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tyrael6192
706 posts
Joined October 2010
tyrael6192

Vulf wrote:

Doesn't matter if it's more fun or not because at the same time it's just as frustrating if not more for others. You got to take into consideration of whats better for the game. Broken over powered champions are fun for people too and that is definitely not an excuse for them to stay that way.
games are made to have fun right? they aren't purely a battleground for the demonstration of mechanical skill. in fact, if they were, point and click suppression wouldn't exist. it has no place because it doesn't require or showcase mechanical skill to either use or avoid. at the same time i would argue that being ulted by warwick is more frustrating than having to dodge a spear because yes, you can dodge a spear and yes, you can do it consistently. using the term "forever" is null because yeah, occasionally you might get hit by a spear; but if you couldn't then it would be a null skill with 0 fun value for the enemy. still, it isn't an aimbot, and if you play the lane with your brain turned on you can avoid 100% of her spear damage.

the balance for frustration caused versus fun created is on my mind too, don't you worry; but you seem to have forgotten that getting suppressed while the enemy team pounds on you is one of the most frustrating things in the game, and something with 0 counterplay if you're behind and can't afford qss or you're not at that point of the game yet or maybe you have it but it's on cooldown. this being the case, the little counterplay that there is is very circumstantial and relies on factors outside of your own mechanical skill. your team has to set itself back just short of 8k gold in order to ensure that everyone has a means of avoiding his ult, and that's not fun nor satisfying
Vulf
17 posts
Joined November 2009
Vulf
Supression has no counterplay when you are behind? Are you joking? A breeze of the wind cancels warwick ult and then he dies because he is in the middle of 5 people. Even if it gets to the point a Warwick 1v5's your team you deserved to lose because you would have had to play like a dumb fuck for him to get to that level. Warwick has no early game at all thats his counter play. Even with his ult being simple it still requires knowledge of the game to use or else it would get you and your team killed for improper use.

Most of what you stated is purely opinion based, because I can say pretty much the same about skill shots.

Edit: If you watched any Korean tournies you would see that one landed Nidalee spear pretty much decided the team fight. Yep that's totally fun to play against. :)
tyrael6192
706 posts
Joined October 2010
tyrael6192
note that i'm not specifically advocating the nidalee spear in its current state with its current numbers. i do think it's ridiculous and on the off chance that you land one accidentally and significantly alter the outcome of a teamfight, it isn't fair or fun. but i still maintain the same argument regarding the mechanics of such skillshots in general.

also the majority of the playerbase doesn't have to face aimbot koreans but that's a minor and slightly racist point.
Vulf
17 posts
Joined November 2009
Vulf
I get what you are saying and I agree with some of it.

Comparing skill shots to a point in click in terms of out play potential and whats more fun to watch it's obvious skill shots will come out on top and that's fine. I'm just saying they can't be immune to balance decisions because they don't land 100% of the time. That just encourages some pretty heavy powercreep down the road.
Sapphiire_old_1
1,301 posts
Joined July 2013
Sapphiire_old_1
Wickd explaining why u should build trinity force on malphite :

First of all let's go over the usefullness of Trinity Force's stats.
30 Ability power.

In my opinion this is not very usefull due to Malphite's low AP Ratios which is also why you see AP Malphites go for a lot of magic penetration.

+30 Attack Damage
I don't see how this isn't usefull on Malphite with him having one of the best AD steriods in the entire game. +62% AD from his W is insane.

+30% attack speed
I don't see how that's any worse than on for example Irelia and she's known for buying Trinity Force. +30% attack speed combined with a 62% AD steriod yes please!

+10% Crit chanceThis is probably one of the best stats on him due to having the highest Attack Damage in the game from Trinity force alone.

+Health, Mana and movement speed are always good stats unless you're a manaless champion so let's not talk too much about those.
Trinity Force Passive.

So yes you are totally right that it's not the greatest passive in the game if you spam your abilities all at once, but who says you need to do that? I believe you can easily use r e w and then q to get 2 sheen procs which is still huge in a teamfight.
Overall I would say Trinity Force is extremely good on Malphite, but the main problem is his weak laning phase and that the components building into Trinity Force aren't that strong, but once you finish it he's a beast.
Last edited by Sapphiire_old_1 , edited 1 time in total.
Justykanna
1,090 posts
Joined April 2011
Justykanna

Vulf wrote:

If you are dying early as nasus you are doing something very very wrong.
Probably. There's a reason I stopped using him. He's not exactly my top champion of choice anyway.
I'd be nice if the only solution to making trades wasn't 'wait for him to go oom' though... Like you said, he shouldn't ooming.
And I don't play Jax or Riven. xD
Ceph23
687 posts
Joined September 2013
Ceph23
On to the next underused champ. Skarner.
I actually like playing this guy. Sure the ult has a lot of limitations (like having to walk straight through the enemy team to get that high-priority target) and he hardly does any damage, this guy can just punish a person who isn't paying attention.
I'm pretty sure there is someone out there who can play this guy well. 'cause I sure as hell can't.
Bakano
7 posts
Joined July 2013
Bakano

Ceph23 wrote:

On to the next underused champ. Skarner.
I actually like playing this guy. Sure the ult has a lot of limitations (like having to walk straight through the enemy team to get that high-priority target) and he hardly does any damage, this guy can just punish a person who isn't paying attention.
I'm pretty sure there is someone out there who can play this guy well. 'cause I sure as hell can't.
I cry every time I play Akali and then there's a Skarner pick.

I no longer have a fun time dashing to enemies and killing them. Instead, I get ult'd and killed.

:(
Sapphiire_old_1
1,301 posts
Joined July 2013
Sapphiire_old_1

Ceph23 wrote:

On to the next underused champ. Skarner.
I actually like playing this guy. Sure the ult has a lot of limitations (like having to walk straight through the enemy team to get that high-priority target) and he hardly does any damage, this guy can just punish a person who isn't paying attention.
I'm pretty sure there is someone out there who can play this guy well. 'cause I sure as hell can't.

Skarner scales well off of nearly every stat in the game, and attack speed can be roughly translated to CDR for him as well. Is it more worthwhile to build full tank and CDR, so that you can spam your perma-slow all throughout a teamfight, or to build more of a tanky DPS role, with items like Wit's End and Iceborne Gauntlet to do good damage and still remain relatively tanky?
Skarner was used during season 2, but fell off steeply later, which most attribute to the nerf to his ult. The nerf was for the occasion where an enemy would blink or dash during the cast time of his ultimate, and instead of escaping they would be dragged right back into Skarner, and their blink would be on cooldown. Now that he is never used competitively, do you think reverting the nerf would bring him back?
With Skarner's rework revealed, more emphasis is being put on his E, becoming his new slow, while his attack speed buff has been moved onto his Q from his shield.
Ceph23
687 posts
Joined September 2013
Ceph23

SoG Tava wrote:

Skarner scales well off of nearly every stat in the game, and attack speed can be roughly translated to CDR for him as well. Is it more worthwhile to build full tank and CDR, so that you can spam your perma-slow all throughout a teamfight, or to build more of a tanky DPS role, with items like Wit's End and Iceborne Gauntlet to do good damage and still remain relatively tanky?
Skarner was used during season 2, but fell off steeply later, which most attribute to the nerf to his ult. The nerf was for the occasion where an enemy would blink or dash during the cast time of his ultimate, and instead of escaping they would be dragged right back into Skarner, and their blink would be on cooldown. Now that he is never used competitively, do you think reverting the nerf would bring him back?
With Skarner's rework revealed, more emphasis is being put on his E, becoming his new slow, while his attack speed buff has been moved onto his Q from his shield.
I don't think reverting the nerf will bring him back. These new champs just offers up so much more than him. Though I do still find him enjoyable to play. And that's what really matters :D
Sapphiire_old_1
1,301 posts
Joined July 2013
Sapphiire_old_1

SoG Tava wrote:

I don't think reverting the nerf will bring him back
This what CloudTemlar says about skarner : From my point of view… Basically, if you ask me, I don’t care about anything else except this. If they just revert the nerf on his ultimate, I’ll immediately play him in tournaments. Those nerfs were rather too much. Yes, stats actually don’t have that big of a meaning.

Sure u can have your opinions but if a Korean Pro player say somthing about a champ u can be sure he is damn right
Last edited by Sapphiire_old_1 , edited 1 time in total.
Vulf
17 posts
Joined November 2009
Vulf
Skarner is another good example of how stupid powercreep is in League.

I personally think he is fine how he is. The big problem is that he currently suffers from what jungle Warwick suffers from and that is the way the jungle mechanics have changed over time. He was good in season 2 because of how extremely fast he cleared the jungle and how potent his ganks were because you couldn't start wards and if you were slightly over extended you would either die from perma slow or burn a summoner.

Then season 3 jungle happened followed by Zac and Vi who do everything he wants to do.

Edit: They aren't going to bring back the whole ult flash mechanic because I'm pretty sure that was a bug to begin with and I find it very sad people were playing him only to abuse that mechanic. What they should have done was make skarners ult briefly root the target so they can't flash. This way the target isn't screwed out of a summoner because of some coding bug.
Ceph23
687 posts
Joined September 2013
Ceph23
Damn it. Now I feel like playing skarner.
Sapphiire_old_1
1,301 posts
Joined July 2013
Sapphiire_old_1

Ceph23 wrote:

Damn it. Now I feel like playing skarner.
What are u waiting for ? :P
maal
maal
wow do you guys think i want to read all this jesus fuck
BrokenArrow
2,236 posts
Joined June 2010
BrokenArrow
Alright I'm officially gonna main Kha jungle. I thought I just had lucky games but it seems like I really am god after all.

Ceph23
687 posts
Joined September 2013
Ceph23

BrokenArrow wrote:

Alright I'm officially gonna main Kha jungle. I thought I just had lucky games but it seems like I really am god after all.

I've never had a bad game as jugle kha'zix, I don'think enyone does, but I still do lose.
I think zix is one of those really amazing cahmpions to play. Also very enjoyable.
Heather
2 posts
Joined December 2013
Heather
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Last edited by Heather , edited 1 time in total.
Cyclohexane
osu! Alumni
4,568 posts
Joined May 2009
Cyclohexane


help how do I carry
tyrael6192
706 posts
Joined October 2010
tyrael6192
what how did they even win that

???
/??????????
psKirika
81 posts
Joined November 2012
psKirika
long games are easy turned. By that time most of the champs have good gold, if any team is able to ace the other team, that's gg. Rumble probably got caught once or smth
Nofool
Elite Mapper
1,102 posts
Joined February 2011
Nofool
even fed, rumble won't make the difference with only 3 ap items :c (no raba), better catch vayne é_è and yeah lategame so everyone had enough stuff so one bad team fight and...
maal
maal
dims where are you imma punch ur face
Miyu
1,283 posts
Joined September 2012
Miyu

Mr Color wrote:



help how do I carry
i tried qq
BrokenArrow
2,236 posts
Joined June 2010
BrokenArrow
Oh hey duo jungle is actually a thing with premades
Pick a jungler who can make good use of blue buff, one who needs red buff and a midlaner without ressources
Split the jungle equally and make sure to invade as much as possible to make the enemy jungler have a bad time = even more farm
Add much ganks and very dragon/baron control
= Win 4v5 easily okay and that might also be because Riven is broken


maal
maal
have ur botlane feed 30 kills to the enemy adc and jungler and the story would be entirely different
Miyu
1,283 posts
Joined September 2012
Miyu

maal wrote:

have ur botlane feed 30 kills to the enemy adc and jungler and the story would be entirely different
Indeed,not all games are good lol,not all players can do well @ solobot
BrokenArrow
2,236 posts
Joined June 2010
BrokenArrow
Well in SoloQ people tend to push their lane when they have an advantage instead of freezing so it wasn't that much of a problem for Sivir to stay alive and farm under turret
she still went afk but it was ok, all the other lanes had an advantage at that point
Vulf
17 posts
Joined November 2009
Vulf
With the changes to ambient gold and early objectives it is a lot easier for the losing team to rubber band effect and win a game now. I doubt it will stay this way though because this encourages passive play/turtling and people don't want to watch that crap in high level tournaments. :(


Speaking of feeding bot lane. No one knows what to do against a Warwick support. Still winning games.
MF lagged out for about 5 mins, but it didn't matter since every time my ult was up we (me mostly) deleted sona and sivir couldn't do shit about that. Oh and their jungler camped the hell out of bottom hence why our top lane kat was 9/0.

Kanye West
2,222 posts
Joined July 2011
Kanye West

tyrael6192 wrote:

what how did they even win that

???
/??????????
They probably got shitstomped in early and midgame but didn't lose too many objectives, then farmed+pressured the map, maybe got some picks and free objectives and got a lategame ace to end
SiFly_old
0 posts
Joined April 2013
SiFly_old

Kanye West wrote:

tyrael6192 wrote:

what how did they even win that

???
/??????????
They probably got shitstomped in early and midgame but didn't lose too many objectives, then farmed+pressured the map, maybe got some picks and free objectives and got a lategame ace to end
They had nidalee support. You never win with nidalee support. Don't know how you guys even expected to win.

Nidalee support -> not buy sightstone -> have no vision -> can't pressure since you have no vision -> can't push advantages -> game stalls -> still can't pressure -> people try to pressure -> people get caught -> lose game

This game is so easy to understand. Also the main reason why I have huge winrate as support, without even playing that well. Vision carries games. Still in plat most supports play the vision game terrible.
Kanye West
2,222 posts
Joined July 2011
Kanye West
Nidalee support actually works in high elo, Bischu played it many times. But yeah I agree, you need to buy a sightstone and pink wards
SiFly_old
0 posts
Joined April 2013
SiFly_old

Kanye West wrote:

Nidalee support actually works in high elo, Bischu played it many times. But yeah I agree, you need to buy a sightstone and pink wards
That has a 0.1% chance to happen. Low chance for either, but sightstone + pinks, won't happen.
Miyu
1,283 posts
Joined September 2012
Miyu


that went a bit better
Kanye West
2,222 posts
Joined July 2011
Kanye West

SiFly wrote:

Kanye West wrote:

Nidalee support actually works in high elo, Bischu played it many times. But yeah I agree, you need to buy a sightstone and pink wards
That has a 0.1% chance to happen. Low chance for either, but sightstone + pinks, won't happen.
fixed
Vulf
17 posts
Joined November 2009
Vulf
In solo queue anything can work if you are good enough with that champion. Heck I would even say this could apply in premades.
maal
maal

Vulf wrote:

In solo queue anything can work if you are good enough with that champion. Heck I would even say this could apply in premades.
i'd like to see u play ap riven thx
tyrael6192
706 posts
Joined October 2010
tyrael6192
wasn't there a bug where hourglass made her ult spammable

ap riven viable
Vulf
17 posts
Joined November 2009
Vulf

maal wrote:

Vulf wrote:

In solo queue anything can work if you are good enough with that champion. Heck I would even say this could apply in premades.
i'd like to see u play ap riven thx

It's already been done lol. Can't remember who that streamer was though.

There was even a guy who was doing a zero item jungle vlad, but he ended up getting banned after awhile. :(
maal
maal
evidence thx
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