Yeah, sorry if this was an inconvenience for any of you. To be honest, this answer was obvious. I'm not going to completely 'abuse' the PP system, but I'm gonna enjoy the game.
You should not be apologizing to us - we should be apologizing to you because the community has clearly had a negative impact on your ability to enjoy the game and progress naturally as a player by poisoning your mind with unhealthy expectations.Qrunch wrote:
Yeah, sorry if this was an inconvenience for any of you. To be honest, this answer was obvious. I'm not going to completely 'abuse' the PP system, but I'm gonna enjoy the game.
Do you know why I don't respect farmers? They didn't try to accomplish their personal goal, they were all chasing for pp.Philosofikal wrote:
This is exactly the dumb kind of shit that is an inevitable result of this community's unhealthy obsession with how you should and should not play the game if you want to be "respected" by a select group of ignorant losers with a sense of unwarranted self importance. Great job spreading poor playing mentalities, guys!
I'm a completely unashamed "farmer". I buy into the PP system completely. You know why? Sure, it has its flaws in map weighting, but I consider the system to be a huge net positive in terms of motivating me to play the game - you know, playing more, the only thing that actually matters and the fundamental message of almost every response to lazy inquiries for advice? The PP system helps set realistic, achievable goals, rewards players for mastering maps and mods they otherwise wouldn't take a second glance at, and helps you track your progress and growth as a player and compare yourself to other players in a fairly accurately objective manner. These are all great positives to the system, it's a huge shame that everyone's elitism due to insecurity overshadows the benefits that using the system to your advantage can bring.
ok I love thisPhilosofikal wrote:
This is exactly the dumb kind of shit that is an inevitable result of this community's unhealthy obsession with how you should and should not play the game if you want to be "respected" by a select group of ignorant losers with a sense of unwarranted self importance. Great job spreading poor playing mentalities, guys!
I'm a completely unashamed "farmer". I buy into the PP system completely. You know why? Sure, it has its flaws in map weighting, but I consider the system to be a huge net positive in terms of motivating me to play the game - you know, playing more, the only thing that actually matters and the fundamental message of almost every response to lazy inquiries for advice? The PP system helps set realistic, achievable goals, rewards players for mastering maps and mods they otherwise wouldn't take a second glance at, and helps you track your progress and growth as a player and compare yourself to other players in a fairly accurately objective manner. These are all great positives to the system, it's a huge shame that everyone's elitism due to insecurity overshadows the benefits that using the system to your advantage can bring.
Yet the idea that someone might actually get good by virtue of playing all the time, or even just playing more than they would without "farming", somehow eludes you. There is always a farm map because as you get better, other maps get easier, and therefore "farmable".SirOxorsid wrote:
Nothing against people who enjoy playing to gain PP but they should be aware that they can't keep it up forever, eventually you will have to actually git gud.
But, see, that's not really why you don't respect pp farmers.Nattsun wrote:
Do you know why I don't respect farmers? They didn't try to accomplish their personal goal, they were all chasing for pp.Philosofikal wrote:
This is exactly the dumb kind of shit that is an inevitable result of this community's unhealthy obsession with how you should and should not play the game if you want to be "respected" by a select group of ignorant losers with a sense of unwarranted self importance. Great job spreading poor playing mentalities, guys!
I'm a completely unashamed "farmer". I buy into the PP system completely. You know why? Sure, it has its flaws in map weighting, but I consider the system to be a huge net positive in terms of motivating me to play the game - you know, playing more, the only thing that actually matters and the fundamental message of almost every response to lazy inquiries for advice? The PP system helps set realistic, achievable goals, rewards players for mastering maps and mods they otherwise wouldn't take a second glance at, and helps you track your progress and growth as a player and compare yourself to other players in a fairly accurately objective manner. These are all great positives to the system, it's a huge shame that everyone's elitism due to insecurity overshadows the benefits that using the system to your advantage can bring.
Is a higher rank really what you want? Don't you want to FC that certain techmap badly? Don't you want to "git guud" and farm whenever you please?
To each his own I guess.
You can't "get good" by only playing farm maps. With the way farm maps are today they dont accurately test your skill—TV size anime openings with 2 big jump sections that boost the star rating from 5* to 6*. Coming from someone who farms a lot, you cant improve by only playing farm maps. Yes you'll be able to farm higher starred maps but eventually you will hit a wall, trust me. You can get better by farming, but you cant get good by farm maps alone. Playing to gain PP is perfectly fine but the idea that you can significantly improve only by playing for PP, is incorrect. The progress is short-lived, and eventually you WILL hit a wall, trust me. However yeah, theres nothing wrong with playing for PP, but if you're actually looking to grow as a player thats not the way to go.Philosofikal wrote:
Yet the idea that someone might actually get good by virtue of playing all the time, or even just more than they would without "farming", somehow eludes you. There is always a farm map because as you get better, other maps get easier, and therefore "farmable".SirOxorsid wrote:
Nothing against people who enjoy playing to gain PP but they should be aware that they can't keep it up forever, eventually you will have to actually git gud.
So, this isn't a farm map, then?c-atsuit wrote:
You can't "get good" by only playing farm maps. With the way farm maps are today they dont accurately test your skill—TV size anime openings with 2 big jump sections that boost the star rating from 5* to 6*. Coming from someone who farms a lot, you cant improve by only playing farm maps. Yes you'll be able to farm higher starred maps but eventually you will hit a wall, trust me. You can get better by farming, but you cant get good by farm maps alone. Playing to gain PP is perfectly fine but the idea that you can significantly improve only by playing for PP, is incorrect. The progress is short-lived, and eventually you WILL hit a wall, trust me. However yeah, theres nothing wrong with playing for PP, but if you're actually looking to grow as a player thats not the way to go.Philosofikal wrote:
Yet the idea that someone might actually get good by virtue of playing all the time, or even just more than they would without "farming", somehow eludes you. There is always a farm map because as you get better, other maps get easier, and therefore "farmable"anyways the osu community is cancer idk what u expected
Did I say the only farm maps were TV size anime openings? No. But I personally wouldn't consider that a farm map cause yeah u can farm it but its actually difficult if youre trying to get a substantial amount of pp from itPhilosofikal wrote:
So, this isn't a farm map, then?
https://osu.ppy.sh/b/774965?m=0
c-atsuit wrote:
Did I say the only farm maps were TV size anime openings? No. But I personally wouldn't consider that a farm map cause yeah u can farm it but its actually difficult if youre trying to get a substantial amount of pp from it
You can't "get good" by only playing farm maps. With the way farm maps are today they dont accurately test your skill—TV size anime openings with 2 big jump sections that boost the star rating from 5* to 6*. Coming from someone who farms a lot, you cant improve by only playing farm maps.Well, you sort of did. And if that's not what you were implying, then your point is essentially diluted into meaningless. If "anything" can be a farm map, well... I guess that brings us to my point, which is... there is no cap to "farm maps" because a farm map can be basically anything that is overweighted relative to maps in its skillset range, or even just tailored to your skillset range - some of my highest pp plays I did in like one or two tries just because I was naturally good at that map. The sky is the limit when it comes to overweighted maps, and they come in all shapes and sizes. As I was saying, "farming" is a mindset and a playstyle, not a property of a map, aside from being overweighted.
I'd respect you if you say that rank is all you care about, but I know that most people who actually claim that lie. I've met enough people who said they wanna FC this and that, but went back to farming.Philosofikal wrote:
But, see, that's not really why you don't respect pp farmers.
You don't respect pp farmers because they don't try to accomplish YOUR personal goals, and that's ignorant.
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/ar ... 2006-03-20
People play games for all different kinds of reasons. Some people play to be part of a community and compete among a group of friends. Some people want to prove that a weird playstyle has viability, or that they can do some oddball thing that nobody else can. Some people want to be ranked as high as possible so they can be seen as better and stronger than their peers. There are all kinds of different reasons to play this game and instead of shaming people for not fitting into neat little boxes of whatever a legitimate player is, we should be fostering a rich, diverse community and encouraging people to find their motivation, whatever that motivation might be, and keep coming back so that this game grows and stays relevant forever.
We lose nothing from having players that like to grind maps that give you an "overweighted" amount of imaginary internet points. But, the only thing we gain from shaming players for doing it is that somebody gets to jerk their little ding dong off about their narrow minded ideology of what a player should be and should do and how cool and smart they are for thinking that way at the expense of having a diverse, welcoming, tolerant community. Who needs that?
The only thing that really matters is that people find a reason to play more. It doesn't matter what that reason is, or how they go about accomplishing that goal. The end, mic drop, th-th-th-that's all folks!
Playing for pp doesn't make you a short-sighted moron jumping from easy target to easy target. Why would you assume that someone who plays for pp only plays maps that are high reward? pp is simply the tool that is used to measure oneself against, the ruler to measure your growth, the ultimate goal that most playing experience is used to develop towards - but that doesn't mean it's the only step in that goal! I don't purely play for rank - I define my ultimate skill by my rank. I mean, look at my recent play history:TIMMY, JOHNNY, AND SPIKE REVISITED wrote:
So why does Spike play? Spikes plays to prove something, primarily to prove how good he is. You see, Spike sees the game as a mental challenge by which he can define and demonstrate his abilities.
That is interesting that you say that, i don't think i agree.SirOxorsid wrote:
There is such a thing as good practice and bad practice, with osu and pretty much everything. Good practice constitutes not only playing maps beyond farm maps but is also dependent on your habits. Good practice involves not raping the restart button as soon as you miss. Doing so is an example of bad practice, and is common practice of people who just care about pp and rank (e.g. farmers).
It's probably not just you. I'm pretty sure everyone has a different definition to it, as this , and a lot of the things in this game are very subjective.Philosofikal wrote:
IDK, maybe it's just that everyone else and I have different definitions as to what it means to be a farmer.
yes, it's bad and you should dieStephOsu wrote:
im pretty sure only the newbies and people that's still living in 2012 still thinks that pp farming is truly bad
oh shit we have the same line of thought we should be friends xdN0thingSpecial wrote:
Think of farming like a progress check.
I play what I like whether it's bullshit 7* techmap or a simple 4* TV size, I only farm when my rival buddy surpass me in rank, I'll start a farming session to see how much pp I can get in a few days, I'll stop once I hit a wall, that's why my ranking graph isn't a gradual increase, cause 70% of the time I wouldn't be playing farm maps
you don't need to know, and you don't need to care for nowtechnomelons wrote:
What exactly is considered "farming"? Because as a newcomer who started a couple days ago, I'm not up to the terms and such. Is farming considered playing a map over and over again, tryharding, etc etc just for the purpose of getting higher in the ranks? Would I technically be "farming" if I played a map, pressing the retry button because I want my C rank to be an A rank? I wasn't thinking about getting up in the ranks or PP or what not, I just really wanted my C rank to go up and just to improve in game in general. :c
Play the game how you want to play it, ignore anyone who tells you otherwise.technomelons wrote:
What exactly is considered "farming"? Because as a newcomer who started a couple days ago, I'm not up to the terms and such. Is farming considered playing a map over and over again, tryharding, etc etc just for the purpose of getting higher in the ranks? Would I technically be "farming" if I played a map, pressing the retry button because I want my C rank to be an A rank? I wasn't thinking about getting up in the ranks or PP or what not, I just really wanted my C rank to go up and just to improve in game in general. :c
That's the immediate effect I'm talking about.HK_ wrote:
I was talking about stuff like this