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minor spacing change and slider shape stuff
10:35 Nao Tomori: oi
10:35 Nao Tomori: lets go
10:36 -himei: oiii
10:36 -himei: yea im rdy
10:37 *Nao Tomori is editing [https://osu.ppy.sh/b/1160044 Arzest - Enemy [Gloom]]
10:37 Nao Tomori: 00:22:957 (1) -
10:38 Nao Tomori: how come these things are fullscreen jumps
10:38 -himei: well mainly because of clock wise pattern + its sliders
10:38 -himei: so theres no way u can miss that
10:38 Nao Tomori: they're slow sliders so it's pretty aids to aim imo
10:39 -himei: hmmm well its easy
10:39 -himei: u can try
10:39 Nao Tomori: hm
10:39 Nao Tomori: ok its not that baad
10:40 Nao Tomori: alright then in this case
10:40 Nao Tomori: 00:22:957 -
10:40 Nao Tomori: did you ignore these vocals on purpose?
10:40 Nao Tomori: could be interesting to do some other type of slider if you wanted
10:40 Nao Tomori: 00:25:743 - too
10:40 Nao Tomori: 00:27:200 -
10:40 -himei: hmmm no the main purpose is like
10:41 -himei: to focus on structure rather than the music in this section
10:41 Nao Tomori: o.0
10:41 Nao Tomori: okay
10:41 -himei: well, in whole map too
10:41 Nao Tomori: mk
10:41 -himei: i mean yes there are some oppotunities
10:41 Nao Tomori: 00:34:100 (2) - i think this one is a bit too big
10:41 -himei: to change things but it will ruin the whole picture
10:41 -himei: ok so
10:42 Nao Tomori: though it keeps the pattern you can move them both in horizontally
10:42 -himei: wait wait ill explain
10:42 Nao Tomori: mhm
10:42 -himei: it used to be like this 00:38:043 (1,2) -
10:42 -himei: but after doyak karen and desperate-kun mods i changed it
10:42 -himei: they both like
10:42 -himei: said it shud be like that
10:43 -himei: i dont remember why tho
10:43 Nao Tomori: hmm
10:43 -himei: it was like 4 weeks ago
10:43 Nao Tomori: you mean change to circles from sliders?
10:43 Nao Tomori: cuz i just think jump is too far
10:43 Nao Tomori: sincec there is no slider leniency to use'
10:43 -himei: well
10:43 -himei: well theres no place here to put these
10:44 -himei: only in center
10:44 Nao Tomori: yeah yeah but you can move it closer together right
10:44 -himei: or i make a double on the (1) stack
10:44 -himei: no, cuz 00:35:300 (1,2) - it is stacked with this
10:44 -himei: and it complements the whole section pattern
10:44 Nao Tomori: oh
10:44 Nao Tomori: hm ok
10:44 -himei: if u select it
10:45 -himei: u will see
10:45 Nao Tomori: yea
10:45 Nao Tomori: this is why i hate pattern based xd
10:45 Nao Tomori: too restrictive
10:45 -himei: xd
10:45 Nao Tomori: 00:40:100 (4,5,6) -
10:45 Nao Tomori: this is not lined up i think?
10:45 -himei: hmm
10:45 Nao Tomori: 5 is off
10:45 -himei: 00:40:443 (5) - is the center between 4 and 6
10:46 -himei: i calculated it xd
10:46 Nao Tomori: ya
10:46 Nao Tomori: move it to the right like 2 px
10:46 Nao Tomori: i just tried it lol
10:46 -himei: are u sure
10:46 -himei: ?
10:46 Nao Tomori: very
10:46 -himei: 2 to the left by x?
10:47 -himei: hold on
10:47 Nao Tomori: two to the right
10:47 -himei: done
10:48 Nao Tomori: 00:57:929 (1) - o.0
10:48 Nao Tomori: why is this 1/4 slider
10:48 -himei: wait
10:48 -himei: 00:40:100 (4,6) -
10:48 -himei: x here is 102+256 = 188
10:48 -himei: why u think its 186?
10:48 Nao Tomori: huh
10:49 Nao Tomori: wait
10:49 Nao Tomori: hm
10:49 -himei: (102+256) / 2 = 188
10:49 Nao Tomori: o
10:49 Nao Tomori: wait..
10:49 Nao Tomori: y axis riigth
10:49 Nao Tomori: its off by a pixel
10:49 Nao Tomori: cuz like
10:50 Nao Tomori: 327/2 is not 164
10:50 Nao Tomori: whatever it isnt big deal
10:50 -himei: hmmm
10:50 -himei: wo 1 pixel to the top?
10:50 -himei: so*
10:50 Nao Tomori: down
10:50 Nao Tomori: 1 px down on 6
10:50 -himei: ok
10:51 -himei: 00:40:615 (6) - ?
10:51 Nao Tomori: ya
10:51 -himei: its stacked with others
10:51 -himei: i cant move it xddddddd
10:51 Nao Tomori: holy
10:51 Nao Tomori: ok whatever
10:51 Nao Tomori: 1 px nobody will notice
10:51 -himei: and its mirrored
10:52 Nao Tomori: 00:57:929 (1) -
10:52 Nao Tomori: why is this 1/4 slider
10:52 -himei: well.. idk
10:52 -himei: suggest me something
10:52 -himei: this place is controvertional
10:52 -himei: if u listen closely
10:52 Nao Tomori: actually the 1/4 sounds right
10:52 Nao Tomori: but.
10:52 -himei: theres a sound on blue tick
10:52 Nao Tomori: ok yeah
10:52 Nao Tomori: it's fine
10:53 Nao Tomori: 00:57:929 (1,1,1) -
10:53 Nao Tomori: 01:05:472 (1,1) -
10:53 Nao Tomori: why are these different lol
10:53 Nao Tomori: 01:05:815 (1,2) - looks really ugly
10:53 Nao Tomori: cuz the slider is almost touching circle
10:54 -himei: well.. its another shit place cuz the ... 01:05:472 (1,1) - s-ends and s-starts are mirrored
10:54 -himei: as u can see
10:54 -himei: and also
10:54 Nao Tomori: fk that just make it look nice
10:54 Nao Tomori: it looks way too bad
10:54 -himei: yea
10:54 -himei: hmmm
10:54 -himei: but how
10:55 -himei: hmm
10:55 Nao Tomori: http://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244338 looks better imo
10:55 -himei: oh nvm
10:55 -himei: sec
10:55 Nao Tomori: plus consistent with copying idea
10:55 -himei: they are different sounds
10:55 -himei: so doyak forced me to change the shape of second one
10:55 Nao Tomori: ..
10:55 -himei: cuz it has the sound on s-end
10:55 Nao Tomori: ok
10:55 Nao Tomori: i see
10:55 -himei: no wait ill change it
10:55 Nao Tomori: just
10:56 Nao Tomori: make it so there isnt a tiny ass overlap
10:56 -himei: just got to change the following jumps
10:56 Nao Tomori: somehow
10:56 -himei: ya give me a minute
10:57 -himei: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244370 ?
10:58 Nao Tomori: ya looks better
10:58 Nao Tomori: small curve on 1 would be even better imo
10:58 Nao Tomori: but not big deal
10:58 -himei: wait wat ar was that
10:59 -himei: 9.4?
10:59 -himei: or 9.3
10:59 Nao Tomori: idk
10:59 Nao Tomori: 9.4
10:59 -himei: i forgot xddd
10:59 -himei: ok
10:59 -himei: i changed to 5
10:59 -himei: for screenshot
10:59 Nao Tomori: rip
11:01 -himei: 02:44:215 - ill change this place also
11:02 Nao Tomori: ya
11:02 Nao Tomori: 01:10:272 (3,4,5,6) -
11:02 Nao Tomori: this is only time with square jump pattern?
11:03 Nao Tomori: every other time its that other sharper angle thing
11:03 -himei: no
11:03 Nao Tomori: and that sound seems same
11:03 -himei: theres a copy of that
11:03 Nao Tomori: in that section?
11:03 -himei: 01:15:758 (3,4,5,6) - this also
11:03 Nao Tomori: thats uh
11:03 Nao Tomori: hmm
11:03 -himei: 01:21:243 (3,4,5,6) - and this
11:03 Nao Tomori: ok
11:04 Nao Tomori: np then
11:04 Nao Tomori: oh man
11:04 Nao Tomori: do we need these 1/2 jumps
11:04 Nao Tomori: :<
11:04 -himei: where?
11:04 Nao Tomori: 01:26:816 -
11:04 Nao Tomori: well w/e
11:04 -himei: it uses a formula xd
11:04 Nao Tomori: those are pretty standard
11:05 -himei: every jump is bigger than another for 15*+the angle of previous jump
11:05 -himei: so its like
11:05 Nao Tomori: ya ya
11:05 -himei: sec
11:05 Nao Tomori: no i mean the ncing
11:05 Nao Tomori: not the pattern
11:05 -himei: oh
11:05 -himei: well its w/e for me
11:05 Nao Tomori: seems as if you can do 4 combo until the last one to me imo
11:05 -himei: it can be 1-4
11:06 Nao Tomori: cuz sound is not changing too much imo
11:06 -himei: ok i changed to 1-4
11:06 -himei: and the second place too
11:07 -himei: at the end
11:07 Nao Tomori: 01:26:386 (3,3,3) - so i think these ones
11:07 Nao Tomori: you can do
11:07 Nao Tomori: other ine is fine
11:08 Nao Tomori: 01:47:986 (1) - holy can u make this look better
11:08 -himei: alright
11:08 Nao Tomori: make 6 point up more or smth
11:08 -himei: what lol
11:08 Nao Tomori: it looks ugly
11:08 Nao Tomori: cuz 6 doesnt rly point into it
11:08 -himei: 6 is the copy of previous 3 the same sliders
11:08 Nao Tomori: but then it also kinda does
11:09 -himei: hmmm
11:09 Nao Tomori: thats only time it isnt 1/4 jump tho
11:09 Nao Tomori: reason for that?
11:09 -himei: alright ill do the same as the previous ones
11:09 -himei: 01:45:243 (1,2,3,4) -
11:10 Nao Tomori: makes sense
11:11 -himei: done
11:13 -himei: 04:12:115 - https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244532
11:14 Nao Tomori: 03:25:357 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) -
11:14 Nao Tomori: hi caren
11:14 Nao Tomori: xdddd
11:14 -himei: lol i didnt copy
11:14 -himei: i designed it myself
11:14 -himei: xdd
11:14 Nao Tomori: mmmhmm
11:15 -himei: i didnt even know
11:15 Nao Tomori: 03:32:729 (3) -
11:15 Nao Tomori: flow wise i think ctrl g on this one and the other one after it would work better
11:15 Nao Tomori: otherwise its kind of weird sharp angle
11:16 -himei: ctrl g?
11:16 -himei: to the left?
11:16 -himei: but the 4 is on the right
11:16 Nao Tomori: so it goes away from 4
11:16 Nao Tomori: yeah
11:16 Nao Tomori: that way the motion is more snappy
11:16 Nao Tomori: same with 7
11:17 -himei: wait but its a kinda
11:17 -himei: unintuitive jump
11:17 -himei: i mean slied always leads the flow right
11:17 -himei: especialy slider kick
11:17 Nao Tomori: hmm
11:17 -himei: cuz i used them only in that way
11:17 Nao Tomori: yeah
11:17 Nao Tomori: alright makes sense
11:17 -himei: in the entire map
11:18 -himei: 03:31:615 (6,3) - but u showed me something
11:18 Nao Tomori: 04:05:815 (1,1) -
11:18 -himei: that shud be fixed ;w;
11:18 -himei: zzzzzz
11:18 Nao Tomori: these things look so fucking ugly
11:18 Nao Tomori: holy
11:18 Nao Tomori: can u move the red point further in
11:19 -himei: http://puu.sh/tPEic/1ab79f6d6f.jpg ?
11:19 Nao Tomori: ya better
11:20 Nao Tomori: 04:12:329 (1) -
11:20 Nao Tomori: did u fix this
11:20 -himei: yes i showed above
11:20 Nao Tomori: ok
11:20 -himei: scroll up
11:21 Nao Tomori: 04:33:243 (1,1,1) - same here
11:21 Nao Tomori: remove nc imo
11:21 Nao Tomori: er
11:21 Nao Tomori: not there
11:21 Nao Tomori: 04:32:900 (1,1,1) -
11:22 Nao Tomori: 04:32:900 (1,1,1) -
11:22 -himei: yo i fixed it
11:22 -himei: as i said like 10 mins ago lol
11:22 -himei: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244631
11:22 Nao Tomori: aa
11:22 Nao Tomori: ok ok
11:22 Nao Tomori: 04:49:015 (1) -
11:22 Nao Tomori: this ain't straight
11:23 -himei: oh shit
11:23 -himei: fixed
11:23 Nao Tomori: none of them are xd
11:23 Nao Tomori: 04:54:500 (1) -
11:23 Nao Tomori: 04:53:129 (4) - is actually
11:24 Nao Tomori: 04:56:900 (2) -
11:24 -himei: done
11:24 Nao Tomori: think this can be a slider
11:24 Nao Tomori: not repeat cuz no sound
11:24 Nao Tomori: on blue tick
11:24 Nao Tomori: you could make cool effect with 3/4 slider at the end
11:24 -himei: but symmetry...
11:24 -himei: how?
11:25 Nao Tomori: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244657 just like this imo
11:25 Nao Tomori: and mute that slider end
11:25 -himei: zzz plz now
11:25 -himei: no*
11:25 Nao Tomori: better than ignoring song imo
11:25 -himei: i really like this place, its like the logical ending
11:25 Nao Tomori: repeat is dumb there -_-
11:26 -himei: hm
11:26 -himei: if i remove the sliders at all
11:26 -himei: just 3 circles
11:27 Nao Tomori: well i think the effect of 1/4 jump after aa slider on that sound is best personally
11:27 Nao Tomori: that's my style tho
11:27 Nao Tomori: just make there not a repeat slider on a blue tick where there isnt sound
11:27 -himei: 04:56:643 - theres no sounds too
11:27 -himei: the sound here is voice line
11:27 Nao Tomori: ya
11:27 -himei: which isnt that i was emphasizing
11:28 -himei: so i guess
11:28 Nao Tomori: you did that on other time too
11:28 -himei: just 3 circles then
11:28 Nao Tomori: with the "enemy"
11:28 -himei: hmm
11:28 Nao Tomori: 01:50:043 (1) -
11:28 Nao Tomori: here
11:28 -himei: but that was 1/3
11:28 -himei: yea i remember
11:28 Nao Tomori: still
11:29 Nao Tomori: it has similar purpose so it's followed same way
11:29 -himei: ok give me a sec
11:31 -himei: no fuck that voice line, it forces me to do something like https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244727
11:32 -himei: is 3 circles bad there?
11:32 -himei: just on bassess
11:32 Nao Tomori: 3 circles is fine
11:32 Nao Tomori: but i think like
11:32 Nao Tomori: idk i think slider captures that sliding sound so well xd
11:32 -himei: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244741
11:32 Nao Tomori: ya thats ok
11:32 -himei: well its the end of the map and i was kinda using some decreasing of intensity in patterns
11:32 -himei: in that ending section after jumps
11:33 -himei: so its like degradation
11:33 Nao Tomori: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7244751 i still suggest this rhythm
11:33 Nao Tomori: if u dont want it just update and ill do the thing
11:34 -himei: jump from s-end of the last slider is kinda weird cuz its the last palpable hitobject
11:34 Nao Tomori: hmm
11:34 -himei: well yea ill update now
11:34 Nao Tomori: k
11:34 -himei: it says that
11:34 -himei: it will reset the bubbled status
11:35 -himei: of mymmap
11:35 -himei: is it ok?
11:35 Nao Tomori: huhhh
11:35 Nao Tomori: hm
11:35 -himei: if i update that
11:35 Nao Tomori: wait
11:35 Nao Tomori: ..
11:35 Nao Tomori: lemme ask realy quick..
11:35 Nao Tomori: idk anything about this since
11:35 Nao Tomori: firs ticon
11:35 -himei: ok
11:35 -himei: lmao it like
11:35 -himei: the first sex, its my first map and ur fist icon
11:35 Nao Tomori: yup
11:35 -himei: and we are losing virginity
11:35 -himei: >///<
11:36 -himei: hahs has hsa
11:36 Nao Tomori: xd
#2
my first icon
odd map
love it
love it
Ashton
ok might as well cast my opinions w
[Gloom]
in modern mapping it's not good to just copy paste ctrl + h everything, symmetry should be achieved by reoccurring patterns in the map, not bilateral symmetry. Although the aesthetics in this map are OK because of the fact you focus your map pretty much purely on symmetry it gets rid of a lot of other important concepts of it: Like flow, rhythm, and spacing.
00:01:700 (3) - why such a very noticeable and large spacing gap here? There's nothing to emphasize in the music
00:04:443 (3) - same problem, it occurs again because of your copy + paste technique, if you have one problem chances are it's going to occur again a few seconds later because of the lack of effort put into it
00:05:815 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - woah! 6* and it's 5.7x spacing? You just jumped from 2.8x spacing to 5.7x spacing in a matter of seconds, also to top it off it's 1/4 seperated 1.1x apart, your making the player go right across the screen in a matter of seconds
00:22:957 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2) - these are insane, they are going right across the screen with really low SV? It's quite literally the highest spaced notes you can do, and with such a low SV it makes no sense. I like the idea of it, but it needs a really big nerf
00:31:186 (1) - vocals get no emphasize? 00:32:557 (1) - same here? Raise SV for them please
00:33:243 (1,2,3) - this honestly looks like a 1/2 pattern, not 1/4
00:35:300 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - again those weird across the whole entire screen dear lord jesus's sliders
00:57:929 (1,2) - really? This spacing is super awkward, make them larger apart and ctrl + g 00:57:929 (1) - this slider
the part whole kiai is a bunch of copy paste, barely any effort put into it all, you literally made one pattern and copy + pasted it through the hole thing changes slight things like spacing.
02:13:957 - missing an obvious beat here
i'll stop here buteven in maps that are specifically made to be symmetrical, they are well thought out and well made, well this one... I feel not so much.
such a lack of effort. sorry.
and here's CanadianBaka trying to pop a bubble, when will he grow up.
[Gloom]
in modern mapping it's not good to just copy paste ctrl + h everything, symmetry should be achieved by reoccurring patterns in the map, not bilateral symmetry. Although the aesthetics in this map are OK because of the fact you focus your map pretty much purely on symmetry it gets rid of a lot of other important concepts of it: Like flow, rhythm, and spacing.
00:01:700 (3) - why such a very noticeable and large spacing gap here? There's nothing to emphasize in the music
00:04:443 (3) - same problem, it occurs again because of your copy + paste technique, if you have one problem chances are it's going to occur again a few seconds later because of the lack of effort put into it
00:05:815 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - woah! 6* and it's 5.7x spacing? You just jumped from 2.8x spacing to 5.7x spacing in a matter of seconds, also to top it off it's 1/4 seperated 1.1x apart, your making the player go right across the screen in a matter of seconds
00:22:957 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2) - these are insane, they are going right across the screen with really low SV? It's quite literally the highest spaced notes you can do, and with such a low SV it makes no sense. I like the idea of it, but it needs a really big nerf
00:31:186 (1) - vocals get no emphasize? 00:32:557 (1) - same here? Raise SV for them please
00:33:243 (1,2,3) - this honestly looks like a 1/2 pattern, not 1/4
00:35:300 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - again those weird across the whole entire screen dear lord jesus's sliders
00:57:929 (1,2) - really? This spacing is super awkward, make them larger apart and ctrl + g 00:57:929 (1) - this slider
the part whole kiai is a bunch of copy paste, barely any effort put into it all, you literally made one pattern and copy + pasted it through the hole thing changes slight things like spacing.
02:13:957 - missing an obvious beat here
i'll stop here buteven in maps that are specifically made to be symmetrical, they are well thought out and well made, well this one... I feel not so much.
such a lack of effort. sorry.
and here's CanadianBaka trying to pop a bubble, when will he grow up.
voicing your thoughts on the map is fine. i brought up a lot of the exact same points when i checked it and the responses are in the irc mod above.
Topic Starter
Most of the issues were discussed in Nao's irc mod.CanadianBaka wrote:
ok might as well cast my opinions w
[Gloom]
in modern mapping it's not good to just copy paste ctrl + h everything, symmetry should be achieved by reoccurring patterns in the map, not bilateral symmetry. Although the aesthetics in this map are OK because of the fact you focus your map pretty much purely on symmetry it gets rid of a lot of other important concepts of it: Like flow, rhythm, and spacing.
00:01:700 (3) - why such a very noticeable and large spacing gap here? There's nothing to emphasize in the music
@ 00:01:700 (3,4,5,1,2,3) - its a copy of the same sounds. so no, thanks.
00:04:443 (3) - same problem, it occurs again because of your copy + paste technique, if you have one problem chances are it's going to occur again a few seconds later because of the lack of effort put into it
@ ^
00:05:815 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - woah! 6* and it's 5.7x spacing? You just jumped from 2.8x spacing to 5.7x spacing in a matter of seconds, also to top it off it's 1/4 seperated 1.1x apart, your making the player go right across the screen in a matter of seconds
@ ill reconsider this place on the last icon mod
00:22:957 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2) - these are insane, they are going right across the screen with really low SV? It's quite literally the highest spaced notes you can do, and with such a low SV it makes no sense. I like the idea of it, but it needs a really big nerf
@ it is well made rounded and logical pattern. no, thanks.
00:31:186 (1) - vocals get no emphasize? 00:32:557 (1) - same here? Raise SV for them please
@ all for the structure. so... no, thanks.
00:33:243 (1,2,3) - this honestly looks like a 1/2 pattern, not 1/4
@ no, thanks.
00:35:300 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - again those weird across the whole entire screen dear lord jesus's sliders
@ no, thanks.
00:57:929 (1,2) - really? This spacing is super awkward, make them larger apart and ctrl + g 00:57:929 (1) - this slider
@ no, thanks.
the part whole kiai is a bunch of copy paste, barely any effort put into it all, you literally made one pattern and copy + pasted it through the hole thing changes slight things like spacing.
02:13:957 - missing an obvious beat here
@ @ ill reconsider this place on the last icon mod
i'll stop here buteven in maps that are specifically made to be symmetrical, they are well thought out and well made, well this one... I feel not so much.
such a lack of effort. sorry.
and here's CanadianBaka trying to pop a bubble, when will he grow up.
thanks for mod! will reconsider some things on the qualification!
Ashton
:thinking:
I'll check these points too later.
Btw -himei, I think you need some better explanation on the points you deny, since it has a reason to be suggested, so you need a better reason to keep it.
I'll check these points too later.
Btw -himei, I think you need some better explanation on the points you deny, since it has a reason to be suggested, so you need a better reason to keep it.
Topic Starter
I already responded to that places in Nao's mod.Doyak wrote:
:thinking:
I'll check these points too later.
Btw -himei, I think you need some better explanation on the points you deny, since it has a reason to be suggested, so you need a better reason to keep it.
So complaining about style, which is mostly focused on structure, isnt the best idea, especially when CannadianBaka doesnt provide any suggestions.
Its a long story behind me and him, so he is doing that "mods" not to keep the map clean, but rather to harass me.
Ashton
-himei wrote:
I already responded to that places in Nao's mod.Doyak wrote:
:thinking:
I'll check these points too later.
Btw -himei, I think you need some better explanation on the points you deny, since it has a reason to be suggested, so you need a better reason to keep it.
So complaining about style, which is mostly focused on structure, isnt the best idea, especially when CannadianBaka doesnt provide any suggestions.
Its a long story behind me and him, so he is doing that "mods" not to keep the map clean, but rather to harass me.
you think I took 1 hour out of my day to harass you?
I'd like clear reasons as to why you denied my suggestions please, style is subjective but when it starts messing around with objectiveness it isn't good.
for example: "it's a copy of the same sounds, so no thanks" yes, I know that thats what i've been saying, but the spacing is bad.
I'm so offended you still wanna say stuff like: "you don't know the history between me and canadianbaka, he's doing "mods" not to keep the map clean, but rather to harass me"
like honestly, can you just stop with that?
Topic Starter
Please, read the log on the previous page. Thanks.
Ashton
-himei wrote:
Please, read the log on the previous page. Thanks.
no, give me proper reasoning. I shouldn't have to take another hour of my life to look through that log to see why you denied it.
a map is unrankable if the creator doesn't properly respond to all the mods
read this
more specifically: "omeone just posted some suggestions on your map, great! - but it doesn't end there. For the record, it's necessary to give a proper response for two major reasons. Firstly, so that future mods can be tailored more specifically to your concept or style, resulting in fewer unhelpful suggestions. Secondly, just as a mod post helps you to improve your mapping ability, providing a detailed mod response helps the modder improve their modding ability, meaning they gain experience and can provide more helpful and detailed mods in the future. You never know who you may need to ask for a mod next time around!
Treat all suggestions as valid and equally important until you have thoroughly inspected and tested them - even minor stylistic changes or alternative viewpoints can help improve the quality of a beatmap
As with making a mod post, be sure to explain yourself as much as possible. State what you changed, and if you didn’t accept the suggestion for some reason, explain why and what you did instead.
When declining a suggestion, remain calm and professional, say what needs to be said in order to explain yourself and leave it at that. No matter how impolite, confusing or unhelpful the suggestion was, getting angry and responding with hostility, sarcasm, etc. will not help the situation.
BNs and QATs will review previous mods before placing any icons and may want to initiate or revisit discussions during their checks. Any assistance you can provide as to why you did or didn’t do something takes very little effort, and could be a huge help to all parties later on."
-Code of Conduct - Mapping and Modding
CB imo ur mod is kinda against the themes the map is trying to use :/
also are u honestly trying to spice up unneeded drama, i mean like BN can do what ur doing rn (and yes its the BNs job not urs xd)
also are u honestly trying to spice up unneeded drama, i mean like BN can do what ur doing rn (and yes its the BNs job not urs xd)
Topic Starter
Its ok, Whirl.
My old friends, Stjpa and Sergio, which i was shit talking around for last 6 months are going to pop that bubble. So you dont need to stress ureself anymore
My old friends, Stjpa and Sergio, which i was shit talking around for last 6 months are going to pop that bubble. So you dont need to stress ureself anymore
Ashton
HighTec wrote:
CB imo ur mod is kinda against the themes the map is trying to use :/
also are u honestly trying to spice up unneeded drama, i mean like BN can do what ur doing rn (and yes its the BNs job not urs xd)
I love the whole idea and theme of the map, I understand the gimmick, but sometimes gimmicks can be bad ranking wise because it's not properly incorporated! that's what I was trying to explain in my mod, for example if he wanted a symettrical gimmick map then he could at least make the spacing and flow well also, but maybe focus most on that one certain thing.
Yes it is a bn job, but it's not okay for me to give opinions?
I'm not trying to stir up unneeded drama, I'll just stop posting here if you think it's come to that point
before u start insulting: this is not a biased bubble pop, a lot of people (and by that i mean A LOT) agree that this map is far away from being ready for the ranked section
[Gloom]
to summarize everything: u are ignoring the song and have wrong emphasis just for the sake of symmetry and also have a lot of patterns that look aesthetically bad because of the way u executed them
if u dont plan on remapping the whole map as u have these issues literally everywhere im going to veto the map as its not ready for ranking in the slightest imo
[Gloom]
- 00:01:014 (1) - why not silencing the sliderend when it isnt on anything audible in the music
- 00:01:700 (3,4,5,1) - having multiple different cursor velocities in one direction plays really bad and i honestly dont see a reason to do that when u start a completely new pattern with different emphasis afterwards
- 00:02:043 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - the whole pattern looks aesthetically bad as every second circle (2,4,6 and 1,3,5) are really close to each other when u have so much more space to use. other than that the player gets the feeling that u are mapping to the weird noise in the background (mainly because of the triplet) so having a jump on 4 feels really counterintuitive as the sound fades there
- 00:02:900 (6,1) - what exactly happened to the emphasis? 00:01:357 (2,3) - here you had a fairly big jump for the exact same sounds
- 00:05:815 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - first of all i really doubt that both triplets need seperate NCs because the sounds they have are pretty much the same and NC barely gives any emphasis anyway. also the jump is way too huge and even linear, making the pattern uncomfortable as hell to play. symmetrical patterns are cool but only if used correctly, which isnt the case here in my opinion
- 00:06:500 - would actually be cool if u would put some effort here instead of just copy pasting a whole section
- 00:08:900 (4,5) - exactly mapped and emphasized the same as the ones from the previous section even though they arent the same music-wise?
- 00:11:300 (3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - i cant hear any 1/4s at all here and the sound they are mapped on dont really support a stream, let alone that its starting way too late because that sound is audible way earlier already. also worth to mention is that u might wanna give 00:11:643 (7) - some kind of emphasis because the noise is so loud that u shouldnt ignore it
- 00:11:986 - what bothers me about this whole section is that u are not doing anything beside copy paste ctrl j / h, which makes it super boring to play and even to look at and not emphasizing stuff properly as there are some different sounds on certain objects that deserve to get their own emphasis, especially since they are sounds u mapped objects to earlier. additionally the nc spam is not necessary as well, only emphasizing every third pattern looks fine and not so spammy like right now
- 00:16:615 (3,1) - why are u using an antijump that destroys the whole structure? i mean, u already used jumps 00:03:757 (1,1) - here that are basically the same sounds, actually even weaker to be exact
- 00:17:128 (2,3,1) - im aware that theres a sound on that blue and red tick but honestly they are so quiet that u could just use extended slider again because it feels wrong the way its mapped atm and the transition from 2 to 3 looks really bad
- 00:19:872 (2,3,1) - they are less strong than 00:18:500 (2,3,1) - but u decided to emphasis them the same?
- 00:20:557 (2,3,1) - and then u dont have anything on the slider here which has a loud noisy sound...and generally not emphasizing anything afterwards properly in comparison to before; 00:20:900 (1,2,3,1) - sound it getting linearly louder but u still keep the same spacing
- 00:21:929 (2,3,1) - and then all of a sudden u use jumps here when u used antijumps on strong sounds here 00:16:615 (3,1) -
- 00:28:100 (2,1,2) - almost looks like 1/4 patterns because they are so close to each other + u used 1/4 gaps to that in the beginning
- 00:28:443 (1) - following ur scheme this one shouldnt be nc'd so the patterns here 00:28:786 - have their own ncs like 00:22:957 (1) . yes both sections are not the same, but it definitely feels better to seperate 00:28:443 (1) - from 00:28:786 (3) -
- 00:33:243 (1,2,3) - this pattern can be really problematic to read if u dont change 00:28:100 (2,1,2) -
- 00:34:957 (5,6) - similar issue as in the beginning, this shouldnt be less spaced than 00:36:329 (4,5) - because the second pattern is actually weakerand u dont use any kind of increasing difficulty progression in ur structure to justify it
- 00:43:529 (1,2) - is also much less aggressive than 00:38:043 (1,2) - so theres no reason to emphasize both the same and especially this much
- 00:46:272 - it would be really cool if the spinner wouldnt be longer than 1 measure because there appears a new sound and having such a long spinner is so exhausting to play
- 00:57:929 (1,2) - either im deaf or theres not even anything different in the song to use a completely different pattern
- 01:02:043 (3,1) - overlap is actually visible ingame and u need to change this pattern as u never had overlaps before, thus not fitting to ur concept of th map
- 01:02:729 (1,2,3,4) - music-wise the pattern doesnt really make sense as the quiet noisy sounds are getting loider / noisier with every 1/1 but ur spacing just ruins it
- 01:04:786 (5,6,7,8) - the whole pattern itself would be fine as it is if the music wouldnt get more intense at this exact point, so increasing the spacing by the same amount as before is counterintuitive
- 01:05:472 (1) - what is this object snapped to? it looks like u u wanted to make it go over the whole screen but a 1/4 gap is too harsh for that so u chose the 1/8 tick before so its somewhat fine lol
- 01:06:843 (1,3) - 01:07:186 (2,4) - etc. its really noticable that the circle are really close
- 01:10:957 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - also ignored the music by just using a symmetrical pattern with the same spacing when the music has a higher pitch in the first one
to summarize everything: u are ignoring the song and have wrong emphasis just for the sake of symmetry and also have a lot of patterns that look aesthetically bad because of the way u executed them
if u dont plan on remapping the whole map as u have these issues literally everywhere im going to veto the map as its not ready for ranking in the slightest imo
ya low key i agree :\ @stjpa
I was one of those not agreeing with this being ready btw, just to not make Stjpa's comment sound like a baseless comment
it seems like a pretty common sentiment, ofc. bad decision by me then.
I mean I kind of agree. Symmetry is a style that not many people can pull off properly (to make a map that is consistent and plays/flows decently). The aesthetics from what I've seen are lacking and I do agree that this map can be improved a lot.
Don't take this entire thing as a personal attack though, please. The BNs are just doing their jobs.
Don't take this entire thing as a personal attack though, please. The BNs are just doing their jobs.
Voicing agreement here, while there's nothing wrong with symmetry as a mapping tool, overusing it can lead to losing other important things like aesthetics/emphasis which was my main problem last time I checked this.
Topic Starter
well, yea. i just like saten maps and wanted to do something in that style
but what makes me sad is that, all these people who complaining now, were ignoring me since i started asking for help/advices.
and eventually all of them are posting here their thought, while they could help me to avoid considered issues awhile ago, cuz i had serious mindset about mapping and wanted to spend a lots of time in it.
thankk Doyak and Nao Tomori for helping me thru the past months.
i guess, thats it, i cant really go against like 3-4 people which are personally against me, even tho i could argue with each of the mentioned issue.
ya shiirn was right telling me that i shouldnt act like an ass and offend people randomly just because i liked that xd.
but yea, stjpa, see u on ur next qualification, will be fun XD
but what makes me sad is that, all these people who complaining now, were ignoring me since i started asking for help/advices.
and eventually all of them are posting here their thought, while they could help me to avoid considered issues awhile ago, cuz i had serious mindset about mapping and wanted to spend a lots of time in it.
thankk Doyak and Nao Tomori for helping me thru the past months.
i guess, thats it, i cant really go against like 3-4 people which are personally against me, even tho i could argue with each of the mentioned issue.
ya shiirn was right telling me that i shouldnt act like an ass and offend people randomly just because i liked that xd.
but yea, stjpa, see u on ur next qualification, will be fun XD
Do you think every person who came to this thread to comment about the lack of quality in your map has a personal vendetta against you? Please stop acting like you have a victim complex and realize that your map has large room for improvement and is not appropriate for ranking as it is now.-himei wrote:
i guess, thats it, i cant really go against like 3-4 people which are personally against me, even tho i could argue with each of the mentioned
wew-himei wrote:
ibut yea, stjpa, see u on ur next qualification, will be fun XD
Xexxar wrote:
Hope you don't get depressed, and reply to the mods properly.
Actually what I thought is that this map can't be improved much more by fixing one by one, because this map is basically already structured by the symmetries, and trying to fix them would rather be likely to ruin it.
On a side note, I think at least having a symmetry structure is better than putting notes in random places, even if the map could not follow every single sounds of the music properly.
Actually what I thought is that this map can't be improved much more by fixing one by one, because this map is basically already structured by the symmetries, and trying to fix them would rather be likely to ruin it.
On a side note, I think at least having a symmetry structure is better than putting notes in random places, even if the map could not follow every single sounds of the music properly.
This is a terrible, terrible way to address a post containing some (apparently) valid critiques, and only encourages witchhunting (and probably pointless post-qualify "mods"). I know you may be annoyed by all of this, but you should try to take a step back and avoid replying like this, because if you continue in this way you'll be likely to receive even less help by now: no one would like to have an argument with a closed-minded person who acts like this.-himei wrote:
but yea, stjpa, see u on ur next qualification, will be fun XD
just pointing out I'm not against you, but against how the map turned out to be.
You're taking this way too personally imo
Excuse me? 02:01:700 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) -
Alright, I can understand that the final result is something like this but when I take the single objects combo by combo I can't see that giant "structure" at all. How am I supposed to remember all those beats?
You're taking this way too personally imo
Doyak wrote:
On a side note, I think at least having a symmetry structure is better than putting notes in random places, even if the map could not follow every single sounds of the music properly.
Excuse me? 02:01:700 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) -
Alright, I can understand that the final result is something like this but when I take the single objects combo by combo I can't see that giant "structure" at all. How am I supposed to remember all those beats?
Cleaned up the spam and rude posts. Please behave yourself and contact me once everything calmed down.
While my fellow partner mentioned already that we do not tollerate such behaviour in our community, I would also like to add that this set is not going anywhere as long as mod posts from people are continued to be responded in this way. You must answer to peoples mod properly by providing actual reasons as in why you deny a suggestion. "no, thanks." Is not a proper answer.-himei wrote:
SPOILERMost of the issues were discussed in Nao's irc mod.CanadianBaka wrote:
ok might as well cast my opinions w
[Gloom]
in modern mapping it's not good to just copy paste ctrl + h everything, symmetry should be achieved by reoccurring patterns in the map, not bilateral symmetry. Although the aesthetics in this map are OK because of the fact you focus your map pretty much purely on symmetry it gets rid of a lot of other important concepts of it: Like flow, rhythm, and spacing.
00:01:700 (3) - why such a very noticeable and large spacing gap here? There's nothing to emphasize in the music
@ 00:01:700 (3,4,5,1,2,3) - its a copy of the same sounds. so no, thanks.
00:04:443 (3) - same problem, it occurs again because of your copy + paste technique, if you have one problem chances are it's going to occur again a few seconds later because of the lack of effort put into it
@ ^
00:05:815 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - woah! 6* and it's 5.7x spacing? You just jumped from 2.8x spacing to 5.7x spacing in a matter of seconds, also to top it off it's 1/4 seperated 1.1x apart, your making the player go right across the screen in a matter of seconds
@ ill reconsider this place on the last icon mod
00:22:957 (1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2,3,4,1,2) - these are insane, they are going right across the screen with really low SV? It's quite literally the highest spaced notes you can do, and with such a low SV it makes no sense. I like the idea of it, but it needs a really big nerf
@ it is well made rounded and logical pattern. no, thanks.
00:31:186 (1) - vocals get no emphasize? 00:32:557 (1) - same here? Raise SV for them please
@ all for the structure. so... no, thanks.
00:33:243 (1,2,3) - this honestly looks like a 1/2 pattern, not 1/4
@ no, thanks.
00:35:300 (1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3) - again those weird across the whole entire screen dear lord jesus's sliders
@ no, thanks.
00:57:929 (1,2) - really? This spacing is super awkward, make them larger apart and ctrl + g 00:57:929 (1) - this slider
@ no, thanks.
the part whole kiai is a bunch of copy paste, barely any effort put into it all, you literally made one pattern and copy + pasted it through the hole thing changes slight things like spacing.
02:13:957 - missing an obvious beat here
@ @ ill reconsider this place on the last icon mod
i'll stop here buteven in maps that are specifically made to be symmetrical, they are well thought out and well made, well this one... I feel not so much.
such a lack of effort. sorry.
and here's CanadianBaka trying to pop a bubble, when will he grow up.
thanks for mod! will reconsider some things on the qualification!
Unlocked.
Topic Starter
So, I'll be explaining things step-by-step right now, because as some people told me that theres still a hope left.
And since Stjpa cant veto this map anymore, therefore Nao Tomori cant bubble it, i'll be looking for someone else to push this forward.
Right, so lets start with this firstly:
And since Stjpa cant veto this map anymore, therefore Nao Tomori cant bubble it, i'll be looking for someone else to push this forward.
Right, so lets start with this firstly:
The mentioned issues were clearly explained in pervious mod, so as Monstrata did to me once, and got away with that, I did the same.OnosakiHito wrote:
While my fellow partner mentioned already that we do not tollerate such behaviour in our community, I would also like to add that this set is not going anywhere as long as mod posts from people are continued to be responded in this way. You must answer to peoples mod properly by providing actual reasons as in why you deny a suggestion. "no, thanks." Is not a proper answer.
Thanks for modding, applied some things.Stjpa wrote:
before u start insulting: this is not a biased bubble pop, a lot of people (and by that i mean A LOT) agree that this map is far away from being ready for the ranked section
> Not biased
I would believe to that affirmation if it would came from anyone but you.
> A LOT
Means, you, sergio and xexxar? Oh, what a concidence.
[Gloom]and honestly im gonna stop at this point because im modding for almost 90 minutes now and im only at about 20% of the map, would take me forever to point out all issues
- 00:01:014 (1) - why not silencing the sliderend when it isnt on anything audible in the music
@ okay, fixed, and the following copied places too- 00:01:700 (3,4,5,1) - having multiple different cursor velocities in one direction plays really bad and i honestly dont see a reason to do that when u start a completely new pattern with different emphasis afterwards
@ okay, changed it to more restrained pattern- 00:02:043 (1,2,3,4,5,6) - the whole pattern looks aesthetically bad as every second circle (2,4,6 and 1,3,5) are really close to each other when u have so much more space to use. other than that the player gets the feeling that u are mapping to the weird noise in the background (mainly because of the triplet) so having a jump on 4 feels really counterintuitive as the sound fades there
@ okay, changed the whole pattern, and the rest of them too- 00:02:900 (6,1) - what exactly happened to the emphasis? 00:01:357 (2,3) - here you had a fairly big jump for the exact same sounds
@ okay, changed the whole pattern, and the rest of them too- 00:05:815 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - first of all i really doubt that both triplets need seperate NCs because the sounds they have are pretty much the same and NC barely gives any emphasis anyway. also the jump is way too huge and even linear, making the pattern uncomfortable as hell to play. symmetrical patterns are cool but only if used correctly, which isnt the case here in my opinion
@ okay, changed the whole pattern- 00:06:500 - would actually be cool if u would put some effort here instead of just copy pasting a whole section
- 00:08:900 (4,5) - exactly mapped and emphasized the same as the ones from the previous section even though they arent the same music-wise?
@ i think they are the same O_O- 00:11:300 (3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - i cant hear any 1/4s at all here and the sound they are mapped on dont really support a stream, let alone that its starting way too late because that sound is audible way earlier already. also worth to mention is that u might wanna give 00:11:643 (7) - some kind of emphasis because the noise is so loud that u shouldnt ignore it
@ its a slight overmap, its like, cant even be considered as overmap. but its good for structure and plays nicely- 00:11:986 - what bothers me about this whole section is that u are not doing anything beside copy paste ctrl j / h, which makes it super boring to play and even to look at and not emphasizing stuff properly as there are some different sounds on certain objects that deserve to get their own emphasis, especially since they are sounds u mapped objects to earlier. additionally the nc spam is not necessary as well, only emphasizing every third pattern looks fine and not so spammy like right now
@ i disagree, the entire pattern looks nice and plays fuzzy, its good for the beginning of the map and shouldnt be over contructured that much, because the melody is easy and repetitive, and also i dont see anything unrankable here, actually, no one does.- 00:16:615 (3,1) - why are u using an antijump that destroys the whole structure? i mean, u already used jumps 00:03:757 (1,1) - here that are basically the same sounds, actually even weaker to be exact
@ why? because the melody getting more intensive, the patterns and the DS as well. so aslo it complements the whole structure that will be used in next sections.- 00:17:128 (2,3,1) - im aware that theres a sound on that blue and red tick but honestly they are so quiet that u could just use extended slider again because it feels wrong the way its mapped atm and the transition from 2 to 3 looks really bad
@ So its a 17 secs into 5 min song in, I pretty much can ignore some mediocre stuff cuz its only the BEGINNING of the song, and its allowed and also complements the structure.- 00:19:872 (2,3,1) - they are less strong than 00:18:500 (2,3,1) - but u decided to emphasis them the same?
@ yes- 00:20:557 (2,3,1) - and then u dont have anything on the slider here which has a loud noisy sound...and generally not emphasizing anything afterwards properly in comparison to before; 00:20:900 (1,2,3,1) - sound it getting linearly louder but u still keep the same spacing
@ its another sound line which i didnt even try to emphasize- 00:21:929 (2,3,1) - and then all of a sudden u use jumps here when u used antijumps on strong sounds here 00:16:615 (3,1) -
@ suddenly? its related to the previous "copy" with different angle, and also, since its relatively slow part and also the beginning of the song, its allowed.- 00:28:100 (2,1,2) - almost looks like 1/4 patterns because they are so close to each other + u used 1/4 gaps to that in the beginning
@ so, whats wrong with it? its simply allowed in the beggining, and also its a part of the whole section structure.- 00:28:443 (1) - following ur scheme this one shouldnt be nc'd so the patterns here 00:28:786 - have their own ncs like 00:22:957 (1) . yes both sections are not the same, but it definitely feels better to seperate 00:28:443 (1) - from 00:28:786 (3) -
@ okay, fixed- 00:33:243 (1,2,3) - this pattern can be really problematic to read if u dont change 00:28:100 (2,1,2) -
@ theres nothing wrong with it cuz its a different melody phrase and also, after like 30 testplays no one ever failed at this place.- 00:34:957 (5,6) - similar issue as in the beginning, this shouldnt be less spaced than 00:36:329 (4,5) - because the second pattern is actually weakerand u dont use any kind of increasing difficulty progression in ur structure to justify it
@ what? its is calculated to be in the middle between 00:34:615 (4,6) - them, and also same thing for 00:35:986 (3,5) -- 00:43:529 (1,2) - is also much less aggressive than 00:38:043 (1,2) - so theres no reason to emphasize both the same and especially this much
@ i honestly believe that its ok as it is, flows good, complements the structure- 00:46:272 - it would be really cool if the spinner wouldnt be longer than 1 measure because there appears a new sound and having such a long spinner is so exhausting to play
@ i understand, but you are actually wrong, that new sounds appears 00:45:243 - , which cant be emphasized in my case.- 00:57:929 (1,2) - either im deaf or theres not even anything different in the song to use a completely different pattern
@ it can be like this, 00:57:929 - and 00:58:015 - both has the sounds under them, so i dont really want to put a double there, which can confuse people.- 01:02:043 (3,1) - overlap is actually visible ingame and u need to change this pattern as u never had overlaps before, thus not fitting to ur concept of th map
@ okay, fixed- 01:02:729 (1,2,3,4) - music-wise the pattern doesnt really make sense as the quiet noisy sounds are getting loider / noisier with every 1/1 but ur spacing just ruins it
@ this pattern doesnt emphasize the increasing yet, the sound line switch you can witness in the next pattern.- 01:04:786 (5,6,7,8) - the whole pattern itself would be fine as it is if the music wouldnt get more intense at this exact point, so increasing the spacing by the same amount as before is counterintuitive
- 01:06:843 (1,3) - 01:07:186 (2,4) - etc. its really noticable that the circle are really close
@ so is there any problem with that? its not an overlap, its basically like.. just nothing wrong with that. you are not telling me whats wrong so i wont change it.- 01:10:957 (1,2,3,1,2,3) - also ignored the music by just using a symmetrical pattern with the same spacing when the music has a higher pitch in the first one
@ its not ignored, 01:10:957 (1,2) - has bigger distance than 01:11:129 (2,3) -
@ well, if you would really want to clean this map, you could do that 6 months ago, or just pm me in any time u wanted to. but you are not doing that even now.
to summarize everything: u are ignoring the song and have wrong emphasis just for the sake of symmetry and also have a lot of patterns that look aesthetically bad because of the way u executed them
@ well yes, some parts arent emphasized that well, but my initial goal was to make a clean map. so theres nothing with my approach to focus more on the structure rather than the emphasis. this map is different.
if u dont plan on remapping the whole map as u have these issues literally everywhere im going to veto the map as its not ready for ranking in the slightest imo
@ well, you cant veto this map anymore unless i ask Nao Tomori to bubble it again, what im not planning to do.
Topic Starter
Ok so, that part is the main "theme" of this soundtrack, which emphasizes the fight with the beast, which explaains why is that part felt that random, but the fights are always random, right? so yea, basically i tried to mix the structure and randomness there.MrSergio wrote:
just pointing out I'm not against you, but against how the map turned out to be.
You're taking this way too personally imoDoyak wrote:
On a side note, I think at least having a symmetry structure is better than putting notes in random places, even if the map could not follow every single sounds of the music properly.
Excuse me? 02:01:700 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) -
Alright, I can understand that the final result is something like this but when I take the single objects combo by combo I can't see that giant "structure" at all. How am I supposed to remember all those beats?
Topic Starter
well, its a reaction to his actions from the past. all this situation is expected by me and i knew what will happen when i got 2nd bubble.-kevincela- wrote:
This is a terrible, terrible way to address a post containing some (apparently) valid critiques, and only encourages witchhunting (and probably pointless post-qualify "mods"). I know you may be annoyed by all of this, but you should try to take a step back and avoid replying like this, because if you continue in this way you'll be likely to receive even less help by now: no one would like to have an argument with a closed-minded person who acts like this.-himei wrote:
but yea, stjpa, see u on ur next qualification, will be fun XD
you can veto only one bubble.
@-Himei there are multiple ways to keep the symmetry and fit the song properly as I explained you before :l, I can do a rhythm mod if you want, but only if you are willing to apply stuff.
Send me a forum pm if you are interested!
@-Himei there are multiple ways to keep the symmetry and fit the song properly as I explained you before :l, I can do a rhythm mod if you want, but only if you are willing to apply stuff.
Send me a forum pm if you are interested!
Topic Starter
my boy natsuNatsu wrote:
you can veto only one bubble.
@-Himei there are multiple ways to keep the symmetry and fit the song properly as I explained you before :l, I can do a rhythm mod if you want, but only if you are willing to apply stuff.
Send me a forum pm if you are interested!
sure thing <3
Topic Starter
MrSergio's irc mod
he might do another mod tho2017-02-06 18:39 -himei: cant we better talk here to understand each other
2017-02-06 18:39 -himei: if you basically dont like that concept i can go with that
2017-02-06 18:39 -himei: but if you ratheer want yo make that map better, i would rather talk here
2017-02-06 18:39 MrSergio: style and concept are fine, execution is not as I would expect for a ranked map
2017-02-06 18:40 MrSergio: give me some time to finish an irc mod with someone and I can give you pointers on that
2017-02-06 18:40 -himei: i applied like 30% of stjpa mod, but the rest is like "why didnt u map that sound, why is spacing here is THAT, etc" so his mod is more lika, his disagreement with my way of thinking
2017-02-06 18:41 -himei: its like a blaket fixing, and i honestly got dissapointed by him
2017-02-06 19:08 -himei: bump
2017-02-06 19:08 MrSergio: ik
2017-02-06 19:08 MrSergio: idk if tomori has anything to say
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: tomori wont bubble it again so like
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: that's why I don't want to do irc mods
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: does it matter
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: he is not involved anymore
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: no, he is the one modding my diff right now, that's what I meant lol
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: pj
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: the irc mod was with him
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: oh
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: on my GD
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: okay tell me then when u will get free xd
2017-02-06 19:12 MrSergio: well, it seems like he's not even replying to my HL, lmao
2017-02-06 19:12 MrSergio: whatever then
2017-02-06 19:12 -himei: hes afk
2017-02-06 19:12 MrSergio: =w=
2017-02-06 19:13 MrSergio: ok then, let's take 00:54:500 - as a reference point
2017-02-06 19:14 -himei: yea
2017-02-06 19:14 MrSergio: what I noticed is that the spacing "before" that point and the spacing "after" that point are way too similar, although the first minute is like an intro
2017-02-06 19:14 MrSergio: I felt like that intro needed less spacing since the song is less intense
2017-02-06 19:14 -himei: i agree
2017-02-06 19:14 MrSergio: take 01:07:529 (3,4,5,6) - and take 00:04:786 (1,2) -
2017-02-06 19:14 -himei: i used some elements from pervious part in the second part
2017-02-06 19:15 although not really the **same**, they are really similar
2017-02-06 19:15 MrSergio: and I;m referring to spacing mostly
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: wait but
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: the specing is like 1.7
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: in comparison
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: isnt it?
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: and also its a different movement
2017-02-06 19:16 -himei: different musclues involved and it feels different
2017-02-06 19:16 -himei: while u playing it
2017-02-06 19:16 MrSergio: umh.. i didn' check the values lol
2017-02-06 19:16 MrSergio: I just looked at t he playfield and I had that impression
2017-02-06 19:16 -himei: [http://puu.sh/tR9Zu/cd5d7c8035.jpg first] vs [http://puu.sh/tRa0p/205fcfa226.jpg second]
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: on the same note as before: 01:39:757 - this part has a too big SV imo
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: well theres like 1.5x or something
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: umh...
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: idk, even in gameplay it felt smilar...
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: wait but the rhythm changes
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: sergio i changed the patterns today btw
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: after stjpa mod
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: o.O
2017-02-06 19:18 MrSergio: ah, fuck
2017-02-06 19:18 MrSergio: ok, updated
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: so regarding this part
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: 01:40:037 -
2017-02-06 19:19 MrSergio: yeah, the pattern is better now although aesthetics are stil not so good
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: wait, what do you mean by aesthetics there? all the notes are stacked under each other
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: in the whole first section
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: till the rounded section
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: angles are fine cuz its mostly 40~60*
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: as pishi recomended for good flow
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: so i mainly was directed by him and sonnyc
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: and doyak while making this
2017-02-06 19:21 -himei: 01:40:037 - this part has different rhythm
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: 00:08:386 (6,1,2,3,4) - 00:02:900 (6,1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: and the part about SVs
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: it's due to the contrast with 00:28:786 (1,2,3) - stuff like this
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: which has a shorter SV even if it's more intense, relatively
2017-02-06 19:22 MrSergio: what you did in this map was merging like.. 3 different styles
2017-02-06 19:22 -himei: hmm
2017-02-06 19:22 -himei: well its kinda a gimmick thing
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: i tried to make a completed pattern that plays good
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: and also complements the symmetry
2017-02-06 19:23 MrSergio: 00:01:014 - symmetry stuff; 00:28:786 - gangsta-like style (like how Blue Dragon maps); 01:39:757 - and this feels like the usual animu style, with those curved sliders
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: and the sound
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: lol there will be even more
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: like grumd style in the seond part
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: in the technical part*
2017-02-06 19:24 MrSergio: well, it's like the whole map doesn't respect the same set of rules I guess
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: yea i agree
2017-02-06 19:24 MrSergio: also, stuff like 02:01:700 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - feels random no matter what
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: but like, i mainly followed the melody
2017-02-06 19:24 MrSergio: and not because it IS, but because the player can't keep track of all those beats
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: did u read my comment on this?
2017-02-06 19:25 MrSergio: ah, nope
2017-02-06 19:25 -himei: p/5801477+
2017-02-06 19:25 -himei: p/5801477
2017-02-06 19:25 MrSergio: umh, I see
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: well honestly
2017-02-06 19:26 MrSergio: but I believe that with so few beats you can't really make that idea come across
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: i have no idea how to map that section with local symmetry
2017-02-06 19:26 MrSergio: and random tings are random anyway xD
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: like there no way of emphasizing 16 pairs of sound with different volume
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: in the way of symmetry cuz
2017-02-06 19:26 MrSergio: well, that's what the mapper should study and try to emphasize tho
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: they cant be divided on 2 or 4
2017-02-06 19:27 MrSergio: as a modder I have to base my reasonings on what I see
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: or 8
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: as u can hear
2017-02-06 19:27 MrSergio: then, let's take just 02:01:015 (7,1,2) -
2017-02-06 19:27 MrSergio: do you know what happens to emphasis there?
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: no
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: idk
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: it getting fucked?
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: i guess
2017-02-06 19:28 MrSergio: the angle on 1 is too wide considered how much emphasis that note has in the song
2017-02-06 19:28 MrSergio: so emphasis on it is weak
2017-02-06 19:28 MrSergio: try a ctrl g on 1,2
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: okay
2017-02-06 19:29 MrSergio: although spacing is still short and the difference is tiny
2017-02-06 19:29 -himei: between what?
2017-02-06 19:29 MrSergio: 02:01:015 (7,1) -
2017-02-06 19:29 MrSergio: before and after
2017-02-06 19:30 -himei: yea i see but like
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: the difference is tiny, so even with a ctrl G the difference is not so noticeable probably
2017-02-06 19:30 -himei: its acceptable isnt it
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: objectively, yes
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: but we don't have a bot ranking stuff
2017-02-06 19:30 -himei:
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: well, there's a reason why we have people checking maps and not programs
2017-02-06 19:31 MrSergio: 02:15:415 (1,2,3) - stuff like this has poor emphasis again, due to the wide angle on 2
2017-02-06 19:31 MrSergio: a stack betweren 2,3 or a sharp angle would have worked better
2017-02-06 19:32 -himei: yes i had to keep that little square
2017-02-06 19:32 -himei: cuz of the previous section
2017-02-06 19:32 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:32 MrSergio: 02:19:529 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - this part is like... the best pattern using symmetry you made so far probably
2017-02-06 19:32 MrSergio: that's really good
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: wait
2017-02-06 19:33 MrSergio: you see... you focused to much on keeping that boxy-oldish feel and you ignored other aspects of the map, like emphasis or aesthetics in some parts
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: 02:15:415 (1,2,3) -
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: if i like move the doubles to the center?
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: in this section
2017-02-06 19:33 MrSergio: http://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7253824 >
2017-02-06 19:33 MrSergio: ?
2017-02-06 19:34 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: the problem is with all the other patterns then
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: they should be similar
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: 02:16:443 (2,3) -
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: btw, that ^ and 02:16:443 (2,3) - are inconsistent too, aestheticcs-wise
2017-02-06 19:35 -himei: u are messed up with links
2017-02-06 19:35 MrSergio: fuck
2017-02-06 19:35 MrSergio: 02:17:815 (2,3) - this is the second one
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: hmmm
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: i think like
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: the melody is kinda calm and consistent there
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: and there shouldnt be much of the sharpy angles
2017-02-06 19:37 MrSergio: in the song, it is
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: i can see the flaws as u mentioned
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: but its kinda... hm well when i was mapping this
2017-02-06 19:37 MrSergio: yeah, but small details do a lot xD
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: i thought about it too
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: and theres no way of emphasizing that shit without breaking some of the rules i set before
2017-02-06 19:38 -himei: thats what getting on my nerves in that place
2017-02-06 19:38 MrSergio: well, that's where planning (aka structure) comes in play
2017-02-06 19:38 -himei: i can show that
2017-02-06 19:38 MrSergio: you should have planned ahead that sort of stuff and re-organize the whole style basing it on that
2017-02-06 19:39 -himei: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7253888 well i fked up with sliders but
2017-02-06 19:39 MrSergio: when I start a map I know what sort of shit will be coming in a minute of song or so, that's why I plan ahead that stuff and change my intro in a way that fits with the later parts
2017-02-06 19:39 -himei: as u can see im trying to keep that square styled stuff
2017-02-06 19:39 MrSergio: yeah, but using always the same spots to place objects means a lot less possibilities for your patterns
2017-02-06 19:39 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: and that's probably the reason
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: but its probably the issue of the current section of the song and the concept
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: of pervious parts
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: isnt it?
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: so i kinda trapped myself
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: 02:42:843 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - was this here before?
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: yes, you did
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: yes it was
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: that's why I always tell people to plan ahead stuff :/
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: uhhh, I missed that then
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: that's cool
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: and that's how you use symmetry but without trapping yourself
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: well, it's just triangles there I gues
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: but the visual impact is still the one of something symmetric
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: another small detail you should consider: take 02:44:900 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:42 -himei: yea
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: and compare it with 02:44:215 (1,1) - and with 02:45:586 (1,2,3,4) - , in the music
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: and see which is the most intense
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: (ignore your current patterns, just listen to the song)
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: the vertical jumps are less intense
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: the key point is on 02:45:586 -
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: but i mapped them in response to previous section
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: with similar sliders
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: in that point a lot of instruments burst out and the song's intensity increases
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: yes, but they should still respect the current song's intensity imo
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: its another trap dude
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: lol
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: well when i was finishing this map
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: i was always thinking about how to not fuck up something i already designed
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: because it shud be similar
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: so that why the second part of this map is kinda
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: hmm
2017-02-06 19:44 MrSergio: there shouldn't be a worry tho :/
2017-02-06 19:44 MrSergio: I mean, if you plan ahead the stuff you just start mapping and care only about of couple of patterns at a time
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: feels like a cage
2017-02-06 19:45 -himei: how do u plan tho?
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: it is fine to struggle with making 2-3 patterns match together
2017-02-06 19:45 -himei: theres like a music patterns and osu patterns
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: I listen to teh song and I throw ideas into a notepad
2017-02-06 19:45 -himei: and u glue them to each other
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: I also get a feeling of what spacing average I need for different parts
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: if you set down bookmarks to distinguish the different sections it will be ewasier
2017-02-06 19:46 MrSergio: you can use whatever comes handy for you to plan better, idk
2017-02-06 19:46 -himei: i know, but its not the case here, cuz everything should be mirrored
2017-02-06 19:46 -himei: so its like
2017-02-06 19:46 -himei: x^2 in terms of difficulty of mapping
2017-02-06 19:46 MrSergio: you can even draw patterns on a piece of paper or make a mock diff where you throw pattern ieas
2017-02-06 19:46 MrSergio: patterns in it*
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: for example: you start planing the patterns on the first section, they are cool
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: you do the same for the second section and they somehow match, so they are fine
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: once you do the third section something strange occurs
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: you need to change something, maybe
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: in that case you need to take that strange part and try to put it also in the other two
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: well i guess its not about current project
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: because i had different intentions back then
2017-02-06 19:48 MrSergio: now... this is really vague, but I can't explain it in specific since every person will come up with different solutions on different songs
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: and i wanted to make this map clean
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: like, proper angles, nice rhythm, no overlaps or something that can be read bad
2017-02-06 19:49 MrSergio: overlaps can be clean tho
2017-02-06 19:49 MrSergio: I ranked a mapset with them just recently
2017-02-06 19:49 -himei: so yea i decreased the ds there in that jumps
2017-02-06 19:49 MrSergio: having something clean is not a matter of "what" you use, but a matter of "how " you use them
2017-02-06 19:49 -himei: oh wait
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: yes i know but
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: yea btw
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: so even overlaps can be clean if used in a certain way
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: 02:43:872 (7,3) -
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: (it was just a side note)
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: they are mirrored copies
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: i cant move that shit
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: I don't want that to be moved at all o.o
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei:
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: that's good as it is
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: wait but
2017-02-06 19:51 -himei: 02:46:100 (3,4) - shud i increase this?
2017-02-06 19:51 -himei: then
2017-02-06 19:51 MrSergio: http://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7253995
2017-02-06 19:51 MrSergio: if you do that the next jumps will feel "bigger than they were before" so it is fine
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: it's a matter of "building mental responses": if you want to emphasize a particular jump you need to place less spacing on the jump before the jump
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: if you want a section to feel more intense you have to make the previous section feel less intense in comparison
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: and so on
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: wait but
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: it's a matter of "contrast"
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: lol i cant afford that
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: because like
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: its a unique section with long jumps
2017-02-06 19:53 MrSergio: it's a matter of how our brains perceive that, and contrast is the most powerful weapon to achieve that
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: and then its another section with BOOM intro
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: there couldnt be any contrast in DS unless i change the
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: direction...
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: oh shit
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: yea ill do that
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: i didnt think about it
2017-02-06 19:54 MrSergio: what I did in that screen was: I hear a "boom" at 02:45:586 - and I want to emphasize that, but how do I do that? The spacing is what it is, so I can't increase it infinitily. That's why I used less spacing for 02:44:900 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:54 MrSergio: so when the BOOM comes it will have more effect due to the contrast with the small spacing for 02:44:900 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: let me make an abstract example
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: stop dude calm down
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: i undestand
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: can you understand what "cold" means" if you don't know what "hot" means? xD
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: ah, rip
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: so 02:46:100 (3,4) - this and 01:06:157 (1,2,3,4) - shud be similar
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: anyway, that's how it works for song expression
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: and also 04:12:672 (1,2,3,4) - this
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: so i cant
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: afford to change it
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: and this is part of that planning I mentioned earlier
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: since they are all the same you already know what to do
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: you just need one pattern and you mapped 3 parts
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: handy, isn't it?
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: and it just needed some more thought of how the song played around those parts
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: ok so 02:45:586 - what do i do here
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: i cant make the ds smaller in prev jumps
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: umh...
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: take the white ticks
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: 02:45:929 - 02:46:272 - 02:46:615 -
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: now... which is/are the most important for you?
2017-02-06 19:57 -himei: 02:45:929 - this one obviouslyu
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: I see
2017-02-06 19:58 MrSergio: well, I would have personally thought that 02:46:272 - 02:46:615 - where more important since 02:46:100 (3,5) - these guys sort of "accelerate" the rhythm
2017-02-06 19:58 MrSergio: but that's due of how the pattern works
2017-02-06 19:58 MrSergio: if you want to emphasize 02:45:929 - you then need to make 02:46:100 (3,4,5,6) - less important
2017-02-06 19:58 -himei: alright
2017-02-06 19:58 -himei: will do
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: oh shit
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: sliders are stacked
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: aAAAAAAAAAA
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: with another sliders
2017-02-06 19:59 MrSergio: how you do it is personal preference tho, so I can't really help after that
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: 02:46:100 (3) - press ctrl+h, j
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: and see
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: damn
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: 02:45:243 (3,4) - and this also
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: wait... is that... important? .-.
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: those references aren't visible in gameplay imo
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: you meant [http://mrsergio.s-ul.eu/0UhfKw4F.png this], right?
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: the ctrl h,j
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: ok tell me is that important to change that place?
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 20:01 MrSergio: come on, how can you imagine that in gameplay? xD
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: 02:46:100 (3,1) -
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: this
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: 02:46:443 (5,8) -
2017-02-06 20:01 MrSergio: himei, you should tell me that: what do you think is more important?
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: oh dude
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: ok i understand
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: emphasis > strcture
2017-02-06 20:02 -himei: ?
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: I understand you wanted that symmetry-like feeling, but trust me that the screen I gave you above is something no one will think about
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: nope, they are equal
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: you should use emphasis to build structure
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: so you first decide which jumps should be important, then based on that you build the pattern
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: deciding which jumps are miportant is the same as deciding which notes in the song are important
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: see how everything connects?
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: so you decide on rhythm > emphasis > Structure > aesthetics
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: for now im trapped in my math-wise map
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: in that order
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: where everything is connected
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: somehow
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: well, why not breaking that then?
2017-02-06 20:04 -himei: well cuz its kinda perfect
2017-02-06 20:04 -himei: lol
2017-02-06 20:04 MrSergio: no one is forcing you to to begin with
2017-02-06 20:04 MrSergio: if some patterns don't come out because of that I don't think you should keep it as a concept
2017-02-06 20:04 MrSergio: for example, now that I know your reasoning I understand how the intro was made and it makes sense
2017-02-06 20:05 MrSergio: the problem is that you then ignored a bit how the player will play that and how it will feel (which is part of structure and aeshtetics)
2017-02-06 20:05 MrSergio: later on in the map you also start having problems on rhythm and emphasis, always because of that math-like sty;e
2017-02-06 20:05 MrSergio: so as you can see... it doesn't work so great :/
2017-02-06 20:06 MrSergio: I mean... you "could" make it work
2017-02-06 20:06 MrSergio: but you need to test a lot of different patterns/flows and see how they are altogether
2017-02-06 20:06 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:06 MrSergio: (which is what I do on every map because I want to make it differently than the map I did previously)
2017-02-06 20:07 -himei: most of people are happy with the first part, but technical part is kinda hard
2017-02-06 20:07 MrSergio: actually, the fact you had a concept for the whole map is a really positive thing
2017-02-06 20:07 -himei: so now i see why
2017-02-06 20:07 MrSergio: actually, please keep mapping and try to refine that, because nowadays we have too few mappers that do that
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: no more symmetry maps dude
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:08 MrSergio: I honestly believe that if you tried to map this song with a different sort of concept (or maybe the same, but with better analysis of the song) it will come out way better
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: i got more crazy ideas in my new map but its not symmetrical
2017-02-06 20:08 MrSergio: and I mean, a lot better
2017-02-06 20:08 MrSergio: then who cares about symmetry xD
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: i guess its my type of personality, too pendantic and things
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: at*
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: so ok i can tell u that i cant really change that place 02:46:015 -
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: honestly it would ruin all shit
2017-02-06 20:09 MrSergio: yeah, it probably would
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: every note has 3 stacks at least
2017-02-06 20:10 -himei: even 4 in future
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: but those stacks are sort of indeirect anyway
2017-02-06 20:10 -himei: yea
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: I'd honestly wouldn't think to imagine flipping so much a single object to find a stack in gameplat
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: y
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: holy typos
2017-02-06 20:10 -himei: so lets move on
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: as I said, having a concept is perfect, but see how that turns out for the player: can he notice it?
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: no but pishi said like
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: if I don't notice it it would feel random, right?
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: map is firstly judged in editor
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: so it shud be perfect
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: and also sonny and doyak kinda
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: had influence on me with that
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: ok... but... I wouldn't think of flipping those objects no matter what xD
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: logic stuff
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: logic stuff is what I like too, trust me
2017-02-06 20:12 MrSergio: but it needs to be more direct
2017-02-06 20:12 -himei: now i can see that after all i got missleaded from the first mod i got
2017-02-06 20:12 -himei: that happened 6 months ago
2017-02-06 20:12 -himei: but well i cant really change my vision of mapping now
2017-02-06 20:12 MrSergio: you don't need to
2017-02-06 20:12 MrSergio: but you need to refine it tho
2017-02-06 20:13 -himei: yea i progressed somehow
2017-02-06 20:13 MrSergio: and it all comes down to whether something is easy to understand and makes sense or not
2017-02-06 20:13 MrSergio: so for starters, don't use all those flippings as reasons, because they are not visible xD
2017-02-06 20:13 MrSergio: I wonder how many would think of flipping stuff
2017-02-06 20:13 -himei: i just dont want to change this map anymore cuz i spent too much on it and its kinda perfect editor-wise
2017-02-06 20:13 -himei: xd
2017-02-06 20:14 MrSergio: and if they do flip it, in actual gameplay they are not that flipped so it doesn't have much to do with the current pattern, isn't it?
2017-02-06 20:14 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 20:14 MrSergio: well.. the editor is not the only thing that matters x)
2017-02-06 20:15 -himei: is it all the places u wanted to pinpoint out?
2017-02-06 20:15 -himei: i guess theres more
2017-02-06 20:15 MrSergio: if you can make those sort of links between objects without the need to move them too much (like flipping) you'd be able to make much more interesting maps
2017-02-06 20:15 MrSergio: since the player, and the modder, would be able to see your intentions right away
2017-02-06 20:15 -himei: yea trust me i wont try this style anymore
2017-02-06 20:15 MrSergio: yesh, there probably is
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: overlaps
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: oh nvm
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: i had one in the entire map
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: but i fixed that today
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: he had the proper step by X
2017-02-06 20:16 MrSergio: for example, some minor stuff: 03:01:528 (7,8,9) - how you suddenly break that continuous horizontal movement feels a bit too forced (03:01:015 (2,3,4,5,6,7) - horixontal movements)
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: try stacking 8 on top of 9
2017-02-06 20:17 -himei: yea good idea
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: I originally had planned to mod this myself when popping the bubble, but Stjpa did it before me so rip
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: idk what he mentioned in it tho
2017-02-06 20:17 -himei: 00:11:300 (3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - well i think
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: or how
2017-02-06 20:17 -himei: it started from this place
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: so let me explain
2017-02-06 20:18 MrSergio: ah, that
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: oh shit its fucked now, i got to recalculate this
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: so bacially i had the (3) circle
2017-02-06 20:18 MrSergio: I hear more the distorted sound there, and not the stream
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: and the slider 00:11:986 (1) -
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: and i had to put there like
2017-02-06 20:18 MrSergio: a strange, long slider would have been cooler imo
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: 00:11:386 (4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - this sound with proper step by x y
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: and i didnt know how to do that
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: so i started fucking with calculator and eventually figured out how to calculate each of the circle
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: so it was the inicial point
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: of this map
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: of concept of it*
2017-02-06 20:19 MrSergio: [https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7254256 dumb stuff]
2017-02-06 20:20 MrSergio: holy
2017-02-06 20:20 MrSergio: you went too far with calculations, trust me xD
2017-02-06 20:20 MrSergio: small pixels won't make a big difference in actual gameplay
2017-02-06 20:20 -himei: yea but how to make a linear stream
2017-02-06 20:20 -himei: with the first and the last point
2017-02-06 20:20 -himei: but u dont know the "step"
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: ah, right
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: u got to divide the coordinates by 2
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: you were forcing yourself within those coordinates
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: and then u divide them again
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: and you see... you shouldn't :/
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: till u find the proper positions
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: it lets you less space for creativity
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: I mean, were those 2 coordinates the only available solutions?
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: hmm well
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: it could have been a lot of different things imo
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: i had the rounded pattern
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: like the stupid slider I did above, for example
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: and also had the position of 00:11:300 (3) - which was stacked with 00:08:386 (6) - this a believe
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: (it follows pretty well the distorted sound tho)
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: heh...
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: how many would notice that in your opinion? xD
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: nobody
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: i mapped it for myslef to like
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: heh...
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: be confident that its good
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: well back then i was affected by
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: ocd
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: if u know what it is
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: so yea
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: the thing is: if 2 objects are too far apart they won't be linked together anymore
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: by anything
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: and by far apart I mean on the timeline
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: well i wanted to make a stream so
2017-02-06 20:24 MrSergio: AR plays a role in here, since based on that you'll have more stuff on the screen or not
2017-02-06 20:24 MrSergio: but that's minor, who cares about it now
2017-02-06 20:24 MrSergio: 00:11:300 - is 3 seconds apart from 00:08:386 -
2017-02-06 20:24 -himei: i got to remap that stream, its out of place now
2017-02-06 20:24 -himei: holy s
2017-02-06 20:25 MrSergio: if I measure it with "beats", it is 9 beats and a half apart
2017-02-06 20:25 MrSergio: beat + from one white tick to the next
2017-02-06 20:25 = *
2017-02-06 20:25 MrSergio: if something is already 2 beats apart from something else it won't be linked to it imo
2017-02-06 20:25 -himei: i mean dude i understand that its kinda a psycho disease when u realized how much of effort i brought in this map
2017-02-06 20:25 -himei: but well
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: its kinda w/e for me now xd
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: wait
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: wait
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: which place u are talking about
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: that stream?
2017-02-06 20:26 MrSergio: umh...
2017-02-06 20:26 MrSergio: 00:11:300 -
2017-02-06 20:26 MrSergio: yeah, the stream
2017-02-06 20:27 -himei: so ure saying that 00:11:300 (3,1) - can not be connected?
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: you said that the stream and 00:08:386 (6) - were linked
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: nonono
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: http://mrsergio.s-ul.eu/jEw8OPiV.png
2017-02-06 20:27 -himei: dude
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: so I was trying to understand that xD
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: 00:10:272 (6) - this sound was flipped by x on 00:11:300 (3) - this
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: C O N N E C T I O N
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: oh
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: too vague lol
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: I can't see the connection at all xD
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei:
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: im probably mad
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: and you probably miclicked too on that link lol
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: since you linked another object
2017-02-06 20:29 MrSergio: and yeah, I would probably not link them anyway, since they are already quite far apart
2017-02-06 20:29 MrSergio: 3 beats
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:30 MrSergio: anyway, I'd like to keep discussing this, but I gotta go have dinner for now. The main things I wanted to say are already said anyway
2017-02-06 20:30 MrSergio: the rest would just be normal modding that it doesn't depend on the pop
2017-02-06 20:30 MrSergio: well, it might, but it wouldn't be necessary
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: are u going to mod this?
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: ill fix something now
2017-02-06 20:31 MrSergio: I can try, but if your reasons are mainly stacks or connections between objects being 3 beats apart, I can't probably help xD
2017-02-06 20:31 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:31 -himei: i ll drop that approach from now
2017-02-06 20:31 MrSergio: moreover, to fix the structure/aeshtetics/expression stuff I mentioned at the beginning you'd need to remap some huge parts of it
2017-02-06 20:31 -himei: but i also want to keep the concept
2017-02-06 20:31 MrSergio: I can point out some stuff, but I can't point it out all
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: got it
2017-02-06 20:32 MrSergio: so I believe my mod won't be able to bring the map on quality standards
2017-02-06 20:32 MrSergio: I'm not superman anyway
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: well if u bring something up ill also apply this for similar places
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: CUZ ITS A COPY ANYWAYS :d::d:d
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: ah ah ha ha
2017-02-06 20:32 MrSergio: xD
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: anyway, I'll be going for now
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: if you have questions send me a pm
2017-02-06 20:33 -himei: ok
2017-02-06 20:33 -himei: and thanks
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: I hope I explained a bit better the reasons behind the pop
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: at lesat imo
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: dunno what Stjpa had to say on this
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: I should check his mod too I guess
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: anyway... later~
2017-02-06 18:39 -himei: if you basically dont like that concept i can go with that
2017-02-06 18:39 -himei: but if you ratheer want yo make that map better, i would rather talk here
2017-02-06 18:39 MrSergio: style and concept are fine, execution is not as I would expect for a ranked map
2017-02-06 18:40 MrSergio: give me some time to finish an irc mod with someone and I can give you pointers on that
2017-02-06 18:40 -himei: i applied like 30% of stjpa mod, but the rest is like "why didnt u map that sound, why is spacing here is THAT, etc" so his mod is more lika, his disagreement with my way of thinking
2017-02-06 18:41 -himei: its like a blaket fixing, and i honestly got dissapointed by him
2017-02-06 19:08 -himei: bump
2017-02-06 19:08 MrSergio: ik
2017-02-06 19:08 MrSergio: idk if tomori has anything to say
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: tomori wont bubble it again so like
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: that's why I don't want to do irc mods
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: does it matter
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: he is not involved anymore
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: no, he is the one modding my diff right now, that's what I meant lol
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: pj
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: the irc mod was with him
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: oh
2017-02-06 19:09 MrSergio: on my GD
2017-02-06 19:09 -himei: okay tell me then when u will get free xd
2017-02-06 19:12 MrSergio: well, it seems like he's not even replying to my HL, lmao
2017-02-06 19:12 MrSergio: whatever then
2017-02-06 19:12 -himei: hes afk
2017-02-06 19:12 MrSergio: =w=
2017-02-06 19:13 MrSergio: ok then, let's take 00:54:500 - as a reference point
2017-02-06 19:14 -himei: yea
2017-02-06 19:14 MrSergio: what I noticed is that the spacing "before" that point and the spacing "after" that point are way too similar, although the first minute is like an intro
2017-02-06 19:14 MrSergio: I felt like that intro needed less spacing since the song is less intense
2017-02-06 19:14 -himei: i agree
2017-02-06 19:14 MrSergio: take 01:07:529 (3,4,5,6) - and take 00:04:786 (1,2) -
2017-02-06 19:14 -himei: i used some elements from pervious part in the second part
2017-02-06 19:15 although not really the **same**, they are really similar
2017-02-06 19:15 MrSergio: and I;m referring to spacing mostly
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: wait but
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: the specing is like 1.7
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: in comparison
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: isnt it?
2017-02-06 19:15 -himei: and also its a different movement
2017-02-06 19:16 -himei: different musclues involved and it feels different
2017-02-06 19:16 -himei: while u playing it
2017-02-06 19:16 MrSergio: umh.. i didn' check the values lol
2017-02-06 19:16 MrSergio: I just looked at t he playfield and I had that impression
2017-02-06 19:16 -himei: [http://puu.sh/tR9Zu/cd5d7c8035.jpg first] vs [http://puu.sh/tRa0p/205fcfa226.jpg second]
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: on the same note as before: 01:39:757 - this part has a too big SV imo
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: well theres like 1.5x or something
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: umh...
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: idk, even in gameplay it felt smilar...
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: wait but the rhythm changes
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: sergio i changed the patterns today btw
2017-02-06 19:17 -himei: after stjpa mod
2017-02-06 19:17 MrSergio: o.O
2017-02-06 19:18 MrSergio: ah, fuck
2017-02-06 19:18 MrSergio: ok, updated
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: so regarding this part
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: 01:40:037 -
2017-02-06 19:19 MrSergio: yeah, the pattern is better now although aesthetics are stil not so good
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: wait, what do you mean by aesthetics there? all the notes are stacked under each other
2017-02-06 19:19 -himei: in the whole first section
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: till the rounded section
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: angles are fine cuz its mostly 40~60*
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: as pishi recomended for good flow
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: so i mainly was directed by him and sonnyc
2017-02-06 19:20 -himei: and doyak while making this
2017-02-06 19:21 -himei: 01:40:037 - this part has different rhythm
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: 00:08:386 (6,1,2,3,4) - 00:02:900 (6,1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: and the part about SVs
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: it's due to the contrast with 00:28:786 (1,2,3) - stuff like this
2017-02-06 19:21 MrSergio: which has a shorter SV even if it's more intense, relatively
2017-02-06 19:22 MrSergio: what you did in this map was merging like.. 3 different styles
2017-02-06 19:22 -himei: hmm
2017-02-06 19:22 -himei: well its kinda a gimmick thing
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: i tried to make a completed pattern that plays good
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: and also complements the symmetry
2017-02-06 19:23 MrSergio: 00:01:014 - symmetry stuff; 00:28:786 - gangsta-like style (like how Blue Dragon maps); 01:39:757 - and this feels like the usual animu style, with those curved sliders
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: and the sound
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: lol there will be even more
2017-02-06 19:23 -himei: like grumd style in the seond part
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: in the technical part*
2017-02-06 19:24 MrSergio: well, it's like the whole map doesn't respect the same set of rules I guess
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: yea i agree
2017-02-06 19:24 MrSergio: also, stuff like 02:01:700 (1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2,1,2) - feels random no matter what
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: but like, i mainly followed the melody
2017-02-06 19:24 MrSergio: and not because it IS, but because the player can't keep track of all those beats
2017-02-06 19:24 -himei: did u read my comment on this?
2017-02-06 19:25 MrSergio: ah, nope
2017-02-06 19:25 -himei: p/5801477+
2017-02-06 19:25 -himei: p/5801477
2017-02-06 19:25 MrSergio: umh, I see
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: well honestly
2017-02-06 19:26 MrSergio: but I believe that with so few beats you can't really make that idea come across
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: i have no idea how to map that section with local symmetry
2017-02-06 19:26 MrSergio: and random tings are random anyway xD
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: like there no way of emphasizing 16 pairs of sound with different volume
2017-02-06 19:26 -himei: in the way of symmetry cuz
2017-02-06 19:26 MrSergio: well, that's what the mapper should study and try to emphasize tho
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: they cant be divided on 2 or 4
2017-02-06 19:27 MrSergio: as a modder I have to base my reasonings on what I see
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: or 8
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: as u can hear
2017-02-06 19:27 MrSergio: then, let's take just 02:01:015 (7,1,2) -
2017-02-06 19:27 MrSergio: do you know what happens to emphasis there?
2017-02-06 19:27 -himei: no
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: idk
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: it getting fucked?
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: i guess
2017-02-06 19:28 MrSergio: the angle on 1 is too wide considered how much emphasis that note has in the song
2017-02-06 19:28 MrSergio: so emphasis on it is weak
2017-02-06 19:28 MrSergio: try a ctrl g on 1,2
2017-02-06 19:28 -himei: okay
2017-02-06 19:29 MrSergio: although spacing is still short and the difference is tiny
2017-02-06 19:29 -himei: between what?
2017-02-06 19:29 MrSergio: 02:01:015 (7,1) -
2017-02-06 19:29 MrSergio: before and after
2017-02-06 19:30 -himei: yea i see but like
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: the difference is tiny, so even with a ctrl G the difference is not so noticeable probably
2017-02-06 19:30 -himei: its acceptable isnt it
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: objectively, yes
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: but we don't have a bot ranking stuff
2017-02-06 19:30 -himei:
2017-02-06 19:30 MrSergio: well, there's a reason why we have people checking maps and not programs
2017-02-06 19:31 MrSergio: 02:15:415 (1,2,3) - stuff like this has poor emphasis again, due to the wide angle on 2
2017-02-06 19:31 MrSergio: a stack betweren 2,3 or a sharp angle would have worked better
2017-02-06 19:32 -himei: yes i had to keep that little square
2017-02-06 19:32 -himei: cuz of the previous section
2017-02-06 19:32 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:32 MrSergio: 02:19:529 (1,2,3,4,5,6,1,2,3,4,5,6,7) - this part is like... the best pattern using symmetry you made so far probably
2017-02-06 19:32 MrSergio: that's really good
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: wait
2017-02-06 19:33 MrSergio: you see... you focused to much on keeping that boxy-oldish feel and you ignored other aspects of the map, like emphasis or aesthetics in some parts
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: 02:15:415 (1,2,3) -
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: if i like move the doubles to the center?
2017-02-06 19:33 -himei: in this section
2017-02-06 19:33 MrSergio: http://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7253824 >
2017-02-06 19:33 MrSergio: ?
2017-02-06 19:34 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: the problem is with all the other patterns then
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: they should be similar
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: 02:16:443 (2,3) -
2017-02-06 19:34 MrSergio: btw, that ^ and 02:16:443 (2,3) - are inconsistent too, aestheticcs-wise
2017-02-06 19:35 -himei: u are messed up with links
2017-02-06 19:35 MrSergio: fuck
2017-02-06 19:35 MrSergio: 02:17:815 (2,3) - this is the second one
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: hmmm
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: i think like
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: the melody is kinda calm and consistent there
2017-02-06 19:36 -himei: and there shouldnt be much of the sharpy angles
2017-02-06 19:37 MrSergio: in the song, it is
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: i can see the flaws as u mentioned
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: but its kinda... hm well when i was mapping this
2017-02-06 19:37 MrSergio: yeah, but small details do a lot xD
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: i thought about it too
2017-02-06 19:37 -himei: and theres no way of emphasizing that shit without breaking some of the rules i set before
2017-02-06 19:38 -himei: thats what getting on my nerves in that place
2017-02-06 19:38 MrSergio: well, that's where planning (aka structure) comes in play
2017-02-06 19:38 -himei: i can show that
2017-02-06 19:38 MrSergio: you should have planned ahead that sort of stuff and re-organize the whole style basing it on that
2017-02-06 19:39 -himei: https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7253888 well i fked up with sliders but
2017-02-06 19:39 MrSergio: when I start a map I know what sort of shit will be coming in a minute of song or so, that's why I plan ahead that stuff and change my intro in a way that fits with the later parts
2017-02-06 19:39 -himei: as u can see im trying to keep that square styled stuff
2017-02-06 19:39 MrSergio: yeah, but using always the same spots to place objects means a lot less possibilities for your patterns
2017-02-06 19:39 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: and that's probably the reason
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: but its probably the issue of the current section of the song and the concept
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: of pervious parts
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: isnt it?
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: so i kinda trapped myself
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: 02:42:843 (1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8) - was this here before?
2017-02-06 19:40 MrSergio: yes, you did
2017-02-06 19:40 -himei: yes it was
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: that's why I always tell people to plan ahead stuff :/
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: uhhh, I missed that then
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: that's cool
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: and that's how you use symmetry but without trapping yourself
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: well, it's just triangles there I gues
2017-02-06 19:41 MrSergio: but the visual impact is still the one of something symmetric
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: another small detail you should consider: take 02:44:900 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:42 -himei: yea
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: and compare it with 02:44:215 (1,1) - and with 02:45:586 (1,2,3,4) - , in the music
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: and see which is the most intense
2017-02-06 19:42 MrSergio: (ignore your current patterns, just listen to the song)
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: the vertical jumps are less intense
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: the key point is on 02:45:586 -
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: but i mapped them in response to previous section
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: with similar sliders
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: in that point a lot of instruments burst out and the song's intensity increases
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: yes, but they should still respect the current song's intensity imo
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: its another trap dude
2017-02-06 19:43 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:43 MrSergio: lol
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: well when i was finishing this map
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: i was always thinking about how to not fuck up something i already designed
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: because it shud be similar
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: so that why the second part of this map is kinda
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: hmm
2017-02-06 19:44 MrSergio: there shouldn't be a worry tho :/
2017-02-06 19:44 MrSergio: I mean, if you plan ahead the stuff you just start mapping and care only about of couple of patterns at a time
2017-02-06 19:44 -himei: feels like a cage
2017-02-06 19:45 -himei: how do u plan tho?
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: it is fine to struggle with making 2-3 patterns match together
2017-02-06 19:45 -himei: theres like a music patterns and osu patterns
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: I listen to teh song and I throw ideas into a notepad
2017-02-06 19:45 -himei: and u glue them to each other
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: I also get a feeling of what spacing average I need for different parts
2017-02-06 19:45 MrSergio: if you set down bookmarks to distinguish the different sections it will be ewasier
2017-02-06 19:46 MrSergio: you can use whatever comes handy for you to plan better, idk
2017-02-06 19:46 -himei: i know, but its not the case here, cuz everything should be mirrored
2017-02-06 19:46 -himei: so its like
2017-02-06 19:46 -himei: x^2 in terms of difficulty of mapping
2017-02-06 19:46 MrSergio: you can even draw patterns on a piece of paper or make a mock diff where you throw pattern ieas
2017-02-06 19:46 MrSergio: patterns in it*
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: for example: you start planing the patterns on the first section, they are cool
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: you do the same for the second section and they somehow match, so they are fine
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: once you do the third section something strange occurs
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: you need to change something, maybe
2017-02-06 19:47 MrSergio: in that case you need to take that strange part and try to put it also in the other two
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: well i guess its not about current project
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: because i had different intentions back then
2017-02-06 19:48 MrSergio: now... this is really vague, but I can't explain it in specific since every person will come up with different solutions on different songs
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: and i wanted to make this map clean
2017-02-06 19:48 -himei: like, proper angles, nice rhythm, no overlaps or something that can be read bad
2017-02-06 19:49 MrSergio: overlaps can be clean tho
2017-02-06 19:49 MrSergio: I ranked a mapset with them just recently
2017-02-06 19:49 -himei: so yea i decreased the ds there in that jumps
2017-02-06 19:49 MrSergio: having something clean is not a matter of "what" you use, but a matter of "how " you use them
2017-02-06 19:49 -himei: oh wait
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: yes i know but
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: yea btw
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: so even overlaps can be clean if used in a certain way
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: 02:43:872 (7,3) -
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: (it was just a side note)
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: they are mirrored copies
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: i cant move that shit
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: I don't want that to be moved at all o.o
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei:
2017-02-06 19:50 MrSergio: that's good as it is
2017-02-06 19:50 -himei: wait but
2017-02-06 19:51 -himei: 02:46:100 (3,4) - shud i increase this?
2017-02-06 19:51 -himei: then
2017-02-06 19:51 MrSergio: http://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7253995
2017-02-06 19:51 MrSergio: if you do that the next jumps will feel "bigger than they were before" so it is fine
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: it's a matter of "building mental responses": if you want to emphasize a particular jump you need to place less spacing on the jump before the jump
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: if you want a section to feel more intense you have to make the previous section feel less intense in comparison
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: and so on
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: wait but
2017-02-06 19:52 MrSergio: it's a matter of "contrast"
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: lol i cant afford that
2017-02-06 19:52 -himei: because like
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: its a unique section with long jumps
2017-02-06 19:53 MrSergio: it's a matter of how our brains perceive that, and contrast is the most powerful weapon to achieve that
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: and then its another section with BOOM intro
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: there couldnt be any contrast in DS unless i change the
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: direction...
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: oh shit
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: yea ill do that
2017-02-06 19:53 -himei: i didnt think about it
2017-02-06 19:54 MrSergio: what I did in that screen was: I hear a "boom" at 02:45:586 - and I want to emphasize that, but how do I do that? The spacing is what it is, so I can't increase it infinitily. That's why I used less spacing for 02:44:900 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:54 MrSergio: so when the BOOM comes it will have more effect due to the contrast with the small spacing for 02:44:900 (1,2,3,4) -
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: let me make an abstract example
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: stop dude calm down
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: i undestand
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: can you understand what "cold" means" if you don't know what "hot" means? xD
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: ah, rip
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: so 02:46:100 (3,4) - this and 01:06:157 (1,2,3,4) - shud be similar
2017-02-06 19:55 MrSergio: anyway, that's how it works for song expression
2017-02-06 19:55 -himei: and also 04:12:672 (1,2,3,4) - this
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: yes
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: so i cant
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: afford to change it
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: and this is part of that planning I mentioned earlier
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: ;w;
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: since they are all the same you already know what to do
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: you just need one pattern and you mapped 3 parts
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: handy, isn't it?
2017-02-06 19:56 MrSergio: and it just needed some more thought of how the song played around those parts
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: ok so 02:45:586 - what do i do here
2017-02-06 19:56 -himei: i cant make the ds smaller in prev jumps
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: umh...
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: take the white ticks
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: 02:45:929 - 02:46:272 - 02:46:615 -
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: now... which is/are the most important for you?
2017-02-06 19:57 -himei: 02:45:929 - this one obviouslyu
2017-02-06 19:57 MrSergio: I see
2017-02-06 19:58 MrSergio: well, I would have personally thought that 02:46:272 - 02:46:615 - where more important since 02:46:100 (3,5) - these guys sort of "accelerate" the rhythm
2017-02-06 19:58 MrSergio: but that's due of how the pattern works
2017-02-06 19:58 MrSergio: if you want to emphasize 02:45:929 - you then need to make 02:46:100 (3,4,5,6) - less important
2017-02-06 19:58 -himei: alright
2017-02-06 19:58 -himei: will do
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: oh shit
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: sliders are stacked
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: aAAAAAAAAAA
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: with another sliders
2017-02-06 19:59 MrSergio: how you do it is personal preference tho, so I can't really help after that
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: 02:46:100 (3) - press ctrl+h, j
2017-02-06 19:59 -himei: and see
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: damn
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: 02:45:243 (3,4) - and this also
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: wait... is that... important? .-.
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: those references aren't visible in gameplay imo
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: you meant [http://mrsergio.s-ul.eu/0UhfKw4F.png this], right?
2017-02-06 20:00 MrSergio: the ctrl h,j
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: ok tell me is that important to change that place?
2017-02-06 20:00 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 20:01 MrSergio: come on, how can you imagine that in gameplay? xD
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: 02:46:100 (3,1) -
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: this
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: 02:46:443 (5,8) -
2017-02-06 20:01 MrSergio: himei, you should tell me that: what do you think is more important?
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: oh dude
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: hm
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: ok i understand
2017-02-06 20:01 -himei: emphasis > strcture
2017-02-06 20:02 -himei: ?
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: I understand you wanted that symmetry-like feeling, but trust me that the screen I gave you above is something no one will think about
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: nope, they are equal
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: you should use emphasis to build structure
2017-02-06 20:02 MrSergio: so you first decide which jumps should be important, then based on that you build the pattern
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: deciding which jumps are miportant is the same as deciding which notes in the song are important
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: see how everything connects?
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: so you decide on rhythm > emphasis > Structure > aesthetics
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: for now im trapped in my math-wise map
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: in that order
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: where everything is connected
2017-02-06 20:03 -himei: somehow
2017-02-06 20:03 MrSergio: well, why not breaking that then?
2017-02-06 20:04 -himei: well cuz its kinda perfect
2017-02-06 20:04 -himei: lol
2017-02-06 20:04 MrSergio: no one is forcing you to to begin with
2017-02-06 20:04 MrSergio: if some patterns don't come out because of that I don't think you should keep it as a concept
2017-02-06 20:04 MrSergio: for example, now that I know your reasoning I understand how the intro was made and it makes sense
2017-02-06 20:05 MrSergio: the problem is that you then ignored a bit how the player will play that and how it will feel (which is part of structure and aeshtetics)
2017-02-06 20:05 MrSergio: later on in the map you also start having problems on rhythm and emphasis, always because of that math-like sty;e
2017-02-06 20:05 MrSergio: so as you can see... it doesn't work so great :/
2017-02-06 20:06 MrSergio: I mean... you "could" make it work
2017-02-06 20:06 MrSergio: but you need to test a lot of different patterns/flows and see how they are altogether
2017-02-06 20:06 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:06 MrSergio: (which is what I do on every map because I want to make it differently than the map I did previously)
2017-02-06 20:07 -himei: most of people are happy with the first part, but technical part is kinda hard
2017-02-06 20:07 MrSergio: actually, the fact you had a concept for the whole map is a really positive thing
2017-02-06 20:07 -himei: so now i see why
2017-02-06 20:07 MrSergio: actually, please keep mapping and try to refine that, because nowadays we have too few mappers that do that
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: no more symmetry maps dude
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:08 MrSergio: I honestly believe that if you tried to map this song with a different sort of concept (or maybe the same, but with better analysis of the song) it will come out way better
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: i got more crazy ideas in my new map but its not symmetrical
2017-02-06 20:08 MrSergio: and I mean, a lot better
2017-02-06 20:08 MrSergio: then who cares about symmetry xD
2017-02-06 20:08 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: i guess its my type of personality, too pendantic and things
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: at*
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: so ok i can tell u that i cant really change that place 02:46:015 -
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: honestly it would ruin all shit
2017-02-06 20:09 MrSergio: yeah, it probably would
2017-02-06 20:09 -himei: every note has 3 stacks at least
2017-02-06 20:10 -himei: even 4 in future
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: but those stacks are sort of indeirect anyway
2017-02-06 20:10 -himei: yea
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: I'd honestly wouldn't think to imagine flipping so much a single object to find a stack in gameplat
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: y
2017-02-06 20:10 MrSergio: holy typos
2017-02-06 20:10 -himei: so lets move on
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: as I said, having a concept is perfect, but see how that turns out for the player: can he notice it?
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: no but pishi said like
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: if I don't notice it it would feel random, right?
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: map is firstly judged in editor
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: so it shud be perfect
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: and also sonny and doyak kinda
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: had influence on me with that
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: ok... but... I wouldn't think of flipping those objects no matter what xD
2017-02-06 20:11 -himei: logic stuff
2017-02-06 20:11 MrSergio: logic stuff is what I like too, trust me
2017-02-06 20:12 MrSergio: but it needs to be more direct
2017-02-06 20:12 -himei: now i can see that after all i got missleaded from the first mod i got
2017-02-06 20:12 -himei: that happened 6 months ago
2017-02-06 20:12 -himei: but well i cant really change my vision of mapping now
2017-02-06 20:12 MrSergio: you don't need to
2017-02-06 20:12 MrSergio: but you need to refine it tho
2017-02-06 20:13 -himei: yea i progressed somehow
2017-02-06 20:13 MrSergio: and it all comes down to whether something is easy to understand and makes sense or not
2017-02-06 20:13 MrSergio: so for starters, don't use all those flippings as reasons, because they are not visible xD
2017-02-06 20:13 MrSergio: I wonder how many would think of flipping stuff
2017-02-06 20:13 -himei: i just dont want to change this map anymore cuz i spent too much on it and its kinda perfect editor-wise
2017-02-06 20:13 -himei: xd
2017-02-06 20:14 MrSergio: and if they do flip it, in actual gameplay they are not that flipped so it doesn't have much to do with the current pattern, isn't it?
2017-02-06 20:14 -himei: yes
2017-02-06 20:14 MrSergio: well.. the editor is not the only thing that matters x)
2017-02-06 20:15 -himei: is it all the places u wanted to pinpoint out?
2017-02-06 20:15 -himei: i guess theres more
2017-02-06 20:15 MrSergio: if you can make those sort of links between objects without the need to move them too much (like flipping) you'd be able to make much more interesting maps
2017-02-06 20:15 MrSergio: since the player, and the modder, would be able to see your intentions right away
2017-02-06 20:15 -himei: yea trust me i wont try this style anymore
2017-02-06 20:15 MrSergio: yesh, there probably is
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: overlaps
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: oh nvm
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: i had one in the entire map
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: but i fixed that today
2017-02-06 20:16 -himei: he had the proper step by X
2017-02-06 20:16 MrSergio: for example, some minor stuff: 03:01:528 (7,8,9) - how you suddenly break that continuous horizontal movement feels a bit too forced (03:01:015 (2,3,4,5,6,7) - horixontal movements)
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: try stacking 8 on top of 9
2017-02-06 20:17 -himei: yea good idea
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: I originally had planned to mod this myself when popping the bubble, but Stjpa did it before me so rip
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: idk what he mentioned in it tho
2017-02-06 20:17 -himei: 00:11:300 (3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - well i think
2017-02-06 20:17 MrSergio: or how
2017-02-06 20:17 -himei: it started from this place
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: so let me explain
2017-02-06 20:18 MrSergio: ah, that
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: oh shit its fucked now, i got to recalculate this
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: so bacially i had the (3) circle
2017-02-06 20:18 MrSergio: I hear more the distorted sound there, and not the stream
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: and the slider 00:11:986 (1) -
2017-02-06 20:18 -himei: and i had to put there like
2017-02-06 20:18 MrSergio: a strange, long slider would have been cooler imo
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: 00:11:386 (4,5,6,7,8,9,10) - this sound with proper step by x y
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: and i didnt know how to do that
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: so i started fucking with calculator and eventually figured out how to calculate each of the circle
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: so it was the inicial point
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: of this map
2017-02-06 20:19 -himei: of concept of it*
2017-02-06 20:19 MrSergio: [https://osu.ppy.sh/ss/7254256 dumb stuff]
2017-02-06 20:20 MrSergio: holy
2017-02-06 20:20 MrSergio: you went too far with calculations, trust me xD
2017-02-06 20:20 MrSergio: small pixels won't make a big difference in actual gameplay
2017-02-06 20:20 -himei: yea but how to make a linear stream
2017-02-06 20:20 -himei: with the first and the last point
2017-02-06 20:20 -himei: but u dont know the "step"
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: ah, right
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: u got to divide the coordinates by 2
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: you were forcing yourself within those coordinates
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: and then u divide them again
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: and you see... you shouldn't :/
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: till u find the proper positions
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: it lets you less space for creativity
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:21 MrSergio: I mean, were those 2 coordinates the only available solutions?
2017-02-06 20:21 -himei: hmm well
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: it could have been a lot of different things imo
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: i had the rounded pattern
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: like the stupid slider I did above, for example
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: and also had the position of 00:11:300 (3) - which was stacked with 00:08:386 (6) - this a believe
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: (it follows pretty well the distorted sound tho)
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: heh...
2017-02-06 20:22 MrSergio: how many would notice that in your opinion? xD
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: nobody
2017-02-06 20:22 -himei: i mapped it for myslef to like
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: heh...
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: be confident that its good
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: well back then i was affected by
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: ocd
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: if u know what it is
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: so yea
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: the thing is: if 2 objects are too far apart they won't be linked together anymore
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: by anything
2017-02-06 20:23 MrSergio: and by far apart I mean on the timeline
2017-02-06 20:23 -himei: well i wanted to make a stream so
2017-02-06 20:24 MrSergio: AR plays a role in here, since based on that you'll have more stuff on the screen or not
2017-02-06 20:24 MrSergio: but that's minor, who cares about it now
2017-02-06 20:24 MrSergio: 00:11:300 - is 3 seconds apart from 00:08:386 -
2017-02-06 20:24 -himei: i got to remap that stream, its out of place now
2017-02-06 20:24 -himei: holy s
2017-02-06 20:25 MrSergio: if I measure it with "beats", it is 9 beats and a half apart
2017-02-06 20:25 MrSergio: beat + from one white tick to the next
2017-02-06 20:25 = *
2017-02-06 20:25 MrSergio: if something is already 2 beats apart from something else it won't be linked to it imo
2017-02-06 20:25 -himei: i mean dude i understand that its kinda a psycho disease when u realized how much of effort i brought in this map
2017-02-06 20:25 -himei: but well
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: its kinda w/e for me now xd
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: wait
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: wait
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: which place u are talking about
2017-02-06 20:26 -himei: that stream?
2017-02-06 20:26 MrSergio: umh...
2017-02-06 20:26 MrSergio: 00:11:300 -
2017-02-06 20:26 MrSergio: yeah, the stream
2017-02-06 20:27 -himei: so ure saying that 00:11:300 (3,1) - can not be connected?
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: you said that the stream and 00:08:386 (6) - were linked
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: nonono
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: http://mrsergio.s-ul.eu/jEw8OPiV.png
2017-02-06 20:27 -himei: dude
2017-02-06 20:27 MrSergio: so I was trying to understand that xD
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: 00:10:272 (6) - this sound was flipped by x on 00:11:300 (3) - this
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: C O N N E C T I O N
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: oh
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: too vague lol
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: I can't see the connection at all xD
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei:
2017-02-06 20:28 -himei: im probably mad
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: and you probably miclicked too on that link lol
2017-02-06 20:28 MrSergio: since you linked another object
2017-02-06 20:29 MrSergio: and yeah, I would probably not link them anyway, since they are already quite far apart
2017-02-06 20:29 MrSergio: 3 beats
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:30 MrSergio: anyway, I'd like to keep discussing this, but I gotta go have dinner for now. The main things I wanted to say are already said anyway
2017-02-06 20:30 MrSergio: the rest would just be normal modding that it doesn't depend on the pop
2017-02-06 20:30 MrSergio: well, it might, but it wouldn't be necessary
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: are u going to mod this?
2017-02-06 20:30 -himei: ill fix something now
2017-02-06 20:31 MrSergio: I can try, but if your reasons are mainly stacks or connections between objects being 3 beats apart, I can't probably help xD
2017-02-06 20:31 -himei: well
2017-02-06 20:31 -himei: i ll drop that approach from now
2017-02-06 20:31 MrSergio: moreover, to fix the structure/aeshtetics/expression stuff I mentioned at the beginning you'd need to remap some huge parts of it
2017-02-06 20:31 -himei: but i also want to keep the concept
2017-02-06 20:31 MrSergio: I can point out some stuff, but I can't point it out all
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: got it
2017-02-06 20:32 MrSergio: so I believe my mod won't be able to bring the map on quality standards
2017-02-06 20:32 MrSergio: I'm not superman anyway
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: well if u bring something up ill also apply this for similar places
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: CUZ ITS A COPY ANYWAYS :d::d:d
2017-02-06 20:32 -himei: ah ah ha ha
2017-02-06 20:32 MrSergio: xD
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: anyway, I'll be going for now
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: if you have questions send me a pm
2017-02-06 20:33 -himei: ok
2017-02-06 20:33 -himei: and thanks
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: I hope I explained a bit better the reasons behind the pop
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: at lesat imo
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: dunno what Stjpa had to say on this
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: I should check his mod too I guess
2017-02-06 20:33 MrSergio: anyway... later~