Full Tablet wrote:

Salvage wrote:

What about considering accuracy with unstable rate? Or is it that hard to calculate on every map played?.

I don't think it is possible since I don't think there is enough information stored to retrieve that value exactly.

It can be estimated though, as long as you ignore sliders (since sliders can potentially increase UR without reducing accuracy, since they don't need to be hit accurately).

Sliders and spinners already are ignored for the part of the calculation that is responsible for accuracy. But yeah, in the end it only is an approximation of unstable rate due to per-hitobject data not being available.

I went from rank 15k to rank 9k. That's...something. I guess it's because I tried really hard to do well on harder songs and didn't farm normal/hards very much at all?

MosaicII wrote:

DT is better for pp, as FL. If i haв highscore with DT, but i've broken my old DT-record with FL, my old reord must be deleted from base and i lose pp, isn't it?
For exampe, WoobWoofWolf has his the best record for "Saiya - Remote Control" beatmap now. He has 5 misses, but he used DT+HD mode. But SnowWhite played this map without DT, with HD+HR, have FC, but doesn't have this map for Best Perfomance. If WoobWoofWolf plays now map without mods and break his own records, he loses old records and loses pp.
So, best score for beatmap is not best pp. It is better to use DT and don't play other mods without DT. Is it wrong?

The old ppv1 system had the same issue. A solution would be storing "best performances" separately from "best scores", but the problem is that would be expensive in term of server resources; and if the system has time degradation of scores, it wouldn't solve the problem in all cases (depending in how the degradation is implemented)

Not sure if this belongs here but I'll ask anyway.

Are there plans on fixing the star star sytem by replacing it with the beatmap difficulty level?

I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:

Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.

My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?

kreph wrote:

Not sure if this belongs here but I'll ask anyway.

Are there plans on fixing the star star sytem by replacing it with the beatmap difficulty level?

That sure sounds like a nice idea, considering all the maps already have a difficulty rating calculated by the system.

Izzypookins wrote:

I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:

Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.

My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?

All scores being used means that it doesn't have the limitation that tp had where it could only access top 50 score data. PPv2 has access to ranks beyond top 50 which is why they say all scores are used.

Izzypookins wrote:

I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:

Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.

My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?

If both scores are on the same map, then the higher score value gets used, even if the other would give more pp. As I mentioned earlier we can not work around this at the moment.
If those 2 scores are on different maps, then how much pp you will get highly depends on how hard the maps are.

Tom94 wrote:

Izzypookins wrote:

I'm not sure if I'm understand the "all scores are used" thing, but tell me if I'm right with this example:

Score 1: 10,000,000 score, played on normal, FC 100%.
Score 2: 3,000,000 score, played on DT/HD, had 1 miss. 99%.

My best score would show up as Score 1, but my best "performance" would probably be from Score 2, so the PP I get from Score 2 would count for my PP ranking?

If both scores are on the same map, then the higher score value gets used, even if the other would give more pp. As I mentioned earlier we can not work around this at the moment.
If those 2 scores are on different maps, then how much pp you will get highly depends on how hard the maps are.

Got it! Thanks!

Damn where's the beatmaps that i have farm. 9k ---> 27k , guess that's because me too mach farm back then :'(

Is it just me or mods aren't affecting too much in the new pp ranking?

well, i think the current system is the closest to perfect ~ time to farm

.

UE95 wrote:

Hey there thank you so much for replying. One last question, you did mention Dt and HR in your example. How well would Hidden fare against those two and against scores without mods?

I can't give definite answers for any mod. All I can say is that it depends a lot on the map. The new system does not just multiply the value of map when adding mods, it calculates a whole new difficulty with the mods. For example, if you're playing a map with DoubleTime, then the algorithm will calculate a new difficulty value of the map, considering it to be 1.5x as fast. With HardRock it considers the circles smaller and the OD higher. Hidden gives a bonus to the aiming-aspect of the map, so it has a greater effect on maps which are harder to aim.
The same logic applies to all other mods.

I'm not sure if it was written anywhere in here, but I would like to be able to see more than just 10 of my top performances. If a player by themselves could see all, or more than just their top 10 scores (Maybe top 100?) it would be very useful.

.

Really good job, I don't feel like a farmer

UE95 wrote:

Haha no worries man, I respect the secrecy. Your answer cleared my doubts either way, thank you! Once the full criteria is updated on the wiki I'll know more. GL with the new system ^^

Not like I want to keep it a secret. I just don't want to type a few paragraphs now and in the wiki later on. Call it laziness.

.

I feel a bit skeptical about encompassing ALL passed ( I am assuming passed ) play-through scores tallying into your rank at the moment. I haven't gotten a chance to hop into multiplayer yet and get a feel for how other players compare to me but personally, I've lived in multiplayer for the past 2 odd years. I've made it a personal rule never to auto-fail in an MP match because I missed a note or made a silly mistake which means I have thousands of play-throughs with horribad scores becuase mr/mrs host decided to tack on DT or I was feeling dangerous and decided to live in the HD HR side of life. Or I was just with a bunch of friends and we were dicking around playing '08-'09 maps, HR super small circle size maps, troll an insane diff AR5 map, etc...

I have not toiled a lot of effort compiling this post, it is simply a couple ideas that came to mind while playing and gestating around the post about this new system being implemented. I have no intention of trying to get into the nitty-gritty about "X" mod gives less value then "Y" mod, my ACC dropped because of those 50 D ranks I have from 4 years ago, trying to meta-game the system to know why exactly "Z" map gives more points then "W" map. I really could care less about whatever new system comes out next and how it ultimately effects my golden number. I say give the option to choose what you want in osu! options to display the new pp/tp system or your original total ranked score rank.

The concern I'm trying to get at is for those who really only play multiplayer now and its effects compared to those who really only play singleplayer and have the ability to always ESC->Retry to their heart's content. I do not find the excuse of 'then auto fail the map if you don't want your score tallied' since it undermines the purpose of multiplayer to those who may have thought that while reading this.

Should there be a completely different point system for MP playing? (this subject is irrelevant to everything else in this post, but came to mind while typing it all. Kinda came outta left field.)

From your lovely flying fish who lives in MP, day in and day out, FishHook. I hope something in this post of rambling helps you in your advancement of the new ranking system. Cheers.

FishHook wrote:

The concern I'm trying to get at is for those who really only play multiplayer now and its effects compared to those who really only play singleplayer and have the ability to always ESC->Retry to their heart's content. I do not find the excuse of 'then auto fail the map if you don't want your score tallied' since it undermines the purpose of multiplayer to those who may have thought that while reading this.

The bad scores you got while playing MP shouldn't affect your ranking much.
As for your accuracy, you can increase it by getting good accuracy in hard maps.

Would it be possible for osutp.net to obtain scores out of the top 50 range since it has been implemented into official osu rankings? it would be great if we can get an exact value on each of our best plays!

Still don't think it's perfect. My top performances are a joke, I did them in many less tries than some of my top performances in the old system. I think you've done a good job to reduce the effect of farmed hard difficulty maps in some way but in other ways you have ruined a lot of people's hard performances.

­

Yuzuru wrote:

9k ---> 27k , guess that's because me too mach farm back then :'(

Everyone who used to rank up by tricking the system are getting wrecked quite hard now huehue
 
 
More seriously; I always felt like short fast streams were a bit underrated in tp, feels pretty much the same here.
A short 250bpm stream (~11 circles) will be worth less than a long 210bpm stream (17+ circles), but the first one is way harder imo.
 
 
 
Other than that, because it's also close from tp it's a really nice ranking system. Good job there :p

GoldenWolf wrote:

Everyone who used to rank up by tricking the system are getting wrecked quite hard now huehue

...except me!

Liiraye wrote:

R e d wrote:

ItHR still have a over value?

Lets have Thelewa for example: He is really good Hr Hd but he don't have so much speed and DT accuracy as SnowWhite, Dungeon or DragonHuman.

I Respect Thelewa. But still think he don't deserve 3#

It depends a lot really. Some maps that are practically impossible to aim propely that only a handful of players can hdhr deserves pp as well. Don't you agree?

Speed isn't everything you know!

Yes but i can say the same for Fast maps with Dt, Where is impossible for Thelewa beat SnowWhite or Dungeon.

Accuracy isn't everything you know!

Is there multiplicator for NF?

I was #169 I was so happy

now im #161

i hate all of you responsible for this

Well I went from 5.8k to 11k. I did trick the system quite a bit to get to 5k, but not too much. The proof being I've already climbed 4k ranks since I've logged in.

My main issue though is that sometimes I will pass a song, it will end up in my best performances, but I won't get any pp for it. A little strange. Also, osusig doesn't update properly. I've had to change the signature layout twice already just to update it, but that's fairly miniscule.

I noticed the new ranking system favors mods even though some no mod maps are a lot more difficult and reward less.

Nakage wrote:

The proof being I've already climbed 4k ranks since I've logged in.

Don't forget to count the fact that inactive players were purged from the rankings.


I really like the system as it is right now. Counting all ranks in the system instead of top 1000/800 or 500 makes it a lot more motivating to try and beat your older scores. Went up from 3.5k (ppv1) to 1.8k.

muh speedy fingers

Syclasm wrote:

Don't forget to count the fact that inactive players were purged from the rankings.

Right :3 the purge made me climb 2300 ranks, so I still went from 9.3k to 7.5k, still decent imo.

~

I like this change actually. It feels much more skill based now rather than just knowing what maps to farm up. The way it was before, if you were in the top 300 or so, then you could make it up to the top 10 if you played enough. You would have enough skill to do so because all the maps that would give the most PP are right around that level to easily farm.

My only problem is rank updates. I played 2 songs. 1 of them made it onto the very top of my best performances, I went up 30 ranks. The 2nd one made it to the 2nd highest, I went up 800 ranks (Now sitting at 6761). I'm sure the ranks aren't clustered that hard in pp to where there's a 100 pp gap somewhere at rank 7k.

EDIT: If it's still in the process of cleaning inactive users, I should note I also went up ~100 pp by playing the 2 songs, so I think the 800 ranks was from the pp, not the cleaning.

Layne wrote:

I lofe the chnge in thisbmpe ok vry god.
thx u

wat

Can't we just use pp rank instead of score rank for every song like the tp website? or keep both so best pp rank and best score rank are independent.

If ppv2 is using the same difficulty calculations on maps as tp, why is it that my highest and 3rd highest tp maps don't make my best performance even though everything below did?

i guess its good. i went from 8.1k to 8.6k and my acc went up by 1% for some reason. no flaws that i can see

Almost wrote:

If ppv2 is using the same difficulty calculations on maps as tp, why is it that my highest and 3rd highest tp maps don't make my best performance even though everything below did?

shh at least you're higher than me

my second highest ppv2 score gave me gave me 0tp.

GoldenWolf wrote:

Everyone who used to rank up by tricking the system are getting wrecked quite hard now huehue
 

It's actually quite nice that easier ranks don't get counted as heavily. Sometimes when I'm tired of playing hard maps over and over I take a "break" where I try getting a top 50 on easier maps. It's a good way to relax a bit if your hands hurt or if you're tired but if you still want to play, but in the old system that'd make your rank go up increasingly. Now I can do the same thing without having to worry about having a "farmed" rank.


I agree with some of the previous posts that it might be nice to see the amount of pp a certain map has earned you, though I understand if that might be annoying to implement.

I have a question about something I've seen in the rankings - next to some ranks, I've seen something like ^3d. Does this refer to the amount of time passed since that score was set? And why does it only show for some rankings, even though I set some other ranks that didn't have that sign beside them?