I hope I answered everything sufficiently. Keep in mind that many stuff is kept vague either because it is too confusing to explain properly (and would bloat the ruleset needlessly) or because it would violate the privacy of single registrees. We can not give full transparency, because there are many things ongoing on the background. If you are expecting me to fraud you all, you really are thinking I live out my personal grunge here, which isn't the case. We have formal requirements of how the tournament is supposed to look like. I want this tournament to be successful and happening as intended. I have no intentions to mob out people. You can trust me blindly, hence I do not even know 98% of the people registering. How shall I be biased here?lolcubes wrote:
Long post inc, bear with me. ╭( ･ㅂ･)وSPOILER
I think all this needs better explaining. Some things are pretty clear, but some aren't, and some are completely redundant.
Just bear with me, not bashing or criticizing, just trying to provide some valid arguments and hopefully bring some changes, making the front wiki page more clear/easier to understand.
For example:
Example:A new/different registration process (per person instead of per team). More info here: <link>Redundancy isn't per se bad. It ensures that everyone is seeing it - as out of experience, many people do not read carefully and may miss it.
same here. You have to keep in mind how many people are registering and that I want to avoid any question if possible. You may see this as "given and clear", but it is not for many.
Example:A new tournament format (double elimination system added). More info here: <link>Since no real info is being given here, just a note, a simple note might do better since the person who is interested in this will have to click the link anyway.
The length of the tournament should be specified in the section that link goes to, and there you could say it's lasting a full week longer, compared to the previous tournament.
This has been proofread and taken over from the OWC news post. Most stuff here clarifies as tournament engages. The tournament schedule is listed above. This note has only been made to ensure that people realize that there are two weeks for the finals.
I consider this as nitpicking on wordings. It is not unclear, if you played the previous TWC and read the new ruleset, realizing that all mappools have the exact same size everywhere.
If you played on previous TWC, you will know what it means. There were picking restrictions on the HD/HR/DT/FM bracket, which are replaced by this veto rule. The veto rule is also explained in the rules. As in the OWC, most people understood this notification on instant.
Making a person read wiki for the previous twc is bad, you want to give clear info, not a bloated library.
another case of "if you played on the TWC before". Reading the rules or "contract" for something you signing up is the basic requirements of registering here. On the one hand, you complain about redundancy, but on the other hand I shall explain a complex ruleset again in the news post. This is just a changelog. You always have to read the entire ruleset. Everything is clearly explained here. Any question or "left out information" can be found out there and do not need to be clarified by me or anyone, in 99% of the cases.SPOILER
A lot of redundancy here, and very little valid information. You can even see it in the discussion thread. You should probably write a small intro here, for example:The registration system has been changed, so you no longer have to form teams by yourself. To register you have to:An then come the notes.
This is to avoid that only 8 people of a country register individually and no one else dares to. We have to certainly wipe out like 2 or 3 people per team due to security issues, so everyone shal signing up without discussing possible team setups in advance, because it doesn't work out in most cases anyways.
I do not need to be specific here. This process can not be made clear, because there are a lot of interna running. The tournament management picks a local representative (captain) from the registrees that passed our checks and form a team along with them. That's like the old team forming process, just that we precheck the entire "Possible candidate list" beforehand. This is MOSTLY to also avoid wasting everyone's time to form teams where the majority of the members will be rejected due to ToS violations. We do not want to expose the names of rejected players anymore. Therefore we let people sign up individually, check by gameplay performance (as in: if they are not rank #100000 in taiko and can barely pass a Muzukashii), check by security and then form the team together with the representative. You are too impatient. You could simply trust the tournament management and wait how it works out.
But to make this better, let's just ask a few questions which might help here:I think a linked section would be best here, just keeping simple notes in the title with a link pointing to all this info.
- Who is a local representative, and how does a person become one? he's decided by the tournament management. We are deciding this on account history, activity, reliability and other factors, that are not objective, but yet valid. Not everything in the world needs to be objective. You have to live with the fact that we are declaring a temp captain from the list of possible candidates for the TWC to form the team with him. This is not better than the old forming procedures of teams, but also not worse. At least this also avoids certain people to always be the captain and kicking out people they don't like personally (happened on OWC and CWC) and just want to bully said candidates. This new picking procedure may let people be captain and pick a team. Give them a chance.
- What makes a registration valid? see above. valid registrations are registrations that are containing the time zone, having sufficient gameplay experience and have not violated the osu! terms of services you all agreed on when registering to osu!
- How does that affect other people who are not local representatives? if the registration is not valid, they don't get on the premade list where the representative can pick from. The representative has to pass this checks, too.
- Will everybody registered have a chance to play, or is the amount of people limited? If it's limited, by which criteria does one discard other people? ( I would assume you really need a limit, because if you take countries like Japan, China or USA (or any other bigger country), you could get 50+ players.) everyone who is a valid registree has a chance to play (see above)
Why would one even need to check that? why playing TWC if you can not even play a Kantan.
Compiling teams based on on something that cannot be checked objectively (well, you can be really close to, but for the sake of discussion let's assume you can't be objective here)? Also, how? What does "based on" mean here? objectivity isn't needed. Intersubjectivity is the key word. I know what I am doing. I know how the mappools look like. I have experience and I know my job here. I do notneed to apply some objective but unnatural formula on people and their performance. Just trust me.
Also, why is this done by tournament management and not a local representative? because the local representative does not know the mappools and the minimum requirements we are expecting to join this tournament.
Would make more sense for this to be done by a local representative, after all he should know what he wants inside his team. Excluding a person can only damage the potential choices and because the staff is doing this, time is wasted. Unless, there is something else here going on which isn't being said, which would require tournament management to step in?
forum
osu! Taiko World Cup 2015 - Discussion Thread
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379
Topic Starter
Looks like the whole problem is asking people to trust the TM
anyway
How about adding this term in " The player having the highest rank in the list will be asked to be the team leader "
So nobody will think that the leader may co-op with TM and eject any player they don't like
or you just say " TRUST ME " and others say " I DON"T TRUST YOU " it will become non-stop argue only.
anyway
How about adding this term in " The player having the highest rank in the list will be asked to be the team leader "
So nobody will think that the leader may co-op with TM and eject any player they don't like
or you just say " TRUST ME " and others say " I DON"T TRUST YOU " it will become non-stop argue only.
I agree that some things need to be kept anonymous for private issues. But the rule of the tournament isn't really the case, it just needs clarity.
Anyways, at least the process of registration should be made into a graph or a list to express it in a better way.
As I understand until now the process is :
1)Register individually
2)Filter noobs and players who violated the rules
3)TM choose the Representative
4)Representative choose members among those who are qualified
For the filtering process, I strongly suggest to list its thresholds to lessen TM's works. A tournament must list it's criteria, listing the criterias of noob and rules.
e.g. Rank>1000 , no multi-account found within past 1 year , etc...
And for the representative choosing process, the list of playes non-qualified will certainly be made public, since the representative will choose among those who are qualified. Thus it's not a big deal publishing the list.
Anyways, at least the process of registration should be made into a graph or a list to express it in a better way.
As I understand until now the process is :
1)Register individually
2)Filter noobs and players who violated the rules
3)TM choose the Representative
4)Representative choose members among those who are qualified
For the filtering process, I strongly suggest to list its thresholds to lessen TM's works. A tournament must list it's criteria, listing the criterias of noob and rules.
e.g. Rank>1000 , no multi-account found within past 1 year , etc...
And for the representative choosing process, the list of playes non-qualified will certainly be made public, since the representative will choose among those who are qualified. Thus it's not a big deal publishing the list.
Good to see things cleared then.
The main issue here were not given facts, it was the various possible interpretations of the said facts. With that cleared up, I believe people will have much easier time understanding all this then.
I still believe team representatives should be the ones responsible for their player list though. You don't need map pool information to see if a person can play a 4 osu stars Oni or not. A normal background check (i.e. a valid registration) should be enough for the team representative to make a decision (I am pretty sure the 5 most skilled people in a country's team will at least know of each other, making "can't play a Kantan" thing an impossible extreme).
That would save time for the staff. But yeah, we can't really see everything so I can only speculate here.
The main issue here were not given facts, it was the various possible interpretations of the said facts. With that cleared up, I believe people will have much easier time understanding all this then.
I still believe team representatives should be the ones responsible for their player list though. You don't need map pool information to see if a person can play a 4 osu stars Oni or not. A normal background check (i.e. a valid registration) should be enough for the team representative to make a decision (I am pretty sure the 5 most skilled people in a country's team will at least know of each other, making "can't play a Kantan" thing an impossible extreme).
That would save time for the staff. But yeah, we can't really see everything so I can only speculate here.
Topic Starter
You don't need to worry about the time sink at my side 
I have enough of it and will spend it, even if it takes a long while. I'd rather move away the time consuming tasks away from the players to make them focus on actually playing the tournament rather than with formal things.
The representative will only see valid registrations, thus not knowing who did not pass the pre checks. I will also not release a list of players that were valid registered but which the representative did not pick. I do that for privacy reasons. Anyways, I can not control what the captain is doing.
I have enough of it and will spend it, even if it takes a long while. I'd rather move away the time consuming tasks away from the players to make them focus on actually playing the tournament rather than with formal things.The representative will only see valid registrations, thus not knowing who did not pass the pre checks. I will also not release a list of players that were valid registered but which the representative did not pick. I do that for privacy reasons. Anyways, I can not control what the captain is doing.
Let's see where this goes then, now that everything is clear \:D/
Hope so
Good luck for this year's tournament
Good luck for this year's tournament
Explain to me why I should watch this tournament when we all know Japan is 98% likely to win?
minhtam1638 wrote:
Explain to me why I should watch this tournament when we all know Japan is 98% likely to win?
Then why people still have to buy lottery? The chance is even less than 0.01%.
The shitmiss is real, even more on the Japanese team according to the last TWC haha!minhtam1638 wrote:
Explain to me why I should watch this tournament when we all know Japan is 98% likely to win?
People who love this game won't say this.minhtam1638 wrote:
Explain to me why I should watch this tournament when we all know Japan is 98% likely to win?
then explain to me why you should watch the tournamentminhtam1638 wrote:
Explain to me why I should watch this tournament when we all know Japan is 98% likely to win?
good luck to all the participants :3
it's either Japan or Taiwanminhtam1638 wrote:
Explain to me why I should watch this tournament when we all know Japan is 98% likely to win?
mrdumpling64 wrote:
it's either Japan or Taiwan
if Taiwan is not banned
who cares about the result? the thing is to have fun playing the game we love, isn't it?
EDIT:
EDIT:
The tiebreaker will be played under FreeMod conditions.what's the meaning of this? you can but you don't have to use mods?
When playing the tiebreaker, no one needs to have a mode activated.
what's the meaning of this? you can but you don't have to use mods?mode not obligatory I suppose ?
it's a bit confusing because these two statements are almost the oposite, or at least, the way i understand them
Topic Starter
Freemod usually allows you to pick a mod, whereas at least one person MUST PICK at least something. This is simply not the case in the tiebreaker. We are enabling freemod, you can play it on HR or HD, but unlike in the real freemod bracket, no one must pick a mod.
then i think it will be better explained with "No free mod at tiebreaker"
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or im still missunderstanding it D:
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or im still missunderstanding it D:
He means that you can use Hd/HR in tiebreaker but there is no obligation for any player to do so, Whereas in freemod bracket, at least one player of each team must enable HD/HR
Is this something new of I just missed it before?Nashmun wrote:
Whereas in freemod bracket, at least one player of each team must enable HD/HR
Topic Starter
That's not new. It has been like that last year, too.
there's some notification if you didnt send your registration correctly?
Topic Starter
Yeh. I just will be able to process all remaining ~100 registrations on Monday. My internet is too dead. Sorry for the delay and I beg for your patience 
oki no problem, i know there will be lots of private messages XD
EDIT: Where's the hype guys?!
EDIT: Where's the hype guys?!
Good luck, guys!
what time is it?
gonna 1 PMThelma wrote:
what time is it?
HYPEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELZD wrote:
Where's the hype guys?!
this already passed the registration phase, right?wiki wrote:
All successfully formed teams will be published after the Registration Phase.
Taiko time~Thelma wrote:
what time is it?
Yeah.Thelma wrote:
this already passed the registration phase, right?wiki wrote:
All successfully formed teams will be published after the Registration Phase.
Topic Starter
I am honest here, my ISP is shitting on me, I have no reliable internet (only tethering with 64kbits) and I can not help it a lot. I wanted to ask if you guys mind it a lot if I postpone the entire TWC by 1 week (respectively 1 weekend), so the drawings may be streamed by someone else, we have more time to form teams properly (and not in haste) and the actual tournament itself can be hosted by myself fluently and fine.
Before I just decide to postpone it, I wanted to hear the public opinion about that. Stuff is rough for me right now, I don't want to cry super much about it, but it's a plain fact that I am lacking of ressources to host the TWC as I actually planned to do. (I had to switch ISP since my current one decided to be unable to provide me the service I ordered. It was planned to be back two weeks ago already, which was not possible and today I finally switched after a final attempt of my old ISP to get shit running - which failed.)
Before I just decide to postpone it, I wanted to hear the public opinion about that. Stuff is rough for me right now, I don't want to cry super much about it, but it's a plain fact that I am lacking of ressources to host the TWC as I actually planned to do. (I had to switch ISP since my current one decided to be unable to provide me the service I ordered. It was planned to be back two weeks ago already, which was not possible and today I finally switched after a final attempt of my old ISP to get shit running - which failed.)
Since it is winter vacation for almost everywhere at this moment, postponing for a week won't be any issue I suppose. Just take your time.
Sorry, I do not take advices from drugsLZD wrote:
myrkulo buy a new avatar pls, put at least a katsu
Loctav if you ever need any help or something I can always assist you, given you'll accept my help. The Taiko community are brothers no matter what, a week of postponing if you need it is fine. Whatever helps you make this tournament a success, is ok with us. Not to speak as a leader for an entire community, certainly one which i've had a strange history with, but as long as you are giving it your all instead of making excuses, certainly it is no problem. I commend your honesty with us instead of just deciding to do things, it can make a world of difference with your community if you're open with them.
If we waited for this 1 year, we can wait 1 week more
bullying
MYRKUL wrote:
Sorry, I do not take advices from drugsLZD wrote:
myrkulo buy a new avatar pls, put at least a katsu
bullying