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osu! World Cup 2015 - Discussion Thread

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Ayako
proud that sg managed to win 2 songs against netherlands :3
Karuta-_old_1

Loctav wrote:

Bancho outputs all scores upon map end. Even disconnect-after-map-end players, that sometimes do not show up on the MP link, are shown there and can be calculated properly
So you are saying Chaoslitz's score didn't count because it didn't "submit"?

forget what I said then
SuzumiyaBR
Sala do BR criada , lets go streamers
invidia_old

fartownik wrote:

Can we get some up-to-date standings on the groups?

And please update the Wiki page, especially with the link to the results page. Some links are really hard to find if you're not on the stream.
Group A
Mexico - record 0-2 - differential -7
Malaysia - record 2-1 - differential +4
Australia - record 1-2 - differential -3
United States - record 2-0 - differential +6

United States and Malaysia move on, seeding to be decided.

Group B
Italy - record 0-1 - differential -3
Lithuania - record 0-2 - differential -5
Hong Kong - record 2-1 - differential +3
France - record 2-0 - differential +5

Lithuania out.

Group C
Ukraine - record 1-1 - differential -1
Latvia - record 0-1 - differential -3
Canada - record 0-1 - differential -4
Poland - record 2-0 - differential +8

Poland moves on (seed not confirmed technically).

Group D
Philippines - record 0-3 - differential -10
Japan - record 1-2 - differential -4
United Kingdom - record 2-1 - differential +5
China - record 3-0 - differential +9

China (1st seed) and United Kingdom (second seed) move on.

Group E
New Zealand - record 1-2 - differential 0
Argentina - record 0-3 - differential -9
Finland - record 2-1 - differential -1
South Korea - record 3-0 - differential +10

South Korea (1st seed) and Finland (second seed) move on.

Group F
Greece - record 0-1 - differential -4
Norway - record 0-1 - differential -2
Brazil - record 1-0 - differential +2
Russian Federation - record 1-0 - differential +4

Nothing decided.

Group G
Singapore - record 0-3 - differential -7
Thailand - record 2-1 - differential +2
Netherlands - record 2-0 - differential +5
Germany - record 1-1 - differential 0

Singapore out.
Possibilities:
Netherlands wins: Netherlands and Thailand in
Germany wins 4-2 or 4-3: Netherlands and Thailand in
Germany wins 4-1: Germany in other spot depends on score
Germany wins 4-0: Germany and Thailand in

Group H
Portugal - record 1-2 - differential -3
Sweden - record 0-3 - differential -6
Austria - record 3-0 - differential +8
Taiwan - record 2-1 - differential +1

Austria (1st seed) and Taiwan (second seed) move on.


Sorry for any mistakes, I did this quickly. I don't know if the tournament is using placement in groups for round of 16.
fartownik
Neat. Thanks.
SuzumiyaBR
Rip Greece , Boa galera, Brasil nas eliminatórias
fartownik

Clumsy Thoughts in a nutshell
Tebz188

fartownik wrote:


Clumsy Thoughts in a nutshell
stream said the whole time that Russia was winning XD
buny

tbag188 wrote:

fartownik wrote:


Clumsy Thoughts in a nutshell
stream said the whole time that Russia was winning XD
index played extraordinarily well that match
CXu
-PC please.
SuzumiyaBR
Game of Fail : 1st Game >>Lativia 1 player and Canda 2 players,,, Lativia win
- Sorveig
Go Brazil~ :oops:
Tebz188
Spoiler
Dat 4-0 by Germany against Netherlands :O
Neliel
Dude after that Hana Tsubomi my hands were so fking shaking. Dude holy shit D:
ToGlette
Thailand > Germany > Netherlands > Thailand ...

What the...
Tebz188

ToGlette wrote:

Thailand > Germany > Netherlands > Thailand ...

What the...
tell me about it
chainpullz
Thailand is in off tiebreakers then?
Bonobo
Is there any way to watch matches that aren't on stream?
SuzumiyaBR
The game of cup : Brasil 3x3 Rússia,,,tiebraker._..Rip Rússia
invidia_old

chainpullz wrote:

Thailand is in off tiebreakers then?
Correct, Thailand is in from map differential. Netherlands was knocked out with the 0-4 loss to Germany. Similarly, Russia was knocked out when they lost 3 maps to Brazil.
Mismagius
MouseEasy
probably the best multiplayer game i played, ggwp
Heinzen

CXu wrote:

THANKS BRAZIL
CXU SENPAI NOTICE ME!
Topic Starter
Loctav
We actually wanted to release a very fancy website with very detailed statistics, but this somehow did not work out, because everything regarding the stream exploded.

However, to deliver an adequate overview for at least the group stage, I will throw this at you as temporary overview

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... Uk/pubhtml

It should live update every 5 minutes.

EDIT: Fixed a few map win/loss counts. I am tired and I am too dumb to count right now lol (and it didnt change the group ranking whatsoever)
Railey2
excellent Loctav, thanks a lot! Maybe you get the website up next time around. Or maybe already later in this tournament? I'm looking forward to it.
tryaway
Man, this group stage is full of suprises
chainpullz

Loctav wrote:

We actually wanted to release a very fancy website with very detailed statistics, but this somehow did not work out, because everything regarding the stream exploded.

However, to deliver an adequate overview for at least the group stage, I will throw this at you as temporary overview

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... Uk/pubhtml

It should live update every 5 minutes.

EDIT: Fixed a few map win/loss counts. I am tired and I am too dumb to count right now lol (and it didnt change the group ranking whatsoever)
Ty for spreadsheet. Things could be worse. Solomid.net has been stuck with generic forums for the past (3?) years in preparation for a reskin that never happened.

Casting seemed bland at first but seems to be steadily improving. Props to casting crew for stepping up their game.
Synchrostar
Meh i underperformed quite a bit, but whatever. close games against germany and i did have fun playing so i guess i got that going for me
on the bright side i wont have to get up so early again during weekend for matches o/
Topic Starter
Loctav

chainpullz wrote:

Casting seemed bland at first
Let me clarify here that this was a cause of really unfortunate combination of circumstances. I know that this might sound as a lame excuse, but the people we wanted to attend were not able to that very first block of matches. Additionally, the people that were forced into it, because the planned ones were not there, literally were half-asleep. Moreover, people in the commentary usually need this very first block to catch up with each other and get into the flow with each other again. Out of experience, the first block of matches usually is a bit more dull than the rest of it, which lies in the nature of things, albeit we try to not make that happen.

For the webpage, it was more like the statistics page should have been done already and Marcin was also supposed to stream. The plan was that he streams and that he fills in the data into the website parallely (which would work great, because the website is automated). However, this wasn't the case and we needed the group stage data - so he literally was like getting the site done while streaming the matches, which, as you know, resulted in OBS being a gigantic dick about staying connected to Twitch for whatever reason. (locking CPU or simply disconnecting for no obvious reasons all the time)

We do our best in efforts to dedicate the week into establishing reliable ressources to enhance the viewing experience, along with finishing the statistics website (to offer you detailed stats as requested for a long time already) and improving the play-along of the commentators.

Anyways, I am very proud of how it turned out whatsoever. All matches were successfully played, we had no major issues from the player side of things. However, if players experienced performance-wise issues during the matches, make sure to open a thread in the Help forums, so devs and support team can track them down better!

I hope everyone enjoyed the group stage and the very special stress and thrill during it. If you have anything else to mention that might enhance your experience as participant of this tournament, feel free to poke me.

For now, I'll update the wiki with everything. About the knock-out bracket, I'll throw that on the wiki tomorrow! (applying the teams to the bracket template eats a bit of time and it is really late here, so I want to give out schedules and mappool first, sleep, and then resume with the brackets). I'll let you know here when I issued updates on the wiki.
buny
I'm having troubles trying to find info about owc matches, maybe that should be added onto the wiki?
Junihuhn
Yes, a link to
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... pw/pubhtml
in short would be nice to see if it isn't too much work/trouble ^^
(maybe even made fancier hehe - but I think Loctav is working on it anyway)

On a side note: Thank you to all competitors. I am have spent my weekend watching some really nice matches. Good luck to all advancing teams.
Topic Starter
Loctav
Wiki has been updated with:
  1. Mappool + mappack
  2. Match schedule
  3. Link to Group Stage statisics (check Links section)
  4. Commentator List
  5. Individual match results of Group Stage
Adding the knock-out bracket, tomorrow.
fartownik
http://challonge.com/owc2015unofficial unofficial bracket

The upper side of the bracket is op
Topic Starter
Loctav
Above unofficial bracket is properly constructed.
Railey2
You're doing a great job so far. If you get the stability-issues fixed within the upcoming week, this could possibly turn out be one of the greatest tournaments that osu has seen so far, if not the greatest.

Now to my ideas for improvement. Note that theres quite a lot coming, but you asked for it Loctav :p


The scoring system v2
SPOILER
The new scoring system seems to do a great job at keeping things exciting. First of all, big thumbs up for that. Now the issues I have with it, mainly 2 of them.

1) The pace at which you lose scorepoints with decreasing accuracy, should be higher. It doesn't feel right if 98% and 96% yield almost the same score, I feel like the difference should be bigger here. Since most top-players are able to consistently get an accuracy within 95%-100%, and the difference that these 5% make in terms of score isn't all that big, it barely feels like accuracy is 30% of the score. Accuracy feels less important, because these 30% really don't show unless someone gets below 90% accuracy, which barely happens. I would like it to be a more important part.

2) It is considerably harder to hold a good accuracy with HR (yay sliders). It is widely regarded as being the substantially harder mod in comparison to hidden, but that huge difference in playability doesn't completely show in the players final score. HR is already given a little advantage over HD regarding the score multiplier, but I think HR still deserves a little buff, boosting the score you get when successfully pulling off a HR-play. I don't think that its enough yet. Picking HR seems like a huge tactical mistake under any circumstance at this point.

Other than that, good job. It feels definitely more like a tournament now, more competitive, more fair, better overall. I hand it to whoever came up with this.

The commentary
SPOILER
Personally, while I think that the commentary started out rather weak, I found it to be very enjoyable later on. Particularly the last block on Saturday was more than I could have ever asked for (amazing job, ztrot and all the others, forgive me for not knowing all of your names already).
Especially the playful banter between the commentators has led the commentary to be very dynamic, interesting, funny and enjoyable.
If you continue in that manner, there is nothing to fear on that front. Well done.


The things that went wrong and can potentially go wrong are rather obvious, so I won't go in depth here. Instead, I have a couple ideas for the commentary, as it seems to run out of ideas some times. Having more things to talk about would obviously make their job significantly easier.

So here it is, Ideas to improve the commentary:


A) Increasing the interactivity with audience and participants
  1. Involving the participants.
    - Invite the captain from a team or any player on chat after the game has ended to discuss the game. I am unsure if they did that yet, since I didn't get to watch all the games, but they didn't do that on the ones that I watched. It would be great to get some comments on the game itself by someone who played it himself.
    - Invite the captain from a team or any player on chat before the game has started, to discuss their expectations and possibly how they want to play this game. Then wish them good luck and off they go!
  2. Involving the audience
    - Answering questions from chat. Excellent idea, was already done to some degree today. Keep that up, its a great way to make things more enjoyable.
    - Strawpolls! Those are easy to make, and can be the starting point for interesting discussions. What team do you root for? Who do you think will win? Etc.
    - I bet there are many more things to do with the audience. This might be something worth thinking about for a longer time.
  3. Involving some of the other staff?
    - This is a very broad one, basically includes all sort of people that are related to the development of osu. Might be cool for breaks.

B) Information about the players.
There are at least 8 players present per game, so theres lots of information the commentators could draw out from that.
  1. Did some of the players compete in prior OWC's?
  2. Are they well-known mappers, maybe? If yes, what are some of their most famous maps?
  3. Were they in the top10 at some point?
  4. Is there anything notable about their top-plays? Do they have a top-performance on the map that is currently played, maybe?
  5. When did they join osu?
  6. Are they mods themselves, or BAT's or maybe even QAT's?
  7. What are their strong points, are they hidden or hardrock players, or nomod or DT, or allrounders? What are their weaknesses?
Theres lots of things to be said, in fact there are so many things to be said that someone who did all the research would probably not run out throughout a 1 hour game.
The commentators already mention many things, but there still is a lot more to say about the people that participate - or about the people that don't participate.


C) Information about the maps.
Doomsday did a good job at giving a quick analysis of the map-pool for the upcoming round. Theres lots of things to be said about maps, and lots of it already gets said, but for the sake of completeness I'll make another list here.
  1. How old are the maps? Are they ahead of their time?
  2. Who mapped them? Is the mapper known for other, famous maps?
  3. What about the song? Do we have famous maps that include songs of the same artist? What genre is the song? Is it well known?
  4. How popular is the map?
  5. Who holds the top-score on the map? Anything notable about it? Any other famous plays on that map?
  6. With what mod-combinations is the map popular?
  7. If it is part of a map-set, is there something to say about the other difficulties?
  8. Is the map technical, does it have scary jumps or particularly hard parts that many people choke on?
Lots of this is done already, and that is one of the reasons why I enjoyed the commentary so much this time around.


D) Information about the tournament.
Everything viewed on a larger scale.
  1. If team A wins now, who will the most likely face next? What are their chances next round?
  2. Who is the underdog in this match, who is expected to win? Or is it even, maybe?
  3. Take a look at past tournaments. How far did the teams get back then? Did they even participate? Is this currently their "best" tournament?
  4. What is the role of a team in the whole tournament. Are they popular or unknown? Serious title-contender? Underdog? How was their role in past tournaments?
  5. Everything about the tournaments organization, schedule, prize-money, the "I support team"-tags that I don't think were advertised at all, so far, the people that are involved with it..
  6. How does loser-bracket work? (many people don't know how it works. Many many people.)


Commentary is first and foremost a task that relies on smart, thorough and accurate research.
First know what you can talk about -> know where to acquire the information that you miss -> acquire and organize the information -> find the right opportunity to include it in your commentary.

Everyone can pull of commentating what happens at the very moment ("oooh he missed, no! thats gonna be it for team X if they can't turn this around, here comes the long slider!"). Don't get me wrong, at-the-present commentating IS an important part, but it leaves little room for improvement. It's mostly about having a good vocabulary and nice sounding phrases to keep things interesting (its the worst when someone uses the same words over and over again).

Theres quite a bit people can do with their voice too. As a negative example, one of the commentators goes up and down with his voice all the time (the one with the heavy accent, again I apologize for not knowing his name), which I find rather irritating.

Overall, I have been very happy with how this played out. If you could include some of the things that I mentioned, and stay consistent with the things that you already include, this can turn out to be really great.

Alright, thats all I have for now, or rather I don't want to keep writing and eat something instead. Surely theres more to be said or discussed. Have a good one!
fabriciorby
canada ^~^
chainpullz

Railey2 wrote:

SPOILER
B) Information about the players.
There are at least 8 players present per game, so theres lots of information the commentators could draw out from that.
  1. Did some of the players compete in prior OWC's?
  2. Are they well-known mappers, maybe? If yes, what are some of their most famous maps?
  3. Were they in the top10 at some point?
  4. Is there anything notable about their top-plays? Do they have a top-performance on the map that is currently played, maybe?
  5. When did they join osu?
  6. Are they mods themselves, or BAT's or maybe even QAT's?
  7. What are their strong points, are they hidden or hardrock players, or nomod or DT, or allrounders? What are their weaknesses?
Theres lots of things to be said, in fact there are so many things to be said that someone who did all the research would probably not run out throughout a 1 hour game.
The commentators already mention many things, but there still is a lot more to say about the people that participate - or about the people that don't participate.


C) Information about the maps.
Doomsday did a hood job at giving a quick analysis of the map-pool for the upcoming round. Theres lots of things to be said about maps, and lots of it already gets said, but for the sake of completeness I'll make another list here.
  1. How old are the maps? Are they ahead of their time?
  2. Who mapped them? Is the mapper known for other, famous maps?
  3. What about the song? Do we have famous maps that include songs of the same artist? What genre is the song? Is it well known?
  4. How popular is the map?
  5. Who holds the top-score on the map? Anything notable about it? Any other famous plays on that map?
  6. With what mod-combinations is the map popular?
  7. If it is part of a map-set, is there something to say about the other difficulties?
  8. Is the map technical, does it have scary jumps or particularly hard parts that many people choke on?
Lots of this is done already, and that is one of the reasons why I enjoyed the commentary so much this time around.
I like seeing a lot of these two particularly but it's also extremely time consuming to dig through all the participants and all the maps and assemble a proper set of notes on them for use in commentating. To aid in this perhaps next year we could have a place where community members could contribute information on specific players (perhaps like a thread per team) and a place for discussion of each map (or pool). That way commentators would be able to probe the thoughts and experiences of the community without having to actually ask around. For each lesser known player there are probably people who they are friends with that could provide a lot of information.

I said something about this on one of the group info videos - it's hard to be hyped up about matches involving players you don't know or a map pool you are unfamiliar with. It might just be me, but I care more about the individuals playing than the specific country/team they are playing for.
Liena
HYPE
Railey2

chainpullz wrote:

Railey2 wrote:

SPOILER
B) Information about the players.
There are at least 8 players present per game, so theres lots of information the commentators could draw out from that.
  1. Did some of the players compete in prior OWC's?
  2. Are they well-known mappers, maybe? If yes, what are some of their most famous maps?
  3. Were they in the top10 at some point?
  4. Is there anything notable about their top-plays? Do they have a top-performance on the map that is currently played, maybe?
  5. When did they join osu?
  6. Are they mods themselves, or BAT's or maybe even QAT's?
  7. What are their strong points, are they hidden or hardrock players, or nomod or DT, or allrounders? What are their weaknesses?
Theres lots of things to be said, in fact there are so many things to be said that someone who did all the research would probably not run out throughout a 1 hour game.
The commentators already mention many things, but there still is a lot more to say about the people that participate - or about the people that don't participate.


C) Information about the maps.
Doomsday did a good job at giving a quick analysis of the map-pool for the upcoming round. Theres lots of things to be said about maps, and lots of it already gets said, but for the sake of completeness I'll make another list here.
  1. How old are the maps? Are they ahead of their time?
  2. Who mapped them? Is the mapper known for other, famous maps?
  3. What about the song? Do we have famous maps that include songs of the same artist? What genre is the song? Is it well known?
  4. How popular is the map?
  5. Who holds the top-score on the map? Anything notable about it? Any other famous plays on that map?
  6. With what mod-combinations is the map popular?
  7. If it is part of a map-set, is there something to say about the other difficulties?
  8. Is the map technical, does it have scary jumps or particularly hard parts that many people choke on?
Lots of this is done already, and that is one of the reasons why I enjoyed the commentary so much this time around.
I like seeing a lot of these two particularly but it's also extremely time consuming to dig through all the participants and all the maps and assemble a proper set of notes on them for use in commentating. To aid in this perhaps next year we could have a place where community members could contribute information on specific players (perhaps like a thread per team) and a place for discussion of each map (or pool). That way commentators would be able to probe the thoughts and experiences of the community without having to actually ask around. For each lesser known player there are probably people who they are friends with that could provide a lot of information.

I said something about this on one of the group info videos - it's hard to be hyped up about matches involving players you don't know or a map pool you are unfamiliar with. It might just be me, but I care more about the individuals playing than the specific country/team they are playing for.
Agreed. As I said, commentating is a research-heavy task, and as such it is definitely time consuming. So it would be best to split up the wordload, at best between people that already have lots of knowledge. Crowdsourcing is an interesting idea, but I wonder how that would look like in practice.
MatsumotoRise

Loctav wrote:

Above unofficial bracket is properly constructed.
Really? I checked last year's bracket and it wasn't like #1 of Group A,B,C,D will be in the same area though.
Like this one:http://puu.sh/lePoX/5ff6f818ed.jpg It's A1/H2 , F1/C2 , E1/D2 , B1/G2 in the same half.
Or you mean this kind of drawing is changed this year?
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