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posted
Hi. Before this queue open a new round, i would like to know how's my map process going on (maybe also for Daikyi's map). I don't know it's ignored or something, but there's no any notification after the first mod.

I just want to say. If this queue can open every week, all of the request on the previous round should be done too before the next round. If not it will be the same like the others queue. Thanks
posted

Kyousuke- wrote:

Hi. Before this queue open a new round, i would like to know how's my map process going on (maybe also for Daikyi's map). I don't know it's ignored or something, but there's no any notification after the first mod.

I just want to say. If this queue can open every week, all of the request on the previous round should be done too before the next round. If not it will be the same like the others queue. Thanks
The problem is that most of us modded that already and it was bubbled by one of our members so there was noone to do anything with that map next. Right now though I just became a BN so I will be getting back to that after I'm done with all MWC work so don't worry
EDIT: Daikyi's map has been modded and maybe it will be moved forward as well

To all pepole: We cannot guarantee that your map will be ranked because we have only 2 BNs on board as of right now. Keep that in mind.
posted

Kyousuke- wrote:

Hi. Before this queue open a new round, i would like to know how's my map process going on (maybe also for Daikyi's map). I don't know it's ignored or something, but there's no any notification after the first mod.

I just want to say. If this queue can open every week, all of the request on the previous round should be done too before the next round. If not it will be the same like the others queue. Thanks
maybe not ignored totality, cuz all member on MMT maybe have a busy in work/school in IRL
posted
for my map, I've been talking w/ members of the MMT so i've been fine on my end I think

I know starry- is hella busy w/ the world cup, so there's been that. I know that i've been working to fix the majority of the tiny timing issues that are left in my map, and i just went through another mod w/ _underjoy.

Been doing a back and forth w/ starry- to hammer out the final touches on the map before the second bubble (at least I think that's what's happening)
posted
if you hope to get your song qualified for requesting a mod here i think you got the wrong idea p,p
posted

Harbyter wrote:

if you hope to get your song qualified for requesting a mod here i think you got the wrong idea p,p
Thank you so much, this is exactly what I want to say.

The endgoal of this queue is to improve your map to a point where the mapset would be deemed more than just "good enough for the ranked section". While we have certain members who can qualify maps, it is not their priority to bubble/rank your map unless they deem it more than good enough to be ranked. Our goal is to help you guys get substantial enough mods to improve your map and to prevent it from any DQs. We are not promising your maps to be qualified through this queue.

edit: I'll try to elaborate on the purpose of the queue and why we reject maps and all that when I get home. Typing on a phone is a drag.
posted
Convenient top page.

Shoegazer wrote:

Thank you so much, this is exactly what I want to say.

The endgoal of this queue is to improve your map to a point where the mapset would be deemed more than just "good enough for the ranked section". While we have certain members who can qualify maps, it is not their priority to bubble/rank your map unless they deem it more than good enough to be ranked. Our goal is to help you guys get substantial enough mods to improve your map and to prevent it from any DQs. We are not promising your maps to be qualified through this queue.
So what is the purpose of the queue?
The Mania Modding Team's purpose is to provide mods that are substantive enough to improve the quality of your map (whether it'd be through more profound musical relevancy, or better playability), to the point where it would exceed the quality of a typical ranked mapset. Or rather, to the point where you can look at your map and say "this is definitely a mapset that should be in the ranked section". This means that the higher priority is improving your map (and your mapping skills as a whole), not qualifying your map. While we might not be the best modders, we strive to be as elaborate in our modding as possible, giving reasons as to why we feel a certain way about a certain pattern and other things. You are free to do whatever you want with the mods that you were given of course, because you did what you have to do (mod a few maps or one from the special list) - we are not forcing you to do anything.

However, I do think that you should at least look at the mods and think about your thought processes behind certain patterning that is pointed out. If you have a gripe with a certain line in a mod, feel free to reject it, but I think it would be good to explain as to why you don't think it's a good suggestion. In the same vein, it is also good to look at it from the modder's perspective, going through their thought processes in a certain mod. If you agree with them, then you can adopt that certain view on a particular pattern and apply it to future charts. That's how you improve in mapping - though making mistakes and rationally justifying your own patterning. Mods are not just made to fix your map, they are supposed to help you improve as a mapper. This is why we try to be as elaborate as possible.


So what about getting our maps qualified/ranked? You have QATs/BNs!
We can rank your maps of course - we have QATs and BNs. However, we have pretty high standards on what should be ranked and what aren't. Again, we're not striving for maps that are "good enough for rank", we are trying to qualify exquisite maps that captivates players. You shouldn't expect your maps to be qualified through this queue, because chances are there are certain things that we would like to point out about your map before moving it to the ranked section - that takes time. If we have a lot to say about your map, that probably also means that your map might not necessarily be up to our standards yet.

...We also don't have that many BNs/QATs to begin with. Especially not at this point in time, where the only two BNs are -Kamikaze- and ajeemaniz, the latter who is pretty on-and-off when it comes to qualifications. Blocko and Starry- are busy with their own obligations. That's all the less reason to expect your map to be ranked.

I want you (not you in particular, talking about the general populace who is reading this) to take a step back and think of why you want your map ranked. Do you want more people to play your map? Do you think you will be deeply respected just because you have ranked maps? While the first point is completely fair and valid (but I'll address this a few sentences down the road), I don't think the second one is valid by any means. People are respected for maps that are enjoyable - and especially now, people don't see the "ranked" label as a "good" map. In fact, it's generally the contrary. Some of the more notable ranked maps get a lot of backlash for abusing the star rating system (intentionally or not) or just has one ridiculous section which people only play because it gives a good amount of PP. Other ranked maps are played, but aren't remembered too much and are shelved a few weeks down the road. We want to try to improve maps to the point where the maps are memorable and a journey to play through.

The point is that you should not necessarily be looking at the ranked section as the endgoal. Your main priority is to ensure that your chart is enjoyable to the largest audience possible. This includes players and mappers alike. It's not possible to appease everyone, but we're trying to reach that point. You are no longer making maps for yourself (or rather, it is not your top priority) when you are ranking a map. You are mapping for an audience. If your map only appeases to a very niche audience (and it's not intended to do so), you have failed in making a "good" ranked map. Given, there are some maps that will not be welcomed with warm applause at first, because they're intentionally (and justifiably) rigid in some form or another. Those maps are an exemption; and chances are, your map is not built based on a certain gimmick (e.g. difficult patterning). So try to improve your mapping to the point where you can make a good amount of people say "whoa, this map is really good", rather than push people around and say that you want your map ranked just because it doesn't break ranking criteria.


If you want our maps (and our mapping styles) to be better, why do you reject certain maps? Not to mention you have such a high cost - we have to mod three maps!
Let's talk about the "cost" of going through our queue first, because this is a smaller issue. The purpose of having such a relatively high cost compared to your conventional M4M is because the ulterior purpose of this queue is for mappers to give back to the community through modding. This is why we also expect the mods to be detailed (though this hasn't been looked at too in-depth yet... that should change soon). It doesn't have to be as structured as some other mods that are given by members of the MMT, but it should at least be more than just "move, move, ^, ^, remove".

You also don't have to mod three maps at all to begin with. You can just mod one of the maps in the special list. The maps in the special list are maps that require improvement for us to "accept" them back into the queue. Alternatively, the mappers who have their maps listed in the special list can skip through us entirely by you guys, by modding the map with constructive feedback. We have given reasons as to why we rejected the map, so you can use those points to help improve the map.

So why do we reject maps? We reject maps for a multitude of reasons - but the most common reasons would be song choice and the fact that the chart really isn't polished enough to begin with. A chart with glaring errors (such as following only the percussion and not the lead instruments, extremely questionable/inconsistent layering) will be rejected, because these are factors that should be easily modded to begin with. We would like your map to reach a certain level of quality through other modders before going to us - mainly because we think it would be excessive for us to go through 2 rounds of modding (one to ensure that everything is layered correctly and everything, basically typical RC shenanigans, and one to finish up and improve your chart) for just one map. In any case, our rejection reasons should be constructive enough for the mapper to improve on. You can ask other modders to look at these particular areas if necessary, since these are the areas that we feel require the most improvement more than anything else.

As for song choice, first we want to say that we don't explicitly discriminate the song itself because we think it sounds bad or anything like that. We only reject songs based by song choice because there is not much you can actually do with the song with our current ranking criteria. We don't say that we're rejecting songs based on song choice explicitly, because there are usually some elements about the song that causes this issue of just not being expressive enough to create an exquisite chart. We point out those instead. Those types of maps, I don't think will be (or at least, should be) put onto the special list. This is because the maps are generally polished enough and probably doesn't require that much improvement (so mods won't be too meaningful there) - their best bet is to get other BNs to get their maps ranked. Those maps aren't necessarily lost causes, but rather they are maps that we have little to really contribute.


That should be all. Hope this clears certain things up about what the queue is about. On a side note we're probably going to take the week off, or at least be open some time later this week. We've all been busy (I've been dealing with projects and exams, and many others are dealing with the same). Apologies for the inconvenience.
posted
after i read Shoegazer's wrote,i want to ask some before i post here and may cause trouble.

Shoegazer wrote:

The point is that you should not necessarily be looking at the ranked section as the endgoal. Your main priority is to ensure that your chart is enjoyable to the largest audience possible. This includes players and mappers alike. It's not possible to appease everyone, but we're trying to reach that point. You are no longer making maps for yourself (or rather, it is not your top priority) when you are ranking a map. You are mapping for an audience. If your map only appeases to a very niche audience (and it's not intended to do so), you have failed in making a "good" ranked map. Given, there are some maps that will not be welcomed with warm applause at first, because they're intentionally (and justifiably) rigid in some form or another. Those maps are an exemption; and chances are, your map is not built based on a certain gimmick (e.g. difficult patterning). So try to improve your mapping to the point where you can make a good amount of people say "whoa, this map is really good", rather than push people around and say that you want your map ranked just because it doesn't break ranking criteria.
i think good map and enjoyable map are quite different.good map is just looking good,made with good logical structure.enjoyable map is same as your playing level.for example,in my case, https://osu.ppy.sh/s/146299 https://osu.ppy.sh/s/114750 they are good maps for me,but they are not enjoyable maps for me because they are too easy for me.my enjoyable maps are like https://osu.ppy.sh/s/195940 https://osu.ppy.sh/s/217583.(i don't say they are not good map,it doesn't matter)

and idk what kind of maps mania people enjoy.
posted

shionelove wrote:

i think good map and enjoyable map are quite different.good map is just looking good,made with good logical structure.enjoyable map is same as your playing level.for example,in my case, https://osu.ppy.sh/s/146299 https://osu.ppy.sh/s/114750 they are good maps for me,but they are not enjoyable maps for me because they are too easy for me.my enjoyable maps are like https://osu.ppy.sh/s/195940 https://osu.ppy.sh/s/217583.(i don't say they are not good map,it doesn't matter)

and idk what kind of maps mania people enjoy.
No harm done, I see your viewpoint.

While you're correct that people will only enjoy maps at their skill level, the problem with your viewpoint is that you separate the objective aspects of a map (the structure of the map) and the subjective impression of the player (i.e. how much they enjoyed it). They are not necessarily separate things - a well-structured chart with nicely placed pitch relevancy will generally have positive reception to the audience intended. Each difficulty (or chart) has their own intended audience, which is why osu! as a whole encourages players to have a difficulty spread to go with your mapset for it to get ranked; you are catering as large of an audience as the song can provide.

People enjoy maps because they have a very logical and clear structure and they play well. What we do is that we are trying to improve or polish up on the structure, and also improve the playability of the chart by getting rid of patterning that creates a huge difficulty spike or something similar.

Hope this makes sense.
posted

Shoegazer wrote:

you are catering as large of an audience as the song can provide.
this sentence makes me feel easy :3 thank you for replying
posted
This informative post will be deleted anyway, just move along
posted

Rori Vidi Veni wrote:

Initially I thought that either I misinterpreted something, or you made mistakes while still having good intentions, However after Shoegazers clarification I am assured that this queue is bullshit. And I refer to just about everything except for not automatically ranking because IDGAF about ranking maps.

Oh well I can just not use... ohwait, you took half of the people that did antimeta maps and told them to not mod anything outside of this queue(see the red text in the announcement topic). In fact, you're now better off converting your chart and asking outside of the osu community for testplays, especially with keycounts that are popular elsewhere. And since there's only one 7K slot now, it's not that bad idea to ask for that in O2Jam communities either, especially if you chart in something like iBMSC instead of osu's editor(which surprisingly many people do).

Also, I don't believe charting should be about catering, it's not a public service, charting should be about having fun and doing the songs you like justice.
It would really help if you had some ability to think logically and the ability to refrain from throwing shit everywhere. That does not only count for this thread btw.
posted
Just as Shoegazer said, you have to take this queue as a "quality test" for your maps, the explanation that he just gave is perfect.
But I have to say that we tend to push maps who are different from the common stuff of the actual ranked pool (but still, we do check maps like TV Size or w/e). Even with that, we are still in test phase so we will figure out how to fix this "issues".

With that said, this week we will not open the queue because of the same reasons that shoegazer pointed. Sorry again for that.
posted
Well, it was a long wait but we were having reaally busy times (we still are a bit, some of the members arent avaiable) but we are ready to open a new round.

We rejected xi - Double Helixand it was added to the special list. We will do a check soon about the other maps in the special list to delete the ones already modded by more people.

We are still working on xi - Halcyone 5K map (we should have it done in the next days).

The other requests are done.


So with that, we will open 2 slots for 4K, 1 for 7K and 1 for other keymodes.

(random open ftw)
posted
mod: https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/p/4837788/ (picked from special list)

my map:https://osu.ppy.sh/s/402220

check 7+1k plz(i will delete 7k)

1diff, 5:18

thanks
posted
hi can i request again? (already 2 weeks more old request, if can't just ignore this)

3 recent mods
p/4776930#p4776930
p/4855085#p4855085
p/4838030#p4838030

map to be modded: https://osu.ppy.sh/s/400351 (4K map)

thanks!
posted
Shoegazer didn't mention that he also reject my ano hana map? Owo
anyways, Since my last req was rejected. so I could post again right?

My map: https://osu.ppy.sh/s/370502 4K (Not HS-ed yet)

Mod: p/4848773#p4848773 p/4843964#p4843964 p/4852870#p4852870
posted
my map https://osu.ppy.sh/s/364112 (ohter keymode/5k)
mod: t/395513/start=105 from special list

thank you
posted
https://osu.ppy.sh/s/405409 4k


old mods

p/4841885#p4841885
p/4840183#p4840183
p/4840226#p4840226


need some mods, if more of you can mod this thanks xd
posted
Because we have 2 requests from non 4k/7k maps we will take those instead of a 7K one. We close this queue now.

Once we finish voting we will post here which maps are rejected.
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