[Rule] Romanisation of Chinese, Japanese and Korean titles

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Topic Starter
SapphireGhost
Metadata originally from a non-Latin alphabet language must be romanized using an accepted system deemed as standard for that language (such as Hepburn for Japanese). In cases where the exact system to use for romanization is uncertain, existing ranked maps with similar metadata in the same language may be used as an example.
This also leaves out the "not translated unless a translated title is officially provided". And again, I would prefer not to use Hepburn is because it would require the use of "ō".

In Hepburn: 金曜日(きんようび): ki + n + yo + u + bi = kinyōbi or kin'yōbi – Friday

I would rather see this as kin'youbi or kinyoubi.
Loctav

SapphireGhost wrote:

I would rather see this as kin'youbi or kinyoubi.
Latter one is more common and way more practicable. The aposrophes only indicate the right spelling, not "really" the right proounciation. The difference is minor (if even existing). And since romaji shall help to make stuff "read- and pronounceable" instead of "catching the entire right spelling", I would not use any apostrophes.
Moreover, trying to catch right spelling (to that extend) in romaji is weird, since writing japanese stuff with latin letters is wrong anyways. So no need for this.
pieguyn
anything like ō or some shit with a bar over it shouldn't be necessary at all imo
it's so pointless + it removes information + not intuitive + more effort etc.
Ephemeral

SapphireGhost wrote:

Metadata originally from a non-Latin alphabet language must be romanized using an accepted system deemed as standard for that language (such as Hepburn for Japanese). In cases where the exact system to use for romanization is uncertain, existing ranked maps with similar metadata in the same language may be used as an example.
This also leaves out the "not translated unless a translated title is officially provided". And again, I would prefer not to use Hepburn is because it would require the use of "ō".

In Hepburn: 金曜日(きんようび): ki + n + yo + u + bi = kinyōbi or kin'yōbi – Friday

I would rather see this as kin'youbi or kinyoubi.
the latter example (kinyoubi) is how we've always done it and is expressed in previous ranked maps with similar metadata, so it is encompassed by the rule.

changing to:

Metadata originally from a non-Latin alphabet language must be romanized using an accepted system deemed as standard for that language (such as Hepburn Traditional for Japanese), unless an official translated title is provided by the artist. In cases where the exact system to use for romanization is uncertain, existing ranked maps with similar metadata in the same language may be used as an example.
Loctav

Loctav wrote:

Also it doesnt include the katakana -> non-japanese cases like "Higurashi Moratorium".
It still doesn't tell that katakana-transcribed words that only replace an english (or other language's) word, should be written in its original language (so not writing the hepburn/whatever way to transcribe the katakana, but writing the English word with right spelling)

Or is that included with that "official translation" thing? If yes, it's misleading
Topic Starter
SapphireGhost

Ephemeral wrote:

the latter example (kinyoubi) is how we've always done it and is expressed in previous ranked maps with similar metadata, so it is encompassed by the rule.
It would be better for the rule to exist without having to rely on previous ranked maps, because not all previously ranked maps have correct metadata, so "how we've always done it" isn't always good reasoning.

Does the romanisation method on http://tangorin.com/ have a name? It seems to fit with what we're looking for, other than its use of apostrophes.
xxbidiao
Hey I found no one talking about Chinese issue.

In Chinese we have a special pinyin letter that is like (yu)

Taking a Chinese word as example, 绿色 (l se)

Actually in our IME we have such letter as V, so this should be OK:

lv se

But V is never used in real pinyin, would that be suitable that we use V in the Chinese "romanized" name?
Kayano

xxbidiao wrote:

Hey I found no one talking about Chinese issue.

In Chinese we have a special pinyin letter that is like (yu)

Taking a Chinese word as example, 绿色 (l se)

Actually in our IME we have such letter as V, so this should be OK:

lv se

But V is never used in real pinyin, would that be suitable that we use V in the Chinese "romanized" name?
"lü se" <- it is OK to type

"lǜ sè" <- 233
mintong89
ü isn't a romanisation word.

i think " lv se " is the most fit at this problem. if you use " lu se " may be confused between u and ü
evanma

OniJAM wrote:

xxbidiao wrote:

Hey I found no one talking about Chinese issue.

In Chinese we have a special pinyin letter that is like (yu)

Taking a Chinese word as example, 绿色 (l se)

Actually in our IME we have such letter as V, so this should be OK:

lv se

But V is never used in real pinyin, would that be suitable that we use V in the Chinese "romanized" name?
"lü se" <- it is OK to type

"lǜ sè" <- 233

mintong89 wrote:

ü isn't a romanisation word.

i think " lv se " is the most fit at this problem. if you use " lu se " may be confused between u and ü
Meh. I think lv and lü are both fine. I think of them interchangably. XD
mintong89
you can't write ü at romanisation title right?
Ephemeral
Gwoyeu Romatzyh looks preferable for Chinese romanisation from what I've read of it
mintong89

Ephemeral wrote:

Gwoyeu Romatzyh looks preferable for Chinese romanisation from what I've read of it
nono, Hanyu Pinyin is the most fit at here, because not all people can be able to understand Gwoyeu Romatzyh.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinyin
Megurine Luka
No please ;w; I can't read Gwoyeu Romatzyh

And I'm sure most Chinese don't use them and more than half of Chinese people don't know this stuff ;w;
Flower

Megurine Luka wrote:

No please ;w; I can't read Gwoyeu Romatzyh

And I'm sure most Chinese don't use them and more than half of Chinese people don't know this stuff ;w;
--Just confirming this, that Pinyin is the most widely used Romanisation system. Wade-Giles is a bit less popular, however hardly anyone uses Gwoyeu Romatzyh among the mainstream.

--Another question is: What if there is transliterated words in the Chinese song name? For example:
有钱的狗 - 沙发

Is it "You Qian De Gou - Sha Fa", or "You Qian De Gou - Sofa"?

--Also. If there is expletive, should it be in lower case? Example:
郭采洁 - 我的未来式

Should it be "Guo Caijie - Wo De Wei Lai Shi" or "Guo Cai Jie - Wo de Wei Lai Shi"?

--Last question. When several characters form a word, should them be written together? Example:
林依晨 - 孤单北半球

Should it be "Lin Yichen - Gu Dan Bei Ban Qiu" or "Lin Yichen - Gudan Beibanqiu"? Or maybe "Lin Yichen - GuDan BeiBanQiu"?

Details see https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/145553
Wafu
I totally agree with your idea.
Loctav
Can someone sum up what we agreed so far? Did SG update the OP or something? Please, anyone? :D
Gezoda

Flower wrote:

Megurine Luka wrote:

No please ;w; I can't read Gwoyeu Romatzyh

And I'm sure most Chinese don't use them and more than half of Chinese people don't know this stuff ;w;
--Just confirming this, that Pinyin is the most widely used Romanisation system. Wade-Giles is a bit less popular, however hardly anyone uses Gwoyeu Romatzyh among the mainstream.
Fact: it's also used by teachers who teach Chinese, so...

--Another question is: What if there is transliterated words in the Chinese song name? For example:
有钱的狗 - 沙发

Is it "You Qian De Gou - Sha Fa", or "You Qian De Gou - Sofa"?

In that case, if the person who maps the song knows that it's a transliterated word, it should be the original word. In that case, sofa.

--Also. If there is expletive, should it be in lower case? Example:
郭采洁 - 我的未来式

Should it be "Guo Caijie - Wo De Wei Lai Shi" or "Guo Cai Jie - Wo de Wei Lai Shi"?

I don't get it in its fullest so I will skip that one for now

--Last question. When several characters form a word, should them be written together? Example:
林依晨 - 孤单北半球

Should it be "Lin Yichen - Gu Dan Bei Ban Qiu" or "Lin Yichen - Gudan Beibanqiu"? Or maybe "Lin Yichen - GuDan BeiBanQiu"?

If they form a word, the best way would be to make a differentiation. I had no trouble at all attributing a syllable to a character. The third option looks weird honestly (although used in some places - I think Chinese cubing manufactures use that for their cube names)

Details see https://osu.ppy.sh/forum/t/145553
errrr... Not everybody knows how to Chinese, lol.
popner
See the discussion here: t/145553
The most preferred use is pinyin, but there is no official system for pinyin. "character-based conversion" and "word-based conversion" are mostly used.
My suggestion: If there can be 3 or more words after word-based conversion, then use word-based conversion, else use character-based conversion. This is to make the conversion clear to understand.
Example:
一一二: Yi Yi Er
一一二二: Yi Yi Er Er
一一二二三三: Yiyi Erer Sansan
Zui Xuan Min Zu Feng O
Zuixuan Minzufeng X
Zhe Yang De Bai Fu Mei Zen Me Ke Yi Na Lai Gui Chu X
Zheyang De Baifumei Zenme Keyi Nalai Guichu O
Kayano
Put something i have written in p/2506832
@Popner, I think your choice seems fine generally, but there is still something could be discussed
For example, 我们的爱, "我们" is a word, "的" is a structural auxiliary word, "爱" is a word, too
So it should be spelled as "Women De Ai" in your way
But "Women"("我们") has different meaning between english and chinese ("women" means ladies, while "我们" means we)
Also it can't be easier to understand then "Wo Men De Ai"
So here is my suggestion:
If there is more than 5 characters, then use word-based conversion, else use character-based conversion.
Example:
一一一二二二: Yiyiyi Ererer
Feifange Zhi Ye X
Fei Fan Ge Zhi Ye O
Zhuanjiao Yudao Ai X
Zhuan Jiao Yu Dao Ai O
Ruguo Zhishi Ruguo O
Ru Guo Zhi Shi Ru Guo X
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