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What happened to the star ranking?

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Total Posts
35
Person012345
10 posts
Joined April 2012
Topic Starter
Person012345
I see in the changelog they've been changed but they now seem to make no sense whatsoever. Everything from the easiest map to moderate (or just easy) is grouped under 1 star, [easy] moderate to hard (and even some labelled insane) is 2 star and everything else is various flavours of insane. It is now even less useful as a difficulty indicator than it was before. And it's completely screwed me up because I used to sort and group by difficulty, now stars don't seem to mean a whole lot for anything other than insane.

Can someone explain the rationale behind this change and how it is supposed to work and be useful?

Sorry if this is in the wrong spot, wasn't sure where I should post it.
Kazuya
894 posts
Joined May 2013
Kazuya
Uhh...

Easy: 0.00 - 0.99
Normal: 1.00 - 1.49
Hard: 1.50 - 2.49
Insane: 2.50 - 3.49
Extra: 3.50 - 5.00 .. i don't know :/
Last edited by Kazuya , edited 1 time in total.
Luccyous
86 posts
Joined March 2014
Luccyous
What about -1? ._.
Tom94
osu!dev
750 posts
Joined August 2012
Tom94
What previously was labeled as "Insane" was hardly insane. It didn't take much time at all to reach the 5-star limit. This has changed now. It is a fault of the sorting system, that you can not sort your maps with better granularity which we hope to improve.
Howl
1,121 posts
Joined June 2013
Howl
The hardest map possible is now 5 stars. It was 5 stars even before, but now another map that is an easy insane isn't rated 5 stars like the hardest map evurr.
Person012345
10 posts
Joined April 2012
Topic Starter
Person012345

Kazuya-sama wrote:

Easy: 0.00 - 0.99
Normal: 1.00 - 1.49
Hard: 1.50 - 2.49
The predominant map type at 1.5+ is normal. My main problem is that 1.25 - 2.25 maps all get dumped in the "2 star" grouping which makes the entire "group by difficulty" mode that I like nearly pointless to me because I can't do insane yet.

Edit: Bunch of corrections, I find the different sized stars in the new style hard to read.
Last edited by Person012345 , edited 7 times in total.
Person012345
10 posts
Joined April 2012
Topic Starter
Person012345

Tom94 wrote:

What previously was labeled as "Insane" was hardly insane. It didn't take much time at all to reach the 5-star limit. This has changed now. It is a fault of the sorting system, that you can not sort your maps with better granularity which we hope to improve.
Ok, fair enough.
Juunooo
3 posts
Joined July 2013
Juunooo
I actually find the new star system a lot more useful for sorting out all my insanes. When I first started playing the insane difficulty, I noticed how wide the range "insane" actually was. There were some that were far too easy being labelled as 5-star and "insane" while others were on a whole other level - yet still grouped under "insane" with 5 stars. The new system helps sort out the real difficulty behind each map where I would have to guess it's difficulty from the number of objects in the past.

Also if you're finding it hard to read the smaller stars, you can find the exact number of stars in the top left of the beatmap selection screen, on the last row with CS, HP, AR, OD. Stars should be next to OD, ex. Stars: 3.45
XPJ38
osu! Alumni
3,570 posts
Joined February 2010
XPJ38
Moved.
Vuelo Eluko
5,484 posts
Joined October 2013
Vuelo Eluko

TheHowl wrote:

The hardest map possible is now 5 stars. It was 5 stars even before, but now another map that is an easy insane isn't rated 5 stars like the hardest map evurr.
scarlet rose isnt even 5 stars tho

but real talk, you're wrong on both accounts. there are possible maps greater than 5 stars and even in the previous system, some of the hardest ranked maps went slightly above 5 stars somehow by decimals.
silmarilen
5,579 posts
Joined February 2010
silmarilen

Person012345 wrote:

Kazuya-sama wrote:

Easy: 0.00 - 0.99
Normal: 1.00 - 1.49
Hard: 1.50 - 2.49
The predominant map type at 1.5+ is normal. My main problem is that 1.25 - 2.25 maps all get dumped in the "2 star" grouping which makes the entire "group by difficulty" mode that I like nearly pointless to me because I can't do insane yet.

Edit: Bunch of corrections, I find the different sized stars in the new style hard to read.
use sort by difficulty instead of/aswell as group by difficulty to get them properly sorted
Ogawaa
5 posts
Joined March 2013
Ogawaa
I get how it makes sense for sorting, but wouldn't just making it 10 stars be a better choice?
Because now I have a ton of maps where easy, normal and hard are pretty much the same star level, and it looks weird.
Not a problem for people who only play insane, lunatic and stuff like that, but hey, not everyone is at that level.
silmarilen
5,579 posts
Joined February 2010
silmarilen
if an easy, normal and hard are the same star rating they are pretty much the same difficulty, so if you can fc the normal then you can most likely fc the hard aswell.
if by pretty much the same you mean something like 0.9 - 1.3 - 1.8
then they are not pretty much the same, there is a huge difference between them, you just have to get used to the new system.
Ogawaa
5 posts
Joined March 2013
Ogawaa

silmarilen wrote:

if by pretty much the same you mean something like 0.9 - 1.3 - 1.8
then they are not pretty much the same, there is a huge difference between them, you just have to get used to the new system.
Well, my point is I don't like the new system. If there's a huge difference between them, show it with more stars.
0.9 to 1.3 doesn't look like a huge difference. Making it look better and making it easier to spot how different the difficulties are would be good, and to do that all it would take is increase the range of stars. So 10 stars for the hardest one instead of 5. It would look better, and hey, who doesn't like stars?
Full Tablet
2,542 posts
Joined September 2011
Full Tablet

Ogawaa wrote:

silmarilen wrote:

if by pretty much the same you mean something like 0.9 - 1.3 - 1.8
then they are not pretty much the same, there is a huge difference between them, you just have to get used to the new system.
Well, my point is I don't like the new system. If there's a huge difference between them, show it with more stars.
0.9 to 1.3 doesn't look like a huge difference. Making it look better and making it easier to spot how different the difficulties are would be good, and to do that all it would take is increase the range of stars. So 10 stars for the hardest one instead of 5. It would look better, and hey, who doesn't like stars?

They are working on it.
Eberon
11 posts
Joined October 2013
Eberon

Bassist Vinyl wrote:

TheHowl wrote:

The hardest map possible is now 5 stars. It was 5 stars even before, but now another map that is an easy insane isn't rated 5 stars like the hardest map evurr.
scarlet rose isnt even 5 stars tho

but real talk, you're wrong on both accounts. there are possible maps greater than 5 stars and even in the previous system, some of the hardest ranked maps went slightly above 5 stars somehow by decimals.

https://osu.ppy.sh/b/29844&m=0 has full 5 stars
Ogawaa
5 posts
Joined March 2013
Ogawaa

Full Tablet wrote:


They are working on it.

Oh, nice to know!
Missed that, I only read the changelog for June 9th that the client linked :P
Aileefangirl
Aileefangirl
They should just use the numbers instead of the stars, it would make things more convinient, how 3.5+ is considered "extra", 2.5-3.49 is insane, etc.
silmarilen
5,579 posts
Joined February 2010
silmarilen
they do use numbers, both ingame and on the website. on the website it is right below the stars, and ingame its where the od, cs and hp drain are also listed
Naywils
64 posts
Joined October 2013
Naywils
Hate the new look of it its just more confusing now, was always 5 star now its 2 and 3 and ? why can they just not add 6 stars all my songs are in a stupid order now also

song rating 3 and 3 quarters?
Dembele
18 posts
Joined March 2014
Dembele
New system is way better, it shows the difficulty of maps more accurately. I don't understand the confusion, just give yourself time to get used to it and get your head around it, the old system was so basic and didnt work properly... But it was simple enough for you to sort your maps out so thats all that matters? :)
B1rd
2,974 posts
Joined December 2013
B1rd
I was thinking of making a request before to change the star rating system so it is like it is now... before any map that wasn't for noobs was 5 stars, making it pointless for 95% of the playerbase.
meteor22
176 posts
Joined May 2013
meteor22
i don't understand star system anymore wtf is going on
can explain somebody
Kaeru
302 posts
Joined February 2013
Kaeru

meteor22 wrote:

i don't understand star system anymore wtf is going on
can explain somebody
Did you really not read any of the posts in this topic?

I like the new star system a lot more (old one was incredibly stupid with only easy and normal maps being less than five stars), but I don't like how the maximum shown in-game (at least in the multi-player rooms) is still only five stars. It's still really not enough of a range from the easiest map in the game to the hardest.
Monstrata
Elite Mapper: Aspirant
4,642 posts
Joined May 2013
Monstrata
I feel like this is a great system, but it discourages new players because when you start a game, you're led to believe you can play these 3.5-4 star maps very soon. When you realize that even 1.5-2 star maps are now difficult (as opposed to 4 stars normally) its just rather discouraging to continue playing and improving. I have a few friends who just play osu for fun and they still brag about "beating a 5 star map the other day". The old system was more encouraging for beginners imo.

And I noticed it changed again, and now there are 6+ star maps. (I'm looking at Rootus atm). However I'm pleasantly surprised that the star rating now changes if you select a mode like DoubleTime. That's awesome :).
theLiminator
68 posts
Joined October 2011
theLiminator

monstrata wrote:

I feel like this is a great system, but it discourages new players because when you start a game, you're led to believe you can play these 3.5-4 star maps very soon. When you realize that even 1.5-2 star maps are now difficult (as opposed to 4 stars normally) its just rather discouraging to continue playing and improving. I have a few friends who just play osu for fun and they still brag about "beating a 5 star map the other day". The old system was more encouraging for beginners imo.

And I noticed it changed again, and now there are 6+ star maps. (I'm looking at Rootus atm). However I'm pleasantly surprised that the star rating now changes if you select a mode like DoubleTime. That's awesome :).
Ichijou kun, you make pretty good points.
McChinaMeal
1 post
Joined April 2012
McChinaMeal

Tom94 wrote:

What previously was labeled as "Insane" was hardly insane. It didn't take much time at all to reach the 5-star limit. This has changed now. It is a fault of the sorting system, that you can not sort your maps with better granularity which we hope to improve.
not everyone as good as you are, maybe to you those "insane" was hardly insane, but this does not apply to everyone else, hope you didn't apply your expectation to everyone else.
Nub1
1,368 posts
Joined May 2013
Nub1

McChinaMeal wrote:

not everyone as good as you are, maybe to you those "insane" was hardly insane, but this does not apply to everyone else, hope you didn't apply your expectation to everyone else.
There's a few insane maps that contain easy insane and the new star rank system helped us to see which one is the easy one and which one is the hard one

I do like this new star rank system btw
Person012345
10 posts
Joined April 2012
Topic Starter
Person012345
The 10 stars has fixed my initial complaint. Thanks. ^^
nrl
1,402 posts
Joined October 2011
nrl

McChinaMeal wrote:

not everyone as good as you are, maybe to you those "insane" was hardly insane, but this does not apply to everyone else, hope you didn't apply your expectation to everyone else.
The point is that under the old system everything from challenging hards to the hardest insanes was given five stars.
Tom94
osu!dev
750 posts
Joined August 2012
Tom94

McChinaMeal wrote:

Tom94 wrote:

What previously was labeled as "Insane" was hardly insane. It didn't take much time at all to reach the 5-star limit. This has changed now. It is a fault of the sorting system, that you can not sort your maps with better granularity which we hope to improve.
not everyone as good as you are, maybe to you those "insane" was hardly insane, but this does not apply to everyone else, hope you didn't apply your expectation to everyone else.
Giving people the impression they can play the hardest maps of the game, but because the star difficulty was easily capped out isn't the right way to go. Older insanes still have a star rating of about 4 which is totally fine in my opinion. The stars are very similar to the old ones for easier maps and only get "compressed" closer together for very hard maps.
Vuelo Eluko
5,484 posts
Joined October 2013
Vuelo Eluko
to be fair i think its wrong to assume the old star system was misguiding anyone, it was just plain useless and i think everyone knew that. everyone knew 5 stars began at a very easy difficulty and didnt go any higher even though the maps did. i dont think anyone passed a 5 star map after playing for like 2 days then went "oh big black is 5 stars too.. i can do that!"


i would agree with insanes starting at 4 stars now, this system actually reduces the shock a bit from just changing the old star system in game where everything 5 star would change to anything between 1.5 stars to 10 stars.
GhostFrog
416 posts
Joined March 2013
GhostFrog

Bassist Vinyl wrote:

to be fair i think its wrong to assume the old star system was misguiding anyone, it was just plain useless and i think everyone knew that. everyone knew 5 stars began at a very easy difficulty and didnt go any higher even though the maps did.
You frequent the osu! forums, so I'm sure you've seen plenty of newer players posting about "5 star maps" and how to pass them or being proud of having passed one. Sure, it didn't take long for players to recognize that star rating meant almost nothing, but I don't think that was obvious at all to very new players.
gr0t
18 posts
Joined January 2013
gr0t

Bassist Vinyl wrote:

to be fair i think its wrong to assume the old star system was misguiding anyone, it was just plain useless and i think everyone knew that. everyone knew 5 stars began at a very easy difficulty and didnt go any higher even though the maps did. i dont think anyone passed a 5 star map after playing for like 2 days then went "oh big black is 5 stars too.. i can do that!"
What makes you think so? I am playing easy insanes for like 4 months now. At the beginning I downloaded every map I found entertaining in terms of music and difficulty (only 5 star diffs as anything lower wasnt hard enough). Of course half of these maps were 'hard' insanes I had no chance of passing. Star system misguided me quite a lot. Im not telling I tried Big Black second day. I didnt know it exists. It just put my-lvl maps on a par with maps I had no chance to pass and it wasnt fun.
Also I dont see many casual players reading all the osu! wiki right off the bat to learn all fancy terms like OD, AR so they could filter off hard insanes while old star system was in work.
New system, while not ideal, gives you slightest hint how far or close you are to some map you chose as your target. Thats how it works for me.
Vuelo Eluko
5,484 posts
Joined October 2013
Vuelo Eluko

gr0t wrote:

Bassist Vinyl wrote:

to be fair i think its wrong to assume the old star system was misguiding anyone, it was just plain useless and i think everyone knew that. everyone knew 5 stars began at a very easy difficulty and didnt go any higher even though the maps did. i dont think anyone passed a 5 star map after playing for like 2 days then went "oh big black is 5 stars too.. i can do that!"
What makes you think so? I am playing easy insanes for like 4 months now. At the beginning I downloaded every map I found entertaining in terms of music and difficulty (only 5 star diffs as anything lower wasnt hard enough). Of course half of these maps were 'hard' insanes I had no chance of passing. Star system misguided me quite a lot. Im not telling I tried Big Black second day. I didnt know it exists. It just put my-lvl maps on a par with maps I had no chance to pass and it wasnt fun.
Also I dont see many casual players reading all the osu! wiki right off the bat to learn all fancy terms like OD, AR so they could filter off hard insanes while old star system was in work.
New system, while not ideal, gives you slightest hint how far or close you are to some map you chose as your target. Thats how it works for me.
im sorry, there were 2 things i was assuming, that most people had seen cookiezi's plays on youtube since hes the first like 10 result for Osu!/Osu gameplay, and quickly realize that those maps and the maps they play are the same star diff, and that most people would look at the scoreboard and quickly make the connection between difficulty of the map and the mods used. The scoreboard is still a good way to determine difficulty, but the star system now is preferable since there are factors that could make a song look easier/harder by the scoreboard, such as number of plays it has.

but as they say, assumptions do more harm then good, and I shouldn't have thought everyone the same as me, there are probably many people that find osu randomly some other way and simply play for the fun of the game without doing much looking around- even at scoreboards.
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