This is glorious
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osu!mania is so fun
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118
How did you get so good at this game, you're my idol =^)
probably can't beat that acc and score even if I play seriously.
that Facebook sounds too :v ,Agka wrote:
this has to be the best thing I've seen in a while
Paints a sad picture of mania. At least the players seem okay with the game as it is though.
Topic Starter
I'd like to point out that this feat has nothing to do with player skill. 7K pressing every 1/2 beat will pass and combo ANY map if it follows these 3 conditions.
1. The map is bellow 180BPM (This for OD7, you have to raise the OD until the missgate's time value is right bellow 1/2 beat, at OD10 you can use this technic for even FDFD)
2. ~80%-90% of the notes or more don't repeat within the next (or previous) 1/4 beat
3. Doesn't have many LNs (it will survive through a couple)
Indeed you can even pass a shit tone of overjoys this way. Look closely at the vid and realize this combos through stairs, triplets, brackets as well as chords. This is do to how the timegate is large enough to hit all the notes even beyond 1/4 beat ahead.
You can get a friend (with a good sense of beat) that never played any VSRGs before and he'll be able to clear overjoys using this technic on day 1.
The people who are serious about developing their VSRG skills, the true enthusiasts amoungst you, should really take a moment to think about this.
1. The map is bellow 180BPM (This for OD7, you have to raise the OD until the missgate's time value is right bellow 1/2 beat, at OD10 you can use this technic for even FDFD)
2. ~80%-90% of the notes or more don't repeat within the next (or previous) 1/4 beat
3. Doesn't have many LNs (it will survive through a couple)
Indeed you can even pass a shit tone of overjoys this way. Look closely at the vid and realize this combos through stairs, triplets, brackets as well as chords. This is do to how the timegate is large enough to hit all the notes even beyond 1/4 beat ahead.
You can get a friend (with a good sense of beat) that never played any VSRGs before and he'll be able to clear overjoys using this technic on day 1.
The people who are serious about developing their VSRG skills, the true enthusiasts amoungst you, should really take a moment to think about this.
Holy crap I pissed myself
Best vsrg vid ever
Best vsrg vid ever
I wonder how many ice cream have you eaten until you have got this recording 
Funny to see ^^
Funny to see ^^
mario paint music!!
I livestreamed the exact same thing a week after o!m was released and nobody cared.
i cry
i cry
oh... rip , poor you xDBRBP wrote:
I livestreamed the exact same thing a week after o!m was released and nobody cared.
i cry
lolol, just memorized the rhythm D:
Peppy seems to take this matter very seriously... lolopeppy wrote:
mario paint music!!
thats why there are such things as holds lol.
I remember doing sorta the same to get a Perfect on some song in Project Diva, had to use palm to press all the keys down at once though. I guess this is on a whole different level from that.
forget i said anything
nice vid, RHYTHM games ftw
forget i said anything
nice vid, RHYTHM games ftw
Any chance of this kind of thing being addressed? I'm new here so I might be totally out of line by asking, but I dunno.
The only real way to deal with this would be to make hitting a key when there's no note nearby punish the player, which is a big change in terms of game mechanics. This is very unlikely.
Honestly, Drace is just trying to make mania look bad.
Besides, any map that's easy enough to do this on shouldn't be worth any real PP anyway.
Honestly, Drace is just trying to make mania look bad.
Besides, any map that's easy enough to do this on shouldn't be worth any real PP anyway.
Fair enough. Back to osumaniaBobbias wrote:
The only real way to deal with this would be to make hitting a key when there's no note nearby punish the player, which is a big change in terms of game mechanics. This is very unlikely.
Honestly, Drace is just trying to make mania look bad.
Besides, any map that's easy enough to do this on shouldn't be worth any real PP anyway.
Topic Starter
The thing is an insane lv2 is far from being an "easy" map. Osu!mania makes it seem easy with broken mechanics. I still can't hard clear nor groove clear that same exact map on it's original game.
I would play LR2 or O2mania, but honestly osu!mania seems to be 1000000x more active and polished sans some wonky mechanics like this I suppose. Always nice to have an active community.
Topic Starter
LR2's playerbase easily doubles osu!"mania"'s in active players. And osu!mania is far from polished, none of the members on the dev cares about the game mode anymore, they said so themselves. Plus mania is only but a side-mode to the main game here so it was expected. But it's not like LR2 is anymore polished, that dev lost the source code so it's forever in beta lol. And o2jam is just near-dead private servers running on quasi-legacy software haha.
Honestly they're all dead-ends, play w/e you want while patiently waiting for the next big thing I guess. It's coming.
Honestly they're all dead-ends, play w/e you want while patiently waiting for the next big thing I guess. It's coming.
A grim time for VSRG players I suppose.
Yep. it is really is FUN-Hazelnut wrote:
oh... wow well uhm... hmm
OSU!MANIA IS SO FUN
lolol, no, it's full on legacy software man.Drace wrote:
quasi-legacy software
yeah, quite a few of themDrace wrote:
play w/e you want while patiently waiting for the next big thing I guess. It's coming.
Like what?Agka wrote:
yeah, quite a few of themDrace wrote:
play w/e you want while patiently waiting for the next big thing I guess. It's coming.
Someone please explain why it's a bad thing that you can get sub-par scores by robbing all fun out of the game?
Topic Starter
Because for much (and I mean MUCH) bigger portion of the general portion of the VSRG playerbase. People look for clears, not scores.
And now that I think about it, that goes for any games.
And now that I think about it, that goes for any games.
i propose the ice cream sandwich test as the standard vsrg testing method
So osu!mania is more about hitting objects at all rather than accurately. What's wrong with shifting focus somewhere else? Should all games be identical?
I think it's been pretty much determined that osu!mania is going to cater primarily to the casual players in terms of game mechanics. I think it's time people stopped complaining about that and admit that peppy isn't going to magically transform osu!mania into the next hardcore VSRG. There are options out there for people who want a much more challenging set of core mechanics. Instead of complaining about what osu!mania is your time would be better spent on one of the other games.
I'm not just saying to give up on osu!mania entirely either, I'm just sick of this negative attitude. No game can be everything to everyone, and osu already has a pretty well defined niche. Considering how stubborn peppy is, it should be no surprise that osu!mania has gone in this direction, so quit whining about it.
I'm not just saying to give up on osu!mania entirely either, I'm just sick of this negative attitude. No game can be everything to everyone, and osu already has a pretty well defined niche. Considering how stubborn peppy is, it should be no surprise that osu!mania has gone in this direction, so quit whining about it.
Topic Starter
So yeah that's exactly my thoughts. Though no one is whining. Everyone knows nothing's gonna change so they just enjoy ridiculing it. Both mania players and people from the outside. They've come to terms with it.Drace wrote:
You "can" get a friend (with a good sense of beat) that never played any VSRGs before and he'll be able to clear overjoys using this technic on day 1.
The people who are serious about developing their VSRG skills, the true enthusiasts amoungst you, should really take a moment to think about this.
I read posts and comment and all I see are people laughing and finding this hilarious, people enjoying themselves. The only way someone can get insulted by this or believe this is negative attitude is if they know this is true and they don't like it. There's no innate negative attitude here, it's all for the amusement with a couple things to learn on the side.
Honestly if you're fine with new players spam clearing overjoys then we live in completely different worlds. I know I like to be proud of my clears and achievements, not have them be shat on like I did here.Tear wrote:
So osu!mania is more about hitting objects at all rather than accurately. What's wrong with shifting focus somewhere else? Should all games be identical?
Like mentioned earlier this only affects people serious about developing their playing skills. This doesn't stop people from enjoying the game casually, this doesn't stop people from enjoying the social aspects of this game, this doesn't stop mappers from sharing their creations. If such ridiculous thread motivated anyone to quit for other games, they were going to quit sooner or later anyways and just needed a little push.
Honestly, I feel like anyone who says they care about improving, but measures themselves against arbitrary achievements (like the Dan system) or other players (like the ranking system here) is on some level lying. If you're truly interested in becoming better at the game purely for the sake of improving, then all the only person you should need to compare scores to is yourself. Of course, if all you care about is being better than other people, then you've got your skill tiers and ranking systems and your videos and screenshots where you can brag all you like as long as you remember that those systems are not without their flaws.Drace wrote:
I know I like to be proud of my clears and achievements, not have them be shat on like I did here.
Like mentioned earlier this only affects people serious about developing their playing skills.
A pass or fail is only as important as you decide it is. If I pass some crazy level 60+ o2jam chart with OD5 HP5, sure, I'm nowhere near being able to pass that in o2jam, but it's still an accomplishment if I've never passed that thing before. It's still an accomplishment if it makes my last personal best look like a joke in comparison. It's still an accomplishment if I didn't think I would be able to accomplish it when I started playing the song. Sure, maybe that score will end up just another awful score in a VERY long list of awful scores sometime in the future, whereas getting a high rank on something here will last longer in the eyes of the community, but I don't think it makes that score any more special than a truly awful pass on something you didn't expect to pass, or an uncharacteristically high accuracy on something you usually have trouble on.
Also:
Funny that in order to be anywhere on a top rank list here you need incredibly high accuracy more than anything else. Osu's system still favors people SSing easy shit over barely passing something actually hard (to a degree anyway, it's better now that tom's new difficulty calculations are in use, but still far from perfect.)Drace wrote:
People look for clears, not scores.
Topic Starter
The dan system is anything but an arbitrary system. It's potentially perfection in measuring skill on a universal level. Not only due to how it's a pure and simple milestone players strive for and achieve with no convoluted system such as this PP here behind it. You clear it or you don't. And to top it off you can make multiple dan scales to cover different areas of skills. You don't get anything more simple, straightforward and efficient than global milestones. It's not about being better than others, it's about having goals everyone strive for together. It's the exact same thing as personal goal, except they're global.
And yes of course everything becomes relative. Your achievements, your skills and your goals all become relative to the game itself. But when deciding what game people should play on a competitive, end game level. Those arguments become superfluous since they can be said for any game. All you're basically doing is coming with explanations on how people come to tolerate the for-mentioned shortcomings, indirectly agreeing that there "are" shortcomings that makes mania inferior to other games.
These things I denote as shortcomings aren't derived from comparisons with other games. It's just objectional observations.
Long notes:
Normal notes:
Clearing / HP bar / Score
Here's a story since I'm bored
No but in all honesty, there's no way you can honestly believe mania plays LNs better than o2jam or single notes better than LR2. But here's the catch. LR2 longnotes are quite crappy, and o2jam's single notes are also quite crappy. Currently there's no games out there currently capable of calling itself a game with mechanics brilliant enough to challenge every area of skill the most efficiently as a possible. But there are games that can call themselves the best in specific fields. Where o2jam reigns over longnotes and LR2 reigns over control/precision. I'd say mania reigns over spamming (and maybe accuracy for those 1'000'000 score farmers, but very few do that). So hey if spamming is the skill you value the most then mania might actually be the best game out there for you.
For me, I'll jump from game to game depending on what skills I want to train. I'm not bound to any single game nor do I feel the need to defend any of them. There's things I hate and things I love in all of them, and I use all of them to my advantage. Seems to be the logical thing to do.
And yes of course everything becomes relative. Your achievements, your skills and your goals all become relative to the game itself. But when deciding what game people should play on a competitive, end game level. Those arguments become superfluous since they can be said for any game. All you're basically doing is coming with explanations on how people come to tolerate the for-mentioned shortcomings, indirectly agreeing that there "are" shortcomings that makes mania inferior to other games.
These things I denote as shortcomings aren't derived from comparisons with other games. It's just objectional observations.
Long notes:
Expand
-We can't "miss" the releases.
-Long notes can be pressed at any time, even after having falsly released the exact same note.
-They renegerate so much HP they're not even intimidating in most cases.
-Dat combo thing they got going on.
Everything here is tailored to literally PROMOTE spam play. Is there any logical explanation as to how mania's longnote mechanics are better than say o2jam? And don't say our visions of how good LNs should be is influenced by this mutual agreement that o2jam is the king in LNs. We had sm, bms, canmusic, djmax all predecessing o2jam and it still got recognized that way for a reason. It's just a simple you gotta hit and release at the right time or else you miss. With mania's longnote system you develop bad habits which impedes your performances in o2jam (it's not that bad to surmount them though). Yet o2jam players that come here completely wreck the game. From a "general" VSRG gamer's perspective. This means a lot.
There's no denying o2jam is the better game for LNs, just take the time to look at those mechanics comparatively.
-Long notes can be pressed at any time, even after having falsly released the exact same note.
-They renegerate so much HP they're not even intimidating in most cases.
-Dat combo thing they got going on.
Everything here is tailored to literally PROMOTE spam play. Is there any logical explanation as to how mania's longnote mechanics are better than say o2jam? And don't say our visions of how good LNs should be is influenced by this mutual agreement that o2jam is the king in LNs. We had sm, bms, canmusic, djmax all predecessing o2jam and it still got recognized that way for a reason. It's just a simple you gotta hit and release at the right time or else you miss. With mania's longnote system you develop bad habits which impedes your performances in o2jam (it's not that bad to surmount them though). Yet o2jam players that come here completely wreck the game. From a "general" VSRG gamer's perspective. This means a lot.
There's no denying o2jam is the better game for LNs, just take the time to look at those mechanics comparatively.
Normal notes:
Expand
As you seen in the video, there's no penalty for overpressing. And the timegates are horrid enough to hit notes a 1/4 beat ahead. You don't even need a sense of rhythm to play this rhythm game. There's so much technical junk I could throw here but I'll just shorten this by pointing out that OD10 actually makes some songs easier simply because it also shortens the 50 gate, a gate whose only purpose is to prevent spamming by being so big. This 7k key press thing actually doesn't work for FDFD OD7 because of the 50 gate, but flip it to OD10 and you're set to clearing it with an extremely minimal miss count. (I mean like, bellow 10). This just goes to say that these mechanics were just thrown into this without even thinking about what their purpose was, they were thrown in here because other games have them and unfortunately implemented poorly because of it.
Clearing / HP bar / Score
Expand
Some people could say mania isn't about clearing, it's all about score. But what would be the point of even having an HP bar if that were case. All that HP bar does is make people believe they're better than they actually are. Allowing them to "clear", "pass", "beat" a song, (terms that mean that your performance was good enough for next level) when you've missed over a third of the notes. It's ridiculous. Sure HP 9/10 are decent, but no one uses them since the community got used to enjoy spamming everything. And for those who say it's all about score.... The scoring system's multiplier breaks it. You get plays where you clearly did better, missed less, better accuracy, bigger combo, yet fall short in score.
Players have a hard time figuring out a medium to measure their improvements. The PP system makes their rank rise even if there's no improvement involved. The scoring system is superficial. And the ranks are all over the place, you can clear with a D or an S. What's the most common question that showed up on my guide and Entozer's map thread? "Uh should I move on when I clear or when I S or etcet". The game itself doesn't even know what it wants to be and makes the new players feel lost.
Players have a hard time figuring out a medium to measure their improvements. The PP system makes their rank rise even if there's no improvement involved. The scoring system is superficial. And the ranks are all over the place, you can clear with a D or an S. What's the most common question that showed up on my guide and Entozer's map thread? "Uh should I move on when I clear or when I S or etcet". The game itself doesn't even know what it wants to be and makes the new players feel lost.
Here's a story since I'm bored
Expand
The following is a true story
Once upon a time there was little boy. He found this game called osu!mania and really enjoyed hitting notes. His scores were pretty bad but that's ok, he was just starting out. He couldn't wait to get better and kept playing. He got curious about high level plays and found the overjoys. As a joke he went on to try them and simply spammed as fast as he could. His fingers were pretty fast to start with since he plays piano. To his surprise, although he failed, his score was very similar to the beginner maps he played earlier. Thinking this was prediction of skill, he kept playing those maps the exact same way. Spamming overjoys, he eventually came to pass them and even B them. Proud of himself, he thought he was ready to show off his skills to the big boys in LR2. But his world got flipped upsidown the second he started playing. He couldn't even clear level 1s let alone the aforementioned overjoys. Thinking it was just a matter of getting used to the game he kept trying. But alas he was getting nowhere.
Depression and frustration hit him so he started cheating.
The end.
Once upon a time there was little boy. He found this game called osu!mania and really enjoyed hitting notes. His scores were pretty bad but that's ok, he was just starting out. He couldn't wait to get better and kept playing. He got curious about high level plays and found the overjoys. As a joke he went on to try them and simply spammed as fast as he could. His fingers were pretty fast to start with since he plays piano. To his surprise, although he failed, his score was very similar to the beginner maps he played earlier. Thinking this was prediction of skill, he kept playing those maps the exact same way. Spamming overjoys, he eventually came to pass them and even B them. Proud of himself, he thought he was ready to show off his skills to the big boys in LR2. But his world got flipped upsidown the second he started playing. He couldn't even clear level 1s let alone the aforementioned overjoys. Thinking it was just a matter of getting used to the game he kept trying. But alas he was getting nowhere.
Depression and frustration hit him so he started cheating.
The end.
No but in all honesty, there's no way you can honestly believe mania plays LNs better than o2jam or single notes better than LR2. But here's the catch. LR2 longnotes are quite crappy, and o2jam's single notes are also quite crappy. Currently there's no games out there currently capable of calling itself a game with mechanics brilliant enough to challenge every area of skill the most efficiently as a possible. But there are games that can call themselves the best in specific fields. Where o2jam reigns over longnotes and LR2 reigns over control/precision. I'd say mania reigns over spamming (and maybe accuracy for those 1'000'000 score farmers, but very few do that). So hey if spamming is the skill you value the most then mania might actually be the best game out there for you.
For me, I'll jump from game to game depending on what skills I want to train. I'm not bound to any single game nor do I feel the need to defend any of them. There's things I hate and things I love in all of them, and I use all of them to my advantage. Seems to be the logical thing to do.