I do not understand why I am the mafia if Echo is a vanilla, Nardi even less (since I know nothing about him and never see him post much)
Facts and figures please?
Facts and figures please?
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Newbie Mafia 2! [Mafia Win!]
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To put this simply, I don't believe you.strager wrote:
One, before the game started, I didn't have the Doctor PM.
Two, if I lied, I would have to stay with that lie. I would rather stay with the truth.
Three, claiming Doctor was an accident. I've said this several times I think.
You don't care that you said nardi would have been suspicious if he defended himself in advance, when you defended yourself in advance?strager wrote:
The second post I may have missed. I have nothing to comment on it though.BagelBob wrote:
Also, why are you ignoring these two posts?
And again,strager wrote:
The first post I thought I responded to, but apparently I didn't. Here's my response:That is correct.BagelBob wrote:
From what I see in that post, I can only think that you're voting for Echo because Echo was attacking you. Is this correct? Is there anything else that I'm missing?It was relative suspicion at the time. The list can be disregarded now as my opinion has changed, though.BagelBob wrote:
And again, Why are Derekku and 0_o above 50? Why are the rest of us below 50? Was that whole chart just BS?
BagelBob wrote:
And again, Why are Derekku and 0_o above 50? Why are the rest of us below 50? Was that whole chart just BS?
strager wrote:
Again, I wasn't trying to explain anything. I WAS re-stating.BagelBob wrote:
This section is just a re-statement. I don't see any explanations, nor a need for any. Of course Echo thinks that you're a mafia. My first clue was the case, my second was the vote. I know you didn't think that Echo thought you were a vanilla townie. There was a whole section about whether or not you were fake-claiming as a townie, with Echo definitively of the mind that that would be a bad idea. You're saying that to make it look like Echo is lynching a townie. You should have at least said doctor, since that's what you're claiming to be.
Would you care to contradict yourself again?strager wrote:
Yes, I was explaining why I said something, because Echo asked for an explanation (Echo's quote expanded for clarification):
It would be circular reasoning if I was saying he was scum because he didn't quick lynch.strager wrote:
Circular reasoning?BagelBob wrote:
A quick-lynch, such as the one you described, would generally be an obvious scum-tell.
I'm saying "If he quick-lynches, then he's probably a scum." This is logical because a townie wouldn't quick-lynch someone who claimed doctor.
You're saying that I'm saying "No one quick-lynched, thus they must not be scum because scum would quick-lynch" which is circular reasoning.
Your exact quote says that one or two of (names) was bandwagoning. Adam and Echo are two of those names. That statement includes an accusation of adam and Echo bandwagoning.strager wrote:
I never said that. The exact thing you quoted:BagelBob wrote:
Really, adam and Echo bandwagoning? Adam was the first one to vote for you, and Echo has been making the case.strager wrote:
All I meant to say there that one or two of adam, Echo, nardi, and SFG were bandwagonning as a Mafia, not all of them.
What is this? You asked what the junk about random voting was and I pasted it. Why is this here? What are you trying to say with it?strager wrote:
In chronological order:BagelBob wrote:
your junk about random voting is this:strager wrote:
In the first case I deduce one of these to be a Mafia: adam, SFG, nardi
In the third case I deduce these are probably NOT Mafia (because they didn't jump on the bandwagon): Derekku, 0_o
For the first case it seems as if adam's vote was random and SFG's vote was only somewhat random, as was nardi's. So my suspicions for the latter two are above my suspicions for adam. From that I really can't say much more though.
For the third case, 0_o seems to be really trying to defend me which either means he's deceitful (and will kill me at night) or genuinely trying to help the town. I'm not foolish enough to denounce the former but based on my observation above he may be a Townie more than a Mafia.
I really don't know what to think of Derekku because he hasn't been doing much from what I can see, really. He could be bad at analysis, not have information to discuss, or is smart enough not to talk because he may leak information. So ... not really sure.BagelBob wrote:
In addition, did you mean that adam, SFG, and nardii's votes looked like bandwagon votes? You state that you think 0_o and Derekuu were not on the bandwagon, but then you throw junk about random voting. Adam's vote started out random, but he kept posting and saying that he was reading the thread and agreed with Echo's logic.The random voting part was for the first case, and the 0_o and Derekku part was for the third case.strager wrote:
Where is this "junk about random voting?"BagelBob wrote:
You state that you think 0_o and Derekuu were not on the bandwagon, but then you throw junk about random voting.
It might be in some games, but in this game, you claimed doctor, which greatly changes things.strager wrote:
On the first day the first lynch is probably random anyway.
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I assume you are referring to this:adam2046 wrote:
I do not understand why I am the mafia if Echo is a vanilla, Nardi even less (since I know nothing about him and never see him post much)
Facts and figures please?
If we are going by the mentioned bandwagon theory, SFG knows (or says) she isn't mafia, and if she thinks Echo is a vanilla, then that leaves both you and nardi as the potential mafia, since no one else jumped in on the chance to lynch strager.Saturos-fangirl wrote:
this does make sense, im going to go back to voting on adam like i should have been doing all along. 67% chance of hitting a mafia sounds great to me, and since im pretty sure Echo is vanilla, that means adam and nardi are the mafia members.0_o wrote:
EDIT: and if you think about it, his theory on strager's bandwagon (Echo, SFG, adam, nardi) does make some sense. Wouldn't you think a mafia member would jump at the chance to lynch the potential doctor? I think it's very likely that both of the mafia members are in that group.
tl;dr vote adam, FOS nardi
I'm going to mostly not comment on BagelBob's post because me explaining why I said something would be restating what I already said, then he'll just ask why I said that again.
I'm wondering how they came up with that table of numbers. With 5 players and 1 mafia, you've got an 80% chance of hitting town on day 1 and 66% of hitting town on day 2. That gives ~47% chance of hitting scum if you lynch randomly. I can't understand.
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For one, I wasn't talking about our game on the IRC. I was telling strager that his comments didn't apply to our game.
For another, I refuse to read strager and derekuu's conversation on the IRC.
For another, I refuse to read strager and derekuu's conversation on the IRC.
So you're saying whoever DIDN'T jump on is a Mafia?Echo wrote:
Even if strager is innocent, the mafia wouldn't jump on since that'd be a huge scum tell.
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Topic Starter
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I'm not quite sure how that answers the question. Maybe I'm reading the other post wrong or am looking for the wrong thing.Echo wrote:
Three things only.I already answered this back here when SFG asked the same question.0_o wrote:
EDIT: and if you think about it, his theory on strager's bandwagon (Echo, SFG, adam, nardi) does make some sense. Wouldn't you think a mafia member would jump at the chance to lynch the potential doctor? I think it's very likely that both of the mafia members are in that group.
It was pretty much a mistake and it didn't really do anything other than urge Derekku to post asking HOW my program worked, and him saying "oh okay" in IRC. For BagelBob's mini-convo I was just pointing something out which may have cleared up some confusion.Echo wrote:
And strager/derekku/bagel are talking about the game in IRC, which is against the rules (simple "posted" lines are ok, I guess, but entire convos are a big no-no. ALL proper conversation MUST be in this thread for all to see).
I assume you don't want the entire .log file? I'll crop out the part with Derekku and I talking (with unrelated lines included, and a bit before and after) and post in a bit.Echo wrote:
edit: I see Suburu has modified the rules slightly, but I still have no guarantee that that is all they talked about in IRC. Post all logs please preferably as an attachment.
I'll post whatever I want.Echo wrote:
And finally NO MORE PERCENTAGES they are completely irrelevant
True, this only applies if you believe strager is innocent. And I do.Echo wrote:
If strager is mafia, then of course we won't have the mafia jumping on.
Well in that case no one is gonna be lynched since anyone who delivers the final blow is gonna be considered mafiastrager wrote:
Even if strager is innocent, the mafia wouldn't jump on since that'd be a huge scum tell.
wat0_o wrote:
True, this only applies if you believe strager is innocent. And I do.Echo wrote:
If strager is mafia, then of course we won't have the mafia jumping on.
(Bold added.)
0_o has a point here. Being the last to vote may be a scum tell but that doesn't mean that's the only thing it could be. There's even a chance no Mafia is voting for the person (in case they are a Mafia), but that wasn't the case earlier with me being voted to L-1.0_o wrote:
Well in that case no one is gonna be lynched since anyone who delivers the final blow is gonna be considered mafiastrager wrote:
Even if strager is innocent, the mafia wouldn't jump on since that'd be a huge scum tell.
With SFG having switched to believing strager(at least for now), there aren't enough votes to lynch strager.
Regarding the decision between adam and nardi:
Adam has been here since the beginning of the game. He first voted for strager in a random vote, but then when strager started to act suspicious, he stated his thoughts and has since continued posting and keeping up with the game.
nardi, on the other hand, showed up for a little bit and voted strager without adding anything new. He has since posted a few times, but mostly just says he doesn't know what to think, that he's in the middle of the road, despite still voting for strager.
Thus, for bandwagoning and lurking, I
Unvote: strager
Vote: nardi
Regarding the decision between adam and nardi:
Adam has been here since the beginning of the game. He first voted for strager in a random vote, but then when strager started to act suspicious, he stated his thoughts and has since continued posting and keeping up with the game.
nardi, on the other hand, showed up for a little bit and voted strager without adding anything new. He has since posted a few times, but mostly just says he doesn't know what to think, that he's in the middle of the road, despite still voting for strager.
Thus, for bandwagoning and lurking, I
Unvote: strager
Vote: nardi
Nope. It depends on the context; if the last person votes with a valid reason, then it's sweet.0_o wrote:
Well in that case no one is gonna be lynched since anyone who delivers the final blow is gonna be considered mafiastrager wrote:
Even if strager is innocent, the mafia wouldn't jump on since that'd be a huge scum tell.
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Anyone could still be mafia. But if they have a valid reason, then they probably aren't mafia.
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Yes, otherwise it's bandwagoning or a random vote.
So.. you are saying that the mafia is incapable of coming up with a valid reason to lynch someone?Echo wrote:
Nope. It depends on the context; if the last person votes with a valid reason, then it's sweet.0_o wrote:
Well in that case no one is gonna be lynched since anyone who delivers the final blow is gonna be considered mafiastrager wrote:
Even if strager is innocent, the mafia wouldn't jump on since that'd be a huge scum tell.
EDIT: also Bagelbob has a good point with nardi, unless he posts something convincing soon my vote's gonna switch...
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Due to Olinad being replaced the voting period will likely be extended.Saturos-fangirl wrote:
to other M2 players: this is the last day before we need to have a decision. if we do not decide, the mafia will get a free nightkill while we dither around not lynching people. Change your vote before time runs out~ (wow that sounded DOOM-y lol)
we dont know that yet and better safe than sorry imho
Meh, I'm good with nardi.
unvote
vote nardi
unvote
vote nardi
Woah there.
Hasty.
I have noticed nardi in the "Users browsing the forum" at the bottom on several occasions and he hasn't posted. So here's what I think.
If he is a Townie, he's going a pretty horrible job at "blending in." He stands out as a lurker and doesn't even attempt to post anything meaningful.
If he is a Mafia, he's trying to sabotage the game by the same cause so Mafia loses. That's Pretty Gay (tm).
I really doubt a Mafia would sabotage his buddy like that so I'm leaning toward the possibility of him being a Townie.
Yes, I'm defending nardi, but it's not like he's hereso he can to defend himself anyway. =\
EDIT: [strike] and added "to" to make sentence more understandable.
Hasty.
I have noticed nardi in the "Users browsing the forum" at the bottom on several occasions and he hasn't posted. So here's what I think.
If he is a Townie, he's going a pretty horrible job at "blending in." He stands out as a lurker and doesn't even attempt to post anything meaningful.
If he is a Mafia, he's trying to sabotage the game by the same cause so Mafia loses. That's Pretty Gay (tm).
I really doubt a Mafia would sabotage his buddy like that so I'm leaning toward the possibility of him being a Townie.
Yes, I'm defending nardi, but it's not like he's here
EDIT: [strike] and added "to" to make sentence more understandable.
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Interesting. I didn't mean to imply that not talking removed suspicion but you have a point about not wanting to slip up in a post. Caution is a bad thing, I guess?0_o wrote:
From what I remember looking through the first WW game, when adam and yoshikart were mafia, adam was on L-1 and yoshikart didn't say a thing. In fact, every post that he made was either a vote or a vote change, with little to no explaination. So don't think that being quiet means they are innocent; they are just as likely to be a wolf who is afraid of posting something suspicious.
So that's what you did with me? xD0_o wrote:
That, and throwing someone on L-2 is a pretty effective way of getting them to speak up
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Derekku, 0_o, SFG, BagelBob.Derekku Chan wrote:
nardi is on L-1 ;/0_o wrote:
That, and throwing someone on L-2 is a pretty effective way of getting them to speak up
Yeah, L-1.
When you say "his buddy" who are you referring to? (nardi is "a Mafia" in that sentence, yes?)strager wrote:
Woah there.
Hasty.
I have noticed nardi in the "Users browsing the forum" at the bottom on several occasions and he hasn't posted. So here's what I think.
If he is a Townie, he's going a pretty horrible job at "blending in." He stands out as a lurker and doesn't even attempt to post anything meaningful.
If he is a Mafia, he's trying to sabotage the game by the same cause so Mafia loses. That's Pretty Gay (tm).
I really doubt a Mafia would sabotage his buddy like that so I'm leaning toward the possibility of him being a Townie.
Yes, I'm defending nardi, but it's not like he's hereso he canto defend himself anyway. =\
EDIT: [strike] and added "to" to make sentence more understandable.
Also, I don't want to lynch him before he gets a chance to speak so
Unvote Nardi
That is exactly what I'm saying. There should be no evidence in posts against townies, which means mafia won't be able to bring up a valid reason to lynch a townie.0_o wrote:
So.. you are saying that the mafia is incapable of coming up with a valid reason to lynch someone?
lynch strager plox vote strager if i'm not voting him already >.> (can't keep up with my unvotes)
Why not? Humans come up with "evidence" against other humans to lynch them, the only difference is that the mafia actually knows that they are lynching a human.Echo wrote:
That is exactly what I'm saying. There should be no evidence in posts against townies, which means mafia won't be able to bring up a valid reason to lynch a townie.0_o wrote:
So.. you are saying that the mafia is incapable of coming up with a valid reason to lynch someone?
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strager, when you say "his buddy" who are you referring to?
"His buddy" being the other Mafia.BagelBob wrote:
When you say "his buddy" who are you referring to? (nardi is "a Mafia" in that sentence, yes?)strager wrote:
Woah there.
Hasty.
I have noticed nardi in the "Users browsing the forum" at the bottom on several occasions and he hasn't posted. So here's what I think.
If he is a Townie, he's going a pretty horrible job at "blending in." He stands out as a lurker and doesn't even attempt to post anything meaningful.
If he is a Mafia, he's trying to sabotage the game by the same cause so Mafia loses. That's Pretty Gay (tm).
I really doubt a Mafia would sabotage his buddy like that so I'm leaning toward the possibility of him being a Townie.
Yes, I'm defending nardi, but it's not like he's hereso he canto defend himself anyway. =\
EDIT: [strike] and added "to" to make sentence more understandable.
I'm sorry, I read that wrong.
"If he is a Mafia, he's trying to sabotage the game by the same cause so Mafia loses."
This reasoning escapes me so much, I must have changed Mafia loses to Town loses just to keep my sanity.
"If he is a Mafia, he's trying to sabotage the game by the same cause so Mafia loses."
This reasoning escapes me so much, I must have changed Mafia loses to Town loses just to keep my sanity.