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What does "authentic mapping" mean to you?

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K2J
872 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
K2J
Hey look, buddy, I'm an engineer, and that means I have no concept of subjectivity and rely on clearly-defined instructions when making judgments.

I'm trying out "authentic mapping". However, I've found that in the past, when I tried to stray from the clearly-defined distance spacing and mapping styles, I've gotten into trouble.

So, I ask you guys: what is "authentic mapping"? If we had a copy of the internal iNis guide for making beatmaps, what would be in it?

Some things I've heard mentioned:

  1. No overlapping
  2. No use of catmull-rom curves, and rare usage of linear curves
  3. Symmetry
  4. Few stacks, and only if the notes are slow
  5. No streams
What do you more experienced guys think is "authentic mapping"?
m980
Elite Mapper
1,234 posts
Here since the beginning
m980
  1. No overlapping
  2. No use of catmull-rom curves, and rare usage of linear curves
  3. Symmetry
  4. Few stacks, and only if the notes are slow (at max 150bpm)
  5. No streams
  6. Intuitive Jumps (Usually)
  7. Intuitive Anti-Jumps (Usually)
  8. Neat, if not, Perfectly Shaped Sliders (Symmetry works)
  9. Repetition
  10. Flowing Structure (or patterns that can merge with other different patterns in the same map)
Kinda depends on the type of iNiS style map you'd want to map.
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201
This map has been deleted on the request of its creator. It is no longer available.
Pasonia
osu! Alumni
1,199 posts
Joined October 2008
Pasonia
Everything m980 says, plus avoiding 1/4s in all manners possible (stacks, sliders, streams).
Wizard Of Orz
965 posts
Joined May 2008
Wizard Of Orz
copy paste
Torran
724 posts
Joined November 2008
Torran
80 60 42 42
LuigiHann
Resident Skinner
4,432 posts
Here since the beginning
LuigiHann

supergarlic wrote:

copy paste
Specifically, if the music is identical, the patterns are the same. So verses tend to have a bit of variety but the choruses tend to be straight-up flipped copies. Although they do mix it up a bit even then
K2J
872 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
K2J
Yeah, I wasn't sure if that was just me being cynical or if repetition was really a big thing. Though I did notice they tend to build a bit; a chorus gets more complex as the song goes on.

soradg123 wrote:

80 60 42 42
I don't speak that dialect, sorry.
arien666
6,271 posts
Joined May 2009
arien666
osu!
  1. Using angle 60,90degree on circles(Sometimes,I use curve circles
  2. Kiai times on highlight part
  3. Aligning is good XD
Taiko
  1. Following namco's original pattern
  2. [HP Drain Rate=norma]Easy=2~3 Normal,Hard=5~6 Oni=8
  3. Keeping speed X1 but sometimes I change it to X0.5 or X2(EkiBEN2000=Many BPM changes on Taiko Oni...)


Umm...
Should I change these things? :3
Yoshi348
113 posts
Joined June 2009
Yoshi348
Things I haven't seen mentioned:

* Four difficulties, with the last one being merely rotated with harder settings (I've heard Ouendan 2 adds a few beats on some songs too though)
* Nearly always end on a spinner.
* On Easy and Normal, no other spinners but the ending spinner.
RandomJibberish
osu! Alumni
1,833 posts
Joined August 2009
RandomJibberish
That last one isn't always true, the spinners are usually in the same place on all difficulties IIRC...
nomedeusuarionaodisp
161 posts
Joined September 2008
nomedeusuarionaodisp
I don't know how to explain it in "technical" terms, but basically... making a map as similar to its song as possible. That means, I guess... making you feel like you're really dancing with the agents/cheer squad/Pippy/YOU while you play.
Larto
4,128 posts
Joined June 2008
Larto

m980 wrote:

[*] No streams
Jumpin' Jack Flash would like to have a word with you.


YES THOSE THINGS ARE STREAMS.
m980
Elite Mapper
1,234 posts
Here since the beginning
m980
No they are flower/honeybomb combos.
peppy
19,301 posts
Here since the beginning
peppy
I'd like to add that you shouldn't make insane "authentic" maps. They are stupid and shouldn't really be ranked in the first place.
K2J
872 posts
Here since the beginning
Topic Starter
K2J
Do you mean:

  1. There should never be a fourth difficulty, ever, since if they want Hard ROCK!! they can just use the appropriate mod
  2. The only appropriate fourth difficulty is the third one flipped around and with tighter difficulty
  3. No map should be what is usually considered "insane" by difficulty standards (e.g., impossible to complete by anyone besides the top #100 or so)
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201

peppy wrote:

I'd like to add that you shouldn't make insane "authentic" maps. They are stupid and shouldn't really be ranked in the first place.
iNiS styleguides work wonders in keeping total crap out of your maps. (recently posted Tropes link for extra phail -.-) Deathstream-ridden / clustery maps have no right to title themselves "authentic." And there's nothing stopping authentic class maps from being hard.

K2J: Hard Rocks usually have extra bits thrown in--extra runs, jumps, etc. Ouendan2 does this especially commonly, and it's the most up-to-date reference we have for iNiS style. Also in keeping with osu! ranking expectations, this is essential.

Also, on break placement: There are always at two and at most four breaks in a map. The first break is usually found before the first chorus, but this rule can be broken if there's not enough music to map before the first chorus. (eg. Survivor) Break placement is usually fairly even, but often the later sections are longer. In Ouendan2, there's a tendency in some maps to have sections which only last for a phrase or two.

Mapping always begins on the first stanza of the first verse. If a chorus is found before this (quite rare, and is usually done slowly in music which does this), it doesn't count as the "first chorus" for the purposes above.

In most cases, breaks should be of equal length.
Senor Cardgage
17 posts
Joined October 2009
Senor Cardgage
Well, this has all been infinitely useful, since I only make authentic-style maps. I find the common osu! map (i.e. those that abuse streams, microsliders, and Super Short Spinners almost obnoxiously, those where even the easiest difficulties are comparable to the toughest Ouendan/EBA songs on Insane) needlessly frustrating, especially for someone like me who's relatively new to osu! and thus doesn't have near the same experience as some of the more seasoned vets. That's why I don't play/mod as much as I probably should, because I can't stand maps that do the above, yet those maps comprise about 90% of all the maps here. Granted, there are some maps that aren't authentic style and still manage to be enjoyable (Counting You Up is a perfect example of this), but they tend to be few and far between.

Go reasonable, or don't go at all. That's my mapping philosophy.
NotShinta
1,021 posts
Joined September 2009
NotShinta
Hard ROCK! only flips vertically, which is stupid, but the games flip horizontally and vertically. So Insanes aren't completely useless.

Senor Cardgage wrote:

Well, this has all been infinitely useful, since I only make authentic-style maps. I find the common osu! map (i.e. those that abuse streams, microsliders, and Super Short Spinners almost obnoxiously, those where even the easiest difficulties are comparable to the toughest Ouendan/EBA songs on Insane) needlessly frustrating, especially for someone like me who's relatively new to osu! and thus doesn't have near the same experience as some of the more seasoned vets. That's why I don't play/mod as much as I probably should, because I can't stand maps that do the above, yet those maps comprise about 90% of all the maps here. Granted, there are some maps that aren't authentic style and still manage to be enjoyable (Counting You Up is a perfect example of this), but they tend to be few and far between.

Go reasonable, or don't go at all. That's my mapping philosophy.
There are lots of enjoyable non-authentic maps hidden in all the anime and Vocaloid.

Anyway, it's all already been explained.
mm201
osu! Alumni
4,495 posts
Joined August 2008
mm201

IAmNotShinta wrote:

There are lots of enjoyable non-authentic maps hidden in all the anime and Vocaloid.
Maps by Rolled, James, peppy, awp, and LuigiHann mainly.

m980 wrote:

Larto wrote:

Jumpin' Jack Flash would like to have a word with you.


YES THOSE THINGS ARE STREAMS.
No they are flower/honeybomb combos.
Countdown.

Streams aren't allowed to overlap, so when they do happen, they are extra hard.

Also please follow the Methods of Symmetry. (Left-Right Repetition, Down-The-Middle, and Segmentation) But not just one method; use all of the methods in ways which fit the music.

Symmetry isn't usually 100% perfect. (Echo style) Especially when a repeat of a pattern is done and you Ctrl+V/Ctrl+H, you should vary the pattern to match any changes to the underlying rhythm if it's slightly different.
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