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Thoughts on Universal Basic Income?

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Jangsoodlor
Topic Starter
Jangsoodlor
Universal basic income (UBI) is a social welfare proposal in which all citizens of a given population regularly receive a guaranteed income in the form of an unconditional transfer payment (i.e., without a means test or need to work). It would be received independently of any other income. If the level is sufficient to meet a person's basic needs (i.e., at or above the poverty line), it is sometimes called a full basic income; if it is less than that amount, it may be called a partial basic income. No country has yet introduced either, although there have been numerous pilot projects and the idea is discussed in many countries. Some have labelled UBI as utopian due to its historical origin. - Wikipedia

TL;DR: Giving out money to everyone unconditionally. People can still go to work and receive their salary as usual, but the UBI will be handed out to them nonetheless. It can either be enough for people to afford basic commodities, or just a little bit to give people an extra headroom.

Some said that it'll be necessary in the future since machines will replace most manual works and people who work those jobs will become unemployed. Others said it'd be unfair for those who work hard. What are your thoughts on this topic?
Arctos Sagittario
212 posts
Joined August 2011
Arctos Sagittario
？
wdym, we have that like for 30 years at least

everyone below the minimum living standard is guaranteed to take the money from local government

it’s 99.99% covered because our country has a super powerful household tracking system, so strong that people can’t just move to another place without registered, or in some metropolis’ case, certificated. as a result scarcely anyone would be “off the radar” so to speak. that’s how the households below minimum income level are found, and money will be transferred to their accounts every month

of course the standard varies according to local par for metropolis, city, village, etc., but the point is that no one lives below local minimum is a common practice
anaxii
15,000 posts
Joined December 2022
anaxii
The universal basic income is not something new, isn't that right?
Last edited by anaxii , edited 1 time in total.
WitherMite
1,598 posts
Joined August 2019
WitherMite
a lot of people here throw a hissy fit anytime you mention something like this. "communism bad and anything I dont understand or like is communism" or something like that.

that plus our government being entirely controlled by multinational corporations tells me this probably wont ever be happening here, even as it becomes something we need with cost of living going up so much faster than wages.
abraker
Global Moderator
8,327 posts
Joined July 2014
abraker
Unrealistic right now due to enormous cost to sustain it. It requires heavy tax on rich and corporations and that just won't happen here. It also feeds leeches of society that are too lazy to get a job anyway. Granted many people live paycheck to paycheck, but UBI would be merely a temporary bandaid solution to the problem faced by those people, and I say temporary because then their expenses would rise in response to the UBI.

UBI would indeed be most appropriate when there is an alarming portion of people out of the workforce. When so many jobs become automated to the point a lot of peoples' skillsets become worthless, when many people are left stranded unable to cover their expenses despite the will to work, that is when it will become a needed policy.
Last edited by abraker , edited 1 time in total.
Stomiks
9,043 posts
Joined March 2021
Stomiks
It'd be unsustainable to do something like that, let alone get a few governments to implement it. I wonder how much taxes a goverment needs to increase so they could support this UBI, I have a feeling that most people would be against it, rich and poor likewise.
Jangsoodlor
Topic Starter
Jangsoodlor

Arctos Sagittario wrote:

？
wdym, we have that like for 30 years at least

everyone below the minimum living standard is guaranteed to take the money from local government
The difference is UBI program gives that money to everyone. Not just the poor. You can be Jack Ma's son and still get that money as those who is below the minimum living standard.
Arctos Sagittario
212 posts
Joined August 2011
Arctos Sagittario

Jangsoodlor wrote:

Arctos Sagittario wrote:

？
wdym, we have that like for 30 years at least

everyone below the minimum living standard is guaranteed to take the money from local government
The difference is UBI program gives that money to everyone. Not just the poor. You can be Jack Ma's son and still get that money as those who is below the minimum living standard.
oh that I see

to me it's kind of pointless though, those who can cover themselves with no problem don't need it. saving such to those in real need would make a world of difference
Ymir
1,757 posts
Joined June 2020
Ymir

Arctos Sagittario wrote:

？
wdym, we have that like for 30 years at least

everyone below the minimum living standard is guaranteed to take the money from local government

it’s 99.99% covered because our country has a super powerful household tracking system, so strong that people can’t just move to another place without registered, or in some metropolis’ case, certificated. as a result scarcely anyone would be “off the radar” so to speak. that’s how the households below minimum income level are found, and money will be transferred to their accounts every month

of course the standard varies according to local par for metropolis, city, village, etc., but the point is that no one lives below local minimum is a common practice
Ah, so homelessness is low in China?
Polyspora
448 posts
Joined September 2019
Polyspora
but if you're giving money to everyone, isnt it the same as decreasing taxes? if not where is this money coming from?

even if machines took over every single job in the world, we still have things they cant do (at least not as good as we do) like art, music, entertainment and so on... jobs are still going to exist, the only thing that is going to change is the meta.
abraker
Global Moderator
8,327 posts
Joined July 2014
abraker

Polyspora wrote:

but if you're giving money to everyone, isnt it the same as decreasing taxes? if not where is this money coming from?
No because it is meant to redistribute the money rich -> poor
Polyspora
448 posts
Joined September 2019
Polyspora

abraker wrote:

Polyspora wrote:

but if you're giving money to everyone, isnt it the same as decreasing taxes? if not where is this money coming from?
No because it is meant to redistribute the money rich -> poor
I'm having a really hard time understanding this

the richer the person is the more he pay so that money can be redistributed to the poor to live with more dignity (system that already exists in some countries), but then this money returns to the rich because accordingly to UBI everyone will receive a share?

sounds like an inflation machine to me.
abraker
Global Moderator
8,327 posts
Joined July 2014
abraker

Polyspora wrote:

abraker wrote:

Polyspora wrote:

but if you're giving money to everyone, isnt it the same as decreasing taxes? if not where is this money coming from?
No because it is meant to redistribute the money rich -> poor
I'm having a really hard time understanding this

the richer the person is the more he pay so that money can be redistributed to the poor to live with more dignity (system that already exists in some countries), but then this money returns to the rich because accordingly to UBI everyone will receive a share?

sounds like an inflation machine to me.
Hey you are beginning to understand why it won't work well in the current economic climate
Polyspora
448 posts
Joined September 2019
Polyspora

abraker wrote:

Polyspora wrote:

abraker wrote:

Polyspora wrote:

but if you're giving money to everyone, isnt it the same as decreasing taxes? if not where is this money coming from?
No because it is meant to redistribute the money rich -> poor
I'm having a really hard time understanding this

the richer the person is the more he pay so that money can be redistributed to the poor to live with more dignity (system that already exists in some countries), but then this money returns to the rich because accordingly to UBI everyone will receive a share?

sounds like an inflation machine to me.
Hey you are beginning to understand why it won't work well in the current economic climate
you're treating me like a dummy 💀 (and wtf is wrong with this new quote thing, its doesnt separate between lines anymore)
Last edited by Polyspora , edited 1 time in total.
Arctos Sagittario
212 posts
Joined August 2011
Arctos Sagittario

-Remi wrote:

Arctos Sagittario wrote:

？
wdym, we have that like for 30 years at least

everyone below the minimum living standard is guaranteed to take the money from local government

it’s 99.99% covered because our country has a super powerful household tracking system, so strong that people can’t just move to another place without registered, or in some metropolis’ case, certificated. as a result scarcely anyone would be “off the radar” so to speak. that’s how the households below minimum income level are found, and money will be transferred to their accounts every month

of course the standard varies according to local par for metropolis, city, village, etc., but the point is that no one lives below local minimum is a common practice
Ah, so homelessness is low in China?
I'd say generally low. you may see some in bigger cities where sometimes outsider can't pay their rent yet still try everyting just to stay there.
Neigdoig
650 posts
Joined May 2021
Neigdoig
UBI is just something that's connected to the Central Bank Digital Currency (CBDC). Long story short, I don't support how it is currently being implemented.
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