Wishy wrote:

@Kanye. I can't really say I tried brown but they just felt like blue's but just harder to press. Between blue and red I prefer blue but that's up to preference, both require almost the same force for activation so...

fun fact: brown is lighter than blue.

you just disproved your statement.

Wishy wrote:

Ok Emaal, let's put it this way:

You got two different objects.

A's weight is 20kg.
B's weight is 10kg.

Are you gonna be able to lift A's weight easier, more times and faster than B? No. Even if you're used to lift 20kg, it's gonna be easier to lift less, always. If you're used to blacks then CONGRATULATIONS, try getting used to red ones and you will notice a big improvement. I was used to those buckler-spring switches, switched to blue and over the next 2/3 days my endurance on streams improved quite a bit. In fact it did pretty much immediatly, but I was just streaming too fast on everything.

And as far as I knew reds and blacks need to be bottomed out to activate. Just asked Metro though and apparently they activate before so I don't know what's the difference between red and blue anymore lol.

@Kanye. I can't really say I tried brown but they just felt like blue's but just harder to press. Between blue and red I prefer blue but that's up to preference, both require almost the same force for activation so...

I can officially say that's bullshit. I can stream for longer with less effort on reds but I can't attain my old speed.

jesus1412 wrote:

Wishy wrote:

Ok Emaal, let's put it this way:

You got two different objects.

A's weight is 20kg.
B's weight is 10kg.

Are you gonna be able to lift A's weight easier, more times and faster than B? No. Even if you're used to lift 20kg, it's gonna be easier to lift less, always. If you're used to blacks then CONGRATULATIONS, try getting used to red ones and you will notice a big improvement. I was used to those buckler-spring switches, switched to blue and over the next 2/3 days my endurance on streams improved quite a bit. In fact it did pretty much immediatly, but I was just streaming too fast on everything.

And as far as I knew reds and blacks need to be bottomed out to activate. Just asked Metro though and apparently they activate before so I don't know what's the difference between red and blue anymore lol.

@Kanye. I can't really say I tried brown but they just felt like blue's but just harder to press. Between blue and red I prefer blue but that's up to preference, both require almost the same force for activation so...

I can officially say that's bullshit. I can stream for longer with less effort on reds but I can't attain my old speed.

and you were the guy i had in my thoughts all the time whilst writing what I wrote


nohomo

Emaal wrote:

jesus1412 wrote:

I can officially say that's bullshit. I can stream for longer with less effort on reds but I can't attain my old speed.

and you were the guy i had in my thoughts all the time whilst writing what I wrote


nohomo

ahauehaueaheaua

blue and reds are the casual - no effort way to stream, blacks seem to come up faster or something but require a lot more effort to fully use.

Wishy browns are actually lighter then blues, but the difference is minimal so you would barely notice it, except for the tactile click which is hardly noticeable on browns(what's the point?). Now if I was OP I would go for the reds, I can't say I have tried them personally, but on the last mech board thread a user recently bought reds and said it was excellent. Also wishy made a good point there, why go for the heavier weight when theres a lighter weight you can do more reps with?

Tanzklaue wrote:

Wishy wrote:

@Kanye. I can't really say I tried brown but they just felt like blue's but just harder to press. Between blue and red I prefer blue but that's up to preference, both require almost the same force for activation so...

fun fact: brown is lighter than blue.

you just disproved your statement.

The fact that they are 5g lighter and that I just tried them out ONCE (as I said I can't really say I tried them), it doesn't. Learn to read.

Jesus, we are talking about endurance and how good they are overall. I'm faster streaming on a rubber-dome too yet my accuracy and endurance are overall way better on blue switches (and after getting used to them I'm pretty much as fast as on a rubber-dome). I don't know much about rubber-domes other than they are shit and hard to press, but there must be some reason that makes it like this (shallow keys? I don't know). Anyways, after a few months of playing on mechanical keyboards my speed is as good as on a rubber-dome if not better. Just need to get used to them. You can always get used to them, and even if you're good with something it doesn't mean you won't be better with a better tool.

You can always optimize a lots of stuff when trying to be good at something, this doesn't mean you can't be good with a shitty setup. Then if you're good with a shitty setup you could improve greatly by getting used to a good setup. I'm faster than most people no matter what keyboard I use, that doesn't mean I can't be better by using lighter keys. Getting the best setup possible and getting used to it is always good, and if you're used to bad stuff and can get either good or very good stuff to get used to, get very good.

PS: Because of fags, I don't know how fast I'm on a rubber-dome right now, which is why I'm saying "as fast if not better". I can do anything I could do on a rubber-dome back then and even more, but since I don't have any rubber-dome to try out how fast I'm on it I can't really tell.

tl;dr: The fact that you're better with a hard-to-press keyboard doesn't mean it's better than a light-to-press keyboard. If you get used to both then the light one will be better, always.

Wishy, first of all, as you've been informed, you don't have to bottom out any of the switches. The activation point is at 2mm, while they bottom out at 4mm (source). Also, the difference in required force between reds and blacks is only 15g. Fingers cannot understand such a small difference. When it comes to keyboards, fingers get used to a specific amount of force through muscle memory after extended usage. Therefore, when using rubber-dome keyboards your finger learn to apply around 70g of pressure on the keys.

Pressing a key multiple times, like while playing osu!, consists of 2 different movements. One is a downwards movement while applying force and the other is an upwards movement while the finger's muscles are in a relaxed state. While a low force switch (reds) makes the first movement to complete faster, on the other hand, a higher force switch (blacks) makes the second movement faster. When coming from a rubber-dome to red switches, your fingers apply so much force on the keys that they don't receive the key's feedback, making the finger's joints to do a lot more work than they used to to lift the finger, which feels uncomfortable and makes the movement slower. In this situation, black switches, not only don't require more force than rubber-domes, but also they feel faster to press repeatedly due to the stronger feedback.

Ultimately, reds might be better than blacks in terms of speed after getting used to. However, they require a lot more time to get used to when coming from rubber-domes and probably they will frustrated the user at the beginning. It is completely logical for a rubber-dome user to be more comfortable with blacks than reds and actually feel the improvement that a mechanical keyboard provides. Even more, you may be able to make better usage of the reds after being already used to mechanical keyboards. You know, sometimes, the ending result is better when the procedure to achieve it is smoother.

That may be the case, still lighter key = less force required overall = if you get used to it, it's better. Which is my point.

I've had my moments of despair over my reds, but that was before I could play with kb.
Over a year with hard training on blues made me confident to give them another try.
It's by far the best for me and it made my control on higher bpms rise dramatically.
I don't think it drains acc with practice either.

I have a keyboard with blues, should I get reds? Blues are the only type of switch I've ever tried.

MxG PhiLL wrote:

I have a keyboard with blues, should I get reds? Blues are the only type of switch I've ever tried.

No blacks master race.

I have blacks and it's hard for me to use the keyboard personally for anything but maybe spamming keys (i.e. half assed streaming)

but I'm not a pro so /shrug

(kinda cause it's harder for me to press down v.v)
(wonder if I should try red)

I am using blue and i hate them. It's ridiculous how hard is to do multiple triples/quads, how is it even possible to lift off your finger so high and then start spamming again :S(on really high bpm, what happens: 1. don't press button at all 2. i don't lift-off enough ) , especially Blackwidow, already broke ~6keys and there's almost nothing left to change... (at least comfortable). Waiting for money and gonna try red.
But maybe that's because i'm really used to small lift-off even after 1 year i just can't get used to them.

LoGo wrote:

I am using blue and i hate them. It's ridiculous how hard is to do multiple triples/quads, how is it even possible to lift off your finger so high and then start spamming again :S(on really high bpm, what happens: 1. don't press button at all 2. i don't lift-off enough ) , especially Blackwidow, already broke ~6keys and there's almost nothing left to change... (at least comfortable). Waiting for money and gonna try red.
But maybe that's because i'm really used to small lift-off even after 1 year i just can't get used to them.

b-b-but blue master race

Sorun wrote:

b-b-but blue master race

Totally agreed. Cherry Blues are awesome.

Wishy wrote:

If the switch is lighter then it's better.

Red is lighter than black and uses pretty much the same mechanism therefore it's better. This is not about opinions and preference but physical facts. If the button requires less force to be activated then your endurance on streams or 1/2 will be better.

What is, indeed, about preference, is choosing between blue or red. Using red switches means you gotta bottom out the key for it to work, on Blue ones you don't.

Most of what people will tell you about this is pure crap, I've tested red, blue, black, buckler-spring (those old IBM switches I don't know how they are called) and I wouldn't even think about getting anything besides red or blue. Not talking about brown switches since I barely used them but they are kind of a mix between blue and black so meh. If you want switches which are just better go with either red or blue, rest are not as good as them for osu!.

that's only if you try to use as much force required for activation force

a lot of people use a lot more force than intended to press the keys

I haven't tried reds because they are ridiculously hard to find here (most likely will have to import), however I am pretty happy with blacks. I prefer the harder keys to super soft ones not because of maximum speed potential, but because I use my keyboard for more than just gaming, and super light keys might get in the way.
On the other hand I am very happy with them because my own speed is good enough (can stream extreme BPM without much issues), but on lower bpm I prefer harder keys by far. It just feels much better streaming 120~140 bpm on harder keys (I wish they were harder actually) than on softer, but I guess that could just be me.
There is no doubt that reds will yield in a bigger stamina pool for reasons Wishy already stated, however I believe there is more to it than just pure stamina/speed which is the reason that I don't want to switch to reds (I would like to try them though, just to see for myself).

I have tested blues in the store I was buying my blacks at and I can say they are disappointingly bad, at least in my opinion. The keys feel weird and pressing them feels weird. I know this is personal preference and pressing those keys felt like my presses are getting interrupted, that just didn't feel right. Also most popular blue keyboards (blackwidlol) have insanely bad build quality and probably bad rollover (my keyboard has NKRO, vs blackwidlol's 3KRO).

Sorun wrote:

b-b-but blue master race

Unless you want to share your thoughts in a more descriptive manner which describes why are they superiour, I would probably say that you might have bought the wrong keyboard.

buny wrote:

a lot of people use a lot more force than intended to press the keys

Yeah well that's why you gotta master it.

Currently on mobile, but i summarized my thoughts in the last mech thread. Blues are excellent for gaming and typing. What's not to like?


Like I said ... Master race

Red are pretty nice to me however I'm pretty curious for blacks/blues, maybe buying additional loose switches for your keyboard would be a good idea to try out the other colors.

i've tried blue, black and red. I'm comfortable with blue and black. Red was waaay too light for me, i couldn't maintain any kind of speed(even though i felt at times i could go REAL FAST). Maybe u just have to get used to them, but i'm way too used to smashing keys so i felt like streaming on the air :/.

i hope that helps

Wishy wrote:

buny wrote:

a lot of people use a lot more force than intended to press the keys

Yeah well that's why you gotta master it.

then stop correcting me, when i say it's all about adaption.

blues suck.

reds master race.

winber1 wrote:

blues suck.

reds master race.

actually i prefered blacks; shame that i had to ship them away 2 months ago ;_;

it's cuz your black santa. gtfo

In just two weeks blues made me stream 600bpm with 1 finger

Wishy wrote:

What is, indeed, about preference, is choosing between blue or red. Using red switches means you gotta bottom out the key for it to work, on Blue ones you don't.

All cherry mechanical switches actuate at halfway points.

Qrunch wrote:

All cherry mechanical switches actuate at halfway points.

Not quite exactly... http://www.wasdkeyboards.com/mechanical-keyboard-guide

Also next time don't necropost.

:cc I don't know which should I buy. I really want blue switches but people say that red it's the best for osu, other say that brow it's better and others say that silver is the best. I heard a lot of people complaining about blue, idk. What should I do?

I'm not a pro player, but I'm decent.

black

brown

Definitely black. Red means you owe peppy something...

Joof wrote:

I'm planning on buying the Steelseries 6Gv2, but I'm not sure which one would be better. The black switches or the red switches, now, before you start going, oh, buying a mechanical keyboard just for osu! isn't worth it. But, I'm not only using it for osu!, that's the thing, I play other games and I need a good keyboard with anti ghosting, etc. Also I'm sorta like a Steelseries fanboy haha.

So, anyways, which one do you guys prefer or recommend? Black or Red?

This is like really really late but I recommend Gateron Optical Yellows for osu!
(if you have an optical hotswap keyboard i recommend this)
Force: 35g
Actuation: 1mm
Response Time: 0.2ms
Travel: 3.2mm