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Newbie Mafia 2! [Mafia Win!]

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anonymous_old
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Derekku

strager wrote:

Derekku Chan wrote:

jk
I hope not?
You hope I'm not joking? That means you are mafia? :<
Echo
@derekku: then lynch strager today and me tomorrow. It's not like you can lynch two people on the same day. If we're both mafia, it won't make a difference. I don't mind dying, if it'll help townies win. It's a team game after all.

@strager: then tell me why anyone should be listening to you.
anonymous_old
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anonymous_old

Echo wrote:

@derekku: then lynch strager today and me tomorrow. It's not like you can lynch two people on the same day. If we're both mafia, it won't make a difference. I don't mind dying, if it'll help townies win. It's a team game after all.
If you want to take one for the team, why don't you do it now?

Here, I'll help.

Vote: Echo

Echo wrote:

@strager: then tell me why anyone should be listening to you.
What are you citing to come to this 'conclusion' exactly?
0_o

strager wrote:

Derekku Chan wrote:

That means you are mafia? :<
I am not a Mafia.
Funny, that's exactly what someone who is in the mafia would say

vote stra-

lol
Echo
You're refusing to defend yourself against my evidence, and you're refusing to bring any evidence against me, yet you claim you are townie and I am mafia?

I think the simple answer is that there is no evidence you can use to defend yourself, and there is no evidence you can bring against me. Which means you are mafia, and I am townie.
0_o
Actually Echo..

0_o wrote:

Echo wrote:

0_o wrote:

So.. you are saying that the mafia is incapable of coming up with a valid reason to lynch someone?
That is exactly what I'm saying. There should be no evidence in posts against townies, which means mafia won't be able to bring up a valid reason to lynch a townie.
Why not? Humans come up with "evidence" against other humans to lynch them, the only difference is that the mafia actually knows that they are lynching a human.
any response to this?
Echo
Townies will be able to convincingly bring evidence to show that the evidence used against them is misguided.
anonymous_old
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Derekku

Echo wrote:

You're refusing to defend yourself against my evidence, and you're refusing to bring any evidence against me, yet you claim you are townie and I am mafia?

I think the simple answer is that there is no evidence you can use to defend yourself, and there is no evidence you can bring against me. Which means you are mafia, and I am townie.
Echo brings up good points. :/

Vot- Nah.

FOS: strager (because it wasn't already obvious </sarcasm>)
anonymous_old

Echo wrote:

Townies will be able to convincingly bring evidence to show that the evidence used against them is misguided.
I think you're mistaken.

Townies will be able to present a LACK of evidence in the claims of those against them.
Derekku

strager wrote:

Echo wrote:

You're refusing to defend yourself against my evidence, and you're refusing to bring any evidence against me, yet you claim you are townie and I am mafia?

I think the simple answer is that there is no evidence you can use to defend yourself, and there is no evidence you can bring against me. Which means you are mafia, and I am townie.
That doesn't explain this at all:

Echo wrote:

@strager: then tell me why anyone should be listening to you.
which is what I asked about.

You're saying even if I defend myself I shouldn't be believed, and even if I attack you I shouldn't be believed?
You're not defending yourself good enough. If you do it right, people will believe you. =)
Echo
Stop twisting my words.

I'm saying if you can't defend yourself, then there is no reason why anyone should believe what you say. If you can defend yourself, then that proves you're not mafia, and what you say holds legitimate value.

  1. Assume what everyone is saying is true
  2. Find evidence to show that a person is likely lying. From this point on assume everything he says is false.
  3. That person defends himself.
  4. Given that the person does so convincingly, assume from this point on everything he says is true. Otherwise, he is likely mafia and should be lynched.
anonymous_old

Echo wrote:

Stop twisting my words.
But it's so fun.

Echo wrote:

I'm saying if you can't defend yourself, then there is no reason why anyone should believe what you say. If you can defend yourself, then that proves you're not mafia, and what you say holds legitimate value.
I'm sure a Mafia can convincingly defend themself too, smart one.

Echo wrote:

  1. Assume what everyone is saying is true
  2. Find evidence to show that a person is likely lying. From this point on assume everything he says is false.
  3. That person defends himself.
  4. Given that the person does so convincingly, assume from this point on everything he says is true. Otherwise, he is likely mafia and should be lynched.
And this logic has gotten you how far in Mafia games?
Echo

strager wrote:

Echo wrote:

I'm saying if you can't defend yourself, then there is no reason why anyone should believe what you say. If you can defend yourself, then that proves you're not mafia, and what you say holds legitimate value.
I'm sure a Mafia can convincingly defend themself too, smart one.
Good to see you know you're not doing a very good job of it.

strager wrote:

Echo wrote:

  1. Assume what everyone is saying is true
  2. Find evidence to show that a person is likely lying. From this point on assume everything he says is false.
  3. That person defends himself.
  4. Given that the person does so convincingly, assume from this point on everything he says is true. Otherwise, he is likely mafia and should be lynched.
And this logic has gotten you how far in Mafia games?
page 26 so far, I believe
anonymous_old
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0_o
And this logic has gotten you how far in Mafia games?
His logic does get him killed quickly in mafia games, but it's usually because the assassins are scared of him ;)
Trust me, I know.

EDIT: bleh I think I misunderstood that post anyway. good night.
adam2046
I only won in Mafia 1 because I had the strategic forsight to take Echo (important to the structual integrity of the humans) out day 1 if he had been kept alive I would have lost on LyLo.

That, is exactly where Echo's logic would have gotten him.
Echo
I would also like to selfishly request that the real doctor, if such a role exists, protect me during the night.
Derekku
I'm with adam/0_o. Echo is effing good at these games, and that's why he keeps getting killed off quickly; People are scared of him. :P

Why I'm still up at 5:30am I don't know.

/me falls asleep
Echo
If you're relying on me, or are biased in any way just because you think I'm good at this game (honestly, I'm not that good), then you're completely missing the point.

Now if you're scared of me, that's a different story ^^

BOO
adam2046
I am quite definitley not relying on you, first time I heavily suspect you of being Mafia, I will lynch you.
Echo
よろしくおねがいしま~す
nardii
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Derekku

nardi11011 wrote:

Echo wrote:

よろしくおねがいしま~す
QFT

like i know what it means
Please remember me IIRC
anonymous_old

nardi11011 wrote:

Anyway, I'm keeping my vote on strager as he just seems to be acting too strange to me.
Are you trying to be punny?

nardi11011 wrote:

Especially his very first slip-up doesn't seem to fit in with the rest of his posts, as I don't see why someone would rather risk dying the first night than lie about their role.
Again, claiming Doctor was a mistake. I didn't mean to "risk dying" by doing it because I didn't mean to do it.
BagelBob_old

nardi11011 wrote:

Holy shit, 6 pages? I hate timezones. Anyway, I'm keeping my vote on strager as he just seems to be acting too strange to me. Especially his very first slip-up doesn't seem to fit in with the rest of his posts, as I don't see why someone would rather risk dying the first night than lie about their role. I don't see anyone else as overly suspicious, so I'm not changing my vote.

also,

Echo wrote:

よろしくおねがいしま~す
QFT

like i know what it means
Could you explain farther what you mean by "fit in with the rest of his posts"? Also, are you going to be more active, or are we going to see you once every three days?

0_o, who are you voting for right now? That last one was only 80% there.

and I think Echo said "Thank you very much," but I'm not sure.
0_o

BagelBob wrote:

0_o, who are you voting for right now? That last one was only 80% there.
I'm indifferent on whether we lynch nardi or adam, and nardi hasn't said anything that would convince me to change my vote, so for now, my vote stands.
anonymous_old

0_o wrote:

BagelBob wrote:

0_o, who are you voting for right now? That last one was only 80% there.
I'm indifferent on whether we lynch nardi or adam, and nardi hasn't said anything that would convince me to change my vote, so for now, my vote stands.
BagelBob was referring to this:

0_o wrote:

strager wrote:

Derekku Chan wrote:

That means you are mafia? :<
I am not a Mafia.
Funny, that's exactly what someone who is in the mafia would say

vote stra-

lol
Please state CLEARLY who you are voting for.
BagelBob_old
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0_o
That vote for you was a joke, I obviously wouldn't defend you this whole time, then vote for you because you said you weren't mafia :|

And I'm voting for nardi because as I've already said

0_o wrote:

EDIT: and if you think about it, his theory on strager's bandwagon (Echo, SFG, adam, nardi) does make some sense. Wouldn't you think a mafia member would jump at the chance to lynch the potential doctor? I think it's very likely that both of the mafia members are in that group.
I'm not confident enough to vote Echo and I believe SFG is a townie. So I'm fine with either nardi or adam, and since nardi is already on L-2, then well, there you go. I'm not going to split the vote between 2 people who I think should be lynched.
BagelBob_old

0_o wrote:

That vote for you was a joke, I obviously wouldn't defend you this whole time, then vote for you because you said you weren't mafia :|

And I'm voting for him because as I've already said

0_o wrote:

EDIT: and if you think about it, his theory on strager's bandwagon (Echo, SFG, adam, nardi) does make some sense. Wouldn't you think a mafia member would jump at the chance to lynch the potential doctor? I think it's very likely that both of the mafia members are in that group.
I'm not confident enough to vote Echo and I believe SFG is a townie. So I'm fine with either nardi or adam, and since nardi is already on L-2, then well, there you go. I'm not going to split the vote between 2 people who I think should be lynched.
Which actions/posts make you believe that Echo and SFG are townies?
They both voted for strager, just like nardi and adam, who you believe is the doctor.
Echo
mod: I'd like to know how many hours until night (6pm what timezone?) and a vote count please.
anonymous_old
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0_o

BagelBob wrote:

Which actions/posts make you believe that Echo and SFG are townies?
They both voted for strager, just like nardi and adam, who you believe is the doctor.
strager answered your question about Echo above

As for SFG, I'm pretty sure this is the third time I've said this, but it's because kuwarudo complained he was a townie, quit, and was replaced my SFG. 1) I don't think he would quit if he was mafia, 2) why would he lie if he is quitting?

strager wrote:

0_o, IMO voting because of the number of votes on one's head isn't a good idea for a Townie (only a Mafia because a Mafia knows if he's lynching a Townie or not). If you are split between nardi and adam you'll need another reason to vote for one or the other. If you stick to your vote for nardi solely to keep him at L-1 without another reason I'm more incline to believe you are a Mafia. (This is supported by you avoiding voting on Echo.)
First of all, he's at L-2 - Bagelbob retracted his vote
I'm not really split between them, I'm indifferent between them. I would be just as happy voting off adam as I would nardi. And since nardi is the more likely candidate right now, it would be pointless to vote for adam since that would just make it more difficult to lynch nardi, whom I believe is just as likely to be mafia as adam.
I hope that made sense? :P
Yuukari-Banteki

BagelBob wrote:

Which actions/posts make you believe that Echo and SFG are townies?
They both voted for strager, just like nardi and adam, who you believe is the doctor.

to be fair, the first time i voted for strager i was trying to rush through things because id missed about seven pages of textwall arguments between Echo and strager. I hadn't actually read them in very much detail, i just wanted to ensure i got to vote. (I obviously hadnt checked when the deadline was either ._.)
anonymous_old

0_o wrote:

1) I don't think he would quit if he was mafia
Well, it is kuu...

0_o wrote:

2) why would he lie if he is quitting?
I don't see a reason not to lie, other than wanting to be truthful.

strager wrote:

0_o, IMO voting because of the number of votes on one's head isn't a good idea for a Townie (only a Mafia because a Mafia knows if he's lynching a Townie or not). If you are split between nardi and adam you'll need another reason to vote for one or the other. If you stick to your vote for nardi solely to keep him at L-1 without another reason I'm more incline to believe you are a Mafia. (This is supported by you avoiding voting on Echo.)

0_o wrote:

First of all, he's at L-2 - Bagelbob retracted his vote
Not at the time you voted.

0_o wrote:

I'm not really split between them, I'm indifferent between them. I would be just as happy voting off adam as I would nardi. And since nardi is the more likely candidate right now, it would be pointless to vote for adam since that would just make it more difficult to lynch nardi, whom I believe is just as likely to be mafia as adam.
I hope that made sense? :P
Still doesn't mean anything to me. I understand it, but it's definitely not a reason from what I can see.
Echo
Can someone explain to me why we just jumped to voting for nardi when strager has been so suspicious and refusing to defend himself?

strager wrote:

Echo wrote:

Echo wrote:

Whereas I've conjured up a single sentence with enough evidence to send you to kingdom come, none of which you've satisfactorily defended against, you've brought none of my posts against me.
I would like you to do two things:
  1. refute my 3 points in the linked post
  2. attack me with my posts
Well you're not getting it.

edit: @strager:
kuu is obviously townie
the way sfg has posted is obviously townie

You're trying to bring suspicion onto someone who is obviously townie. Now why would you do that?
BagelBob_old
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