will make its length shorter about half than it supposed to be without having slow sv manipulation on it, which I think that against the current rules above


They are allowed, since they have a clear slider patch.

And why using 1/4 slider stream here 03:12:750 (4,5) - ? yet on demigod and deity use more simple rhythm, a bit questionable to me when the easier diff use denser rhythm choice than higher diffs. The comparison,




because they are different diffs, they don't need to be consistent with each other and both rhythms are valid there tho, btw the slider is easier to play than the 3 circles


Just my two cents when I played the diff :)
Fycho
On one side, can you reply Kibbleru's post: p/5703486?
I think it's worthy a fix most among these posts.
Topic Starter
Natsu

Fycho wrote:

On one side, can you reply Kibbleru's post: p/5703486?
I think it's worthy a fix in the most.
I was thinking alot about it and tbh, I think is fine, but I don't have problems changing it either, I just tho the pianos were more prominent in the second one.
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