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o!m scoring...

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Total Posts
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Tidek
1,571 posts
Joined March 2011
Topic Starter
Tidek
In my opinion o!m has the best scoring system from all modes, but still its strange sometimes, especially with scores with a lot of 200 100 50 and misses (it doesnt seem to be very well accurate).

How is it possible that that score
SPOILER
has more points than this?
SPOILER

2x more combo, more rainbow 300, less 200, less 100, less misses and only 1x50 more.

Im just curious, WHY?
[TIM]
38 posts
Joined April 2012
[TIM]
I agree that Mania's scoring system is pretty solid. And to answer your question, I think it would help to look at the math behind the scoring for Mania. Here is how it works.

Score = BaseScore + BonusScore

BaseScore = (MaxScore * ModMultiplier * 0.5 / TotalNotes) * (HitValue / 320)

"BonusScore = (MaxScore * ModMultiplier * 0.5 / TotalNotes) * (HitBonusValue * Sqrt(Bonus) / 320)
Bonus = Bonus before this hit + HitBonus - HitPunishment / ModDivider
Bonus is limited to [0, 100], initially 100.

MaxScore = 1 000 000
ModMultiplier = The score multiplier of the selected mods (difficulty reduction and/or nK)
ModDivider = The punishment divider of the selected mods (difficulty increase)

Judgement HitValue HitBonusValue HitBonus HitPunishment
MAX 320 32 2
300 300 32 1
200 200 16 8
100 100 8 24
50 50 4 44
Miss 0 0 ∞"

-Pulled from the scoring wiki

The biggest thing to take into account here is the bonus score. I.E BonusScore = (MaxScore * ModMultiplier * 0.5 / TotalNotes) * (HitBonusValue * Sqrt(Bonus) / 320)
Bonus = Bonus before this hit + HitBonus - HitPunishment / ModDivider
Bonus is limited to [0, 100], initially 100.

Since misses and 50's make you take a big hit to your bonus score. My guess is that you hit these 50's and misses (and some :x times 200's and 100's) to keep your average Bonus Score lower than the other score where you had less 300's and rainbow 300's. It is sometimes deceiving, but hitting these 50's and misses at the right time can be detrimental to your bonus score... lowering your max potential score by a good amount. In more simple terms, hitting three misses in a row is not nearly as bad as hitting three misses within 50 notes of each other, the latter has a worse effect on your average bonus score.
Last edited by [TIM] , edited 1 time in total.
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo
tldr it's magic
Tidek
1,571 posts
Joined March 2011
Topic Starter
Tidek
Thanks for explaining.
Kamikaze
2,898 posts
Joined November 2012
Kamikaze

Aqo wrote:

tldr it's magic
Words of wisdom
CephiCC
76 posts
Joined August 2013
CephiCC
I don't know how to feel about the o!m system. Regular osu doesn't have a max does it? what would happen if osu's system was implemented into o!m?
Tidek
1,571 posts
Joined March 2011
Topic Starter
Tidek
Never, osu!standard has the worst scoring system ever. (combo scoring)
Lokovodo
463 posts
Joined December 2012
Lokovodo

-Kamikaze- wrote:

Aqo wrote:

tldr it's magic
Words of wisdom
Meseki
29 posts
Here since the beginning
Meseki

CephiCC wrote:

I don't know how to feel about the o!m system. Regular osu doesn't have a max does it? what would happen if osu's system was implemented into o!m?
That would be a very terrible idea, considering that osu!mania has multiple things to hit at once, so making a single mistake in the middle of a song (that would entirely ruin your score) would be a lot more common.

Also, osu!standard's scoring system is really terrible and annoying to deal with, and I believe it has pushed some people away from enjoying the game as much as they could (at least for some time). The creation of the ppv2 system has shown without a doubt that osu!standard's scoring is not nearly an accurate display of how well you performed on a song.
CephiCC
76 posts
Joined August 2013
CephiCC
I didn't know regular osu's score system was so bad ;~; how so?
Meseki
29 posts
Here since the beginning
Meseki

CephiCC wrote:

I didn't know regular osu's score system was so bad ;~; how so?
It uses combo as a multiplier for score gained, making combo exponentially more important than accuracy.

For example, if you get 300s up to 5 combo twice on a 5 star, it gives 2 * (300 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 480) = 3,720 score.
However, if you get 300s up to 10 combo on a 5 star, you get 300 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 480 + 540 + 600 + 660 + 720 + 780 = 5,160 score. Even if the last two 300s were replaced by 50s, they'd be 120 and 130 score, which would be losing 600 and 650 score, which would mean you'd get 3,910 score. That's still more score than if you missed in the middle but got 300s otherwise, despite being notably less Accuracy (83.33% compared to 90.91%).

And it gets much, much worse when the combo numbers get higher.
Janioszek
35 posts
Joined January 2012
Janioszek
I still have no idea how some particular songs are weighed much higher than other, more difficult songs. I'm not saying that o!m score system is bad, but there are some songs which are really easy and you can get loads of pp for them e.g http://osu.ppy.sh/s/49776

Edit:

Wrong thread indeed, don't mind me :(
Last edited by Janioszek , edited 1 time in total.
Vuelo Eluko
5,484 posts
Joined October 2013
Vuelo Eluko

Meseki wrote:

CephiCC wrote:

I didn't know regular osu's score system was so bad ;~; how so?
It uses combo as a multiplier for score gained, making combo exponentially more important than accuracy.

For example, if you get 300s up to 5 combo twice on a 5 star, it gives 2 * (300 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 480) = 3,720 score.
However, if you get 300s up to 10 combo on a 5 star, you get 300 + 300 + 360 + 420 + 480 + 540 + 600 + 660 + 720 + 780 = 5,160 score. Even if the last two 300s were replaced by 50s, they'd be 120 and 130 score, which would be losing 600 and 650 score, which would mean you'd get 3,910 score. That's still more score than if you missed in the middle but got 300s otherwise, despite being notably less Accuracy (83.33% compared to 90.91%).

And it gets much, much worse when the combo numbers get higher.
its scored different because it requires a different skillset than mania

being consistent is rewarded more than being accurate because frankly most of the time it's harder to hold a combo unless were reaching the ridiculous min-maxing levels of accuracy lewa brings for example [chipscape pls].

Accuracy being over combo would be especially bad given the diversity of maps on standard. Take jump heavy maps for example, missing a few key jumps is supposed to be a bad thing because the spacing and aim requirement for those jumps is a big part of what makes the map difficult. well if a particular jump is too hard you could just ignore it and keep focusing on accuracy on other parts of the map and you'd end up winning out over someone who is landing all the heavy aim challenges but isn't able to be as accurate because he can simply keep track of a 1/2 and 1/4 rhythm with his ears and hit 2 keys to it. And there are no or very few maps with very difficult jumps that also feature very long streams where accuracy can [not always] be more impressive than holding a combo.

the combo system works for standard just fine, and mania's scoring system works well for mania. Nothing good could happen from putting mania's score system on standard or vice versa.
Kamikaze
2,898 posts
Joined November 2012
Kamikaze

Janioszek wrote:

I still have no idea how some particular songs are weighed much higher than other, more difficult songs. I'm not saying that o!m score system is bad, but there are some songs which are really easy and you can get loads of pp for them e.g http://osu.ppy.sh/s/49776
Wrong thread, it's not about pp it's about score itself ;A;
Taadashi
230 posts
Joined January 2011
Taadashi
The scoring should be flat imo. No combo multipliers.
Shydon
12 posts
Joined January 2013
Shydon

Taadashi wrote:

The scoring should be flat imo. No combo multipliers.
I think it's ok as it's now. Accuracy is what really matters, and the combo multiplier helps to get a realistic score.. With a flat system the point difference between 80% and 81% is the same than between 99% and 100%, while the real skill difference is much higher in the second case.
Taadashi
230 posts
Joined January 2011
Taadashi

Shydon wrote:

Taadashi wrote:

The scoring should be flat imo. No combo multipliers.
I think it's ok as it's now. Accuracy is what really matters, and the combo multiplier helps to get a realistic score.. With a flat system the point difference between 80% and 81% is the same than between 99% and 100%, while the real skill difference is much higher in the second case.
The 99% score can actually contain more maxes than the 100% score though, wouldn't that be considered more skillful in that case? :P
Shydon
12 posts
Joined January 2013
Shydon

Taadashi wrote:

The 99% score can actually contain more maxes than the 100% score though, wouldn't that be considered more skillful in that case? :P
Yes. And I think with the system we have now if you get 99% with a lot of maxes is better than 100% with none. But someone should confirm that, I don't get a lot of 99% :P
Aqo
2,710 posts
Joined April 2010
Aqo
99% and 100% gives you practically the same. there's only 3%~ difference between 300g and 300 when you play maps near perfectly.
the difference mostly plays in the non-perfect plays range where you get A ranks, there doing an accurate play with misses on the hard part will reward you more than doing an overall spammy play that just happened to hit a lot of notes
onotoleonide
onotoleonide

Tidek wrote:

Never, osu!standard has the worst scoring system ever. (combo scoring)
yes

every gamemode scoring in osu is based on combo
fuck

also 300 shouldn't give 100%, only 300g should
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