Performance Points feedback and suggestions (Standard)

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Topic Starter
Tom94

Kinji wrote:

um, well, i am really confused with the new system, but why is there a BIG difference between a player tp and the ranking? Sorry if I kinda offended anyone here....
Don't worry, asking as question shouldn't offend anyone.
tp and pp while being more similar now are still very different. Especially in lower ranks, since tp was neither able to obtain information about sub-top50 scores nor designed for casual players in the lower rankings. You can look at tp for a general guideline of how much your scores are worth, but that's about it. Don't expect the two systems to overlap too much.
Mazzerin
I just played https://osu.ppy.sh/b/263384&m=0 on Nogard for the first time and passed it, and lost 4pp. Is there any particular reason for that?
Kinji
Thx, but if its like that, then what is the algorithm or method that the new pp system is running by? Its by calculating all your scores right? Isn't that a advantage for old players that have played alot more beatmaps than the new players? Or is it using a similar system as osu!tp? Because osu!tp is calculating the player aim, speed and accuracy, which is the closest to calculating the skill of the players.....? :D
Xiaolin
Well, still the pp are bad. :(
Daiyaa

Mazzerin wrote:

I just played https://osu.ppy.sh/b/263384&m=0 on Nogard for the first time and passed it, and lost 4pp. Is there any particular reason for that?
Probably the system updating
Magnolia
this system seems semi messed up. i mean in all honesty the person with the most #1's should be #1 not someone who has a few #1's on some retarded maps, i mean this was proven yesterday 1 person 20 #1's and 8k pp, this system is super flawed
Topic Starter
Tom94

Mazzerin wrote:

I just played https://osu.ppy.sh/b/263384&m=0 on Nogard for the first time and passed it, and lost 4pp. Is there any particular reason for that?
You can't lose pp by getting a completely new score - that is by passing a map you never passed before. Everything is being reprocessed at the moment, so instabilities like this may occur for a short while. Did you maybe have a NoFail pass on the map before? That one might have been considered better.


HandHeldPillow wrote:

this system seems semi messed up. i mean in all honesty the person with the most #1's should be #1 not someone who has a few #1's on some retarded maps, i mean this was proven yesterday 1 person 20 #1's and 8k pp, this system is super flawed
If I would present you with a system where players are strictly ranked by amount of #1s, then believe me, you wouldn't be happy about it. Or do you support farming easy diffs with all possible mods all day? :P
Daiyaa

HandHeldPillow wrote:

this system seems semi messed up. i mean in all honesty the person with the most #1's should be #1 not someone who has a few #1's on some retarded maps, i mean this was proven yesterday 1 person 20 #1's and 8k pp, this system is super flawed

HandHeldPillow wrote:

the person with the most #1's should be #1
I hope this a sincere troll. By your logic, if I went and got the most #1's on easy maps, I should be #1 world? Please.
NaTha
i don't like it :'(
To get more pp i must pass and read insane
But thats what i can't!!
Iam on Hard + HD so Insane needs to long!
So i must give up my Rank
Daiyaa
Well thats the rank you deserve if you can't do the insanes.
Fantastic_Cake
...
Magnolia
i dont believe that farming easy and normals should not reward pp at higher levels, but i do believe that hards should be taken account and give some (not as much as ppv1 but some) pp, in the current state it seems that i have to become a circle clicking god to gain ranks, sadly my asian levels have not hit 9000 yet
Topic Starter
Tom94

HandHeldPillow wrote:

i dont believe that farming easy and normals should not reward pp at higher levels, but i do believe that hards should be taken account and give some (not as much as ppv1 but some) pp, in the current state it seems that i have to become a circle clicking god to gain ranks, sadly my asian levels have not hit 9000 yet
Hards still do give a considerable amount of pp - if your best scores consist of hards or worse. You seem to already have climbed up to some Insanes. A ranking system, that tries to tell people how good they are shouldn't reward you a lot for playing maps that are more or less easy for you. Farming is not a bad thing and actually already built in for your first few thousand scores, but with 20,000 plays this has already more or less come to a halt for you.
XGeneral2000

NaThaNeL wrote:

i don't like it :'(
To get more pp i must pass and read insane
But thats what i can't!!
Iam on Hard + HD so Insane needs to long!
So i must give up my Rank

HandHeldPillow wrote:

i dont believe that farming easy and normals should not reward pp at higher levels, but i do believe that hards should be taken account and give some (not as much as ppv1 but some) pp, in the current state it seems that i have to become a circle clicking god to gain ranks, sadly my asian levels have not hit 9000 yet
If you want ranks, you need to get better. You don't need to be Cookiezi to make your rank higher than it is, you just need to be better than you are right now.

Constantly gaining rank for doing what you always do is exactly what farming is. If you no longer gain rank from what you are doing, the system is telling you that it is time to bite the bullet and improve.

If you don't need to improve to increase rank, what's the point of it?
ChaosVictor
I think there could be a separate ranking to Speed, Accuracy and Aim, instead of only for Score and overall Performance. You can already calculate each of them, right? It would help give people a notion to what they should improve and what they can already do.
FlameseeK

Tom94 wrote:

You can't lose pp by getting a completely new score - that is by passing a map you never passed before. Everything is being reprocessed at the moment, so instabilities like this may occur for a short while. Did you maybe have a NoFail pass on the map before? That one might have been considered better.
Don't you think No Fail and Slow passes should be left out? I mean, I don't even know why they're ranked in the first place, but allowing these to give pps just makes things even messier.
Salvage
I really think that having the speed, acc and aim thing here as well will help every player to know what they lack and how to improve, since tp and pp now are really like each other whenever i want to farm pp i'd go to tp and see what gives me points and the most important thing, WHY it gives me points (high speed, aim etc) and that way i'm recognizing the 'training' i'm doing to increase my ranking. (And with this i mean we should be able to see that here too, it's not a big deal but since maps are calculated in another way here, there is a difference from what we're seeing on osutp.net and what we would be seeing here)

I'm sorry if explain myself like a retard but well, i tried.



Also i guess this would be dealed with when the wiki comes so it's not like things like this aren't planned, just saying.
Pold

FlameseeK wrote:

Tom94 wrote:

You can't lose pp by getting a completely new score - that is by passing a map you never passed before. Everything is being reprocessed at the moment, so instabilities like this may occur for a short while. Did you maybe have a NoFail pass on the map before? That one might have been considered better.
Don't you think No Fail and Slow passes should be left out? I mean, I don't even know why they're ranked in the first place, but allowing these to give pps just makes things even messier.
Not at all, see this hypothetical example, there is a long song with 1000 notes (fc) and 220 bpm, which has a long stream at the end. Player 1 can't stream at that speed, so he plays with NF, and gets a 90% acc 600 combo score, player 2 can barely stream at that speed, and gets a 75% acc 300 combo score, without mods. At least, if you ask me, Player 1 deserves more pp, by far, and that score shouln't be left out.
-Chronopolis-

ChaosVictor wrote:

I think there could be a separate ranking to Speed, Accuracy and Aim, instead of only for Score and overall Performance. You can already calculate each of them, right? It would help give people a notion to what they should improve and what they can already do.
And when the more important stuff is settled, a place where you can see all your contributing maps and their scores.
Nyxa

HandHeldPillow wrote:

i dont believe that farming easy and normals should not reward pp at higher levels, but i do believe that hards should be taken account and give some (not as much as ppv1 but some) pp, in the current state it seems that i have to become a circle clicking god to gain ranks, sadly my asian levels have not hit 9000 yet
What you're basically asking for here is for an increase in rank without an increase in skill. This is exactly why the old ranking system was removed. If you don't like your rank - improve as a player. If you don't want to improve as a player, accept the rank you have.

pold10 wrote:

Not at all, see this hypothetical example, there is a long song with 1000 notes (fc) and 220 bpm, which has a long stream at the end. Player 1 can't stream at that speed, so he plays with NF, and gets a 90% acc 600 combo score, player 2 can barely stream at that speed, and gets a 75% acc 300 combo score, without mods. At least, if you ask me, Player 1 deserves more pp, by far, and that score shouln't be left out.
Wasn't nofail only going to give a 0.05x score decrease? I think this is better, since there are some maps that I can play quite fine until one part that I always fail. Being able to still get a reasonable score for doing well on the rest of the map should be fair.
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