Tidek wrote:

Before it will be ranked

05:15:476 - 05:20:373 - Those SVs are really TOO strong, I recommend to make them a little weaker (maybe 1,5-0,5? or 1,75-0,25). Not gonna lie, if u have shitty monitor (and pretty low fps), then it looks really bad and its painful to read.

Yoshiap wrote:

Doing a check of all SV's, since otherwise nobody else will.

Also Tidek, I think those SV's are fine (see reasoning in the box). Though I can totally see why you wouldn't think they're ok.

can you love me now?

00:33:843 - .90x goes into...
00:34:251 - 1.50x/.50x = 1.0x. Maybe change to 1.40x/.40x instead? (or 1.30x/.50x)
Also, could consider starting the wubbing at 00:33:843 - , or making the shaking increase gradually. i'll just make it shake more gradually, personally felt that the first bar didn't really have any effect as the next note was out of sight for most scroll speeds hmm

00:30:986 - .95x vs.
00:33:843 - .90x vs.
00:37:516 - 1.00x (and so on)
If anything, you should switch the .95x/.90x? They don't necessarily have to be all consistent. Some are meant for pauses and some are centered around 1.0 SV due to heavy effects, but mostly revolving around the 0.9 to 1.1 area so that the scroll speed doesn't go overboard

00:46:904 - No SV's here? Could try something similar to 00:26:496 - oh right, that could work, imma add some stuff

00:50:986 - Possibly a slight slowdown? Just fell off of a buildup in both music/pattern.Set a 0.95 so that it doesn't really affect the game play that much

00:54:251 - Yay fountains ' w' !
01:00:373 - Could consider lagging with 1/16ths here? lagged a bit
01:04:455 - Could add something here, considering for the same sound back in 00:57:925 - you have an SV. (Admittedly, you don't have a LN here anymore, and I'm not modding the patterns.) ehhh might want to just omit this as there is a stutter before so it kinda feels a bit overkill

02:12:618 - These are so good. www
02:23:435 - These all add up to 1.00x, even though the non-bumps have been running at 0.90x before this. Considering your making the shaking build up anyways, maybe recompute some of the earlier ones to slowly build up to 1.00x speed? uhhhhhh kinda bumped it up gradually by 0.02
02:25:680 - 1.30x bumps feel much weaker when going at 1.00x normally. Maybe bump them up a bit more? raised to 1.4
02:28:945 - Camellia why you skip beat -_- - _ ______ -

02:30:782 - 1/12 lag vs.
02:31:190 - 1/16 lag. Feels like you should make these 2 the same. Also, the overall amount of laginess here doesn't feel as nice as before, as its just simply constant lag throughout the phrase. uhhh i think i'll just keep it as it is since the lag difference is almost negligible during play, it's supposed to lag more than the previous anyways woop

02:38:741 - You go back up to 1.40x bumps here (mostly referring to previous comment). Admittedly, you feel this less since they're just stuck to an LN instead of rice.
02:43:639 - As shown by the fact you don't continue it here.
02:44:455 - Or here. This whole section is rather repetitive so I used LN to change up how this is structured so that it doesn't get too boring

02:48:945 - Why do you have 3 bookmarks here??? uh
02:49:353 - If you feel particualrly daring, you can try using the same idea all the way back from 00:26:496 - again. changed up some stuff

02:57:925 - A bit sudden. Maybe you should try adding something at 02:58:027 - the net is 1.0 scroll speed so uh it should be fine i guess

03:04:353 - Not too confusing while playing, but the SV's do not add up here nicely. On the other hand, I can't think of an easy fix. So idk. ehhhh it adds up to 1.0 so it should be fiiine

03:10:986 - Bit weird to have such a huge jump like that, especially since it sounds like there's another note at 03:11:190 - as well. hmm not sure what to think about this, i can easily memorise this though so im not sure lol, people didn't have any problems with this except for telling themselves to jumptrill instead of playing it legitly, the jump is intended as the map signals the usage of a jumptrill for dense jumpstream

04:02:720 - The gap between this and the next note is somewhat big, so it feels like a somewhat jarring transition. it's intended to be big due to the rhythm

04:16:700 - This builds from 0.60x to 1.00x, while...
04:23:231 - goes frokm 0.80x to 1.00x. It feels like this is picking up the previous buildup after a small interruption in the middle, so maybe you can make the 2 buildups intersect a bit? (Like maybe 0.60 to 0.85, and 0.75 to 1.00, for instance.) Had to go from 0.6 to 0.9 and 0.8 to 1.00 due to the 1.0 section in the middle, i wanted smooth transition from the first synth to the jump, it kinda overlaps currently i guess

04:32:618 - 0.90x ...
04:35:476 - to 1.00x ...
04:39:149 - Back to 0.90x again. You don't have a LN this time.
04:42:006 - And back to 1.0x again. Decide :< special effects = 1.0, blanks < 1.0

05:15:476 - This SV will almost certainly be controversial. I think this entire section is fine though. The first part of this is regular enough such that even if this is the first time seeing this section, you can grasp the pattern quickly, and know how to play it, not to mention having done it before. I remember this part was supposed to be intentionally borderline undreadable. Once you reach...
05:18:741 - There are 2 points to this. A. For players that don't want to acc this part, they can jumptrill this. Not to mention that this exact same setup occurs at 02:09:353 - , kind of repeated 03:11:394 - , and emphasizes the jumptrillness at 04:49:353 - . If someone wanted to pass this part, they know exactly what they need to do. B. If they want to acc this section, its actually still neverthless readable. Definitely trickier, but still readable. meant to be 100% unreadable anyways, if the player refuses to adapt to this map then he can just fail it i guess

06:53:027 - Any reason for the random speedup at the end? Idk, it might trip up some people. Probably not. it's fine for me and most testplayers so imma just uh leave it, it's supposed to be a small speedup anyways

Somehow I managed to crash the game at the end of this. To anybody else checking SV's or anyone that cares, all the SV values not mentioned (and actually, most of the ones mentioned) are all correct. Even the really strange looking numbers. not sure what is the crash but i've crashed once woop

Evening wrote:

Tidek wrote:

Before it will be ranked

05:15:476 - 05:20:373 - Those SVs are really TOO strong, I recommend to make them a little weaker (maybe 1,5-0,5? or 1,75-0,25). Not gonna lie, if u have shitty monitor (and pretty low fps), then it looks really bad and its painful to read.

yea it is a pain to read, which is intended

Blocko wrote:

Everything here seems entirely subjective to me '_>'

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[did i say i love you?]

maybe you did, maybe you didn't

00:21:496 (21496|3) - Move to 2? You didn't have that little trill on 03:37:312 - . made that a trill then

00:54:251 (54251|1,54251|0) - Add finishes here

00:56:496 (56496|0,56598|1) - Add claps here, similar to what you have on 01:03:027 - .

01:00:782 (60782|2) - Add finish here

01:07:108 - Add a note here for that drum tom Focusing on the synth, not sure about having a note here, kinda dilutes the effect

01:13:843 (73843|1) - Add finish here

01:17:108 (77108|2,77108|3) - Add finishes here

01:26:700 (86700|0,86700|3,86802|2,86802|0) - Add claps here for that kick

01:41:190 (101190|2,101190|0,101190|3,102006|0,102006|1,102006|2) - Remove claps for some hitsound consistency?

01:55:884 (115884|0) - Clap here

01:59:557 (119557|3,119557|2) - Add another clap n finish
02:00:373 (120373|2,120373|3) -
02:01:190 (121190|2,121190|3) -
02:02:006 (122006|1,122006|3) -
02:02:822 (122822|1,122822|0) -
02:03:639 (123639|2,123639|1) -
02:04:455 (124455|2,124455|0) -
02:05:271 (125271|2,125271|1) -
02:47:720 (167720|3,167720|2) -
02:48:027 (168027|1,168027|3) -
02:48:333 (168333|3,168333|2) -

02:06:088 (126088|2) - Add finish here

02:12:618 (132618|3,132618|2) - Add finishes here

02:25:680 (145680|3,145680|2) - Add finishes here

02:38:741 (158741|2,158741|3) - Add finishes here

02:48:435 (168435|0) - Add clap here

02:48:537 (168537|3,168537|1) - Add finishes here

02:50:169 (170169|2,170169|0) - Add claps here

02:51:802 (171802|0,171802|1) - Add finishes here

02:57:108 - Add a note here? o ok

04:29:761 (269761|2,269761|3) - Add claps here

04:36:292 (276292|1,276292|0) - Switch these claps into finishes

04:55:884 (295884|1,295884|3) - Switch these into claps and finishes

05:05:271 (305271|2,305680|1,305986|2,306292|1,306598|1,307312|0,307312|2) - Add finishes here? probably a bit excessive

05:08:945 (308945|0,308945|1) - Add finishes here

05:22:414 (322414|3,322414|2,322414|0,322516|1) - Remove claps for some hitsound consistency

05:28:537 (328537|0) - Add finish here

06:05:271 (365271|3,365271|0) - Add claps here

06:32:822 - I think you missed a note here

06:39:455 - Some of the notes in the ending are a little bit early compared to the song. Might wanna double check those snaps just in case.

---- 06:40:680 (400680|1) - This is 1/32 early but lol osu
---- 06:40:680 (400680|1,401343|0) - shifted the joint 1/16 later
---- 06:45:067 (405067|2) - 1/32 early
---- 06:45:629 (405629|1) - 1/64 early
---- 06:46:700 (406700|3) - 1/32 early
---- 06:47:771 (407771|1) - 1/48 early(?)
---- 06:48:333 (408333|0) - 1/32 late
---- 06:48:843 (408843|3) - 1/32 early
---- 06:49:914 (409914|1) - 1/32 early

shifted HP to 9.2



puranetto seipaa

Evening wrote:

shifted HP to 9.2

at least i passed it with 9.2 woop

Blocko wrote:

Evening wrote:

shifted HP to 9.2

eh

Reduce HP to 9? I understand increasing HP discourages mash-passing, but then you also encourage players to jumptrill certain patterns if they wanna pass it, and said patterns are pretty mashy to me, so this whole idea doesn't really make a lot of sense.

at least i passed it with 9.2 woop

Evening wrote:

I don't know how many times I've said that some patterns are made to be jumptrilled

Mashing isn't wrong, it is a technique that players can use in the right situations
If it looks stupid but it works it aint that stupid

And whata the differnece between 9.2 and 9 going to make anyways, sounds like you're just being picky

Evening wrote:

I don't know how many times I've said that some patterns are made to be jumptrilled

Mashing isn't wrong, it is a technique that players can use in the right situations
If it looks stupid but it works it aint that stupid

And whata the differnece between 9.2 and 9 going to make anyways, sounds like you're just being picky

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Blocko wrote:

You're right, mashing isn't wrong, but for others, it's sort of discouraged when players are trying to get a score with really good accuracy on a map. That's entirely on them, though.

Blocko wrote:

Evening wrote:

I don't know how many times I've said that some patterns are made to be jumptrilled

Mashing isn't wrong, it is a technique that players can use in the right situations
If it looks stupid but it works it aint that stupid

And whata the differnece between 9.2 and 9 going to make anyways, sounds like you're just being picky

You're right, mashing isn't wrong, but for others, it's sort of discouraged when players are trying to get a score with really good accuracy on a map. That's entirely on them, though.

But, um, dude, what's up with turning HP to 10?
I'm strongly suggesting you to switch it back to 9.2. 9 was just to be a bit forgiving for other players (which was pretty much the reason behind my suggestion to begin with), and 9.2 is still tolerable as the map still lets itself play for its designated audience. 10 just limits your audience into a very small one, and that's way too much, man. shifted to 9.5, it's meant to be a challenge anyways, was thinking of just putting it higher but people will get mad


With all that said, I think you can get the snaps in the ending to be as close as possible using 1/12s even though some of them sound 1/32 early or late.

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[did you say you love me?]

snaps and stuff

00:33:843 (33843|1,33843|0) - Snap those LN ends to 00:34:557 - with 1/4? That's when the next synth note occurs. This goes according to the SV changes, don't think it really makes a difference at that point anyways
00:40:373 (40373|0,40373|1) - Same as above, on 00:41:088 - ^

02:11:292 (131292|2) - Not sure but is this supposed to be on 02:11:317 - ? uhh no

03:07:720 (187720|1,187788|2,187856|0,187925|1,187993|3,188061|1) - I think this is supposed to be 1/8. Source: ddream ok this is pretty shit to play on 1/8 hold on

03:16:292 - Add 2 notes here with clap hitsounds for that kick? personal preference, no

03:54:863 (234863|2,234931|1,234999|2) - I think these notes are supposed to be in 1/8. did this for playability but w/e
04:07:925 (247925|2,247993|1,248061|2) - Same as above

04:35:476 (275476|1,275476|0) - Snap those LN ends to 04:36:190 - with 1/4? That's when the next synth note occurs. same reasoning as prev

05:20:442 (320442|2,320510|1) - Should be 1/8 starting from 05:20:476 - .

06:33:639 (393639|3,393690|2,393741|1) - I think you missed a little trill here like all the others. meant to be


Here are some snaps that are as close as possible to the song:
06:40:067 (400067|2) - With 1/16, 06:40:093 -
06:40:680 (400680|1) - With 1/16, 06:40:705 -
06:41:343 (401343|0) - With 1/12, 06:41:360 - this should be fine
06:42:567 (402567|2) - With 1/4, 06:42:618 - moved 1/16 later instead
06:43:180 (403180|1) - With 1/16, 06:43:205 -
06:45:067 (405067|2) - With 1/16, 06:45:093 -
06:45:629 (405629|1) - With 1/12, 06:45:646 -
06:46:700 (406700|3) - With 1/16, 06:46:726 -
06:47:261 (407261|2) - With 1/12, 06:47:278 - this should be fine
06:47:771 (407771|1) - With 1/4, 06:47:822 - uhh no, it's way too late
06:48:843 (408843|3) - With 1/16, 06:48:868 -
06:49:914 (409914|1) - With 1/16, 06:49:940 -



And here are some snaps unsupported in the editor (just wanna mention them):
01:04:047 - 1/18
01:46:088 - 1/20
04:55:476 - 1/10

hmm

Shoegazer wrote:

Hey there, will be speaking for the Mania Modding Team.

I want to start by saying that I (personally, at least) think the chart is pretty enjoyable to play through. It has its appeal, its gimmicks are very nice and the SVs, while might be difficult for some, aren't unacceptable by any means and gave the chart a distinctive personality.

However, while I think the chart is very good playability-wise; the map just fiddles around between what is rankable and what isn't - to the point where we didn't think that it should be ranked because of how grey the area is. The chart is very distinctively a dump chart - rather a chart that is really overlayered - considering that about 60% of the chart are chords, but it could be layered a lot less heavily because the song really isn't all that heavy. Even if you could justify the chart's heaviness though, the layering scheme is pretty inconsistent, or rather not really resounding. Sections like 02:12:618 - , where quads are used very liberally, though it is used quite sparsely before in far more intense areas (e.g. the buildup) and 01:33:435 - , where triples aren't used anywhere as frequently anywhere as the part before - despite being only a tiny bit less intense.

Personally didn't look at this track as 1 whole song in general, instead a mash up of different sectioned as indicated by their respective "unique" patterning, probably did miss out on the consistency in terms of note counts in chords used.

@ 02:12:618 - More of a personal opinion but I feel that note counts in chords don't really matter if the playability of the chart intended is shown when I testplayed the map, I feel that using quads makes the feeling gotten when playing skew more towards the "control" instead of the "mashing" aspect in which is what I am trying to get here. The feeling gotten when playing those quads kinda matches the "sudden" movement in the track itself in which is also paired with a swing/bump SV there

@ 01:33:435 - kind of the same idea here, I focus more on the "control" itself rather than using quads as they kinda throw player's control off more, intended to make this as "flowy" as possible while making use of jacks instead of streams hence the really high playability in this section.

Though my main complaint is probably the dense jumpstream sections. The patterns aren't necessarily bad, far from it - you're supposed to 1/6 jumptrill it. But that's also the problem, you're kinda exploiting a flaw in the ranking criteria - that you're not allowed to chart a particular rhythm in any snap that is not divisible by 2. (e.g. 1/8s -> 1/4s are fine, 1/8s -> 1/6s are not). Considering that the dense jumpstream is practically impossible to SS unless you're ungodly good at the game, the dense JS is a massive spike as it is. You might as well use a 1/6 jumptrill instead, but you're not allowed to do that. Trying to mimick a certain pattern that you want to do with a completely different pattern is probably pushing it, and might not be rankable to begin with.

I understand this, personally feel like 1/6 was rather hard to catch accurately with the music mainly on a non-1/3swing rhythm, not too sure what to really replace this with except a simple stream in which i feel that it's kinda not what I'm really aiming for, but on a second look at this section, I guess the note density can get thinner as the music's build up fades out, i guess it's somewhat better but it's not really what i'm aiming for currently in this chart in general

something like : (not really going to upload/update to this version though)


The other complaint seemed to be about the SVs being a bit too exaggerated, but they're not necessarily talking about the last SV. I don't really hold this opinion, but it's something to consider. Maybe you can ask them (particularly Jole and underjoy) as to which SVs they're mainly referring to, but since they didn't give a specific SV I'm assuming that it's a general issue.

Yeaaa, didn't really make this to be 100% SS-able therefore the jumptrill 1/6 thingy but i guess these kinds of maps are strictly not-rankable. Not sure what to really think about the SVs right now, they feel ok for me lol

Again though, no one in the team has said that the map is bad or is unsatisfactory quality-wise for rank. It is far from it, most of us enjoyed for what it is, playability-wise. It's just that it probably isn't appropriate for the ranked section just yet. Maybe when the Ranking Criteria gets reconstructed, then it might have a chance of getting into the ranked section. There really isn't much I can particularly point out about the chart, because the chart, aside from layering inconsistencies, is fine. If you want it to be perfectly rankable, you'd have to redo the entire chart and I'm very sure that's not something that you want to do at all.

I'm personally not quite sure why your chart is in the special list however, your chart is an edge case and unfortunately will not have much benefit if put on the special list. In any case, good luck with your future maps - your charts are pretty good.

Thanks for posting this explanation btw, really appreciate that you can give a closure on this issue that has been bugging me for quite a bit

This isn't a mod by any means, so don't give kudosu to this. This is just reasoning as to why we decided to reject your map.

Evening wrote:

basically what's preventing this from ranking is the jumptrill, SVs and inconsistency in note counts in chord usage is still intended, if i amend the jumptrill to a 1/8 stream will this still be rankable

there's also no definitive rule saying that every map should be 100-able humanly

idk why is 1/6 over a 1/8 section a problem, some songs/maps require you to play at a rhythm that doesn't follow a specific rhythm as the rhythm hasn't been established in the player's mind yet, for example the first notes in the music or even some notes in this track that doesn't really even follow a 1/4 nor 1/6 rhythm, it's more of a dynamic rhythm that focuses mainly on you visualizing the gaps between the notes in the map correctly. So why is it that 1/6 is not allowed over a 1/8? Personally don't really feel like making a 1/8 jumptrill cause that's dumb and 1/8 streams are just horribly underwhelming, why is it that people can't play 1/6 over that rhythm visually by approximating all rolls to a jump? I can do that so I have no idea what's wrong

dumps are already ranked, not even talking about AiAe, altale is a very distinctive dump, if I were to map the altale track without the BMS I wouldn't even know there were 1/6s, heck, I wouldn't even know those 1/6 exists, I bet 99.99% of the players don't even realize that when they listened to it, it felt more like a chilling track than that of a 1/6 stream song, do maps have to have a BMS chart behind it to justify everything?

I really would like to just create a song using 1% volume samples over some lounge track and call those 1/32 streams justified

so why is it that I can't use 1/6 to go over a 1/8? It is the perfect snap to jumptrill at this skill level without it going overboard and without it feeling like the most underwhelming pattern in the universe, so why can't the ranking system, not even talking about the ranking criteria, the ranking system just bend and let this map go through?

I highly doubt there is a more fitting pattern for this section than this, this follows what I wanted, a map that doesn't give the player a free 100%, this is to create replayability this also includes the more expressive SV changes, a map that doesn't just give you a massive ass spike at any point, of course it's a massive spike if you want to 100% this but that's a mindset, not a criteria to rank any map, if you really want to 100% every map in existence i hope you try this map on halftime.

This is NOT aimed at those top tier players that want to go for 100%s and 1 000 000s, this is aimed at those around my skill level, god damn this is not a fucking MA file.

BNs are supposed to cover the subjective part in this ranking criteria area, not follow 100% on the norm of people ranking maps, feels like you guys are just restricting everything because you're afraid of what is going to happen next and I have to agree with you, it's a risky move as it promotes more expressive+edgy cases in terms of ranking maps, but god damn if no one is going to rank these files who the fuck would and why the fuck would people even map anything away from all these standard patterns and standard songs, no one will ever do that anymore and that is why no one plays ranked maps.