1. Try to use AR 5. It makes things look neater and improves the balance of the set. Not to mention, it matches with your slider velocity and makes the diff a little more pleasant.
   
2. Sorry to say that, but after a long discussion with Sieg we've decided that your rhythm really needs to be improved as its quality is not what we believe to be qualification-ready. Below you'll find the reasos why and some comments.
   
   1. 00:08:019 (1) - the vocals aren't strong enugh here and they have no support from the music. It is just too hard to hit + it wassn't mapped in the rest of the diffs. We highly suggest removing the slider.
      In fact, the idea of following the vocals did not turn out well. To start with, a lot of quite strong beats are unstressed (like 00:09:970 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - and some others) or are totally ignored. (00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - this one leaves the beginning of kiai unstressed)
      Note: to avoid this kind of issues, the best solution is to combine both vocals and music as this kind of rhythm is quite consistent/logical and reflects the song well.
   2. 00:14:604 - the empty space here shoul be mapped. It feels really confusing to have that much of an emty unmapped space while the music is still quie strong and could be mapped.
   3. 01:15:092 (4,5,6) - the 3/4 gaps are not playable enough for this diff. You have quite a lot of 1/2s and mixing them with 3/4s (which are hard to play in general) makes the diff too tricky/complicated to be a Normal. I strobgly suggest replacing such rhythms with 3/4 sliders like 01:16:067 (7).
      Note: 01:00:458 (3,4) - this is even harder as (3) gets off music and (4) becomes hard to catch.
   4. 03:16:799 (9) - you didn't use such sliders before, adding a new kind of rhythm in the end of the diff will bug players In addition, the sliders are too short and tey might be sorta hard to hit.
      
      All these issues combined together make the rhythm of the diff too hard for a Normal and become sorta unplayable for Normal diff players. Try to learn a little more and check out this and that as thee pages will be really helpful! Also, you're free to contact either me or Sieg if you have any questions.
3. 01:42:165 (3,4,5) - just for your future maps, try to avoid this kind of overlaps while mapping Easy/Normal diffs as they are hardly readable for players and trouble them a lot.
4. 02:13:385 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - well, kinda the same as above. That's a nice pattern, but overlaps with hitbursts will make it too complicated/hard to read and newbies won't be able to appreciate te amazingness of the idea.
5. 03:01:433 (3,5) - according to the rules, all reverse-arrows must be visible and perfectly readable. However, a significant part of the reverse-arrow here gets overlapped with the previous slider aand this is not really readable
6. 03:21:921 (1,1) - try to leave more space after spinners when it's possible. The best is to keep ~750ms of recovery time after each spinner, so players will be able to aim and catch objects after the spinner properly.

1. Your BG is 1365x768, almost 16:9 :3 this doesn't need to be fixed. Just wanted to mention for you to know.
2. add "the midsummer station" - album name to tags

1. 02:06:799 (2,4) - Make them similar by copy-paste, will be more appealing
2. 03:19:970 (1) - There should be 1 full measure for recovery after spinner for easy. You can end spinner on 03:23:872 () - this will also allow to cover 03:23:385 () - 03:23:872 (1) which is nice. And delete 03:24:848 (1) - slider.
3. 03:29:726 (1) - way too short for easy level, also there not enough time to recover after.
4. ^Play rhythm gap after this slider is also kinda ruin following part because it really feels like the very end of diff.
5. 03:32:653 (1) - you should lower volume level according to background music for this part.
6. 03:34:604 (3,1) - Also this would be nice to cover "don't" lyrics here instead of ending slider on 03:35:580 ()

1. 00:38:506 (8,9,10,11) - This pattern offers player to play 00:39:482 (11) - like 1\2 It would be good to place 00:38:506 (8,9,10) - as single pattern aside from 00:39:482 (11) -
2. 01:48:750 (8,9,10,11) - ^Same here
3. 00:46:189 (2,3) - Actually doubles here would be much more suitable than on 00:44:604 (5,6,7,8) Beats 00:46:067 () and 00:46:433 () way too strong you shouldn't ignore them.
4. 01:56:433 (2,3) - ^And here too.
5. 01:29:970 (1,2) - Why this two placed too so tight? Widen them a bit to make them more appealing \ consistent with general spacing.
6. 02:11:677 (5,6,7,8) - Line jumps hard by themselves and such high DS for jump here is making this even more like hell, consider to reduce this.
7. 02:50:458 (3,1) - Fells like they way to close after 02:49:970 (1,2,3) You can more this to something like http://puu.sh/dgJDV/df51f98e0c.jpg

1. Would be good to have some variety because just soft-hitnormal all the way is a bit monotonous, yep song doesn't give space for many hard beats so you can use alternation for soft-hitnormal.
2. For example using different hitnormal http://puu.sh/dgKCn/7d97927d2a.wav on every 1 - 3 notes and hitfinish http://puu.sh/dgKFd/d834cabcd0.wav on every 2 downbeats or whatever follows music can give such results:
   http://puu.sh/dgKzz/2d86c9852d.mp3
   You can compare that with start of your kiai

Sieg wrote:

Hello

[General]

1. Your BG is 1365x768, almost 16:9 :3 this doesn't need to be fixed. Just wanted to mention for you to know.
2. add "the midsummer station" - album name to tags

[ColdTooth's Easy]

1. 02:06:799 (2,4) - Make them similar by copy-paste, will be more appealing
2. 03:19:970 (1) - There should be 1 full measure for recovery after spinner for easy. You can end spinner on 03:23:872 () - this will also allow to cover 03:23:385 () - 03:23:872 (1) which is nice. And delete 03:24:848 (1) - slider.
3. 03:29:726 (1) - way too short for easy level, also there not enough time to recover after.
4. ^Play rhythm gap after this slider is also kinda ruin following part because it really feels like the very end of diff.
5. 03:32:653 (1) - you should lower volume level according to background music for this part.
6. 03:34:604 (3,1) - Also this would be nice to cover "don't" lyrics here instead of ending slider on 03:35:580 ()

[Hard]

1. 00:38:506 (8,9,10,11) - This pattern offers player to play 00:39:482 (11) - like 1\2 It would be good to place 00:38:506 (8,9,10) - as single pattern aside from 00:39:482 (11) -
2. 01:48:750 (8,9,10,11) - ^Same here
3. 00:46:189 (2,3) - Actually doubles here would be much more suitable than on 00:44:604 (5,6,7,8) Beats 00:46:067 () and 00:46:433 () way too strong you shouldn't ignore them.
4. 01:56:433 (2,3) - ^And here too.
5. 01:29:970 (1,2) - Why this two placed too so tight? Widen them a bit to make them more appealing \ consistent with general spacing.
6. 02:11:677 (5,6,7,8) - Line jumps hard by themselves and such high DS for jump here is making this even more like hell, consider to reduce this.
7. 02:50:458 (3,1) - Fells like they way to close after 02:49:970 (1,2,3) You can more this to something like http://puu.sh/dgJDV/df51f98e0c.jpg

I went through the suggested changes and felt that this did not impact game-play or hurt the creation of the map, everything in here is following of the rules and ranking guide lines (And I enjoy it they way it plays as of now.) while I value your suggestions I will not change anything in my hard, as for the other guest diffs that is for them to decide.
[Hitsounds]

1. Would be good to have some variety because just soft-hitnormal all the way is a bit monotonous, yep song doesn't give space for many hard beats so you can use alternation for soft-hitnormal.
2. For example using different hitnormal http://puu.sh/dgKCn/7d97927d2a.wav on every 1 - 3 notes and hitfinish http://puu.sh/dgKFd/d834cabcd0.wav on every 2 downbeats or whatever follows music can give such results:
   http://puu.sh/dgKzz/2d86c9852d.mp3
   You can compare that with start of your kiai

I have the hitsounds set to a pattern of the music, nothing there is broken or in the need of changing, but I will go over some methods to make the sound more impactful

-Bakari- will post our detailed feedback the for Normal diff. p/3546794

-Bakari- wrote:

Just don't let the fire die!

I am here as Sieg requested an extra pair of eyes for the Normal. Hello little Cirno!!

[Normal]

1. Try to use AR 5. It makes things look neater and improves the balance of the set. Not to mention, it matches with your slider velocity and makes the diff a little more pleasant. Changed it
   
2. Sorry to say that, but after a long discussion with Sieg we've decided that your rhythm really needs to be improved as its quality is not what we believe to be qualification-ready. Below you'll find the reasos why and some comments.
   
   1. 00:08:019 (1) - the vocals aren't strong enugh here and they have no support from the music. It is just too hard to hit + it wassn't mapped in the rest of the diffs. We highly suggest removing the slider. Changed it for a short slider + a circle following the vocal
      In fact, the idea of following the vocals did not turn out well. To start with, a lot of quite strong beats are unstressed (like 00:09:970 (3) Changed- 00:37:287 (3) I don't see why this part is unstressed as there is a slider here - and some others) or are totally ignored. (00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - this one leaves the beginning of kiai unstressed ... It's the same time 3 times o-o")
      Note: to avoid this kind of issues, the best solution is to combine both vocals and music as this kind of rhythm is quite consistent/logical and reflects the song well.
   2. 00:14:604 - the empty space here shoul be mapped. It feels really confusing to have that much of an emty unmapped space while the music is still quie strong and could be mapped. I mapped it
   3. 01:15:092 (4,5,6) - the 3/4 gaps are not playable enough for this diff. You have quite a lot of 1/2s and mixing them with 3/4s (which are hard to play in general) makes the diff too tricky/complicated to be a Normal. I strobgly suggest replacing such rhythms with 3/4 sliders like 01:16:067 (7). Owwwwww it's sad I liked it T.T Changed btw most of these patterns, I only kept the "mixed" ones like in this part 02:59:726 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7)
      Note: 01:00:458 (3,4) - this is even harder as (3) gets off music and (4) becomes hard to catch. Changed
   4. 03:16:799 (9) - you didn't use such sliders before, adding a new kind of rhythm in the end of the diff will bug players In addition, the sliders are too short and tey might be sorta hard to hit. Changed
      
      All these issues combined together make the rhythm of the diff too hard for a Normal and become sorta unplayable for Normal diff players. Try to learn a little more and check out this and that as thee pages will be really helpful! Also, you're free to contact either me or Sieg if you have any questions.
3. 01:42:165 (3,4,5) - just for your future maps, try to avoid this kind of overlaps while mapping Easy/Normal diffs as they are hardly readable for players and trouble them a lot.
4. 02:13:385 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - well, kinda the same as above. That's a nice pattern, but overlaps with hitbursts will make it too complicated/hard to read and newbies won't be able to appreciate te amazingness of the idea. "amazingness" Really? xD I'll try to keep the advice in mind.
5. 03:01:433 (3,5) - according to the rules, all reverse-arrows must be visible and perfectly readable. However, a significant part of the reverse-arrow here gets overlapped with the previous slider aand this is not really readable Moved the slider. But i just realized it looked (and still look) ugly with 03:01:433 (3)...
6. 03:21:921 (1,1) - try to leave more space after spinners when it's possible. The best is to keep ~750ms of recovery time after each spinner, so players will be able to aim and catch objects after the spinner properly. I don't know what to do with this; if I shorten it to 03:21:921 (1) it becomes a very short spinner, maybe too short for a Normal... Maybe I have to delete this spinner and add a very long slider?...

To sum up, the diff should use some more work on its rhythm and appearance before it gets qualified.

Sieg wrote:

[ColdTooth's Easy]

1. 02:06:799 (2,4) - Make them similar by copy-paste, will be more appealing Agreed
2. 03:19:970 (1) - There should be 1 full measure for recovery after spinner for easy. You can end spinner on 03:23:872 () - this will also allow to cover 03:23:385 () - 03:23:872 (1) which is nice. And delete 03:24:848 (1) - slider. Wow, I didn't think of that
3. 03:29:726 (1) - way too short for easy level, also there not enough time to recover after. Removed spinner and added a couple notes to flaw it out.
4. ^Play rhythm gap after this slider is also kinda ruin following part because it really feels like the very end of diff. I agree. But I wanted to have 'something' there every now and then that fitted the main beats (i probably read that wrong >.<)
5. 03:32:653 (1) - you should lower volume level according to background music for this part. Done
6. 03:34:604 (3,1) - Also this would be nice to cover "don't" lyrics here instead of ending slider on 03:35:580 () I honestly couldn't come up with anything to adjust this. I think it's fine though.

Minao wrote:

00:37:287 (3) I don't see why this part is unstressed as there is a slider here - the problem is that the stong beat (on the white tick) is unclickable, so, players don't feel like it is emphasized enough
03:21:921 (1) it becomes a very short spinner, maybe too short for a Normal... Maybe I have to delete this spinner and add a very long slider?... the long slider will do great o/
00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - this one leaves the beginning of kiai unstressed ... It's the same time 3 times o-o") 00:47:775 - 00:49:726 - 00:51:677 - sorry, didn't notice that the copypaste hadn't worked correctly "."

-Bakari- wrote:

00:37:287 (3) I don't see why this part is unstressed as there is a slider here - the problem is that the stong beat (on the white tick) is unclickable, so, players don't feel like it is emphasized enough Changed this part
03:21:921 (1) it becomes a very short spinner, maybe too short for a Normal... Maybe I have to delete this spinner and add a very long slider?... the long slider will do great o/Mapped this part with more than a simple long slider
00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - 00:37:287 (3) - this one leaves the beginning of kiai unstressed ... It's the same time 3 times o-o") 00:47:775 - 00:49:726 - 00:51:677 - sorry, didn't notice that the copypaste hadn't worked correctly "."Changed the 3 places

I guess we've made it more clear and that's should be it. Once you're done with the changes, feel free to call Sakura back for the rebubble!

Good luck with the map!

ztrot wrote:

now it is gonna happen coldtooth!

21:09 Lust: heya ztrot
21:09 *Lust is editing [http://osu.ppy.sh/b/352685 Owl City - Embers [Hard]]
21:09 Lust: are you ready for me to go over your map
21:09 ztrot: yeag
21:10 Lust: alright, i highly recommend you change this to OD7, there are certain patterns such as 00:16:555 (4,5,6) - where the spacing is quite large and the rhythm is unclear (players aren't going to expect the circle on the blue tick at first for instance)
21:10 Lust: switching it to OD7 will allow for a bit more leniency when it comes to those particular patterns
21:11 Lust: i dont want you to modify any of them since they are well made
21:12 ztrot: lol I had just changed it to od 8
21:12 ztrot: but yeah tbh I liked it better as od7
21:12 Lust: 03:16:067 (1,2,3) - i know what you are trying to do here in regards with the rhythm, but throughout the majority of the song you followed the vocals (had the circle on the blue tick)
21:13 Lust: this shorter spacing but with different rhythm is a pretty difficult thing to pick up, i had quite a bit of an issue going through a couple of times reading it
21:14 ztrot: it is consistent tho
21:15 ztrot: 01:11:189 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5) -  does the same thing
21:15 ztrot: the one you are pointing out in the latter is the same pattern just change around so it isn't just copy paste
21:16 Lust: the thing is with that pattern the spacing is enlarged so therefore it takes longer to reach the circles making it easier to get the rhythm down
21:17 ztrot: would this be okay for a fix? http://puu.sh/dr2YB/3897d505d3.jpg
21:18 Lust: could you update it so i can have a look? 
21:18 ztrot: sure
21:18 Lust: looks like it would be fine, but i need to make sure
21:19 ztrot: give it a look now
21:19 Lust: much better
21:20 ztrot: I like the change too because it makes a nice pattern
21:20 Lust: 03:22:897 (1,2) - for these two, instead of the normal whistle which kinda sticks out like a sore thumb how about having a drum hitclap on both of the slider heads
21:21 Lust: i think it would fit a lot better, you can lower the volume of them with green lines if you think they are loud
21:21 ztrot: it shouldn't be a normal whistle
21:21 ztrot: I have a custom set on this
21:21 ztrot: do you have hitsounds on overide?
21:22 Lust: ah excuse me
21:22 Lust: i didnt mean normal whistle i meant
21:22 Lust: the whistle thats on there now
21:22 Lust: haha

1. 00:50:945 (1) - Is the whistle on this slider body intentional? If so I highly recommend you remove it as it does not really fit the music well
2. 01:24:604 (7) - The movement on this slider feels unnatural in comparison to the rest of the patterns you have set due to that sharp curve, I highly recommend you have the curve go the other way so it flows better
3. 01:57:775 (1) - Kiai time starting in the middle of a slider? Yea not quite a good idea. There is a strong beat there, please try and use a rhythm similar to the one you had in the beginning of the kiai - it is way more clear and fun in comparison
4. 02:31:189 (1) - Another weird sounding whistle on the slider body
5. 03:05:336 (3) - ^
6. 03:36:555 (2) - ^

Lust wrote:

Just some thoughts on the normal

[Minao's Normal]

1. 00:50:945 (1) - Is the whistle on this slider body intentional? If so I highly recommend you remove it as it does not really fit the music well Removed
2. 01:24:604 (7) - The movement on this slider feels unnatural in comparison to the rest of the patterns you have set due to that sharp curve, I highly recommend you have the curve go the other way so it flows better Changed
3. 01:57:775 (1) - Kiai time starting in the middle of a slider? Yea not quite a good idea. There is a strong beat there, please try and use a rhythm similar to the one you had in the beginning of the kiai - it is way more clear and fun in comparison Changed
4. 02:31:189 (1) - Another weird sounding whistle on the slider body Fixed
5. 03:05:336 (3) - ^ Fixed
6. 03:36:555 (2) - ^ Fixed

Call me back!

ztrot wrote:

updated, hope to hear from lust soon

Lust wrote:

Everything looks good to me, Qualified!

Minao wrote:

So... All the changes we made to the Normal to simplify it was pointless?

Sakura wrote:

Minao wrote:

So... All the changes we made to the Normal to simplify it was pointless?

Why did you tone down Normal in the first place? :<

Minao wrote:

So... All the changes we made to the Normal to simplify it was pointless? I'm not blaming anybody, I'm just disapointed that all the work on it didn't help this beatmap to be ranked...
Ztrot, I'm waiting for your opinion on it to know what i'm supposed to do with this diff now...