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S.H.E - London Bridge Is Falling Down

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NaomiMinette
Yeah, it works now.
Sunny Holic
支持中文歌~ ~
Topic Starter
shenpei310

Sunny Holic wrote:

支持中文歌~ ~
THANKS……
vivere
Hi :) ~

BMP: 120,000

[Easy]:

00:52:587- The spinner may terminate at this time: 00:56:337.

01.47:334 (4)- Move 1 grid level to your left.
01:48:334 (1)- ^
--------------------
[Normal]:
Much difficulty
--------------------
[Hard]:

00:38:838 (1,2)- Remove new combo
00:39:838 (1,2)- ^
--------------------
[Insane]:

01:16:836- Remove new combo
01:17:336- ^
01:17:836- ^
--------------------
:3
Topic Starter
shenpei310
SPOILER

vivere wrote:

Hi :) ~

BMP: 120,000 maybe it is right

[Easy]:

00:52:587- The spinner may terminate at this time: 00:56:337. i don't think so

01.47:334 (4)- Move 1 grid level to your left. done
01:48:334 (1)- ^ done
--------------------
[Normal]:
Much difficulty
--------------------
[Hard]:

00:38:838 (1,2)- Remove new combo done
00:39:838 (1,2)- ^ done
--------------------
[Insane]:

01:16:836- Remove new combo
01:17:336- ^
01:17:836- ^ no.....i thinck one color looks boring....
--------------------
:3

good
Takuma
Hard:

02:44:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - the jumps are a little sudden.. maybe you can fix?

Insane:

01:44:330 ~ is a little weird. You continue going fast, despite it being a slow part, then go to .5x in the middle. Then you unexpectedly go back to fast. Perhaps you can change this then remap accordingly?

I suggest this..

01:44:330 - add a timing section of .5x
02:21:455 ~ remove any additional sections

OR an easier method would be to remove the .5x section and keep mapping at 1x. Your choice.

At the end the jumps are kinda unreasonable and hard.. consider changing them.
Topic Starter
shenpei310
SPOILER

pandabun wrote:

Hard:

02:44:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - the jumps are a little sudden.. maybe you can fix?maybe it is not too hard?

Insane:

01:44:330 ~ is a little weird. You continue going fast, despite it being a slow part, then go to .5x in the middle. Then you unexpectedly go back to fast. Perhaps you can change this then remap accordingly?at this time,it sounds slow,but then goes fast. i think only this slider can be 0.5X

I suggest this..

01:44:330 - add a timing section of .5x but it may be a little crowd?
02:21:455 ~ remove any additional sections

OR an easier method would be to remove the .5x section and keep mapping at 1x. Your choice.emm,may remove 0.5X is reasonable,i will thinck about it

At the end the jumps are kinda unreasonable and hard.. consider changing them.it is not too hard for insane i think


THANKX
Curisu
London Bridge Is Falling Down~Falling Down~Falling Down~ :D

[General]
Hitsound偷懒了哦~

[NM]
00:13:330 (3) - 移上去一点点 和蓝色的4对齐
00:35:330 (3) - 条的末端使用soft whistle
01:47:330 (5) - ^
01:56:580 (1) - 往前移1/2拍 延长1/2拍

[HD]
00:33:830 (7) - soft whistle
01:17:830 (4) - 复制3
Vikon
map不錯, 找不到大問題
只是一些建議

[Easy]
00:14:330 (1,1) - 對於EASY來說,note太接近spinner
01:10:330 (1,1) - ^
02:30:330 (1,1) - ^

[Normal]
fine for me

[Hard]
02:47:080 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - 這麼多note放在一起,或會有點混淆

[Insane]
00:04:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - ^

(mod得有點少,可以不給kd~ :) good luck~
Topic Starter
shenpei310
[quote="yangzd88"]London Bridge Is Falling Down~Falling Down~Falling Down~ :D

[General]
Hitsound偷懒了哦~还好吧,我黔驴技穷了而已。

[NM]
00:13:330 (3) - 移上去一点点 和蓝色的4对齐
00:35:330 (3) - 条的末端使用soft whistle 我换了个顺序,实在不习惯连用两个whistle
01:47:330 (5) - ^
01:56:580 (1) - 往前移1/2拍 延长1/2拍 不对,我根据歌词来的

[HD]
00:33:830 (7) - soft whistle 实在不习惯连用两个whistle
01:17:830 (4) - 复制3
Topic Starter
shenpei310

Vikon wrote:

map不錯, 找不到大問題
只是一些建議

[Easy]
00:14:330 (1,1) - 對於EASY來說,note太接近spinner只能让他们别转太狠了。。。再变的话我听不习惯
01:10:330 (1,1) - ^
02:30:330 (1,1) - ^

[Normal]
fine for me

[Hard]
02:47:080 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - 這麼多note放在一起,或會有點混淆迪西也说过了,所以第一次分开放了,到后面的话节奏应该掌握了。再说总不能认为这首歌只被玩一次吧?

[Insane]
00:04:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - ^

(mod得有點少,可以不給kd~ :) good luck~
Shiro
Modding legend:

Unrankable.
Major issues in the map: it is highly recommended to fix them.
Minor issue in the map: you don't have to follow them exactly, but I recommend you to.
Suggestions: those are personal opinions, feel free to follow them or not.
Possible fix suggestion.
If there's one black bold line in the whole mod post, I won't star the map. PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS DOESN'T MEAN I WILL STAR THE MAP IF THERE IS NO BLACK BOLD LINE. Learn to mathematical implication.

General:
Empty .osb file. Delete then full submit.

Easy:
00:16:330 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed. Move it away. Okay, it's a slider, so you can see it anyway. Make this slider horizontal or something.
01:12:830 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
02:01:330 (1) - ^
02:32:830 (1) - ^

02:38:455 - Useless break.
How about mapping until the very end of the song ?


Normal:
01:38:580 (1) - Too close to previous object.
02:32:830 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
How about mapping until the very end of the song ?

Hard:
00:02:330 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - Do those notes really make sense ?
01:12:705 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
02:47:080 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - ^


Insane:
00:02:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1) - Do those notes really make sense ?
02:47:080 (1,2,3) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
Topic Starter
shenpei310
SPOILER

Odaril wrote:

Modding legend:

Unrankable.
Major issues in the map: it is highly recommended to fix them.
Minor issue in the map: you don't have to follow them exactly, but I recommend you to.
Suggestions: those are personal opinions, feel free to follow them or not.
Possible fix suggestion.
If there's one black bold line in the whole mod post, I won't star the map. PLEASE NOTE THAT THIS DOESN'T MEAN I WILL STAR THE MAP IF THERE IS NO BLACK BOLD LINE. Learn to mathematical implication.

General:
Empty .osb file. Delete then full submit.done

Easy:
00:16:330 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed. Move it away. Okay, it's a slider, so you can see it anyway. Make this slider horizontal or something.
01:12:830 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
02:01:330 (1) - ^
02:32:830 (1) - ^[/color]
02:38:455 - Useless break.
How about mapping until the very end of the song ?


Normal:
01:38:580 (1) - Too close to previous object.fixed
02:32:830 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
How about mapping until the very end of the song ?

Hard:
00:02:330 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1) - Do those notes really make sense ?because nothing to note
01:12:705 (1) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
02:47:080 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - ^


Insane:
00:02:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,1) - Do those notes really make sense ? YES,you can not hear without earphone or low volume
02:47:080 (1,2,3) - Hidden by the 300/100 when the spinner is completed.
Vanmonky
As your request :3

Read this first for the icon explanation.
- [?] Asking for a second thought.
- [!] Fatal error. You have to fix this for sure.
- [No icon] Only a suggestion.

[General]
1. Please full submit the map again. I was given the update button when I just downloaded and installed the map. [!]
2. What a cute song :3
3. Did you cut the video or it does stop on 02:59:080?
4. Cut the useless part of the mp3. It could decrease the filesize. But I suggest you to map the song until the end.

[Easy]
00:38:080 (2) - Move it like this (turn off distance snap).

00:52:580 (1) - Extend it to 00:56:330.
01:18:455 - Will be better if you remove the break.
02:12:580 (1) - Extend it to 02:16:330.

[Normal]
01:00:631 (2) - I prefer it put on 01:00:411. [?]
01:03:278 (2) - Make it start from 01:03:499.
00:52:580 (1) - Extend it to 00:56:330.
02:10:580 (1) - Ugly slider. Change the shape.
02:12:580 (1) - Extend it to 02:16:330.

[Hard]
00:02:330 to 00:05:830 - Soft hitsound sounds weird. Change them to normal hitsound, then lower the volume to the first tick. Also, remove the whistle sound.
01:26:080 (1) - Can you change this into a slider or something else? This slider is too short and ruin the epicness of this diff.
02:46:080 (1) - ^

[Insane]
-- I found some death jumps. Consider reducing the distance of some jumps?
-- A little bit overmapped but it's okay I think.

00:02:330 to 00:05:830 - Soft hitsound sounds weird. Change them to normal hitsound, then lower the volume to the first tick. Also, remove the whistle sound.
01:16:830 (1,1,1) - Remove new combo.
02:24:330 (2,3,4) - Unstacked properly.
Star. I love modding this.
Topic Starter
shenpei310

VanMoNky wrote:

As your request :3

Read this first for the icon explanation.
- [?] Asking for a second thought.
- [!] Fatal error. You have to fix this for sure.
- [No icon] Only a suggestion.

[General]
1. Please full submit the map again. I was given the update button when I just downloaded and installed the map. [!]it is weird....
2. What a cute song :3ah,i think so~
3. Did you cut the video or it does stop on 02:59:080?i cut....
4. Cut the useless part of the mp3. It could decrease the filesize. But I suggest you to map the song until the end.i think play a song over 3min is too tired,so......but i want to give the players a complete mp3 of this song....

[Easy]
00:38:080 (2) - Move it like this (turn off distance snap).ok..
[attachment=0:da26e]screenshot024.jpg[/attachment:da26e]
00:52:580 (1) - Extend it to 00:56:330.i really do not know why many modders want me to change this...after the spinner is over,according to the lyrics,it is another part,and i make it as a break.....
01:18:455 - Will be better if you remove the break.done, add a spinner
02:12:580 (1) - Extend it to 02:16:330.the same reason

[Normal]
01:00:631 (2) - I prefer it put on 01:00:411. [?]nothing is there????
01:03:278 (2) - Make it start from 01:03:499.nothing is there????
00:52:580 (1) - Extend it to 00:56:330.
02:10:580 (1) - Ugly slider. Change the shape.......changed
02:12:580 (1) - Extend it to 02:16:330.

[Hard]
00:02:330 to 00:05:830 - Soft hitsound sounds weird. Change them to normal hitsound, then lower the volume to the first tick. Also, remove the whistle sound.maybe it is really hard for people to here the bass here,i think i had better remove them
01:26:080 (1) - Can you change this into a slider or something else? This slider is too short and ruin the epicness of this diff.
02:46:080 (1) - ^ah,i am very bad at spinner,but i can still get 300 here,so i think it is ok....

[Insane]
-- I found some death jumps. Consider reducing the distance of some jumps?not too hard...but i remove the jump in hard diff
-- A little bit overmapped but it's okay I think.

00:02:330 to 00:05:830 - Soft hitsound sounds weird. Change them to normal hitsound, then lower the volume to the first tick. Also, remove the whistle sound.all removed!!!!!!!
01:16:830 (1,1,1) - Remove new combo.but now it looks beautiful? if remove,one color looks ugly...
02:24:330 (2,3,4) - Unstacked properly.maybe you don't get the newest one?
Star. I love modding this.
GladiOol
[General]
  1. Maybe some Custom Hitcircle Colors ?
[Insane]

00:19:330 (1) - Remove New Combo.
00:39:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - This stream isn't going synchrone. (6,7,8) are really badly placed. Please remap this stream.
01:12:330 (9) - Add New Combo.
01:12:830 (1) - Remove New Combo.
01:35:330 (5) - Move 2 grid levels to the right. (Grid Level 3 / Most Precise)
01:35:580 (6) - Move 2 grid levels to the left.
01:55:330 (1) - Remove New Combo.
02:01:330 (1) - ^


[Hard]
  1. Tick Rate 2 please.
  2. Drain Rate +1 please.
01:42:330 (1) - Center this one ?
01:43:080 (1) - ^


[Normal]

01:39:080 (2) - Add New Combo here so it will match with the rest of the difficulties at that point.


[Easy]

00:52:580 (1) - Extend till 00:56:330. (VanMoNky also posted it and I agree with him.)

Starred~
Topic Starter
shenpei310

GladiOol wrote:

[General]
  1. Maybe some Custom Hitcircle Colors ?
i am bad at drawing,so bad at selecting color,but i think pink is ok...

[Insane]

00:19:330 (1) - Remove New Combo.
00:39:330 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - This stream isn't going synchrone. (6,7,8) are really badly placed. Please remap this stream.
01:12:330 (9) - Add New Combo.
01:12:830 (1) - Remove New Combo.
01:35:330 (5) - Move 2 grid levels to the right. (Grid Level 3 / Most Precise)
01:35:580 (6) - Move 2 grid levels to the left.
01:55:330 (1) - Remove New Combo.
02:01:330 (1) - ^
all done!

[Hard]
  1. Tick Rate 2 please.
  2. Drain Rate +1 please.
01:42:330 (1) - Center this one ?
01:43:080 (1) - ^
all done

[Normal]

01:39:080 (2) - Add New Combo here so it will match with the rest of the difficulties at that point.done


[Easy]

00:52:580 (1) - Extend till 00:56:330. (VanMoNky also posted it and I agree with him.)now,i think at 00:55:330 or 00:56:330 both are ok...since you all like end at 00:56:330...i'll change...the other spinners like this are also changed

Starred~
thank you !!!!!!!!!1
Dusty
[Hard]
sometimes your 1/4 triples are stacked and sometimes they're not, it confused me at first o__o

01:38:580 (1,1,1,1,1,1) - unstack please? It's a little awkward to me

[Insane]
01:38:580 (1,1,1,1) - unstack these?
01:58:080 (4,1) - and these?

hm, I think I like [Insane] best, it looks like you put the most effort into that one
Topic Starter
shenpei310

Dusty wrote:

[Hard]
sometimes your 1/4 triples are stacked and sometimes they're not, it confused me at first o__o

01:38:580 (1,1,1,1,1,1) - unstack please? It's a little awkward to mei do not think so,but i found it boring,so add a spinner,mayby a little difficult

[Insane]
01:38:580 (1,1,1,1) - unstack these?如果突然在屏幕上四个地方放四个单音,感觉有点莫名其妙。
01:58:080 (4,1) - and these?没啥必要。

hm, I think I like [Insane] best, it looks like you put the most effort into that onei am good at making insane.我最先做的insane,然后另存为HARD,再一个个删,再NORMAL。。。
arsrun
nice♫
a little Advice:

[normal]
01:18:580 SP may start at 01:18:330

[hard]
01:18:705 (2) remove this note.unuseful, here is no hitsound 3>
01:43:330 (2~ ) 这段不对,redone it plz~
02:03:080 May add a note here.

[ins]
01:18:705 (2) as hard.
02:03:080 as hard.
Topic Starter
shenpei310

arsrun wrote:

nice♫
a little Advice:

[normal]
01:18:580 SP may start at 01:18:330也可以,但是normal我想根据歌词来,hard和insane这里根据音乐来

[hard]
01:18:705 (2) remove this note.unuseful, here is no hitsound 3>是有点问题。
01:43:330 (2~ ) 这段不对,redone it plz~不是不对,从这里开始变为跟音乐而不是跟歌词
02:03:080 May add a note here.我觉得都可以,我听上去感觉就是两个。弹起来也不别扭。

[ins]
01:18:705 (2) as hard.
02:03:080 as hard.
AdRon Zh3Ro
I don't love ur song but moding anyway... (k)

Colours seems to be too random, put these.



Well, i think u can call some bats...
Topic Starter
shenpei310

adron zhero wrote:

I don't love ur song but moding anyway... (k)

Colours seems to be too random, put these.



Well, i think u can call some bats...
THANKS.....
Doomsday
Hey :)

  1. I got offset: 336. BPM seems fine though
  2. Maybe put "Chinese" in the tags as well?
[EASY]

Lookin' good

[NORMAL]

Perhaps the beats are stuck to straight lines a bit too much, but it's nice overall. Nothing bothered me

[HARD]


01:26:080 (1) - Replace this spinner with something else? It's so short and jumps out of nowhere, so maybe a slider would work better.
01:42:330(1) - ^
02:46:080 (1) - ^

[INSANE]

Apart from the jumps you put in (like 00:21:080 (4,5,6,7), 00:49:330 (5,6,7), 01:25:080 (4,5,6,7), etc). which don't fit in imo, Nothing bothered me. I see those jumps in many Insane maps so I can't force you to change them, but I want you to :(

Overall, it's actually quite a nice map. Insane uses jumps a bit too much, but the other difficulties are Nice and fairly well made, but not amazing though. Nice.

Starred
Topic Starter
shenpei310

Doomsday wrote:

Hey :)

  1. I got offset: 336. BPM seems fine thoughhmm....maybe different from different people...but the bpm is sure to be right,so people can change local offset according to themselves..
  2. Maybe put "Chinese" in the tags as well?
ok

[EASY]

Lookin' good

[NORMAL]

Perhaps the beats are stuck to straight lines a bit too much, but it's nice overall. Nothing bothered me

[HARD]


01:26:080 (1) - Replace this spinner with something else? It's so short and jumps out of nowhere, so maybe a slider would work better.changed
01:42:330(1) - ^changed
02:46:080 (1) - ^i consider to remove the part after it

[INSANE]

Apart from the jumps you put in (like 00:21:080 (4,5,6,7), 00:49:330 (5,6,7), 01:25:080 (4,5,6,7), etc). which don't fit in imo, Nothing bothered me. I see those jumps in many Insane maps so I can't force you to change them, but I want you to :(ok,i make the distance shorter

Overall, it's actually quite a nice map. Insane uses jumps a bit too much, but the other difficulties are Nice and fairly well made, but not amazing though. Nice.

Starred
thanks
deepsea
I got offset +5 ~ 10, not sure though. timing of most chinese songs are terrible.>_>
Topic Starter
shenpei310

deepsea wrote:

I got offset +5 ~ 10, not sure though. timing of most chinese songs are terrible.>_>
...........doomsday say -4,you say +5~10......terrible....
deepsea

shenpei310 wrote:

deepsea wrote:

I got offset +5 ~ 10, not sure though. timing of most chinese songs are terrible.>_>
...........doomsday say -4,you say +5~10......terrible....
I rememered it had 330 so what I got is about 335 ~ 340 and doomsday got 336 so seems not too wrong?

Or did I forget something?_?
Topic Starter
shenpei310
hexie……
Topic Starter
shenpei310

shenpei310 wrote:

SPOILER

deepsea wrote:

I got offset +5 ~ 10, not sure though. timing of most chinese songs are terrible.>_>
...........doomsday say -4,you say +5~10......terrible....I rememered it had 330 so what I got is about 335 ~ 340 and doomsday got 336 so seems not too wrong?

Or did I forget something?_?[/quote]

i made a mistake ,i have thought my offset is 340....ok,now i change it to 336........it is very hard to get a exact offset of a low bpm song..[/quote]
Selee
;)
Topic Starter
shenpei310

Selee wrote:

;)
hello?
ShaggoN
Blue: Sugestion. Not necessary, but should take good effects.
Green: Notification or cosmetic thing. May, but don't have to be fixed.
Orange: Should be fixed.
Red: Have to be fixed.

General
  1. If song comes from an album, put the album name in source.
[Easy]
  1. 00:34:330 (1) - Maybe remove new combo here, to follow combos pattern used before.
[Normal]
  1. 01:39:080 (1) - Remove new combo. No reason to place it here.
  2. 02:10:580 (1) - I'm not completely sure about it, but i'd remove new combo here too.
[Hard]
  1. 00:39:330 (1) - Remove new combo here.
  2. 01:39:080 (1) - and here, 01:41:080 (1) - and here.
[Insane]
  1. 01:16:830 (1,1,1) - Remove new combos.
  2. 01:39:080 (1) - Same here, 01:41:080 (1) - and here.
  3. 02:28:830 (1) - And here.
My mod can look stupid, but i really don't like overused combos.
Anywas. Map is well made, and it plays cool. I hope it'll be ranked. Starrr'd :D
James2250

ShaggoN wrote:

General
  1. If song comes from an album, put the album name in source.

Put the album name in the tags not the source, read this
Topic Starter
shenpei310

ShaggoN wrote:

Blue: Sugestion. Not necessary, but should take good effects.
Green: Notification or cosmetic thing. May, but don't have to be fixed.
Orange: Should be fixed.
Red: Have to be fixed.

General
  1. If song comes from an album, put the album name in source.
[Easy]
  1. 00:34:330 (1) - Maybe remove new combo here, to follow combos pattern used before.
DONE
[Normal]
  1. 01:39:080 (1) - Remove new combo. No reason to place it here.ok
  2. 02:10:580 (1) - I'm not completely sure about it, but i'd remove new combo here too.i add a note so new combo may looks reasonable
[Hard]
  1. 00:39:330 (1) - Remove new combo here.done
  2. 01:39:080 (1) - and here, 01:41:080 (1) - and here.
done

[Insane]
  1. 01:16:830 (1,1,1) - Remove new combos.emm...logically,there should not be new combo obviously,but ...i think it colorful so looks better?....hm...i change that,since i think it may really confuse the player if they don't know the rythm....
  2. 01:39:080 (1) - Same here, 01:41:080 (1) - and here.done
  3. 02:28:830 (1) - And here.
OK

My mod can look stupid, but i really don't like overused combos.ah...anyway it is a Good mod .A good map should be excellent on every aspects,so it need different modders to focus on different things.
Anywas. Map is well made, and it plays cool. I hope it'll be ranked. Starrr'd :D
thanks
Topic Starter
shenpei310

James2250 wrote:

ShaggoN wrote:

General
  1. If song comes from an album, put the album name in source.

Put the album name in the tags not the source, read this
good...i'd rather not ....looks strange...
Andrea
Revived.
nongfushanquan_old
怎么还没有rank啊?必须顶起啊!!
Topic Starter
shenpei310

nongfushanquan wrote:

怎么还没有rank啊?必须顶起啊!!
别打酱油……
Garven
As per your request:

[General]
Aah, what's with all the spaces in the tags? Remove them. Also the "Album:" part of the tag. Also remove "pop" since that'll be the genre
The video is really low quality for 8 megs. Think you can find/make a better one? If you have problems with this, let me know and I'll see what I can find for you.
Your MP3 is 320 kbps: please re-encode it to 256 or 192kbps (192 is preferred, but since your map is so old, you can technically do 256). Once again, if you don't know how to or have problems getting this done, let me know.
I'm not seeing a reason why most of the slider ticks are silenced

[Easy]
00:16:336 (1) - This is way too soon after a spinner for a difficulty like this. Please consider mapping through the spinner, or changing some of the rhythms afterward.
00:22:336 (1) - Hrm, these don't really work too well in an easy difficulty simply because it's hard for new players to tell when it will stop - plus having a note so soon after it will just cause more problems. Please try a simpler rhythm.
01:12:836 (1) - Too soon after a spinner again. Please try to leave 2-3 beats before starting another note for a difficulty this easy.
01:20:836 (1) - ^
02:32:836 (1) - ^
02:38:336 - Just delete this break.

[Normal]
02:06:336 (5) - Maybe stack this with the 6 slider instead?
02:38:336 - Add a note here and delete that break

[Hard]
01:15:336 (2) - That whistle sounds really odd
Some of the stacking and overlaps were kind of weird but the map is okay.

[Insane]
Reduce stack leniency to this:

It'll make some of your stacks look neater such as 02:30:336 (1,3,5) -
02:40:336 (1,2,3) - Really don't like this overlap
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