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How to judge the speed of a stream?

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Total Posts
78
FlyingKebab
339 posts
Joined July 2014
Topic Starter
FlyingKebab
I am having problems in judging the speed of a stream in a beatmap, since half of the time there is no direct correlation between the music and the stream itself and therefore I can't judge the stream through the music. At times i see a stream appear and I am afraid to over stream so I start to tap slowly and I under stream, other times I think a stream is fast and over stream. I have thought of a few ways to fix this problem but I don't know if they are useful at all:

1. Check the BPM of a song before playing it (since streams are always the same speed as the BPM of the song right?) however, since I don't know what speed corresponds to what BPM then it's quite useless for me.
2. Judge the speed of the stream from the speed of the appearance of approach circles, this method seems more legit but it's hard to focus my eyes on a stream when a map has jumps and my eyes are flying around.

Since I'm asking about streams I might as well ask: When I stream if the stream is fast I don't have a problem keeping speed but if it slower than my limit (200-210~) then I tend to slowly ramp my speed down leading to 100's but not so severe to get 50's. How should I practice to counter this problem?
f i z i k
154 posts
Joined January 2013
f i z i k
you really make way too much threads instead of just playing

FlyingKebab wrote:

1. Check the BPM of a song before playing it (since streams are always the same speed as the BPM of the song right?) however, since I don't know what speed corresponds to what BPM then it's quite useless for me.
yes but that only means you can get a feel what kind of speed it is. simply solution: play more and learn to listen to music. learn to stream low bpm so you can get a feel too,play those long stream practice maps on 140bpm till you can do it properly. ultimately you just need to learn to listen to music and get a feel for it (RHYTHM)

FlyingKebab wrote:

2. Judge the speed of the stream from the speed of the appearance of approach circles, this method seems more legit but it's hard to focus my eyes on a stream when a map has jumps and my eyes are flying around.
sound > visuals,so this is not the best idea. maybe works for you,i can only see a difference between < 180bpm and > 180bpm streams so it doesnt matter really


FlyingKebab wrote:

Since I'm asking about streams I might as well ask: When I stream if the stream is fast I don't have a problem keeping speed but if it slower than my limit (200-210~) then I tend to slowly ramp my speed down leading to 100's but not so severe to get 50's. How should I practice to counter this problem?
learn to STREAM,not mash. play low bpm streams and learn to hold a speed and stream properly. no bpm should be too slow to stream,else you can't stream
dung eater
2,395 posts
Joined December 2013
dung eater
If the bpm does not change, you can judge the speed of the stream from any singles before the stream. Pretty much all circles and slider starts&ends do have some sound/change they represent in the song, if not it's probably not a ranked song.

Having louder music, hitsounds off/lower might help in hearing what the circles are there for. Also playing lower bpm songs because less objects means easier time compehending what souinds they represent.
winber1
4,520 posts
Joined February 2010
winber1
every 4 hitcircles in a stream is usually a main beat; therefore every 4 taps you emphasize your hitting motion so that you know where the main beat is, then adjust accordingly to where you emphasize a beat relative to where the actual beat is.

then proceed to rank 1
otoed1
639 posts
Joined May 2014
otoed1
Playmore. Ok 4 real, practice playing a lot of different bpms and eventually it will start to just come to you. I've gotten specifically better at doing different BPM triples by doing this, and its the same for streams, quads, doubles, and basically everything. Don't only play fast songs. Play really low speed songs too so taht you learn to stream accurately.
I Give Up
1,648 posts
Joined January 2014
I Give Up
Play more. 150bpm streams, go.
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo
just play LR2 with gambol until you learn to read streams note by note on infinity OD
chainpullz
2,334 posts
Joined June 2013
chainpullz
You don't judge the speed of a stream. You just play it. You are over thinking things too much. See stream play stream. If you have to think about the stream then you are doing it wrong.
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl
Streams that aren't comprised entirely of 1/4s are pretty uncommon. Do some reading on musical rhythm and try again.
B1rd
2,974 posts
Joined December 2013
B1rd
How to get stream accuracy? practice. you need to practice to be able to visualise in your head what the stream is going to sound like in relation to the music.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy
This maybe a very specialized case, but OP may have a valid reason here. I haven't yet passed Six trillion years and overnight story [0108] but there's one part of it where it seems to not be 1/2's or 1/4's but, yet 1/3's.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dv2GnEXUr6U @ 2:40 is the part im referring to. I see that cookie single'd that part, but 1/3's at 180 bpm is a shocking 270 bpm.

All-in-all, is that part 1/3's ?
B1rd
2,974 posts
Joined December 2013
B1rd
why don't you check in editor?
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

B1rd wrote:

why don't you check in editor?
Not home and this was a rather impromptu response to support op's point, I consider myself a decent reader, yet this part confused me. I played the map twice and i streamed it to no avail and I remembered it and played it again reminding myself to single tap to no avail. It's either 1/3rd's or I am a considerably worse reader than I once thought.

I even just did the math to figure out what bpm it was.


nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl

Clappy wrote:

1/3's at 180 bpm is a shocking 270 bpm.
1/3s are slower than 1/4s (or 1/8s? osu!'s timing system really wigs me out to be honest). That part is slower than all of the other streams.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Narrill wrote:

Clappy wrote:

1/3's at 180 bpm is a shocking 270 bpm.
1/3s are slower than 1/4s (or 1/8s? osu!'s timing system really wigs me out to be honest). That part is slower than all of the other streams.
I assume all beats 1/2's because I single tap them instead of alternating. 180 bpm 1/3 beats equate to a 270 bpm single tap, see the math above to see my reasoning. It would also explain not being able to single tap them or stream them.
Miku Maekawa
58 posts
Joined July 2013
Miku Maekawa
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sixteenth_note
Vuelo Eluko
5,484 posts
Joined October 2013
Vuelo Eluko
i dont know, i think most people should be able to singletap rainbow tylenol singles which is the same as 270 right? i don't think it's that bad. and streaming them would be even easier, effortless even since you just have to go 135 with each finger...
B1rd
2,974 posts
Joined December 2013
B1rd
you don't exactly need to write down just to calculate the bpm of 1/3 notes..

but 135bpm should be very easy to stream, and singletap as well for most people.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Riince wrote:

i dont know, i think most people should be able to singletap rainbow tylenol singles which is the same as 270 right? i don't think it's that bad. and streaming them would be even easier, effortless even since you just have to go 135 with each finger...
Not the point, in most maps you have either halfs and quarters or thirds and sixths. This map contains halfs, thirds and, quarters. The thirds part fit very well but I wasn't able to read it due to me expecting quarter notes. It other maps with random parts they contain notes when you download them saying, there's a 1/6 stream like silver temple for example.

http://osu.ppy.sh/s/59345

and this is even worse 270 note streaming is exceptionally high, jesus1412 and elysion status.
Miku Maekawa
58 posts
Joined July 2013
Miku Maekawa

Riince wrote:

i dont know, i think most people should be able to singletap rainbow tylenol singles which is the same as 270 right? i don't think it's that bad. and streaming them would be even easier, effortless even since you just have to go 135 with each finger...
cuz in that map u singletap in a straight line for 2 minutes totally yeah
Vuelo Eluko
5,484 posts
Joined October 2013
Vuelo Eluko
well its never going to be buffed simply on the merits of reading because tom said on his ask.fm that he doesnt find that kind of confusing bpm changes confusing or difficult
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl

Clappy wrote:

I assume all beats 1/2's because I single tap them instead of alternating. 180 bpm 1/3 beats equate to a 270 bpm single tap, see the math above to see my reasoning. It would also explain not being able to single tap them or stream them.
Don't single tap them? I feel like that would be obvious.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Riince wrote:

well its never going to be buffed simply on the merits of reading because tom said on his ask.fm that he doesnt find that kind of confusing bpm changes confusing or difficult
They aren't confusing or difficult but they should be noted somewhere because when playing a map I expect the bpm to stay the same unless otherwise noted. Check this map out for example: http://osu.ppy.sh/s/65923
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl
The bpm does stay the same, it's just the rhythm that changes. It's your responsibility to read that.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Narrill wrote:

Don't single tap them? I feel like that would be obvious.
Unless otherwise noted, I should either be able to single tap or stream notes because there isnt any notification saying HEY THERE'S 1/3's IN THIS MAP. Is that hard to understand? I thought my whole sight read was fucked.
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl
"Stream" isn't an input paradigm. You either single-tap or alternate, and there shouldn't have to be notifications to help you read the rhythm. You're supposed to do that on your own.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Narrill wrote:

The bpm does stay the same, it's just the rhythm that changes. It's your responsibility to read that.
The rhythm changes if and only if the bpm changes.
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl
No, that's not correct at all. Musical rhythm isn't confined to 1/2s and 1/4s.
CXu
osu! Alumni
3,558 posts
Joined March 2009
CXu
No you shouldn't "either be able to single tap or stream notes because there isnt any notification saying HEY THERE'S 1/3's IN THIS MAP". if the map was any slower you probably could singletap those notes even when they're 1/3. Also, there's no reason to make a notification for 1/3's, as much as there's no reason to write a note about silly fullscreenjumps at the end of some map, or anything for that matter. You play the map, and if you didn't read it properly, then in most cases your sight-reading is just bad.
Miku Maekawa
58 posts
Joined July 2013
Miku Maekawa

Clappy wrote:

Riince wrote:

well its never going to be buffed simply on the merits of reading because tom said on his ask.fm that he doesnt find that kind of confusing bpm changes confusing or difficult
They aren't confusing or difficult but they should be noted somewhere because when playing a map I expect the bpm to stay the same unless otherwise noted. Check this map out for example: http://osu.ppy.sh/s/65923

bpm listed there and the and Dake's mapping reflects the accelerando decently well imo and flows fine
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Narrill wrote:

No, that's not correct at all. Musical rhythm isn't confined to 1/2s and 1/4s.
That is correct however most maps are founded on the idea of single tapping and streaming. [1/2's and 1/4's] its not like the 1/3's are just thrown in there willy nilly but they're exceptionly rare. Rare to the point that, a month of supporter goes to you if can name 5 maps within 10 minutes that contain three of the following: 1/2's, 1/3's and 1/4's. If 5 exist in the game that are ranked.
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl
Are you joking? I can't throw them out by name, but there are dozens upon dozens of maps with 1/2s, 1/3s, and 1/4s. And even if there weren't, mapping conventions aren't sufficient to warrant notification of irregular rhythm. It's up to the player to read the rhythm, and believe you me, it's entirely readable.
Miku Maekawa
58 posts
Joined July 2013
Miku Maekawa

Clappy wrote:

Narrill wrote:

No, that's not correct at all. Musical rhythm isn't confined to 1/2s and 1/4s.
That is correct however most maps are founded on the idea of single tapping and streaming. [1/2's and 1/4's] its not like the 1/3's are just thrown in there willy nilly but they're exceptionly rare. Rare to the point that, a month of supporter goes to you if can name 5 maps within 10 minutes that contain three of the following: 1/2's, 1/3's and 1/4's. If 5 exist in the game that are ranked.
so ur describing the difference between songs in common time and compound time
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Narrill wrote:

Are you joking? I can't throw them out by name, but there are dozens upon dozens of maps with 1/2s, 1/3s, and 1/4s. And even if there weren't, mapping conventions aren't sufficient to warrant notification of irregular rhythm. It's up to the player to read the rhythm, and believe you me, it's entirely readable.
I'm not saying it's not readable, but it's rare enough to the point that I feel there should be a notifaction about them as there are in other maps. It's 100% upto the player to read the rhythm but when there aren't enough maps to practice 1/2's, 1/3's and 1/4's there should be a notifaction about them.
B1rd
2,974 posts
Joined December 2013
B1rd
you're actually serious? lol.
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl
Your feels are noted.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

Apink Chorong wrote:

so ur describing the difference between songs in common time and compound time
Not exactly an instrument player but I know enough about the game to say that 99%+ of the maps are founded on halfs and quarters or thirds and sixths. One of the few rare cases in which halfs, thirds and quarters are applicable to the song, there should be some notification about because it is out of the standard mapping convention.
Clappy
373 posts
Joined May 2013
Clappy

B1rd wrote:

you're actually serious? lol.

Narrill wrote:

Your feels are noted.
Hey I'll extend it, 5 ranked maps with halfs, thirds, and quarters. I'll make it 24 hours. Are there actually a decent number of (ranked) maps with this convention? If so, please show me so I get something new to practice and you get your month of supporter.
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl
That's the thing, it's not out of standard mapping convention. It's out of most mappers' tendencies, but standard mapping convention is totally alright with non-standard rhythms. I would even go so far as to say they're a staple of high-level maps.
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