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Your opinions on "Nearby countries/regional ranking"

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Vish024
2,640 posts
Joined December 2010
Vish024

thelewa wrote:

you can't drive from scotland to norway
You clearly haven't watched Top Gear mate.

Anyway I'm all for an Oceania region rankings, as for Finland I think it'd be alright grouping them with the Baltic countries considering that their language is similar to Estonian. The only problem is that some users, a minority seemingly, might not feel comfortable being included in a ranking system with users of another country. Initially I imagined an EU rankings would be ok, including all nations in the European Union, but there's a shitload of users in that region and it wouldn't be entirely fair to all countries in the region. Also avoid placing Turkey and Greece together.
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
Posting this here in case laport doesn't notice.

boat wrote:

laport wrote:

Just in case: The Netherlands wouldn't want to be grouped with any other country except for Finland. We get along with Belgium but we're too different (they speak French/Flemming and are roman Catholics, whereas we speak Dutch and are Protestants) and we don't get along with any other EU countries except for Finland.
If you can get people to vouch in on that then it will be noted down as a majorities opinion. Regardless of what country you supposedly get along with, if there is no ethnic correlation then chances are you will not get merged.
silmarilen
5,579 posts
Joined February 2010
silmarilen
i vouch for nl + finland
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat

silmarilen wrote:

i vouch for nl + finland
Provide some reasoning for it. I'm not good at geography but I see zero correlation between you two.
thelewa
3,537 posts
Joined August 2010
thelewa
our countries have a history of defending this world from eldritch abominations and safeguarding the sanity of us all
Vish024
2,640 posts
Joined December 2010
Vish024
You guys can't forget that the rankings have to do predominantly with geographic location as opposed to how well you get along with the sub-communities of other countries. Place Quebec and France together.
Last edited by Vish024 , edited 1 time in total.
Metro
692 posts
Joined April 2010
Metro

boat wrote:

Metro wrote:

Just in case: Argentina wouldn't want to be grouped with any other country. We get along with Brazil but we're too different and we don't get along with any other SA countries.
Argentina should have enough players for this to not be required anyways.
For the record.
laport
1,239 posts
Joined June 2010
laport
Dutch people have been in a sauna with Finnish people. We have never been in a sauna with Belgian people.
XPJ38
osu! Alumni
3,570 posts
Joined February 2010
XPJ38

CDFA wrote:

What am I doing with my life
You can put Monaco with France. It's like they are almost French, really.
Same thing for San Marino and Vatican City with Italy, I suppose.

--
Would it be possible to create a "North America" entity with USA, Virgin Islands and Canada? After all, they are very close each other. Otherwise, Canada would be all alone...

Also, a Maghreb entity grouping Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia and eventually Lybia and Mauritania would be cool I think.
Hiryuu_old
439 posts
Joined June 2011
Hiryuu_old

BRBP wrote:

There's only 10 people from Estonia who have a 4-digit osu! rank, I still don't see how merging Finland with only Estonia would be beneficial to either of us. Nearly 500 in Russia, so I don't see the point in merging them with anyone.

peppy wrote:

I'd like to see the largest groupings possible to allow for actual competitive rankings.

+ Iceland

Opinions?
As far as I know, there aren't a lot of Estonians that are rather active and yeah, there is about 10 people who only have a 4-digit rank on osu!. The majority of maps I play and whenever I have country ranking selected, I mostly see either nobody there or just my own score. I barely see anyone there except sometimes the same 2-6 people. (this is only from my osu!standard pov, I have no idea about taiko, ctb or mania)
There is no point with merging with only Finland, at least I don't see it being any beneficial either.

The area you highlighted on that picture, that area is pretty huge and it would be pretty interesting. If peppy would like to see the largest groupings possible, then I think that's already a good start.

With Iceland, I personally wouldn't mind, though as much as i remember it does have something to do with Denmark + Sweden + Norway back in the old times of history. Other than that i cannot remember anything else.

laport wrote:

Dutch people have been in a sauna with Finnish people. We have never been in a sauna with Belgian people.
bonus info: Estonians have had a war for quite a while with the finnish whenever it comes to sauna + beer, I believe there is more of a competition between our two countries than anywhere when it comes to saunas.
Mara
4,906 posts
Joined November 2009
Mara
OP, Finland is not part of Scandinavia. It's part of Nordic countries.

But honestly, I don't care what happens to Finland. Just take good care of our lil' bro Estonia.
Dark_Ai
1,832 posts
Joined July 2010
Dark_Ai

boat wrote:

Loctav wrote:

SPOILER
Well, Germany, Switzerland, Austria and Liechtenstein share the same community channel, the same subboard, also we all speak the same language. Also Switzerland, Austria and Liechtenstein have not many active players. And the active ones can easily compete with the ones from Germany. Even if Germany has a huge playerbase compared to other countries, I think a merge is justified due to language and community sharing.

This is pretty much comparable with the merge of french speaking countries (even if I disagree in merging NL into FR, because they don't share the community (#french vs. #dutch) that much.
As I do keep a list of the possible minor country groupings excluded from the major ones as well I would like to know if merging Switzerland, Austria and Liechtenstein without Germany would be reasonable.
Switzerland, Austria & Liechtenstein without Germany is a bad idea tho. I mean we alll speak the same language so why we/they or whatever need two channel which speak and write german?
And also tbe whole idea is nor bad tho but could it goes well? I'm not sure tho
BrokenArrow
2,236 posts
Joined June 2010
BrokenArrow

Dark_Ai wrote:

Switzerland, Austria & Liechtenstein without Germany is a bad idea tho. I mean we alll speak the same language so why we/they or whatever need two channel which speak and write german?
This change won't affect community channels at all, it will only turn the country rankings into regional rankings.
Dark_Ai
1,832 posts
Joined July 2010
Dark_Ai
My bad but still I think the same
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
Opinions are fine but I get the feeling you're not quite sure what the deal is about. I'd advise you to read the op thoroughly.

We can't satisfy everyone, but I'm certain that majority would be happy to get an alternative for more competition within the smaller circles.

So far it's either Austria + Switzerland + Liechtenstein as a "German Region" or depending on peppys final word having them merged with Germany. Since it seemingly makes little sense to merge these alone I will certainly add in a word about it.
GladiOol
4,475 posts
Joined August 2008
GladiOol
NL could only work with belgium probably, even though I'd rather see NL on its own~ Germany won't work, France won't work, UK might work, but that's an odd combo. Next to that the dutch islands Aruba, Curaçao, Sint Maarten (and i'm not sure if Saba, Sint Eustatius and Bonaire are listed..?) Next to that you could add Netherlands Antilles, seeing how they were part of our country till 2010. We're still close with Suriname as well, seeing how they also still speak Dutch 'n all.

Also about Belgium, they are splitted up with 50% dutch 50% french practically. And from what I know, the 2 sides are really, well, not close.

how silly, just add the 'benelux' as one. keep france out. (belgium, netherlands, luxembourg)
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
France is irrelevant to the Netherlands, it's merely there in the list because of Belgium which even I know is viable. Majorities vote so far is benelux though, so don't worry about it.
UnderminE
osu! Alumni
4,011 posts
Joined August 2010
UnderminE

CDFA wrote:

Maybe the Middle East can be grouped (Unless they have a high population of players. ie. Turkey, Egypt, Israel) as well?
Once again, there is a huge mistake. We are pretty far from Arabic culture. Our language and whatever. Just because the main religion is Islam, I don't accept being under same region with countries we don't have anything to share. And any of Turkish players won't accept either.
Weird thing is we are both in Asia and Europe.;_;

As I already said to boat, if there are any Azerbaijani players, we will be more than okay to share same region since our language are almost the same and we can understand each other very well. Maybe it has nothing with communication or sharing cultures but if we are talking about a regional scoreboard, I am sure it will bring some hate against countries with it since there will be a race to get the first rank. So IMO kind-of-enemy countries being on same ranking scoreboard as a "region" is not a good idea.

The idea must be discussed with country players very well, to prevent negative results in the future.

---

On another side, how about Balkans?
Ruidoso
236 posts
Joined November 2010
Ruidoso
It seems a nice idea but about my country I don't think we lack active players for such thing to be required also I don't see any group that actually we would fit in. We neither can be in the Balkans group nor grouped with Syria, Egypt and such.
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
I sort of figured as much, and if you can't come up with any country to merge with and deem the state of your country ranking to be reasonable (consider special gamemodes as well) there's nothing to do about it.

I cant do anything but go for majorities vote, and as such it's clearly up to you representative users to decide what happens.
Ruidoso
236 posts
Joined November 2010
Ruidoso

UnderminE wrote:

Once again, there is a huge mistake. We are pretty far from Arabic culture. Our language and whatever. Just because the main religion is Islam, I don't accept being under same region with countries we don't have anything to share. And any of Turkish players won't accept either.
Weird thing is we are both in Asia and Europe.;_;

As I already said to boat, if there are any Azerbaijani players, we will be more than okay to share same region since our language are almost the same and we can understand each other very well. Maybe it has nothing with communication or sharing cultures but if we are talking about a regional scoreboard, I am sure it will bring some hate against countries with it since there will be a race to get the first rank. So IMO kind-of-enemy countries being on same ranking scoreboard as a "region" is not a good idea.

The idea must be discussed with country players very well, to prevent negative results in the future.

---

On another side, how about Balkans?

I don't think we can be included in Balkans. As for Azerbaijan, we would be more than happy to be grouped with them since their number of acitve users is a bit low, that would be a great idea and I think we should consider what is actually happening between countries before merging them up in a regionall scoreboard since we don't want to cause any racism problems or arguments.
GladiOol
4,475 posts
Joined August 2008
GladiOol
East europe will be a bitch. From what I know, Romania and Hungary won't work together. Croatia and Serbia won't work. Bosnia and Serbia won't work. Hungary and Slovakia won't work. Kosovo won't work with Croatia either iirc. Macedonia don't like the serbs either from what i know.

Good luck sorting it out :~D
lolcubes
osu! Alumni
4,437 posts
Joined November 2010
lolcubes

GladiOol wrote:

East europe will be a bitch. From what I know, Romania and Hungary won't work together. Croatia and Serbia won't work. Bosnia and Serbia won't work. Hungary and Slovakia won't work. Kosovo won't work with Croatia either iirc. Macedonia don't like the serbs either from what i know.

Good luck sorting it out :~D
You're partially right. There is still bad blood between some people here due to the past, however I don't think it's gonna be that much of a problem. At least not with Croatia.
:p
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat

GladiOol wrote:

East europe will be a bitch. From what I know, Romania and Hungary won't work together. Croatia and Serbia won't work. Bosnia and Serbia won't work. Hungary and Slovakia won't work. Kosovo won't work with Croatia either iirc. Macedonia don't like the serbs either from what i know.

Good luck sorting it out :~D
Leave the users from their respective countries to decide that. Either way I don't agree with weighting historical events over the geographic aspect. This is a game and some things will have to be disregarded. Most of these wont be grouped specifically with one partner either, rather as a whole within a "Balkan Region".
XEPCOH
529 posts
Joined February 2011
XEPCOH
Europe:
SPOILER
1 - Portugal
2 - Spain
3 - France and Benilux countries (+ Netherlands)
4 - British Isles
5 - German speaking countries
6 - Balkan countries (except Greece)
7 - Czech, Slovakia, Hungary
8 - Poland
9 - Scandinavia + Finland + Greenland
10 - Baltic countries
11 - Russia (separately from USSR cuz of high amount of players in both sides)
12 - Belarus, Ukraine, Moldova, (Kazakhstan)
13 - Romania
14 - Bulgaria
15 - Italy
16 - Greece
17 - Turkey
18 - Caucasian countries (can be connected with 12)

Asia:
SPOILER
1 - Israel
2 - Middle East (maybe with Egypt)
3 - Iran (can be united with 2)
4 - Uzbekistan, Turkmenisan, Tajikistan, Kyrgyztan
5 - Afghanistan, Pakistan
6 - India, Bangladesh, Sri Lanka
7 - China, Mongolia
8 - Nepal, Bhutan
9 - Vietnam, Thailand, Laos, Burma
10 - South Korea
11 - Japan
12 - Malaysia, Singapore, Brunei
13 - Philippines (can be joined to 12 or 14)
14 - Indonesia, New Guinea
15 - North Korea (nobody likes her D:)
Last edited by XEPCOH , edited 1 time in total.
silmarilen
5,579 posts
Joined February 2010
silmarilen
what sense is there in putting france together with benelux?
maybe half of belgium speaks french and a bit of luxemburg, but putting netherlands with france makes as litle sense as putting scotland with norway
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
I'd say leave France as they got nearly 50k active users either way. Benelux alone makes more sense.

I didn't even think of Greenland though, I'll add that.

Don Omar wrote:

11 - Russia (separately from USSR cuz of high amount of players in both sides)
12 - Belarus, Ukraine, Moldova, (Kazakhstan)
This is in discussion in the Russian subforum as well. I'm looking into how to group the SOUSSR.
XEPCOH
529 posts
Joined February 2011
XEPCOH
Well, ok
France really needs to be separated, Netherlands too because of their high amount
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
Don't get me wrong, I appreciate your suggestions and they are of help, but some of these groups are too small. The netherlands doesn't have as big of a playerbase as you may think. Statistics say that they got less active users than Sweden, and take the other gamemodes into consideration as well.

As a taiko player, this is pretty much what I see on every map ever



And I'm pretty sure users in the Netherlands and for the other modes do as well. I find benelux to make sense and seemingly so do most users from these respective countries. As I've mentioned before, try to stick to your own regions. This is what you know best, and I'm pretty sure users from their own regions now theirs better. If users from the Netherlands don't deem merging benelux to be necessary then they are free to vote against it, same deal goes for Belgium and Luxembourg, although considering the size of their playerbase It'd be pretty silly of them to.
GladiOol
4,475 posts
Joined August 2008
GladiOol

boat wrote:

GladiOol wrote:

East europe will be a bitch. From what I know, Romania and Hungary won't work together. Croatia and Serbia won't work. Bosnia and Serbia won't work. Hungary and Slovakia won't work. Kosovo won't work with Croatia either iirc. Macedonia don't like the serbs either from what i know.

Good luck sorting it out :~D
Leave the users from their respective countries to decide that. Either way I don't agree with weighting historical events over the geographic aspect. This is a game and some things will have to be disregarded. Most of these wont be grouped specifically with one partner either, rather as a whole within a "Balkan Region".
I'm merely suggesting that you need to be careful to some degree when you put these countries together in one, selected group. Es tut mir leid.
Pizzicato
2,739 posts
Joined February 2011
Pizzicato
asia? no please

i cant compete anymore :<
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat

boat wrote:

those with well below 20k users qualify
XPJ38
osu! Alumni
3,570 posts
Joined February 2010
XPJ38
Uh, since it seems really complicated now to make divisions and since peppy wanted to have as bigger regions as possible, why don't we just make a continental ranking?

Like:



This way, one could say "Yay, I am #3 in Europe, I am the best" instead of "Yay, I am number #3 in whatever group of countries I don't know much about".
The number of continents is up to you (but frankly, Europe and Asia need to be separated for obvious reasons).
Last edited by XPJ38 , edited 1 time in total.
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
This is a possibility and what you see in the OP is not the only options I've noted down, the issue is that there has been no word about whether or not grouping the minor countries with the major will be an option and as such I'd like to keep other possible options available.

The issue with that though is the amount of people who disagree, and I sort of do as well. The idea is to improve upon the competition within the smaller circles, not group them with those who don't have the issue, essentially fix the problems for those who have it and leave it as it is for those who don't.

I think you've also misunderstood that this is for the beatmap specific filter only. Don't focus on what's noted down, think of new and logical additions, such as the already almost concluded "benelux" which makes perfect sense.
XPJ38
osu! Alumni
3,570 posts
Joined February 2010
XPJ38

boat wrote:

I think you've also misunderstood that this is for the beatmap specific filter only. Don't focus on what's noted down, think of new and logical additions, such as the already almost concluded "benelux" which makes perfect sense.
Yes, I did understand well that it's beatmap-specific.

Sure about Benelux and other regional areas, but the main issue is the countries that aren't in a specific already-created region: everything depends on people's perception of why a country should be grouped with another. Ukraine and Russia fit well for some of the Ukrainians and Russians, but doesn't for others. This could be dangerous.

I am not as optimistic as you, but yeah, it doesn't hurt to try anyway.
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
If there is no logical fit then there's nothing to do but either not adding them anywhere or grouping them in the most logical continental region, which is what I'm asking suggestions for.

I don't intend to propose grouping countries without logical reasons for it, nor am I expecting to be able to cover everyone.

Updated the op with some clearer groups, and I may as well add in that you can message me personally if you don't want express your opinion publicly, for whatever reasons you may have.
Noobita
597 posts
Joined June 2009
Noobita

UnderminE wrote:

CDFA wrote:

Maybe the Middle East can be grouped (Unless they have a high population of players. ie. Turkey, Egypt, Israel) as well?
Once again, there is a huge mistake. We are pretty far from Arabic culture. Our language and whatever. Just because the main religion is Islam, I don't accept being under same region with countries we don't have anything to share. And any of Turkish players won't accept either.
Weird thing is we are both in Asia and Europe.;_;

As I already said to boat, if there are any Azerbaijani players, we will be more than okay to share same region since our language are almost the same and we can understand each other very well. Maybe it has nothing with communication or sharing cultures but if we are talking about a regional scoreboard, I am sure it will bring some hate against countries with it since there will be a race to get the first rank. So IMO kind-of-enemy countries being on same ranking scoreboard as a "region" is not a good idea.

The idea must be discussed with country players very well, to prevent negative results in the future.

---

On another side, how about Balkans?

Didn't see anywhere that it says "Religious ranking" or "Cultural ranking"...
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat
I had a talk with a few people regarding the Middle East. Supposedly Turkey aren't keen on getting merged with anybody but Azerbaijan because they don't deem the countries to be similar enough. Geographically, you're all in the middle east, and more importantly, religion and politics are not related to the matter and should not in any way be involved.

My proposal is to merge the countries listed under the "Traditional definition of the Middle East" and the "Greater Middle East" as following:

Middle East group A (temporary name)
SPOILER
  • Bahrain
    Cyprus
    Egypt
    Iran
    Iraq
    Israel
    Jordan
    Kuwait
    Lebanon
    Oman
    State of Palestine
    Qatar
    Saudi Arabia
    Syria
    United Arab Emirates
    Yemen
Middle East group B (temporary name as well)
SPOILER
  • Afghanistan
    Turkey
    Algeria
    Armenia
    Azerbaijan
    Comoros
    Djibouti
    Georgia
    Kazakhstan
    Kyrgyzstan
    Libya
    Mauritania
    Morocco
    Pakistan
    Somalia
    Sudan
    Tajikistan
    Tunisia
    Turkmenistan
    Uzbekistan
    Western Sahara Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic

and more importantly, to disregard anything but the geographic location. Feel free to notify me of any problems that may arise with this, but do keep in mind that this is a game and you should keep political and personal matters out of it.

edit: turkey moved to group B despite the definition of the regions because of various concerns
Last edited by boat , edited 2 times in total.
VoidnOwO
1,256 posts
Joined August 2012
VoidnOwO
For about a millionth time, it's Finland, not Finnland ._.
boat
2,369 posts
Joined February 2010
Topic Starter
boat

BRBP wrote:

For about a millionth time, it's Finland, not Finnland ._.
Haha oh well, my bad.

Fixed.
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